If you do change the animiation or fx on Burst Ray is there any chance we could get a 'SMG burst' like power for particle rifle?
There is a (very good) chance that (at some point) we will make another Particle Rifle power, and a cone/spray attack would be fairly likely. However, it won't be happening with this new set of powers right now.
Passing thought/question: What would it do to the costing of the power to be used while held, a la Force Eruption and Sparkstorm? With the feeling that you're putting overwhelming power into the attack, it'd be slick.
Using things while held is a pretty big deal, and not something we like to hand out very often, as is probably pretty obvious. I'm not sure it's something we'd want to add to this power, but it's something we can think about if we aren't happy with it.
Ame this is minor suggestion but how about energy wave instead of being a charged pbaoe be a maintained pbaoe along with the ranks and advatages we the players choose then followed by the cooldown and whatever else. OR another option could be to give it an optional adv to change it to a maintained power then followed by the cooldown. We got more than enough charged pbaoes imo but not a whole lot of maintained ones as far as I can remember, would be nice to have at least one just as long as it has a cooldown along with it so it's not too powerful. Just a thought is all
We aren't terribly big on maintained powers with cooldown times, as it frequently can just "feel bad" to have your maintained end early and then go on cooldown. Obviously, this can happen with charge powers as well, but it's not nearly as common and it's easier to get a good feel for how much energy you need for a full charge than it is for a full maintain, and charges are also less likely to get interrupted due to shorter charge vs maintain times.
Second, changing a power from charged to maintained effectively means making a new power - the way the anims, FX, and the power itself are built are so different that it would mean redoing all of it. A suggestion for more maintained PBAoEs because you feel they are lacking is a fine suggestion, but we don't plan on scrapping this one. This power was specifically created because we wanted to have a "Destroyer Wave" style power available, and this is what that power is.
I know there are already a number of powers in the game that give benefits when hitting multiple targets, but honestly it's kinda a counter-intuitive mechanic.
We view it more as a mechanic that makes a power better during AoE fights, specifically. We don't really want a single power to be awesome at single target, awesome at AoE, and also an awesome defensive power. It'd be really easy to make powers like that, but I don't think many people would continue playing after a week of effectively playing with cheat codes on.
Might: Mighty Kick: Madness?!: This advantage now correctly has a 100% chance to apply Defiance when fully charged, and will now properly only apply or refresh Defiance, instead of allowing it to stack up to 6 times.
Regarding Mighty Kick, I like the power. It's hilarious. Fun. I don't want it to go.
But.. what is it supposed to do, other than be, arguably, one of the highest damaging Tier 1 attacks in game? A non-tanking method of applying Defiant! to people who don't use Defiance? Defensive Combo with the Surge of Strength advantage generates two stacks.. and has been this way in-game for so long that I imagine it cannot be viewed any longer as a bug.
Unless, of course, that changes tomorrow.
I think either Madness?! or a core portion of Mighty Kick needs to change. Perhaps have it as a single-target Enrage generator on max charge? Not refreshing.. but actual generation of an Enrage stack? Might doesn't really _have_ one of those that's not an AOE.
I have this character that doesn't display a face portrait in the login character selector, and most other places where there should be one. When using this character, and I think there might be a connection to the portrait problem, the game very very frequently is crashing to desktop... Note: I don't recall the crashing being so problematic for as long as the face portrait issue has manifested, so it seems a more recent issue, and might not be related after all, even if the two issues coincide for me.
But why am I bringing this up in this PTS thread, you might wonder?
Well, the PTS build is what is crashing for this character "very very frequently"...very quickly every time I go the desktop, and also in some other situations when playing the character, and it seems worse than Live was last week (haven't tested Live after today's build or post Blood Moon).
I offer this report in case that is helpful in tracking down the issue. I also wonder if there might be other players with character specific CTD problems with CO, but not reported as character specific, and if this report might help even more broadly.
hi ame im really sorry to bring this up when its not really related, but is there any chance at all that you and your team will be looking at stealth mechanics any time soon? as it stands, it is possible in team games to be hit by multiple r3 smoke nades and literally be permanently blinded whilst being attacked. (ss int and 3 sets of perception gear does not help deal with it), when ppl combine this with arctic wolf/stealth sigils etc.. it causes entire teams of ppl to be blinded continuously)
also i think its great that 'the mega d' wave will be availble to use!! also the more powers with part damage the better!
is there any chance more synergy with pa powers, e.g adv that gives further particle damage res debuff, if ppl were to choose energy wave instead of chest beam? thanks
The Power Colour Selector in the Powers UI DOES NOT RENDER. You can pick whatever colour you wish but all you see is the close box half-way across the Power UI window and that's it. Nothing else draws in between.
Regarding Mighty Kick, I like the power. It's hilarious. Fun. I don't want it to go.
But.. what is it supposed to do, other than be, arguably, one of the highest damaging Tier 1 attacks in game?<snip>
I was confused by your post at first, and looked at some stuff to see what was concerning you... when I noticed that Mighty Kick is not using it's proper cost, at all. It is currently just using Beatdowns Energy cost, which is wrong. So, that will be getting fixed. The correct cost is closer to 16 Energy at Tap, and 24 at full charge. Sorry for that, all.
If you're just asking "what is the purpose of giving Might a Kick attack, and where does it fit into MY Might build?" the answer might be that it doesn't. The power is being made because we've received a lot of requests for a basic Kick attack, specifically in Might, and felt that we should make one. It is an option for players that want to have a Kick power. It is another option for Defiance refreshing, as well.
You mentioned Defensive Combo + Advantage granting 2 stacks of Defiance, which is not intended... and looking into it, this does not seem happen with R1 DC, but sometimes does occur with R2. This will be getting fixed.
hi ame im really sorry to bring this up when its not really related, but is there any chance at all that you and your team will be looking at stealth mechanics any time soon?
We're aware there are problems with stealth, still, on both sides of the token - being too useful, and being not useful enough. Which, in general, always seems to be the case with stealth... Either you're hidden, or you're not. Anyhow, we do want to look further at stealth mechanics in the game, but are not working on them currently. I don't have an estimated time to give you right now, sorry.
Due to technical limitations, we can't let it select from 2 different "weapon types" in the tailor - meaning, it can't be both "Experimental Blaster" and "Particle Rifle," it has to be one or the other. This would mean that it could ONLY select Particle Rifle options, and not Experimental Blaster options. We're still looking at what we want to do with it, and we've discussed changing the anim on the power to make it make more sense as an Experimental Blaster, which, being named Experimental Burst Ray, is what it was intended to be.
I'd love to have a solution that let you pick which weapon you wanted for each of the powers, but that isn't something the game can support currently, and as such we have to make decisions about what fits best for most cases.
If you would be looking for an animation suggestion for Experimental Burst Ray. I'd recommend a traditional two handed pistol hold. Just a suggestion and it's already in game for the NPC's.
Also regarding Energy Wave>Hardend Particle Matrix, I got to check it out finally and I had expectations that it would look similar to Energy shield but like a buckyball around the player. That didn't happen I guess. It's not bad, just you know how expectations go.
We're aware there are problems with stealth, still, on both sides of the token - being too useful, and being not useful enough. Which, in general, always seems to be the case with stealth... Either you're hidden, or you're not. Anyhow, we do want to look further at stealth mechanics in the game, but are not working on them currently. I don't have an estimated time to give you right now, sorry.
Aww... and I think the reason for the 'stealth is fine' 'stealth needs help' war is simply the power that grants stealth in question. Few would probably say sneak is great, but radiant sigils might get tons calling for nerf. I guess this means when the Unarmed MA pass happens no tweak for Sneak will happen?
