I have a Moderate amount of confidence in this Dev team.

roughbearmattach

There has been lots of development over the past six months. Much of it has been great, and there has been new content, too.
On the other hand, there have been missteps--some changes that I wasn't wild about and that I don't think improved the game.

Overall, I think the good has outweighed the bad. The Dev team is doing well, but there is still plenty of work to be done.

chaelk

I'm not worried about the chnages.
Things change, deal with it.
I wasn't raised to expect everything to be perfect or exactly the way they want it.​​

biffsmackwell

I'm still grumpy about the cost/time to acquire Heroic gear, but aside from that I think they've done really well.

chaosdrgnz43

Is this "I have X amount of confidence in this dev team" a thing now?

Anyway, the changes the devs made is somewhat adaptable. But I hope they don't change things too much that will cause a real uproar.

roughbearmattach

I'm not a fanboy or a hater. I love CO, but the Devs have done things I really don't like. They've also made changes I've supported.

The addition of content, though, has been great.

mijjestic

This would be the ultimate contrarian thread, being the second and separate response to the first but it runs smack in the middle of things.

How about next we have, 'You Are All Wrong About Your Levels of Confidence In This Dev Team'?

decorumfriends

I'm apathetic towards extremism.

canadascott

This is pretty much where I am. They're doing a decent job of squeezing so much lemonade out of so few lemons. But it's hard not to notice how few lemons there are, or that there are other parts of the operation that aren't running as smooth as the devs.

squirrelloid

mijjestic said:

This would be the ultimate contrarian thread, being the second and separate response to the first but it runs smack in the middle of things.

How about next we have, 'You Are All Wrong About Your Levels of Confidence In This Dev Team'?

Make it happen!

biffsmackwell said:

I'm still grumpy about the cost/time to acquire Heroic gear, but aside from that I think they've done really well.

That and the manipulator change are the ones that really bug me.

As much as I'd like the fire additions/changes to HW to be more optional, it does give me build ideas, so ultimately its a net plus. (And if it wasn't for the jacking up of the heroic gear prices, I'd be looking at a bunch of new characters soon).

spinnytop

canadascott

spinnytop said:

What a croc.

xcelsior41

bluegrassbeast said:

Yeah, I'm currently here and dropping fast. They ruined my main character with the idiot 2GM cost hike, now theyw ant to screw over my secondary main by doing the same to Skewer...

The Heroic gear hike..

Such a strong start, but it feels now like a false front to build goodwill before this crap-storm of player-screwing changes.

Turn it back around, or people are going to start getting off the ride I expect.

Stop doing things the majority of the playerbase doesn't have any desire for, and take 'increase costs' as a concept from your collective Dev vocabulary, take it out back, and then torture it to death before burying it in a shallow, crossroads grave.

Then maybe we can have some faith again.

Agreed, increased cost never help to elongate, but instead deteriorate.

squirrelloid

bluegrassbeast said:

Yeah, I'm currently here and dropping fast. They ruined my main character with the idiot 2GM cost hike, now theyw ant to screw over my secondary main by doing the same to Skewer...

The Heroic gear hike..

Such a strong start, but it feels now like a false front to build goodwill before this crap-storm of player-screwing changes.

Turn it back around, or people are going to start getting off the ride I expect.

Stop doing things the majority of the playerbase doesn't have any desire for, and take 'increase costs' as a concept from your collective Dev vocabulary, take it out back, and then torture it to death before burying it in a shallow, crossroads grave.

Then maybe we can have some faith again.

The 2gm change at least made sense. It was being splashed because it was too good for how easy it was to use. The new 2gm at least gained utility to compensate for the cost, and afaik the AT that uses it does have the energy generation set up to actually make use of it.

The skewer change is completely out of left field and without any reason at all. No one thought skewer was overperforming. (If anything, HW as a framework underperforms). It gained no buffs to compensate. PTS version now costs more e than annihilate while dealing less damage, and also uniformly costs more e than skullcrusher while doing the same damage. It's like they don't want people to play with it anymore for *no reason whatsoever*, and screw you devastators who made use of it and don't have tons of other options.

