We've been told elsewhere that the lockboxes drop in addition to, not instead of, other drops. They do seem to drop ridiculously often, though. I spent some time farming Trey Kings in Vibora.
Time: exactly 1 hour
Mobs destroyed: 1311
Takoboxes: 62
UNTIL Recog: 43
Resources: 5g 43s 28l
Mods (Rank 4): 20
Mods (Rank 5): 7
Gear (Green): 35
Gear (Blue, no slot): 4
Gear (Blue, 2 slots): 4
Gear (Purple, no slot): 3
Call Up A Trey Kings Gang War: 2
Costume Unlock: 1
So that's a Takobox drop every 58 seconds at the rate I was killing, or approximately 21 mobs. They drop more often than recognition. Make of that what you will. Mods were dropping every ~48 mobs, and gear every ~28.
I will say that I wish Takoboxes and recognition both were auto-looted.
So far, it's felt like that non-lockbox items are dropping at the same frequency. At least, my inventory has been filling up at the same rate. I also have had loot drop with lockboxes. So I will nod in agreement with TT when he says that the lockbox drop independently and aren't part of the regular loot table.
I do agree that it'd be nice if the lockboxes and recog (oh, most definitely recog) were auto-looted. Other items (gear, mods), I'm happy to have not auto-loot.
I've been doing a lot of running around with Skyfire (trying to hit 40 before my month of Gold is up, for the free character slot), Pandemic, and my newest, Dr. Destiny (that's Randall W. Destiny, PhD in Applied Thaumaturgy from the University of Michigan). I seem to have been picking up all the usual stuff at the same rate as always - in fact, Skyfire recently got a couple of Dogz costume drops (a baseball bat with a sawblade attached, and a set of strap-on claws) while investigating reports of Bludhound's appearance in VB.
Getting the Takoboxes as well, but since they stack to 999, they don't bug me as much as STO lockboxes (that only stack to 10, and thus fill up the ol' inventory real fast). They annoy me, but it's hardly a game-breaker...
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
You know, we could just not pick them up if we don't like them. It's easy enough to press Z, see it's nothing we particularly want, then move on.
I for one, am going to leave the magic boxes ALONE. Too many horror movies has told me what happens when you leave mystic artefacts clogging up your storage areas. Leave it where it is for the mystic division of the police to clean up when they do a post-Alert cleanup.
Yeah they created this new currency (questionite) then promptly abandoned it. Heres an idea, what if they actually added stuff to it instead of creating yet another type of loot/currency :rolleyes:
I've been doing a lot of running around with Skyfire (trying to hit 40 before my month of Gold is up, for the free character slot), Pandemic, and my newest, Dr. Destiny (that's Randall W. Destiny, PhD in Applied Thaumaturgy from the University of Michigan). I seem to have been picking up all the usual stuff at the same rate as always - in fact, Skyfire recently got a couple of Dogz costume drops (a baseball bat with a sawblade attached, and a set of strap-on claws) while investigating reports of Bludhound's appearance in VB.
Getting the Takoboxes as well, but since they stack to 999, they don't bug me as much as STO lockboxes (that only stack to 10, and thus fill up the ol' inventory real fast). They annoy me, but it's hardly a game-breaker...
999. I noticed that immediately. Does anything else in the game stack to 999?
Kind of made me set a goal to see if I could actually gather that many. I'm thinking of then putting the full stack of 999 up on the AH for a single Local just see if anyone would take that deal. Yeah, I know. I'm weird like that.
Yeah they created this new currency (questionite) then promptly abandoned it. Heres an idea, what if they actually added stuff to it instead of creating yet another type of loot/currency :rolleyes:
Drifter Salvage is hardly new currency. It came out at the tail-end of the On Alert updates.
I have absolutely zero confirmation, but I haven't heard anything about it only being in the Drifter store for a limited time... but the flip side is that they are in the Halloween Store tab. I'll ask the devs about that tomorrow -- they may not have a plan for it yet, though.
Yeah they created this new currency (questionite) then promptly abandoned it. Heres an idea, what if they actually added stuff to it instead of creating yet another type of loot/currency :rolleyes:
The Q-Store has been periodically updated, including three Halloween be-critters this week.
Asked Stokeman, and there is currently no end date for the Legacy items in the Drifter Salvage store. They may get rotated out eventually, but not for the near future certainly.
The Q-Store has been periodically updated, including three Halloween be-critters this week.
I dont consider adding things that have been available by other means for ages, such that most people that want them already have them as adding new things to the q store, not to mention that in the adding of it to the q store they removed it from the zen store and increased its cost, yeah thats supporting the q store - moving an old few hundred zen/global item there and charging 200,000 questionite !
Especially when new things ARE added but as a totally new loot/currency that could have perfectly well gone into it, instead of double hiding it behind a zen payment AND then having a gamble mechanic as well!
Or how about the legacy stuff, that you double hide in the same way, needing multiple zen store purchases to have a chance of getting what you want as its a RANDOM item!
As someone pointed out earlier, the least they could have done is made the keys available as a rare drop. Even something as severe as 1 out of 250 or 500 would have worked. The way this thing is set up makes the majority of players feel excluded, and that's not really wise for a holiday event. The Halloween event they had last year was way better than this mess.
Asked Stokeman, and there is currently no end date for the Legacy items in the Drifter Salvage store. They may get rotated out eventually, but not for the near future certainly.