You mentioned Defensive Combo + Advantage granting 2 stacks of Defiance, which is not intended... and looking into it, this does not seem happen with R1 DC, but sometimes does occur with R2. This will be getting fixed.
Since a lot of old power bugs are getting fixed, please take a look at sigils of ebon weakness. The description says that their damage debuff scales with PRE, but this PRE scaling doesn't appear in the tooltip for the power. Direct testing shows that the scaling is about -10% damage per sigil for every 100 PRE. This means that on a character with ~300 PRE each sigil does -40% damage, so under the effect of all 5 sigils the target's damage output is reduced to 1/(1+5*0.4) = 1/3 of its undebuffed value. Characters with 400 and 500 PRE are not uncommon either, and sigils from seperate players stack, leading to even more extreme -damage debuff stacking.
The -damage debuff works on most of the mobs in the game, including some legendaries and cosmics, and in PvP they are often cherry picked so that multiple players on each team have them, leading to long stalemate type matches. Lastly, please also take a look at the snaring effect of these sigils, it's much too strong relative to other snares and maybe it is bugged to scale with PRE as well.
We're aware there are problems with stealth, still, on both sides of the token - being too useful, and being not useful enough. Which, in general, always seems to be the case with stealth... Either you're hidden, or you're not. Anyhow, we do want to look further at stealth mechanics in the game, but are not working on them currently. I don't have an estimated time to give you right now, sorry.
Part of the reason for this "too useful" vs "not useful enough" problem is built-in to the game mechanics. +perception stealth is too weak (except for teleport, which gives +1000) , and -perception debuffs are too strong.
The solution is to make more use out of the 'visibility as a function of distance' effect that already exists, and give players better ways to buff our own perception to stop complaints in PvP. (also we still need to be able to ignore targetting pets, as a distant dream).
In the Powers Menu text. It labels Sonic Boom Generator as "Particle" damage in its description. This is only a text issue with this menu, tooltip and combat damage logs list it correctly as "Sonic".
If you would be looking for an animation suggestion for Experimental Burst Ray. I'd recommend a traditional two handed pistol hold. Just a suggestion and it's already in game for the NPC's
That anim doesn't actually work, unfortunately. It works decently as an anim on critters, but looks pretty bad if you see it up close on a player model, especially with some of the ways player models can look. Believe me, I've attempted to use that anim for player powers multiple times, and it's never worked out well. That doesn't mean we couldn't get a DIFFERENT anim like that which would work with player powers... but I'm no animator, so that goes beyond my ability to answer.
Since a lot of old power bugs are getting fixed, please take a look at sigils of ebon weakness. The description says that their damage debuff scales with PRE, but this PRE scaling doesn't appear in the tooltip for the power. <snip>
Unfortunately, that goes beyond a simple bug fix, and sounds much more like a power in need of design review. I'll make sure it is on our list, if it isn't already.
If you would be looking for an animation suggestion for Experimental Burst Ray. I'd recommend a traditional two handed pistol hold. Just a suggestion and it's already in game for the NPC's.
Also regarding Energy Wave>Hardend Particle Matrix, I got to check it out finally and I had expectations that it would look similar to Energy shield but like a buckyball around the player. That didn't happen I guess. It's not bad, just you know how expectations go.
That would definitely be cool tho, a honeycomb-patterned energy field.
...
You mentioned Defensive Combo + Advantage granting 2 stacks of Defiance, which is not intended... and looking into it, this does not seem happen with R1 DC, but sometimes does occur with R2. This will be getting fixed.
...
Hey segma, enjoy that horse's head you'll be waking up with tomorrow!
Hey segma, enjoy that horse's head you'll be waking up with tomorrow!
Courtesy of Kenpo, I imagine. XD
While most of these bug fixes are weakening powers, I'm honestly glad to see them happen, because hopefully it means more and more powers that are bugged in bad ways will get improved. Enjoying the fine toothed combing going on.
I don't suppose this could be looked at: The power Frenzy states that on every 3rd hit you will become Enraged. This implies that the power can stack Enrage as opposed to just refreshing it.
I imagine this is just a tooltip error, but can you either allow the power to stack Enrage (Bestial does indeed need ways to do that inside the set) or correct the tooltip to read 'applies or refreshes' any enrage stacks? Thanks.
Hey segma, enjoy that horse's head you'll be waking up with tomorrow!
Hm?
I'm HAPPY Combo is getting fixed. It's only been that way since, I don't know, LAUNCH? It justifies my seven or so bug reports I've filed on that one power. Next up I hope are those average stance walking animations which have been off-kilter since Kitchen Sink 1.0.
I was confused by your post at first, and looked at some stuff to see what was concerning you... when I noticed that Mighty Kick is not using it's proper cost, at all. It is currently just using Beatdowns Energy cost, which is wrong. So, that will be getting fixed. The correct cost is closer to 16 Energy at Tap, and 24 at full charge. Sorry for that, all.
If you're just asking "what is the purpose of giving Might a Kick attack, and where does it fit into MY Might build?" the answer might be that it doesn't. The power is being made because we've received a lot of requests for a basic Kick attack, specifically in Might, and felt that we should make one. It is an option for players that want to have a Kick power. It is another option for Defiance refreshing, as well.
Mighty Kick can either Repel, or Knock, depending on charge. Repels do not trigger Aggressor or Unstoppable.
I'm afraid that this is a problem now because Mighty Kick just went from a lovely, fun, albeit somewhat innocuous ability to a lovely, fun, and completely useless ability because its no longer competing with Beatdown now.
It's competing with UPPERCUT.
And Uppercut absolutely THRASHES it.
For two more energy on tap and three more energy on a full charge, you get a power that deals about two to two and a half times as much damage on tap, up to three times as much on a full charge, and ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS triggers Aggressor and Unstoppable's energy gain.
And it will not, on tap, shove the target out of melee range.
So.. what is the point of Mighty Kick again? To refresh Defiance? Combo still does it better.. because, again, it doesn't shove the target.. and does it for less. Eight energy times three swings beats 26 energy.. and for two advantage points, refreshes one stack for ONE swing.
I want to use this power but as it stands now, people are only going to use it for kick duels and then bench it once the novelty wears off, especially after those changes. =/
I'm glad we have a kick, too.. but will no effort be made to make it competitive?
That anim doesn't actually work, unfortunately. It works decently as an anim on critters, but looks pretty bad if you see it up close on a player model, especially with some of the ways player models can look. Believe me, I've attempted to use that anim for player powers multiple times, and it's never worked out well. That doesn't mean we couldn't get a DIFFERENT anim like that which would work with player powers... but I'm no animator, so that goes beyond my ability to answer.
Hey, at least its publicly known now that you have that animation as a wish list item for yourself
I'm HAPPY Combo is getting fixed. It's only been that way since, I don't know, LAUNCH? It justifies my seven or so bug reports I've filed on that one power. Next up I hope are those average stance walking animations which have been off-kilter since Kitchen Sink 1.0.
I'm afraid that this is a problem now because Mighty Kick just went from a lovely, fun, albeit somewhat innocuous ability to a lovely, fun, and completely useless ability because its no longer competing with Beatdown now.
It's competing with UPPERCUT.
And Uppercut absolutely THRASHES it.
For two more energy on tap and three more energy on a full charge, you get a power that deals about two to two and a half times as much damage on tap, up to three times as much on a full charge, and ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS triggers Aggressor and Unstoppable's energy gain.
And it will not, on tap, shove the target out of melee range.