...Asked Stokeman, and there is currently no end date for the Legacy items in the Drifter Salvage store. They may get rotated out eventually, but not for the near future certainly.
Yay.
Now people can spend multiple paychecks to fill their device slots with Teleiosaurus Pheromones. Because all the cool kids have 5x raptor spawners active at the same time.
EDIT: Well actually 6x raptor spawners if they were awesome enough to get the real thing before the gear change. Just add AoED + Commander tree for crit chance bonuses and win!
Now people can spend multiple paychecks to fill their device slots with Teleiosaurus Pheromones. Because all the cool kids have 5x raptor spawners active at the same time.
EDIT: Well actually 6x raptor spawners if they were awesome enough to get the real thing before the gear change. Just add AoED + Commander tree for crit chance bonuses and win!
No. 5x3=15 raptor spawners active at the same time. With all other Power Pets.
All Mods price has been heavy fall in stock prices, No one buying / using Safegurd Catalyst for fuse, G-Zen-Q balance all broken, Some very few ppl have super OPs and those balance will never be fixed (impossible anymore), Costume box are now sold in Drifter 60 random drop. I think I will never get what I needed I could get them just by 5000 mobs kill before...
I spend 100$ in 2 days and I feel this will be the last time to spend my real money...
[Takofanes' Cache of Treasures] became worst grab bag just in 1 day. By fix they done to drop rate.
Assuming the device is like the original you'll probably never see more than 9 raptors per device. I ran the original pheromones for close to two years and never saw more than 9 raptors at once so it's a fair bet. 45 equal level pets at the lost cost of at *least* 120 salvage (assuming you somehow got two per device box twice and your third box had another)... or you might end up starving yourself and getting kicked out of your apartment by spending all your money on keys/bags and never getting what you want.
Asked Stokeman, and there is currently no end date for the Legacy items in the Drifter Salvage store. They may get rotated out eventually, but not for the near future certainly.
Well you say that, but I can't help but notice that they are listed in the newly added "Halloween Store" and not the "Standard Store".
When GC said we'd get the devices in a vendor, I think the majority of us were under the impression we'd actually be able to choose what legacy devices or costume unlocks we wanted.
At any rate, I'm actually thankful as replacing a standard drop with a grabbag that costs 1 dollar to open makes it easier for folks like myself to let go. In the year I've been a part of the CO community, my experience has gotten progressively worse, not better.
What's really disappointing is that since alert hit, CO has progressively gotten better at alienating the player base. The pvp community took the worst of it, but pve is anything but unscathed. So much more money could be made by providing a quality product as opposed to this constant dependence on gambling mechanisms.
pfffft ive spent so much money into champions and now they ad lockboxes...
that was teh reason iv left sto...well maybe ill not play as much anymore here now...
How many times must it be said that the lockboxes aren't REPLACING any drops, but are an addition?
In 1 run TT yesterday, our party has gotten 3 green drops 4 blues ( boss drops excluded ), the REST of the items were lockboxes ( around 23 boxes in total ). You obviously did not do any testing. Remember ( i love saying this btw ) by repeating a lie, the truth will still remain the truth regardless of if it is in a minority of one or not. Go out, kill monsters, compare before / after, come back and tell me what you noticed.
How many times must it be said that the lockboxes aren't REPLACING any drops, but are an addition?
A thought though, wouldn't adding things to a loot table cause the automatic adjustment of percentage likelyhood of all other things in a loot table?
Not that the lockboxes bother me, really. Just a thought that popped into my head on seeing this.
In 1 run TT yesterday, our party has gotten 3 green drops 4 blues ( boss drops excluded ), the REST of the items were lockboxes ( around 23 boxes in total ). You obviously did not do any testing. Remember ( i love saying this btw ) by repeating a lie, the truth will still remain the truth regardless of if it is in a minority of one or not. Go out, kill monsters, compare before / after, come back and tell me what you noticed.
So far, it's felt like that non-lockbox items are dropping at the same frequency. At least, my inventory has been filling up at the same rate. I also have had loot drop with lockboxes. So I will nod in agreement with TT when he says that the lockbox drop independently and aren't part of the regular loot table.
I do agree that it'd be nice if the lockboxes and recog (oh, most definitely recog) were auto-looted. Other items (gear, mods), I'm happy to have not auto-loot.
In 1 run TT yesterday, our party has gotten 3 green drops 4 blues ( boss drops excluded ), the REST of the items were lockboxes ( around 23 boxes in total ). You obviously did not do any testing. Remember ( i love saying this btw ) by repeating a lie, the truth will still remain the truth regardless of if it is in a minority of one or not. Go out, kill monsters, compare before / after, come back and tell me what you noticed.
I have had single enemies drop both regular items AND lockboxes at the same time. Your conclusion would suggest that said enemies were dropping 2 non-lockbox items previously, which they simply were not. Therefore, the lockboxes must be dropping in addition to regular drops.
<::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::)xxxxxxxx(:::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> "Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
Why do the lock boxes exist? They should have just been put in the Z Store where they would have to be paid for anyways.
People spend far more on keys than they would on the items themselves. Basically, gamers tend to lack impulse control and game companies will gladly catch any money thrown at them.
I'm fine with this. Buyer beware and all of that. But the money STO got for it went to a useless waste of time. I'd be sad if the money for the CO lockboxes was used in a similar way instead of ... um, maybe bug fixes?
The Q-Store has been periodically updated, including three Halloween be-critters this week.
I know you haven't been here around last Halloween but those Halloween Be-Critter *updates* aren't anything new. As well as the fact, i highly doubt anyone will actually buy it from the Q-store when people who still have it can just sell it off because of how badly they were handled from the On-Alert patch. Which would also factor in to why people won't buy these devices as much any more.
And i disagree that adding old imbalanced items to the Q-store is a way to go as justifying keeping it in use. Especially when they also go up in cost to acquire too.
I'm not blaming you for any of this though, if the way i type might somehow seem otherwise, just whoever it is that actually decides what goes into the Q-Store, and think they need to better evaluate how to run it.
2 class societies are not good, if you say it is then you are... nvm.
I said nothing about, "2 class societies."
The treasure chests killed the drop rate of every other item, it killed the Q exchange, which used to be unreasonably high already before the latest patch. It made some of my friends play other games in less than 24h, etc. I mean seriously every drop is a lockbox now, this cannot be intentionally and if it was, what is the purpose? Expanding the gap between silver and gold players further? Lockboxes would not bother me at all, if it did not replace other / better / more useful drops such as mods for example.
Did it replace ? We were told otherwise, perhaps, if your statement is accurate, this is a bug ?
I find encouraging people to spend Zen for for cosmic keys to have a chance at obtaining items that they want / can use / need is reprehensible. Part of what I'll say below is repeated but I wanted to express how dissatisfied and disappointed with the direction that CO has taken with this.
I've recently come back to actively playing CO (I would still always tinker in the costume creator) so I'm getting acquainted with the changes since I was last here.
As a lifetime supporter I had some Zen built up and while I generally abhor gambling, I bought a couple of keys to see how it works and what I'd get etc.
While this came out of my Zen allocation, I still felt horribly ripped off so I can only imagine how people might feel if they're actually spending real money on this.
I love the availability of purchasable costume packs, travel powers and a few of the other bits and pieces but I find it morally objectionable to encourage gambling. While I'm assuming most of us are informed adults, there will be kids playing this game that may just go and ask their parents to add more $$ to play the game - with the parent not knowing that the kid is gambling away $$.
Shameful.
I find encouraging people to spend Zen for for cosmic keys to have a chance at obtaining items that they want / can use / need is reprehensible. Part of what I'll say below is repeated but I wanted to express how dissatisfied and disappointed with the direction that CO has taken with this.
I've recently come back to actively playing CO (I would still always tinker in the costume creator) so I'm getting acquainted with the changes since I was last here.
As a lifetime supporter I had some Zen built up and while I generally abhor gambling, I bought a couple of keys to see how it works and what I'd get etc.
While this came out of my Zen allocation, I still felt horribly ripped off so I can only imagine how people might feel if they're actually spending real money on this.
I love the availability of purchasable costume packs, travel powers and a few of the other bits and pieces but I find it morally objectionable to encourage gambling. While I'm assuming most of us are informed adults, there will be kids playing this game that may just go and ask their parents to add more $$ to play the game - with the parent not knowing that the kid is gambling away $$.
Shameful.
I guess part of the reason I am not overtly opposed to this model (though I dont particularly like it either) is that it has been around in collectible card games for a couple of decades now. For that matter baseball cards have been random chance per packet since the mid to late 1800's.
Ultimately, "but kids might encounter it," could be used as an excuse to disallow many (if not most) forms of entertainment in which adults participate.
I guess part of the reason I am not overtly opposed to this model (though I dont particularly like it either) is that it has been around in collectible card games for a couple of decades now. For that matter baseball cards have been random chance per packet since the mid to late 1800's.
Ultimately, "but kids might encounter it," could be used as an excuse to disallow many (if not most) forms of entertainment in which adults participate.
Or, in the words of Jubal Harshaw in Heinlein's Stranger In a Strange Land, "The whole principle is wrong; it's like demanding that grown men live on skim milk because the baby can't eat steak."
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
Or, in the words of Jubal Harshaw in Heinlein's Stranger In a Strange Land, "The whole principle is wrong; it's like demanding that grown men live on skim milk because the baby can't eat steak."
Thank you for this. I havent read Stranger in a Strange Land (my second favorite work of fiction) in entirely too long. I am getting it off of the shelf tonight.
I guess part of the reason I am not overtly opposed to this model (though I dont particularly like it either) is that it has been around in collectible card games for a couple of decades now. For that matter baseball cards have been random chance per packet since the mid to late 1800's.
Ultimately, "but kids might encounter it," could be used as an excuse to disallow many (if not most) forms of entertainment in which adults participate.
You're talking about Grab bags. those do work as a collectible card game 'cause you went to the store and you bought a set knowing that it was a gamble. The drop boxes (while technically the same thing) don't work like that. As someone said earlier, gamers are impulsive, and as soon as they get something they want to look at it. Another thing is not everyone goes to the Z store to look at what was released this week, but when you get a weird looking drop you've never gotten before you start asking questions. They knew what they were doing. But again if the money they get from gamblers is put to good use, and I'm talking a real content update, the Foundry, the sidekick system, a nemesis update (as in creator not missions) then it'll be worth it. I always say if the Foundry shows up on CO I might go LT.