So.. what is the point of Mighty Kick again? To refresh Defiance? Combo still does it better.. because, again, it doesn't shove the target.. and does it for less. Eight energy times three swings beats 26 energy.. and for two advantage points, refreshes one stack for ONE swing.
I want to use this power but as it stands now, people are only going to use it for kick duels and then bench it once the novelty wears off, especially after those changes. =/
I'm glad we have a kick, too.. but will no effort be made to make it competitive?
I dunno, I think the variance isn't that bad. Beatdown does 216 damage and costs 7.4 energy. Kick does 302-593, costs 16-24 with a 1 sec charge. Uppercut (by no means a super-high damage power) does 270-768, costs 14-22 and has a 2 sec charge. Sure, Uppercut gives you more bang for your buck in terms of energy, but it requires double the charge time. Kick on tap gives you better bang for your energy buck, but since it doesn't knock on tap you lose that potential benefit. So it's all a give and take. Hell, Beatdown is the clear winner in damage per energy by a wide margin. Doesn't really mean it's the best choice most of the time tho.
It's all about flavor. Not everyone cares about min/maxing energy and stats. What's important to you might not be to someone else.
I dunno, I think the variance isn't that bad. Beatdown does 216 damage and costs 7.4 energy. Kick does 302-593, costs 16-24 with a 1 sec charge. Uppercut (by no means a super-high damage power) does 270-768, costs 14-22 and has a 2 sec charge.
The Energy cost numbers I was quoting are base costs, which most people rarely see, because they have at least some amount of Int. For comparison purposes, the base cost of Uppercut is 18-29 Energy, so Mighty Kick comes in lower than it. Mighty Kick has a higher tap damage, with a slightly lower activate time, than Uppercut. Uppercut deals more damage and has a larger knock back at full charge, but costs more Energy and takes 2s for a full charge + activate, while Kick takes 1s.
It's all about flavor. Not everyone cares about min/maxing energy and stats. What's important to you might not be to someone else.
I honestly don't care about Mighty Kick being the best choice at a specific level of power for a specific amount of energy.
My main focus, and perhaps I didn't communicate that well, is that it does not synergize nor enrich the Might tree as a whole, aside from making me giggle when I punt a few crates or a slightly shorter than average superhero. It has plenty of flavour, no doubt about that, but little other merit.
It clearly knocks people. You push the button and on tap or on full charge, they go backwards. On any other power, with Aggressor toggled on, this nets you a stack because it was an attempted knock.
But not Mighty Kick.
This also triggers Unstoppable's energy gain mechanic because, citing the above example, you did attempt a knock, even if they slid ten feet or one hundred.
But not Mighty Kick.
So, performance-wise, you now have an ability that penalizes you when you use it (the pushback which, make no mistake, is a penalty to _you_ and you alone, not to anyone else), but you don't gain any benefits (Aggressor, energy gain).
So, what else is there?
For two points, you can generate a stack of Defiant!. That's great. Let's look at the other two powers in the Brick framework that do the same thing: Cleave and Defensive Combo.
Cleave is a beast. It is terrible, horrible beast. It hits a cone for as much damage as a tap of Uppercut. Each swing has a chance to generate Enrage per target hit. If targets are Disoriented, it has an even better chance to generate Enrage per target hit. And for two advantage points, it generates a stack of Defiant!. It's a great AOE that does a lot. Its very hard call to build a Heavy Weapons guy and consciously ignore Cleave.
Defensive Combo is also a beast, but in an entirely different way. Each swing does paltry damage but it also does additional threat with each swing, putting its threat on par with Uppercut taps, if you take Aggressor. Even better, it can inflict Crippling Challenge with every swing. Every. Swing. And it generates a stack of Defiant!. If you feel compelled, you can even spend two advantage points to make it the easiest Defiant! you ever did apply, a sweet 3-8% or so mitigation, depending on your passive, for a paltry amount of energy.. but you certainly don't have to. It is the best single target tanking ability in-game.
Mighty Kick.. is fun. Visions of Leonidas and Hulk Hogan overwhelm the senses and the special effects are top notch. It even knocks the target back with every swing and punts them into the stratosphere (or a corner filled with crates) with a relatively modest charge. But it doesn't generate Aggressor on tap; it doesn't generate Enrage; it compares poorly with Uppercut, its closest competitor and it barely synergizes with a framework built around knocks, giving you a nebulous shove on tap that serves to only lower your damage per second. It's like the power was put in specifically to keep people off of a high perch. And for two advantage points, you can make it do what other powers in the same framework do, only they do it better because the advantage is attached to either a far, far superior damage-dealing power (Cleave) or a power that possesses a ton more utility (Defensive Combo).
So, I ask, what is the harm in having Mighty Kick actually _do_ what you expect it to do when you shove a person back ten feet? Building a stack of Aggressor on tap would break it somehow?
Would it somehow also cripple the ability if you had it generate a stack of Enrage on full charge, either as part of the core power or as part of the two point advantage? The Might tree even lacks a solid, single target method of stacking Enrage as, aside from Roomsweeper and Havoc Stomp, every other ability just refreshes it including Iron Cyclone.
A ton of time was spent on TK Lance to make it not suck by boosting its damage and overwhelming it with synergy, turning it into a ranged Rush applicator for Mentalists.
Yet Mighty Kick barely gets any attention? "You guys wanted a kick so here's a kick?"
I honestly don't care about Mighty Kick being the best choice at a specific level of power for a specific amount of energy.
My main focus, and perhaps I didn't communicate that well, is that it does not synergize nor enrich the Might tree as a whole, aside from making me giggle when I punt a few crates or a slightly shorter than average superhero. It has plenty of flavour, no doubt about that, but little other merit.
It clearly knocks people. You push the button and on tap or on full charge, they go backwards. On any other power, with Aggressor toggled on, this nets you a stack because it was an attempted knock.
But not Mighty Kick.
This also triggers Unstoppable's energy gain mechanic because, citing the above example, you did attempt a knock, even if they slid ten feet or one hundred.
But not Mighty Kick.
So, performance-wise, you now have an ability that penalizes you when you use it (the pushback which, make no mistake, is a penalty to _you_ and you alone, not to anyone else), but you don't gain any benefits (Aggressor, energy gain).
So, what else is there?
For two points, you can generate a stack of Defiant!. That's great. Let's look at the other two powers in the Brick framework that do the same thing: Cleave and Defensive Combo.
Cleave is a beast. It is terrible, horrible beast. It hits a cone for as much damage as a tap of Uppercut. Each swing has a chance to generate Enrage per target hit. If targets are Disoriented, it has an even better chance to generate Enrage per target hit. And for two advantage points, it generates a stack of Defiant!. It's a great AOE that does a lot. Its very hard call to build a Heavy Weapons guy and consciously ignore Cleave.
Defensive Combo is also a beast, but in an entirely different way. Each swing does paltry damage but it also does additional threat with each swing, putting its threat on par with Uppercut taps, if you take Aggressor. Even better, it can inflict Crippling Challenge with every swing. Every. Swing. And it generates a stack of Defiant!. If you feel compelled, you can even spend two advantage points to make it the easiest Defiant! you ever did apply, a sweet 3-8% or so mitigation, depending on your passive, for a paltry amount of energy.. but you certainly don't have to. It is the best single target tanking ability in-game.