I guess part of the reason I am not overtly opposed to this model (though I dont particularly like it either) is that it has been around in collectible card games for a couple of decades now. For that matter baseball cards have been random chance per packet since the mid to late 1800's.
Ultimately, "but kids might encounter it," could be used as an excuse to disallow many (if not most) forms of entertainment in which adults participate.
Let me see if i get the comparisons right:
Collectible Cards
>buy a random pack of cards-because obviously you want to try to get some cards
>get only cards-excluding that blank cardboard in the back to keep them from being bent.
>don't get a random marble or dinosaurs toy-because it's a card pack, duh.
Grab bags
>Buy a grab bag because you want the top tier NEW items added in it.
>Get only heaps of old junk.
>Don't get a single thing of what you were aiming for.
I really don't see how you come up with your conclusion that collectible cards scam people of their money in the same way cryptic do. Because at least when you buy a pack of those cards, you know it's always going to be a card. but as for these Crap bags? The only thing they will guarantee is salvage... which is very minimal at best. out of 2 lock boxes, i got only salvage, nothing else. With cards, at least you could trade away any repeats you get. What am i going to do with 4 salvage? 8 more keys to be able to afford something with 20 salvage? forget it.
Had the ability to trade any individual card for another without restriction.
There was no subscription or lifetime membership fee.
Came with cards that were useful to anyone.
Were based entirely on chances, luck, and trading.
Only ridiculously and intentionally rare cards couldn't be bought for a few bucks
Did not halt production of standalone decks and expansions to focus entirely on the 5 Card add-packs.
Did not require you to buy an add-pack you didn't care about to get old cards from previous decks.
You never opened a pack and got less cards than the guy who bought a pack before you.
And most importantly:
I'm not playing a collectable card game. I'm playing a Massive Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Game. The only common thing between the two is the word 'game'- but Call of Doodie, Yahtzee, Football, and Lady-Whalin' are also games. The entire premise of Collectable Card games was based on gambles and chances, just like collecting baseball cards.
I won't even go as far as to say I hate Grab Bags. But this is my idea of Grab Bags based on a real-world Metaphor from my childhood (And Halloween!):
The most AWESOME old lady on my Grandma's street was a German woman who'd actually survived the Holocaust and spent time in a concentration camp for working as a Dental Assistant to a Jewish Dentist. She made grab bags for kids.
In the grab bag, she put the same items- one little toy (those little plastic robots, space ships, monsters, and vehicles from the Chinese vending companies), something chocolate, something fruity, some peanuts/cashews/almonds/pistachios/sunflower seeds, a couple of pencils, and a toothbrush and some floss. No grab bag had less. No grab bag had more.
THAT is what I hate about Grab Bags. The 'Gamble Bags' are more of a lottery and a game of chance. If EVERY grab bag came with A costume piece, a set number of mods, a piece of gear, and a temp device (or some other arrangement of the catagories)- and let me define this: Everyone who gets a grab bag is getting an X, Y, and a Z of some sort, then not only would I be fine with them- I'd support it.
So far the only time that I think Grab Bags were done decently was when the Mountain Grab Bags were available.
Had the ability to trade any individual card for another without restriction.
There was no subscription or lifetime membership fee.
Came with cards that were useful to anyone.
Were based entirely on chances, luck, and trading.
Only ridiculously and intentionally rare cards couldn't be bought for a few bucks
Did not halt production of standalone decks and expansions to focus entirely on the 5 Card add-packs.
Did not require you to buy an add-pack you didn't care about to get old cards from previous decks.
You never opened a pack and got less cards than the guy who bought a pack before you.
And most importantly:
I'm not playing a collectable card game. I'm playing a Massive Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Game. The only common thing between the two is the word 'game'- but Call of Doodie, Yahtzee, Football, and Lady-Whalin' are also games. The entire premise of Collectable Card games was based on gambles and chances, just like collecting baseball cards.
I won't even go as far as to say I hate Grab Bags. But this is my idea of Grab Bags based on a real-world Metaphor from my childhood (And Halloween!):
The most AWESOME old lady on my Grandma's street was a German woman who'd actually survived the Holocaust and spent time in a concentration camp for working as a Dental Assistant to a Jewish Dentist. She made grab bags for kids.
In the grab bag, she put the same items- one little toy (those little plastic robots, space ships, monsters, and vehicles from the Chinese vending companies), something chocolate, something fruity, some peanuts/cashews/almonds/pistachios/sunflower seeds, a couple of pencils, and a toothbrush and some floss. No grab bag had less. No grab bag had more.
THAT is what I hate about Grab Bags. The 'Gamble Bags' are more of a lottery and a game of chance. If EVERY grab bag came with A costume piece, a set number of mods, a piece of gear, and a temp device (or some other arrangement of the catagories)- and let me define this: Everyone who gets a grab bag is getting an X, Y, and a Z of some sort, then not only would I be fine with them- I'd support it.
So far the only time that I think Grab Bags were done decently was when the Mountain Grab Bags were available.
Thank you so much, your card points express what i was trying to say in better detail.
How many times must it be said that the lockboxes aren't REPLACING any drops, but are an addition?
Those aren't the numbers I've been seeing. It's particularly a sad sight when everything you loot is a sea of boxes and one or two "normal" drops.