Mighty Kick.. is fun. Visions of Leonidas and Hulk Hogan overwhelm the senses and the special effects are top notch. It even knocks the target back with every swing and punts them into the stratosphere (or a corner filled with crates) with a relatively modest charge. But it doesn't generate Aggressor on tap; it doesn't generate Enrage; it compares poorly with Uppercut, its closest competitor and it barely synergizes with a framework built around knocks, giving you a nebulous shove on tap that serves to only lower your damage per second. It's like the power was put in specifically to keep people off of a high perch. And for two advantage points, you can make it do what other powers in the same framework do, only they do it better because the advantage is attached to either a far, far superior damage-dealing power (Cleave) or a power that possesses a ton more utility (Defensive Combo).
So, I ask, what is the harm in having Mighty Kick actually _do_ what you expect it to do when you shove a person back ten feet? Building a stack of Aggressor on tap would break it somehow?
Would it somehow also cripple the ability if you had it generate a stack of Enrage on full charge, either as part of the core power or as part of the two point advantage? The Might tree even lacks a solid, single target method of stacking Enrage as, aside from Roomsweeper and Havoc Stomp, every other ability just refreshes it including Iron Cyclone.
A ton of time was spent on TK Lance to make it not suck by boosting its damage and overwhelming it with synergy, turning it into a ranged Rush applicator for Mentalists.
Yet Mighty Kick barely gets any attention? "You guys wanted a kick so here's a kick?"
Come. On.
I think you need to settle down. You're being overly dramatic, and unfortunately most of what you're saying simply doesn't make any sense. I get it, you don't like Mighty Kick. That's fine. No one is forcing you to take it.
And even after reading this manifesto I'm still not sure what you're asking for. You want the repel turned into a knock so it procs Aggressor and Unstoppable? Why not then just charge it and get the knock? Simple as pie. You say it's clearly inferior to Uppercut, tho the numbers say it's not due to it's very fast charge. And Uppercut has no buffs attached to it. And now all of a sudden you think it should proc Enrage too? Because there are other powers that give Defiant? Like I said, you're not making any sense. Why can't a kick just be a simple kick?
I can see at least one use for Mighty Kick, but it's mostly a PvP thing. Repels don't make stacks of Knock Resistance, and might not disable your opponent, but some extra distance can be nice.
In terms of practical use, though? Pretty much everything segma said nails it. It actually reminds me of Skullcrusher in the Heavy Weapons tree: Brimstone does disorients along with guaranteed knockdown, Arc of Ruin does more damage and guarantees disorient on a full charge, Skewer does more damage and can stack Enrage (somewhat badly, but still).
they don't like adding them if they can help it. I feel like the sheer volume of complaints regarding Electric Form's FX calls for it though. Woops, replying to something way early there.
And I entirely agree with Segma, and making Mighty Kick generate Enrage on charge would be *crazy* awesome.
How about making a charged Mighty Kick reduce the target's dodge? Shadow Bolt's adv does that.
Well, not really; it subtracts rating points rather than actually reducing dodge (and does not scale with level), which makes it almost irrelevant at high levels.
Try to disarm people who make well reasoned arguments contrary to your opinions by accusing them of being angry or untoward somehow.
You should stop doing it. It doesn't reflect well on you.
I'm sorry you consider that a well-reasoned argument. It read a lot more like a hysterical rant to me. Which of course is completely unnecessary if you're trying to have a civilized discussion. But I get it, Segma doesn't like Mighty Kick, and that's fine. I just don't see the point he/she is trying to make.
And if you don't like the form or tone of my posts feel free to ignore me. Honestly, I won't hold it against you. Promise.
I'm sorry you consider that a well-reasoned argument. It read a lot more like a hysterical rant to me. Which of course is completely unnecessary if you're trying to have a civilized discussion. But I get it, Segma doesn't like Mighty Kick, and that's fine. I just don't see the point he/she is trying to make.
And if you don't like the form or tone of my posts feel free to ignore me. Honestly, I won't hold it against you. Promise.
Well at least you got the second part right; I don't care for your tone one bit.
As for segma being "hysterical" well, that's just exactly what I said it was; your preferred tactic to diminish other people. That you keep doing it and pretending you're above it all is an act that you don't have the skill to pull off.
Well at least you got the second part right; I don't care for your tone one bit.
As for segma being "hysterical" well, that's just exactly what I said it was; your preferred tactic to diminish other people. That you keep doing it and pretending you're above it all is an act that you don't have the skill to pull off.
Does this mean you won't be accepting my friend request? Pity.
Here is a hint: If you honestly believe anyone who disagrees with you is emotionally unstable; you're the unstable one.
Now go ahead and carry on with your day.
Some people confuse being unstable with being insanely fabulous. It's an easy mistake to make, especially if you're never been fabulous. No worries, I'll let it slide this time.
Segma was illustrating how the power falls in between the cracks in functionality when compared to other Brick powers that serve a similar function/as utility. By bringing these points to the attention of the good Power folks and the rest of us, he's hoping to inspire some kind of thinking to provide a solution to make the power come into its own, in a manner of speaking. It's an earnest plea that doesn't attack the Powers team- or anyone else. To call it a hysterical rant is just silly, and at its worst, entirely useless. Look at the post and look at the points brought up. If you're so inclined as to "challenge" what is being said, or to dismiss it in its entirety, please take a look at it and actually say *why.*
We're not children here. At the very least, if you're going to call something a "hysterical rant" you ought to try to offer some ideas or points to assuage or calm down the person behind it, to do otherwise is to talk and say nothing.
Anyway, maybe the Enrage idea isn't a good one. Refreshing Enrage seems like a common functionality, so what if it were to do this as a base as well? A nice and quick single target Enrage refresh (On top of another function like generating Defiance) wouldn't be TOO bad. Though it still seems that might not be enough to give it a strong, unique function.
Segma was illustrating how the power falls in between the cracks in functionality when compared to other Brick powers that serve a similar function/as utility. By bringing these points to the attention of the good Power folks and the rest of us, he's hoping to inspire some kind of thinking to provide a solution to make the power come into its own, in a manner of speaking. It's an earnest plea that doesn't attack the Powers team- or anyone else. To call it a hysterical rant is just silly, and at its worst, entirely useless. Look at the post and look at the points brought up. If you're so inclined as to "challenge" what is being said, or to dismiss it in its entirety, please take a look at it and actually say *why.*
We're not children here. At the very least, if you're going to call something a "hysterical rant" you ought to try to offer some ideas or points to assuage or calm down the person behind it, to do otherwise is to talk and say nothing.
Anyway, maybe the Enrage idea isn't a good one. Refreshing Enrage seems like a common functionality, so what if it were to do this as a base as well? A nice and quick single target Enrage refresh (On top of another function like generating Defiance) wouldn't be TOO bad. Though it still seems that might not be enough to give it a strong, unique function.
I did, in my response to Segma's first post, where I compared Beatdown, Uppercut, and Mighty Kick and illustrated how despite the previous claim of Uppercut being demonstrably better than Mighty Kick they're all pretty much on par when taken as a whole. And I for one like the fact that Mighty Kick gives a stack of Defiance instead of Enrage. I think doing both is overkill. The repel doesn't bother me for 3 reasons: 1.) the repel distance is small so you're unlikely to push them out of melee range; 2.) the repel prevents them from attacking; and 3.) the repel does NOT apply knock resistance. The option of converting the repel into a knock on a 1 second charge is also very appealing, cause it gives you flexibility. To me that's a plus, not a minus. The inability of the repel to proc Aggressor and Unstoppable is IMO trivial, and it certainly wouldn't be the only power in the Brick framework that doesn't.
... The repel doesn't bother me for 3 reasons: 1.) the repel distance is small so you're unlikely to push them out of melee range; 2.) the repel prevents them from attacking; ...
If the repel distance is so small you're unlikely to push them out of melee range how does that prevent the target from attacking? Repel just pushes things away (or towards if negative repel). It does nothing to stop a character from acting.
Personally I'd rather have some power that knocks on tap like Uppercut so the repel on tap when using Mighty Kick annoys me. It just means I have to either charge Mighty Kick (rooting the user, which I also dislike) or have another power that knocks on tap or on the move or both to keep Aggressor stacks up. Maybe my inner min/maxer is showing when I say this but, Mighty Kick serves no real purpose aside from aesthetics.
I have the same issue with Energy Wave. That power also has no purpose. It can't be used for maintained dps due to a cooldown. The damage is too low for spike. It's charged, so on Elite mode it will likely be dodged. And to top it all off the damage per cast time is lower than other AoE powers.
If the repel distance is so small you're unlikely to push them out of melee range how does that prevent the target from attacking? Repel just pushes things away (or towards if negative repel). It does nothing to stop a character from acting.
Sure it does. Not only will it likely cancel a charge, but they are unable to attack until they recover from the repel. It might not be very long, maybe 1-2 seconds, but because there is no repel resistance one could, in theory, keep repelling them back over and over again.
Maybe my inner min/maxer is showing when I say this but, Mighty Kick serves no real purpose aside from aesthetics.
And what exactly is wrong with that? If you want a knock on tap to proc Aggressor and/or Unstoppable you can use Haymaker, Roomsweeper, or Uppercut.
I have the same issue with Energy Wave. That power also has no purpose. It can't be used for maintained dps due to a cooldown. The damage is too low for spike. It's charged, so on Elite mode it will likely be dodged. And to top it all off the damage per cast time is lower than other AoE powers.
Again, just because a power that you see as having no set purpose doesn't mean it's bad. People take different powers for all sorts of reasons. Not everything needs to be a min/maxer's dream. Sometimes people take a power for no other reason than they like the animation or it fits their theme. They don't really care how it compares to other powers. In the case of Energy Wave it's a Power Armor attack, and PA has no PbAoEs. So this fits that purpose nicely enough. The shield advantage is just icing on the cake. Oh, and cause it has a cooldown it'll also proc MSA. So I can see a number of uses for it.
Honestly I just don't understand the obsession with expecting all new powers be the greatest thing evah. Sometimes a kick only needs to be a kick and nothing more.
We're aware there are problems with stealth, still, on both sides of the token - being too useful, and being not useful enough. Which, in general, always seems to be the case with stealth... Either you're hidden, or you're not. Anyhow, we do want to look further at stealth mechanics in the game, but are not working on them currently. I don't have an estimated time to give you right now, sorry.
thanks for the reply ame! well its nice to hear that you do envisage some kind of change to them long term
all i would say is that at the moment stealth in pvp is pretty much at a gamebreaking level, and while you dont have any immediate plans to change how stealth works, i think it would be really great if you might consider some small hotfix to stop perception debuffs stacking
Sure it does. Not only will it likely cancel a charge, but they are unable to attack until they recover from the repel. It might not be very long, maybe 1-2 seconds, but because there is no repel resistance one could, in theory, keep repelling them back over and over again. ...
Try again. Repel does nothing but move your target. It does not disable nor cancel targets. Use it. I just did to make sure I'm not going crazy. You're still going to get beat in the face as you repeatedly tap Mighty Kick.
I don't need every power to be the best thing ever, but at least ensuring there's a reason to use it outside of it looking shiny.
Try again. Repel does nothing but move your target. It does not disable nor cancel targets. Use it. I just did to make sure I'm not going crazy. You're still going to get beat in the face as you repeatedly tap Mighty Kick.
Then we must be playing 2 different games. I admit I wasn't able to reliably cancel a charge, but pushing critters back does prevent them from attacking as they're forced to do the waving arms animation.
I don't need every power to be the best thing ever, but at least ensuring there's a reason to use it outside of it looking shiny.
Apparently you do, because anything less than the perfect min/maxed ability and it's simply not good enough for you.
But whatev, I'm really tired of arguing. Bottom line, if you don't like the power don't take it. It's as simple as that. Not every power in the game is going to meet the lofty standards of the elitists that frequent these forums. There are a whole lot of players that simply don't care about the things you do, and who like shiny.
Then we must be playing 2 different games. I admit I wasn't able to reliably cancel a charge, but pushing critters back does prevent them from attacking as they're forced to do the waving arms animation. ...
Near as I can tell it's like the Fear debuff. If the critter isn't doing anything they'll cower. Similarly if a character is repelled, they'll do the waving hands animation. Try fighting a player or mob with a maintain then repel them. The mob will continue the maintain despite being repelled (unless they're repelled out of range).
I'm sorry you consider that a well-reasoned argument. It read a lot more like a hysterical rant to me. Which of course is completely unnecessary if you're trying to have a civilized discussion. But I get it, Segma doesn't like Mighty Kick, and that's fine. I just don't see the point he/she is trying to make.
Pretty sure I'm not hysterical, and thank you to those who did read my prior post. But I'll TL;DR it for you in point form, Captain, and reiterate my concerns in the most recent thread:
Mighty Kick's repel should be treated like a failed knock. That way, you can benefit from Aggressor and proc Unstoppable, if you choose to take those Brick-specific powers. Because the repel, as fun as it is, is a DPS loss.
Mighty Kick should build (not just refresh) stacks of Enrage on a full charge.Whether this is a part of Madness?! or part of the core power, I do not care. The Brick framework already has two methods to refresh Defiant! which I illustrated in my prior post. The Might tree specifically, however, lacks a single target Enrage builder.
The part below this is not part of the TL;DR. Stop reading here if you're so inclined. I already talked about Defiant!. What follows are my remaining thoughts on the matter, specifically relating to the lack of synergy with Might's other powers.
I like Mighty Kick.
Its a recycled animation. The Destroid in Dr. Destroyer's Robot Factory has been doing this boot since launch. But I don't care. Punting someone around brings a smile to my face. I'm sure people have other powers that give them the same feeling. Even the special effects are nice. I even _like_ the mandatory repel on tap. It gives the power a feeling of, well, power.
To reiterate, I like the kick.
But a repel is nothing. Its arguably worse than nothing. Its fun to look at and, as Empyreal10 said, may provide a situational use, however being repelled is not a form of CC. It does not cause you to lose control of your character in any meaningful way. It is a failed knock.
Its counter is holding down whatever key make you go forward. If your target does not do you the courtesy of holding down their forward button, Mighty Kick's damage per second drops considerably because, after the second or third kick, you can't kick them anymore. They're out of range.
You're welcome to go ahead and test it. Parse Mighty Kick + Unstoppable + Aggressor versus Uppercut + Unstoppable + Aggressor. Or, heck, each power by itself with no toggle or passive. I would guestimate that even rank 3 Beatdown gives rank 3 Mighty Kick a run for its money in raw damage, just because you have to continually chase your target.
That'd be okay _if_ you got something out of it.
This is why I ask that Mighty Kick's repel be treated as a failed knock and inherit all the benefits and penalties of being a failed knock. That way, at least the penalty for the repel will not be as great. And hey, Mighty Leap + Mighty Kick to start a brawl will really get the energy rolling in this situation, if you're running Unstoppable, especially now that it has AM. Shoulder check into boot to the gut.. its a great visual image.
If Mighty Kick remains as is, it'll be a nice novelty power Brick-minded people will pick up to try out, maybe even retain for a month or two. I'll probably even do that. But then, after using it for a while and the urge to retcon becomes overwhelming, it will be one of the first powers that gets cut if they're looking to trim because your only reason to keep it will be, 'It looks cool'. It won't even be a terribly hard choice.