Considering I was killing nothing but a group of destroids in resistance repeatedly, there's no way I would have made it an entire level without filling up the bags (short of double xp). When you've hit 40 17 times, these things are pretty noticeable. That and the fact that out of all the picks, there was all of 3-4 mods in that entire run from 34-35. I was getting that many from full unity runs just days before, and I killed a whole lot less.
I'm not sure why you are feeling so certain that these lockboxes aren't replacing drops, unless you're relying on dev word or something. And as I've seen "devspeak" here fail to come to pass, I would recommend you think twice before accepting it as fact.
Those aren't the numbers I've been seeing. It's particularly a sad sight when everything you loot is a sea of boxes and one or two "normal" drops.
Considering I was killing nothing but a group of destroids in resistance repeatedly, there's no way I would have made it an entire level without filling up the bags (short of double xp). When you've hit 40 17 times, these things are pretty noticeable. That and the fact that out of all the picks, there was all of 3-4 mods in that entire run from 34-35. I was getting that many from full unity runs just days before, and I killed a whole lot less.
I'm not sure why you are feeling so certain that these lockboxes aren't replacing drops, unless you're relying on dev word or something. And as I've seen "devspeak" here fail to come to pass, I would recommend you think twice before accepting it as fact.
I'd have to agree with this.
I normally get lots of mods and other junk during Therakial's Temple. with these Mock-Boxes, they stopped, only had about 3 non box drops.
ALSO. which genuis Dev thought it was be smart to make it so you can NOT edit box drops with need/greed loot mode?
Mock-Boxes, which proves more evident in this rage, are White drops, yet even with purple threshold for loot triggering need/greed mode in team looting. it still spams the fricking screen, which is why i know for a damn fact it replaces drops because every 2 seconds in combat it pops up
Well, Secks, I'm taking their word for it because I'm still seeing normal drops in the usual proportions, and I'm seeing a fair number of times when the stupid lockboxes are dropping at the same time as the useless greens that I can then vend. In my bags, and in my experience, I'm getting more pointless crap my toons can't really use, not less.
And Skyfire's still getting those costume drops from the gangs in VB, too. Yesterday I added the Sovereign Sons upper-body paint to my collection.
Maybe the RNG hates you lately, since the drops are essentially random? Or maybe, if this is based on the one TT run (not sure - this argument is starting to get confusing), a single data point does not a trend make?
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
Another way in which these grab bags (and boxes) are not like CCGs is that most CCGs have guaranteed amounts of rarity in each pack.
That is to say, if you buy a booster of Magic: The Gathering, you're guaranteed to get X common, Y uncommon, and Z rare cards. Different cards are useful for different players, but Wizards (who make MTG) make a reasonable effort to ensure that all the cards of a specific rarity are roughly equal in value. If people figure out combinations that make certain cards extra good, those cards will get bumped up in rarity in the next edition. The system works well because, while you may only get one rare card per pack, the chances of getting any particular card are equal. The boxes do not guarantee anything, and as was said before, the most common prizes are useless junk (which, as a bonus, are obliterating the mod market).
As for the boxes replacing normal loot, this was something that was brought up in STO and proven to be false. In STO's case, the loot boxes are basically a separate roll of the RNG, and there's really no reason for them to be otherwise in CO.
Well, Secks, I'm taking their word for it because I'm still seeing normal drops in the usual proportions, and I'm seeing a fair number of times when the stupid lockboxes are dropping at the same time as the useless greens that I can then vend. In my bags, and in my experience, I'm getting more pointless crap my toons can't really use, not less.
And Skyfire's still getting those costume drops from the gangs in VB, too. Yesterday I added the Sovereign Sons upper-body paint to my collection.
Maybe the RNG hates you lately, since the drops are essentially random? Or maybe, if this is based on the one TT run (not sure - this argument is starting to get confusing), a single data point does not a trend make?
if that last line as for me, i've run TT several times since the boxes, the box spam is constant, but everything else is virtually gone.
Well, Secks, I'm taking their word for it because I'm still seeing normal drops in the usual proportions, and I'm seeing a fair number of times when the stupid lockboxes are dropping at the same time as the useless greens that I can then vend. In my bags, and in my experience, I'm getting more pointless crap my toons can't really use, not less.
And Skyfire's still getting those costume drops from the gangs in VB, too. Yesterday I added the Sovereign Sons upper-body paint to my collection.
Maybe the RNG hates you lately, since the drops are essentially random? Or maybe, if this is based on the one TT run (not sure - this argument is starting to get confusing), a single data point does not a trend make?
Just remember "they" told us CTPs and legacy costumes unlocks and afs would be in a vendor - and that was months ago. CTPS are long gone now (and I do hold a grudge with GC for telling us folks that we'd be able to get CTPS post-alert only to have to grind out 3 of them 2 weeks before alert hit because they weren't. And "they" also didn't give us any impression that we'd now be gambling for said legacy items, but a direct purchase from a vendor.
Normally most of my drops are junk, pure vendor trash. It's simply taking far longer to fill up on said vendor trash. The frequency of the boxes has me not wanting to loot at all - which means I might as well pvp or log, and well pvp is... dead.
There are three answers to this. First is that grab bags and lock boxes make money. Champions Online is ultimately a business, and we have to follow the money. It's the honest truth. We have to judge the best way to package content. Sometimes this is even to give it away for free, like the Comic Series and Adventure Packs ultimately were.