Comments
There is a (very good) chance that (at some point) we will make another Particle Rifle power, and a cone/spray attack would be fairly likely. However, it won't be happening with this new set of powers right now.
Using things while held is a pretty big deal, and not something we like to hand out very often, as is probably pretty obvious. I'm not sure it's something we'd want to add to this power, but it's something we can think about if we aren't happy with it.
We aren't terribly big on maintained powers with cooldown times, as it frequently can just "feel bad" to have your maintained end early and then go on cooldown. Obviously, this can happen with charge powers as well, but it's not nearly as common and it's easier to get a good feel for how much energy you need for a full charge than it is for a full maintain, and charges are also less likely to get interrupted due to shorter charge vs maintain times.
Second, changing a power from charged to maintained effectively means making a new power - the way the anims, FX, and the power itself are built are so different that it would mean redoing all of it. A suggestion for more maintained PBAoEs because you feel they are lacking is a fine suggestion, but we don't plan on scrapping this one. This power was specifically created because we wanted to have a "Destroyer Wave" style power available, and this is what that power is.
We view it more as a mechanic that makes a power better during AoE fights, specifically. We don't really want a single power to be awesome at single target, awesome at AoE, and also an awesome defensive power. It'd be really easy to make powers like that, but I don't think many people would continue playing after a week of effectively playing with cheat codes on.
Regarding Mighty Kick, I like the power. It's hilarious. Fun. I don't want it to go.
But.. what is it supposed to do, other than be, arguably, one of the highest damaging Tier 1 attacks in game? A non-tanking method of applying Defiant! to people who don't use Defiance? Defensive Combo with the Surge of Strength advantage generates two stacks.. and has been this way in-game for so long that I imagine it cannot be viewed any longer as a bug.
Unless, of course, that changes tomorrow.
I think either Madness?! or a core portion of Mighty Kick needs to change. Perhaps have it as a single-target Enrage generator on max charge? Not refreshing.. but actual generation of an Enrage stack? Might doesn't really _have_ one of those that's not an AOE.
I made a thread about this issue recently.
But why am I bringing this up in this PTS thread, you might wonder?
Well, the PTS build is what is crashing for this character "very very frequently"...very quickly every time I go the desktop, and also in some other situations when playing the character, and it seems worse than Live was last week (haven't tested Live after today's build or post Blood Moon).
I offer this report in case that is helpful in tracking down the issue. I also wonder if there might be other players with character specific CTD problems with CO, but not reported as character specific, and if this report might help even more broadly.
also i think its great that 'the mega d' wave will be availble to use!! also the more powers with part damage the better!
is there any chance more synergy with pa powers, e.g adv that gives further particle damage res debuff, if ppl were to choose energy wave instead of chest beam? thanks
I was confused by your post at first, and looked at some stuff to see what was concerning you... when I noticed that Mighty Kick is not using it's proper cost, at all. It is currently just using Beatdowns Energy cost, which is wrong. So, that will be getting fixed. The correct cost is closer to 16 Energy at Tap, and 24 at full charge. Sorry for that, all.
If you're just asking "what is the purpose of giving Might a Kick attack, and where does it fit into MY Might build?" the answer might be that it doesn't. The power is being made because we've received a lot of requests for a basic Kick attack, specifically in Might, and felt that we should make one. It is an option for players that want to have a Kick power. It is another option for Defiance refreshing, as well.
You mentioned Defensive Combo + Advantage granting 2 stacks of Defiance, which is not intended... and looking into it, this does not seem happen with R1 DC, but sometimes does occur with R2. This will be getting fixed.
Mighty Kick can either Repel, or Knock, depending on charge. Repels do not trigger Aggressor or Unstoppable.
We're aware there are problems with stealth, still, on both sides of the token - being too useful, and being not useful enough. Which, in general, always seems to be the case with stealth... Either you're hidden, or you're not. Anyhow, we do want to look further at stealth mechanics in the game, but are not working on them currently. I don't have an estimated time to give you right now, sorry.
If you would be looking for an animation suggestion for Experimental Burst Ray. I'd recommend a traditional two handed pistol hold. Just a suggestion and it's already in game for the NPC's.
Also regarding Energy Wave>Hardend Particle Matrix, I got to check it out finally and I had expectations that it would look similar to Energy shield but like a buckyball around the player. That didn't happen I guess. It's not bad, just you know how expectations go.
Aww... and I think the reason for the 'stealth is fine' 'stealth needs help' war is simply the power that grants stealth in question. Few would probably say sneak is great, but radiant sigils might get tons calling for nerf. I guess this means when the Unarmed MA pass happens no tweak for Sneak will happen?
Since a lot of old power bugs are getting fixed, please take a look at sigils of ebon weakness. The description says that their damage debuff scales with PRE, but this PRE scaling doesn't appear in the tooltip for the power. Direct testing shows that the scaling is about -10% damage per sigil for every 100 PRE. This means that on a character with ~300 PRE each sigil does -40% damage, so under the effect of all 5 sigils the target's damage output is reduced to 1/(1+5*0.4) = 1/3 of its undebuffed value. Characters with 400 and 500 PRE are not uncommon either, and sigils from seperate players stack, leading to even more extreme -damage debuff stacking.
The -damage debuff works on most of the mobs in the game, including some legendaries and cosmics, and in PvP they are often cherry picked so that multiple players on each team have them, leading to long stalemate type matches. Lastly, please also take a look at the snaring effect of these sigils, it's much too strong relative to other snares and maybe it is bugged to scale with PRE as well.
Part of the reason for this "too useful" vs "not useful enough" problem is built-in to the game mechanics. +perception stealth is too weak (except for teleport, which gives +1000) , and -perception debuffs are too strong.
The solution is to make more use out of the 'visibility as a function of distance' effect that already exists, and give players better ways to buff our own perception to stop complaints in PvP. (also we still need to be able to ignore targetting pets, as a distant dream).
That anim doesn't actually work, unfortunately. It works decently as an anim on critters, but looks pretty bad if you see it up close on a player model, especially with some of the ways player models can look. Believe me, I've attempted to use that anim for player powers multiple times, and it's never worked out well. That doesn't mean we couldn't get a DIFFERENT anim like that which would work with player powers... but I'm no animator, so that goes beyond my ability to answer.
Unfortunately, that goes beyond a simple bug fix, and sounds much more like a power in need of design review. I'll make sure it is on our list, if it isn't already.
That would definitely be cool tho, a honeycomb-patterned energy field.
Hey segma, enjoy that horse's head you'll be waking up with tomorrow!
I laugh at all the people who insisted this obvious bug was a feature.
Courtesy of Kenpo, I imagine. XD
While most of these bug fixes are weakening powers, I'm honestly glad to see them happen, because hopefully it means more and more powers that are bugged in bad ways will get improved. Enjoying the fine toothed combing going on.
I imagine this is just a tooltip error, but can you either allow the power to stack Enrage (Bestial does indeed need ways to do that inside the set) or correct the tooltip to read 'applies or refreshes' any enrage stacks? Thanks.
Hm?
I'm HAPPY Combo is getting fixed. It's only been that way since, I don't know, LAUNCH? It justifies my seven or so bug reports I've filed on that one power. Next up I hope are those average stance walking animations which have been off-kilter since Kitchen Sink 1.0.
I'm afraid that this is a problem now because Mighty Kick just went from a lovely, fun, albeit somewhat innocuous ability to a lovely, fun, and completely useless ability because its no longer competing with Beatdown now.