Second is that there will definitely still be content outside of boxes. We did just release the Shadow Wings, and updated the Q-Store with three items that used to be ZEN-only.
Third is that I don't think we've even approached the threshold of pay to win. MODs are helpful, but I hardly think they're game-breaking. And the grand prize of the lock box is a be-critter, which I consider a vanity item. If you feel this is approaching pay to win, I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on how that is, because it's helpful feedback.
Well, the purple upgrades that is at same level as silver champion items with 4 slots (pretends I did not buy keys and have 2 of these :rolleyes: ) that is only available though paying with real money is pretty much p2w...
[SIGPIC]
[/SIGPIC]
A test server is supposed to be used to properly test patches before patching anything....
A thought though, wouldn't adding things to a loot table cause the automatic adjustment of percentage likelyhood of all other things in a loot table?
Not that the lockboxes bother me, really. Just a thought that popped into my head on seeing this.
Here is my understanding (though it could be wrong): There are two separate tables, rather than adding it to the existing table. Roll 1d100, that's the main rewards; roll 1d100, that's your chance of the getting a lock box.
1) Going over the last UNTIL report (which by the way where is our Ask Cryptic/State of the Game/New UNTIL report?) there was no mention that this was even a twinkle in Cryptc's eye.
2) Looking over at STO their keys (125ZP for 1 or 1125ZP for 10) are higher priced than ours. Can we assume that our price will also skyrocket in the future?
3) I hope that Mr.Turtle is letting the higher-ups know that the forums are exploding over this new addition and that it needs to be addressed.
4) If you guys must have the lockbox system in the game can you not also allow keys to very rarely be able to be looted in the game as well?
Lastly this is to the community. If you don't want this system don't buy the keys. Vote with your dollar and maybe it will go away.
Comments
Time: exactly 1 hour
Mobs destroyed: 1311
Takoboxes: 62
UNTIL Recog: 43
Resources: 5g 43s 28l
Mods (Rank 4): 20
Mods (Rank 5): 7
Gear (Green): 35
Gear (Blue, no slot): 4
Gear (Blue, 2 slots): 4
Gear (Purple, no slot): 3
Call Up A Trey Kings Gang War: 2
Costume Unlock: 1
So that's a Takobox drop every 58 seconds at the rate I was killing, or approximately 21 mobs. They drop more often than recognition. Make of that what you will. Mods were dropping every ~48 mobs, and gear every ~28.
I will say that I wish Takoboxes and recognition both were auto-looted.
@brainstem
I do agree that it'd be nice if the lockboxes and recog (oh, most definitely recog) were auto-looted. Other items (gear, mods), I'm happy to have not auto-loot.
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Getting the Takoboxes as well, but since they stack to 999, they don't bug me as much as STO lockboxes (that only stack to 10, and thus fill up the ol' inventory real fast). They annoy me, but it's hardly a game-breaker...
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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I for one, am going to leave the magic boxes ALONE. Too many horror movies has told me what happens when you leave mystic artefacts clogging up your storage areas. Leave it where it is for the mystic division of the police to clean up when they do a post-Alert cleanup.
Kind of made me set a goal to see if I could actually gather that many. I'm thinking of then putting the full stack of 999 up on the AH for a single Local just see if anyone would take that deal. Yeah, I know. I'm weird like that.
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And playing by myself since Aug 2009
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Any new news about that, TT?
The Q-Store has been periodically updated, including three Halloween be-critters this week.
Asked Stokeman, and there is currently no end date for the Legacy items in the Drifter Salvage store. They may get rotated out eventually, but not for the near future certainly.
I dont consider adding things that have been available by other means for ages, such that most people that want them already have them as adding new things to the q store, not to mention that in the adding of it to the q store they removed it from the zen store and increased its cost, yeah thats supporting the q store - moving an old few hundred zen/global item there and charging 200,000 questionite !
Especially when new things ARE added but as a totally new loot/currency that could have perfectly well gone into it, instead of double hiding it behind a zen payment AND then having a gamble mechanic as well!
Or how about the legacy stuff, that you double hide in the same way, needing multiple zen store purchases to have a chance of getting what you want as its a RANDOM item!
I thank you for the update. I appreciate it.
Now people can spend multiple paychecks to fill their device slots with Teleiosaurus Pheromones. Because all the cool kids have 5x raptor spawners active at the same time.
EDIT: Well actually 6x raptor spawners if they were awesome enough to get the real thing before the gear change. Just add AoED + Commander tree for crit chance bonuses and win!
No. 5x3=15 raptor spawners active at the same time. With all other Power Pets.
I spend 100$ in 2 days and I feel this will be the last time to spend my real money...
[Takofanes' Cache of Treasures] became worst grab bag just in 1 day. By fix they done to drop rate.
Just sad.
RNG is fun!
Well you say that, but I can't help but notice that they are listed in the newly added "Halloween Store" and not the "Standard Store".
Perhaps you can better define "near future"?
People are broken. - Lum the Mad
At any rate, I'm actually thankful as replacing a standard drop with a grabbag that costs 1 dollar to open makes it easier for folks like myself to let go. In the year I've been a part of the CO community, my experience has gotten progressively worse, not better.
What's really disappointing is that since alert hit, CO has progressively gotten better at alienating the player base. The pvp community took the worst of it, but pve is anything but unscathed. So much more money could be made by providing a quality product as opposed to this constant dependence on gambling mechanisms.
that was teh reason iv left sto...well maybe ill not play as much anymore here now...
So many PRE/INT/EGO mods at rank 5 xD
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In 1 run TT yesterday, our party has gotten 3 green drops 4 blues ( boss drops excluded ), the REST of the items were lockboxes ( around 23 boxes in total ). You obviously did not do any testing. Remember ( i love saying this btw ) by repeating a lie, the truth will still remain the truth regardless of if it is in a minority of one or not. Go out, kill monsters, compare before / after, come back and tell me what you noticed.
Not that the lockboxes bother me, really. Just a thought that popped into my head on seeing this.
....
As I have posted earlier in this thread:
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I have had single enemies drop both regular items AND lockboxes at the same time. Your conclusion would suggest that said enemies were dropping 2 non-lockbox items previously, which they simply were not. Therefore, the lockboxes must be dropping in addition to regular drops.
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People spend far more on keys than they would on the items themselves. Basically, gamers tend to lack impulse control and game companies will gladly catch any money thrown at them.
I'm fine with this. Buyer beware and all of that. But the money STO got for it went to a useless waste of time. I'd be sad if the money for the CO lockboxes was used in a similar way instead of ... um, maybe bug fixes?
Wait? Whaaaa..?
I know you haven't been here around last Halloween but those Halloween Be-Critter *updates* aren't anything new. As well as the fact, i highly doubt anyone will actually buy it from the Q-store when people who still have it can just sell it off because of how badly they were handled from the On-Alert patch. Which would also factor in to why people won't buy these devices as much any more.
And i disagree that adding old imbalanced items to the Q-store is a way to go as justifying keeping it in use. Especially when they also go up in cost to acquire too.
I'm not blaming you for any of this though, if the way i type might somehow seem otherwise, just whoever it is that actually decides what goes into the Q-Store, and think they need to better evaluate how to run it.
Responses above.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
I've recently come back to actively playing CO (I would still always tinker in the costume creator) so I'm getting acquainted with the changes since I was last here.
As a lifetime supporter I had some Zen built up and while I generally abhor gambling, I bought a couple of keys to see how it works and what I'd get etc.
While this came out of my Zen allocation, I still felt horribly ripped off so I can only imagine how people might feel if they're actually spending real money on this.
I love the availability of purchasable costume packs, travel powers and a few of the other bits and pieces but I find it morally objectionable to encourage gambling. While I'm assuming most of us are informed adults, there will be kids playing this game that may just go and ask their parents to add more $$ to play the game - with the parent not knowing that the kid is gambling away $$.
Shameful.
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I guess part of the reason I am not overtly opposed to this model (though I dont particularly like it either) is that it has been around in collectible card games for a couple of decades now. For that matter baseball cards have been random chance per packet since the mid to late 1800's.
Ultimately, "but kids might encounter it," could be used as an excuse to disallow many (if not most) forms of entertainment in which adults participate.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
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Thank you for this. I havent read Stranger in a Strange Land (my second favorite work of fiction) in entirely too long. I am getting it off of the shelf tonight.
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
You're talking about Grab bags. those do work as a collectible card game 'cause you went to the store and you bought a set knowing that it was a gamble. The drop boxes (while technically the same thing) don't work like that. As someone said earlier, gamers are impulsive, and as soon as they get something they want to look at it. Another thing is not everyone goes to the Z store to look at what was released this week, but when you get a weird looking drop you've never gotten before you start asking questions. They knew what they were doing. But again if the money they get from gamblers is put to good use, and I'm talking a real content update, the Foundry, the sidekick system, a nemesis update (as in creator not missions) then it'll be worth it. I always say if the Foundry shows up on CO I might go LT.
Let me see if i get the comparisons right:
Collectible Cards
>buy a random pack of cards-because obviously you want to try to get some cards
>get only cards-excluding that blank cardboard in the back to keep them from being bent.
>don't get a random marble or dinosaurs toy-because it's a card pack, duh.
Grab bags
>Buy a grab bag because you want the top tier NEW items added in it.
>Get only heaps of old junk.
>Don't get a single thing of what you were aiming for.
I really don't see how you come up with your conclusion that collectible cards scam people of their money in the same way cryptic do. Because at least when you buy a pack of those cards, you know it's always going to be a card. but as for these Crap bags? The only thing they will guarantee is salvage... which is very minimal at best. out of 2 lock boxes, i got only salvage, nothing else. With cards, at least you could trade away any repeats you get. What am i going to do with 4 salvage? 8 more keys to be able to afford something with 20 salvage? forget it.
Had the ability to trade any individual card for another without restriction.
There was no subscription or lifetime membership fee.
Came with cards that were useful to anyone.
Were based entirely on chances, luck, and trading.
Only ridiculously and intentionally rare cards couldn't be bought for a few bucks
Did not halt production of standalone decks and expansions to focus entirely on the 5 Card add-packs.
Did not require you to buy an add-pack you didn't care about to get old cards from previous decks.
You never opened a pack and got less cards than the guy who bought a pack before you.
And most importantly:
I'm not playing a collectable card game. I'm playing a Massive Multiplayer Online Role-Playing Game. The only common thing between the two is the word 'game'- but Call of Doodie, Yahtzee, Football, and Lady-Whalin' are also games. The entire premise of Collectable Card games was based on gambles and chances, just like collecting baseball cards.