It's competing with UPPERCUT.
And Uppercut absolutely THRASHES it.
For two more energy on tap and three more energy on a full charge, you get a power that deals about two to two and a half times as much damage on tap, up to three times as much on a full charge, and ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS triggers Aggressor and Unstoppable's energy gain.
And it will not, on tap, shove the target out of melee range.
So.. what is the point of Mighty Kick again? To refresh Defiance? Combo still does it better.. because, again, it doesn't shove the target.. and does it for less. Eight energy times three swings beats 26 energy.. and for two advantage points, refreshes one stack for ONE swing.
I want to use this power but as it stands now, people are only going to use it for kick duels and then bench it once the novelty wears off, especially after those changes. =/
I'm glad we have a kick, too.. but will no effort be made to make it competitive?
Hey, at least its publicly known now that you have that animation as a wish list item for yourself
See? I'm not alone in this.
I dunno, I think the variance isn't that bad. Beatdown does 216 damage and costs 7.4 energy. Kick does 302-593, costs 16-24 with a 1 sec charge. Uppercut (by no means a super-high damage power) does 270-768, costs 14-22 and has a 2 sec charge. Sure, Uppercut gives you more bang for your buck in terms of energy, but it requires double the charge time. Kick on tap gives you better bang for your energy buck, but since it doesn't knock on tap you lose that potential benefit. So it's all a give and take. Hell, Beatdown is the clear winner in damage per energy by a wide margin. Doesn't really mean it's the best choice most of the time tho.
It's all about flavor. Not everyone cares about min/maxing energy and stats. What's important to you might not be to someone else.
The Energy cost numbers I was quoting are base costs, which most people rarely see, because they have at least some amount of Int. For comparison purposes, the base cost of Uppercut is 18-29 Energy, so Mighty Kick comes in lower than it. Mighty Kick has a higher tap damage, with a slightly lower activate time, than Uppercut. Uppercut deals more damage and has a larger knock back at full charge, but costs more Energy and takes 2s for a full charge + activate, while Kick takes 1s.
... I am aware, my apologies for rounding.
I honestly don't care about Mighty Kick being the best choice at a specific level of power for a specific amount of energy.
My main focus, and perhaps I didn't communicate that well, is that it does not synergize nor enrich the Might tree as a whole, aside from making me giggle when I punt a few crates or a slightly shorter than average superhero. It has plenty of flavour, no doubt about that, but little other merit.
It clearly knocks people. You push the button and on tap or on full charge, they go backwards. On any other power, with Aggressor toggled on, this nets you a stack because it was an attempted knock.
But not Mighty Kick.
This also triggers Unstoppable's energy gain mechanic because, citing the above example, you did attempt a knock, even if they slid ten feet or one hundred.
But not Mighty Kick.
So, performance-wise, you now have an ability that penalizes you when you use it (the pushback which, make no mistake, is a penalty to _you_ and you alone, not to anyone else), but you don't gain any benefits (Aggressor, energy gain).
So, what else is there?
For two points, you can generate a stack of Defiant!. That's great. Let's look at the other two powers in the Brick framework that do the same thing: Cleave and Defensive Combo.
Cleave is a beast. It is terrible, horrible beast. It hits a cone for as much damage as a tap of Uppercut. Each swing has a chance to generate Enrage per target hit. If targets are Disoriented, it has an even better chance to generate Enrage per target hit. And for two advantage points, it generates a stack of Defiant!. It's a great AOE that does a lot. Its very hard call to build a Heavy Weapons guy and consciously ignore Cleave.
Defensive Combo is also a beast, but in an entirely different way. Each swing does paltry damage but it also does additional threat with each swing, putting its threat on par with Uppercut taps, if you take Aggressor. Even better, it can inflict Crippling Challenge with every swing. Every. Swing. And it generates a stack of Defiant!. If you feel compelled, you can even spend two advantage points to make it the easiest Defiant! you ever did apply, a sweet 3-8% or so mitigation, depending on your passive, for a paltry amount of energy.. but you certainly don't have to. It is the best single target tanking ability in-game.
Mighty Kick.. is fun. Visions of Leonidas and Hulk Hogan overwhelm the senses and the special effects are top notch. It even knocks the target back with every swing and punts them into the stratosphere (or a corner filled with crates) with a relatively modest charge. But it doesn't generate Aggressor on tap; it doesn't generate Enrage; it compares poorly with Uppercut, its closest competitor and it barely synergizes with a framework built around knocks, giving you a nebulous shove on tap that serves to only lower your damage per second. It's like the power was put in specifically to keep people off of a high perch. And for two advantage points, you can make it do what other powers in the same framework do, only they do it better because the advantage is attached to either a far, far superior damage-dealing power (Cleave) or a power that possesses a ton more utility (Defensive Combo).
So, I ask, what is the harm in having Mighty Kick actually _do_ what you expect it to do when you shove a person back ten feet? Building a stack of Aggressor on tap would break it somehow?
Would it somehow also cripple the ability if you had it generate a stack of Enrage on full charge, either as part of the core power or as part of the two point advantage? The Might tree even lacks a solid, single target method of stacking Enrage as, aside from Roomsweeper and Havoc Stomp, every other ability just refreshes it including Iron Cyclone.
A ton of time was spent on TK Lance to make it not suck by boosting its damage and overwhelming it with synergy, turning it into a ranged Rush applicator for Mentalists.
Yet Mighty Kick barely gets any attention? "You guys wanted a kick so here's a kick?"
Come. On.
I think you need to settle down. You're being overly dramatic, and unfortunately most of what you're saying simply doesn't make any sense. I get it, you don't like Mighty Kick. That's fine. No one is forcing you to take it.
And even after reading this manifesto I'm still not sure what you're asking for. You want the repel turned into a knock so it procs Aggressor and Unstoppable? Why not then just charge it and get the knock? Simple as pie. You say it's clearly inferior to Uppercut, tho the numbers say it's not due to it's very fast charge. And Uppercut has no buffs attached to it. And now all of a sudden you think it should proc Enrage too? Because there are other powers that give Defiant? Like I said, you're not making any sense. Why can't a kick just be a simple kick?
I've noticed you do this a lot.
Try to disarm people who make well reasoned arguments contrary to your opinions by accusing them of being angry or untoward somehow.
You should stop doing it. It doesn't reflect well on you.
In terms of practical use, though? Pretty much everything segma said nails it. It actually reminds me of Skullcrusher in the Heavy Weapons tree: Brimstone does disorients along with guaranteed knockdown, Arc of Ruin does more damage and guarantees disorient on a full charge, Skewer does more damage and can stack Enrage (somewhat badly, but still).
And I entirely agree with Segma, and making Mighty Kick generate Enrage on charge would be *crazy* awesome.
I'm sorry you consider that a well-reasoned argument. It read a lot more like a hysterical rant to me. Which of course is completely unnecessary if you're trying to have a civilized discussion. But I get it, Segma doesn't like Mighty Kick, and that's fine. I just don't see the point he/she is trying to make.
And if you don't like the form or tone of my posts feel free to ignore me. Honestly, I won't hold it against you. Promise.
Well at least you got the second part right; I don't care for your tone one bit.
As for segma being "hysterical" well, that's just exactly what I said it was; your preferred tactic to diminish other people. That you keep doing it and pretending you're above it all is an act that you don't have the skill to pull off.
Does this mean you won't be accepting my friend request? Pity.
Here is a hint: If you honestly believe anyone who disagrees with you is emotionally unstable; you're the unstable one.
Now go ahead and carry on with your day.