I won't even go as far as to say I hate Grab Bags. But this is my idea of Grab Bags based on a real-world Metaphor from my childhood (And Halloween!):
The most AWESOME old lady on my Grandma's street was a German woman who'd actually survived the Holocaust and spent time in a concentration camp for working as a Dental Assistant to a Jewish Dentist. She made grab bags for kids.
In the grab bag, she put the same items- one little toy (those little plastic robots, space ships, monsters, and vehicles from the Chinese vending companies), something chocolate, something fruity, some peanuts/cashews/almonds/pistachios/sunflower seeds, a couple of pencils, and a toothbrush and some floss. No grab bag had less. No grab bag had more.
THAT is what I hate about Grab Bags. The 'Gamble Bags' are more of a lottery and a game of chance. If EVERY grab bag came with A costume piece, a set number of mods, a piece of gear, and a temp device (or some other arrangement of the catagories)- and let me define this: Everyone who gets a grab bag is getting an X, Y, and a Z of some sort, then not only would I be fine with them- I'd support it.
So far the only time that I think Grab Bags were done decently was when the Mountain Grab Bags were available.
Thank you so much, your card points express what i was trying to say in better detail.
Those aren't the numbers I've been seeing. It's particularly a sad sight when everything you loot is a sea of boxes and one or two "normal" drops.
Considering I was killing nothing but a group of destroids in resistance repeatedly, there's no way I would have made it an entire level without filling up the bags (short of double xp). When you've hit 40 17 times, these things are pretty noticeable. That and the fact that out of all the picks, there was all of 3-4 mods in that entire run from 34-35. I was getting that many from full unity runs just days before, and I killed a whole lot less.
I'm not sure why you are feeling so certain that these lockboxes aren't replacing drops, unless you're relying on dev word or something. And as I've seen "devspeak" here fail to come to pass, I would recommend you think twice before accepting it as fact.
I'd have to agree with this.
I normally get lots of mods and other junk during Therakial's Temple. with these Mock-Boxes, they stopped, only had about 3 non box drops.
ALSO. which genuis Dev thought it was be smart to make it so you can NOT edit box drops with need/greed loot mode?
Mock-Boxes, which proves more evident in this rage, are White drops, yet even with purple threshold for loot triggering need/greed mode in team looting. it still spams the fricking screen, which is why i know for a damn fact it replaces drops because every 2 seconds in combat it pops up
And Skyfire's still getting those costume drops from the gangs in VB, too. Yesterday I added the Sovereign Sons upper-body paint to my collection.
Maybe the RNG hates you lately, since the drops are essentially random? Or maybe, if this is based on the one TT run (not sure - this argument is starting to get confusing), a single data point does not a trend make?
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That is to say, if you buy a booster of Magic: The Gathering, you're guaranteed to get X common, Y uncommon, and Z rare cards. Different cards are useful for different players, but Wizards (who make MTG) make a reasonable effort to ensure that all the cards of a specific rarity are roughly equal in value. If people figure out combinations that make certain cards extra good, those cards will get bumped up in rarity in the next edition. The system works well because, while you may only get one rare card per pack, the chances of getting any particular card are equal. The boxes do not guarantee anything, and as was said before, the most common prizes are useless junk (which, as a bonus, are obliterating the mod market).
As for the boxes replacing normal loot, this was something that was brought up in STO and proven to be false. In STO's case, the loot boxes are basically a separate roll of the RNG, and there's really no reason for them to be otherwise in CO.
if that last line as for me, i've run TT several times since the boxes, the box spam is constant, but everything else is virtually gone.
Just remember "they" told us CTPs and legacy costumes unlocks and afs would be in a vendor - and that was months ago. CTPS are long gone now (and I do hold a grudge with GC for telling us folks that we'd be able to get CTPS post-alert only to have to grind out 3 of them 2 weeks before alert hit because they weren't. And "they" also didn't give us any impression that we'd now be gambling for said legacy items, but a direct purchase from a vendor.
Normally most of my drops are junk, pure vendor trash. It's simply taking far longer to fill up on said vendor trash. The frequency of the boxes has me not wanting to loot at all - which means I might as well pvp or log, and well pvp is... dead.
Well, the purple upgrades that is at same level as silver champion items with 4 slots (pretends I did not buy keys and have 2 of these :rolleyes: ) that is only available though paying with real money is pretty much p2w...
[/SIGPIC]
A test server is supposed to be used to properly test patches before patching anything....
Here is my understanding (though it could be wrong): There are two separate tables, rather than adding it to the existing table. Roll 1d100, that's the main rewards; roll 1d100, that's your chance of the getting a lock box.
1) Going over the last UNTIL report (which by the way where is our Ask Cryptic/State of the Game/New UNTIL report?) there was no mention that this was even a twinkle in Cryptc's eye.
2) Looking over at STO their keys (125ZP for 1 or 1125ZP for 10) are higher priced than ours. Can we assume that our price will also skyrocket in the future?
3) I hope that Mr.Turtle is letting the higher-ups know that the forums are exploding over this new addition and that it needs to be addressed.
4) If you guys must have the lockbox system in the game can you not also allow keys to very rarely be able to be looted in the game as well?
Lastly this is to the community. If you don't want this system don't buy the keys. Vote with your dollar and maybe it will go away.
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