Some people confuse being unstable with being insanely fabulous. It's an easy mistake to make, especially if you're never been fabulous. No worries, I'll let it slide this time.
While this t
We're not children here. At the very least, if you're going to call something a "hysterical rant" you ought to try to offer some ideas or points to assuage or calm down the person behind it, to do otherwise is to talk and say nothing.
Anyway, maybe the Enrage idea isn't a good one. Refreshing Enrage seems like a common functionality, so what if it were to do this as a base as well? A nice and quick single target Enrage refresh (On top of another function like generating Defiance) wouldn't be TOO bad. Though it still seems that might not be enough to give it a strong, unique function.
I did, in my response to Segma's first post, where I compared Beatdown, Uppercut, and Mighty Kick and illustrated how despite the previous claim of Uppercut being demonstrably better than Mighty Kick they're all pretty much on par when taken as a whole. And I for one like the fact that Mighty Kick gives a stack of Defiance instead of Enrage. I think doing both is overkill. The repel doesn't bother me for 3 reasons: 1.) the repel distance is small so you're unlikely to push them out of melee range; 2.) the repel prevents them from attacking; and 3.) the repel does NOT apply knock resistance. The option of converting the repel into a knock on a 1 second charge is also very appealing, cause it gives you flexibility. To me that's a plus, not a minus. The inability of the repel to proc Aggressor and Unstoppable is IMO trivial, and it certainly wouldn't be the only power in the Brick framework that doesn't.
If the repel distance is so small you're unlikely to push them out of melee range how does that prevent the target from attacking? Repel just pushes things away (or towards if negative repel). It does nothing to stop a character from acting.
Personally I'd rather have some power that knocks on tap like Uppercut so the repel on tap when using Mighty Kick annoys me. It just means I have to either charge Mighty Kick (rooting the user, which I also dislike) or have another power that knocks on tap or on the move or both to keep Aggressor stacks up. Maybe my inner min/maxer is showing when I say this but, Mighty Kick serves no real purpose aside from aesthetics.
I have the same issue with Energy Wave. That power also has no purpose. It can't be used for maintained dps due to a cooldown. The damage is too low for spike. It's charged, so on Elite mode it will likely be dodged. And to top it all off the damage per cast time is lower than other AoE powers.
That way, you're guaranteed to send someone hurtling back with a charged sparta kick.
Sure it does. Not only will it likely cancel a charge, but they are unable to attack until they recover from the repel. It might not be very long, maybe 1-2 seconds, but because there is no repel resistance one could, in theory, keep repelling them back over and over again.
And what exactly is wrong with that? If you want a knock on tap to proc Aggressor and/or Unstoppable you can use Haymaker, Roomsweeper, or Uppercut.
Again, just because a power that you see as having no set purpose doesn't mean it's bad. People take different powers for all sorts of reasons. Not everything needs to be a min/maxer's dream. Sometimes people take a power for no other reason than they like the animation or it fits their theme. They don't really care how it compares to other powers. In the case of Energy Wave it's a Power Armor attack, and PA has no PbAoEs. So this fits that purpose nicely enough. The shield advantage is just icing on the cake. Oh, and cause it has a cooldown it'll also proc MSA. So I can see a number of uses for it.
Honestly I just don't understand the obsession with expecting all new powers be the greatest thing evah. Sometimes a kick only needs to be a kick and nothing more.
thanks for the reply ame! well its nice to hear that you do envisage some kind of change to them long term
all i would say is that at the moment stealth in pvp is pretty much at a gamebreaking level, and while you dont have any immediate plans to change how stealth works, i think it would be really great if you might consider some small hotfix to stop perception debuffs stacking
Try again. Repel does nothing but move your target. It does not disable nor cancel targets. Use it. I just did to make sure I'm not going crazy. You're still going to get beat in the face as you repeatedly tap Mighty Kick.
I don't need every power to be the best thing ever, but at least ensuring there's a reason to use it outside of it looking shiny.
Then we must be playing 2 different games. I admit I wasn't able to reliably cancel a charge, but pushing critters back does prevent them from attacking as they're forced to do the waving arms animation.
Apparently you do, because anything less than the perfect min/maxed ability and it's simply not good enough for you.
But whatev, I'm really tired of arguing. Bottom line, if you don't like the power don't take it. It's as simple as that. Not every power in the game is going to meet the lofty standards of the elitists that frequent these forums. There are a whole lot of players that simply don't care about the things you do, and who like shiny.
This is sacrilegious!
What about my Eyebeams/Mini Mines/Mighty Kick/AoAC build!?!
Near as I can tell it's like the Fear debuff. If the critter isn't doing anything they'll cower. Similarly if a character is repelled, they'll do the waving hands animation. Try fighting a player or mob with a maintain then repel them. The mob will continue the maintain despite being repelled (unless they're repelled out of range).
Pretty sure I'm not hysterical, and thank you to those who did read my prior post. But I'll TL;DR it for you in point form, Captain, and reiterate my concerns in the most recent thread:
- Mighty Kick's repel should be treated like a failed knock. That way, you can benefit from Aggressor and proc Unstoppable, if you choose to take those Brick-specific powers. Because the repel, as fun as it is, is a DPS loss.
- Mighty Kick should build (not just refresh) stacks of Enrage on a full charge. Whether this is a part of Madness?! or part of the core power, I do not care. The Brick framework already has two methods to refresh Defiant! which I illustrated in my prior post. The Might tree specifically, however, lacks a single target Enrage builder.
The part below this is not part of the TL;DR. Stop reading here if you're so inclined. I already talked about Defiant!. What follows are my remaining thoughts on the matter, specifically relating to the lack of synergy with Might's other powers.I like Mighty Kick.
Its a recycled animation. The Destroid in Dr. Destroyer's Robot Factory has been doing this boot since launch. But I don't care. Punting someone around brings a smile to my face. I'm sure people have other powers that give them the same feeling. Even the special effects are nice. I even _like_ the mandatory repel on tap. It gives the power a feeling of, well, power.
To reiterate, I like the kick.
But a repel is nothing. Its arguably worse than nothing. Its fun to look at and, as Empyreal10 said, may provide a situational use, however being repelled is not a form of CC. It does not cause you to lose control of your character in any meaningful way. It is a failed knock.
Its counter is holding down whatever key make you go forward. If your target does not do you the courtesy of holding down their forward button, Mighty Kick's damage per second drops considerably because, after the second or third kick, you can't kick them anymore. They're out of range.
You're welcome to go ahead and test it. Parse Mighty Kick + Unstoppable + Aggressor versus Uppercut + Unstoppable + Aggressor. Or, heck, each power by itself with no toggle or passive. I would guestimate that even rank 3 Beatdown gives rank 3 Mighty Kick a run for its money in raw damage, just because you have to continually chase your target.
That'd be okay _if_ you got something out of it.
This is why I ask that Mighty Kick's repel be treated as a failed knock and inherit all the benefits and penalties of being a failed knock. That way, at least the penalty for the repel will not be as great. And hey, Mighty Leap + Mighty Kick to start a brawl will really get the energy rolling in this situation, if you're running Unstoppable, especially now that it has AM. Shoulder check into boot to the gut.. its a great visual image.
If Mighty Kick remains as is, it'll be a nice novelty power Brick-minded people will pick up to try out, maybe even retain for a month or two. I'll probably even do that. But then, after using it for a while and the urge to retcon becomes overwhelming, it will be one of the first powers that gets cut if they're looking to trim because your only reason to keep it will be, 'It looks cool'. It won't even be a terribly hard choice.
And that's my problem with Mighty Kick.