I mean, yeah, my devastator will probably weather the change, but I'm rocking justice primaries and OSV secondaries, r7 mods, and with total ~500 cost reduction on gear. Good luck if you wanted to play a devastator without top-of-the-line gear.

spinnytop

Oh look, it turned into a complaining thread. You guys want that other thread, the "zero confidence" one.

rtma

bluegrassbeast said:

The change to 2GM made it damn near unusable.

I can still use it, despite rearranging powers to synergize, Pistols feel like a proper Framework on their own now, I like that you don't just rely on it with very little thought, Have you tried EGO/Rec/??? with Killer Instinct EU?, I can make it work and I'm using Heroics/Rank 5 mods.

ninjapiff

bluegrassbeast said:

They ruined my main character with the idiot 2GM cost hike, now theyw ant to screw over my secondary main by doing the same to Skewer...

Of course, this is somewhat subjective. Reaper's Caress' cost was increased, and was turned into an AoE. Same with 2GM. Apparently, the difference is that 2GM now "sucks". Slice N Dice's build (by the way, yeah, it's me, Slice N Dice. That's his face as my profile image. Line up for signatures on breasts and whatnot) has only gotten better with the recent changes to Reaper's Caress and Way of the Warrior. Seriously, my DPS has gotten A LOT better overall thanks to those changes. It's not all bad!

However, the nerf to Master of the Mind was a letdown. It's still a decent miniset (if you can make it work) but not having each debuff get purges separately really tans my hide. Granted, I'm a little late to this specific change, but whatever. I rarely used 2GM because I knew it was oftentimes abused. Apparently, though, Ice Blast was nerfed at some point. I didn't even notice a difference on my Ice toon.

xcelsior41

bluegrassbeast said:

The difference is they didn't ruin RC with an insufferably high cost,take away a feature, and jack it up two tiers.

I mean sure, DP is its own now, and thats awesome! But, leveling a DP is not. In that, if you level a DP, your in for a The Mind experience. Low damage, but not bad end cost, thank god I got my DP to 40 waaaaaay back, and all I have to do(for a third time) is retcon him to get KI to work and 2GM will be the same again, probably. but just because I work around it doesnt mean someone else should be forced to redo everything they've built, and thats what I think is the problem here with alot of people on these forums. Your trying to impose on others. "Just do so and so" or "Change so and so". Well, what if a power could be reduced or buffed(adjusted, period.) without this imposing mentality?. It may be hard to fathom, but that's whats supposed to happen, not limitations.

biffsmackwell

I would have rather Two Gun Mojo go back to how it was pre-buff, where it was a cool looking attack that people wished did more damage based solely on how it looks, rather than have it be the crown jewel Force Cascade of Munitions.

The developers had to do a balancing act; do they A - nerf the power back to what it should have been, B - leave it, or C - place it among the other heavy hitters out there, but by doing so justify it with a heavy cost?

Solution A would have pissed people off because now all of their characters which relied on doing nothing but hitting the 2 key all day is now "totally useless". Solution B is ridiculous because then the power is just overpowered. Before anyone says "No, B is fine, leave it like it is and then just buff everything else to be on par," that is even more ridiculous. If all powers start doing more damage just because of one ham-fisted buff that happened a few years ago, then all characters will be ridiculously overpowered, and then content needs to be adjusted around those changes. This is literally readjusting the game around one power. So, no. Solution C is what they went with. The same amount of people are pissed as if they went with A, but now the power is justifiably powerful.

However, the reason I don't like it? Little tiny pistols are now the strongest guns in the game. Someone missed the forest for the trees, and just paid attention to two-gun mojo in a vacuum. If you were to stand in front of a rhino with a couple of pistols and someone next to you is standing in front of a rhino with a minigun, guess who's going to have Cream of Rhino soup first?

In Champions, it's pistol guy.

xcelsior41

biffsmackwell said:

I would have rather Two Gun Mojo go back to how it was pre-buff, where it was a cool looking attack that people wished did more damage based solely on how it looks, rather than have it be the crown jewel Force Cascade of Munitions.

The developers had to do a balancing act; do they A - nerf the power back to what it should have been, B - leave it, or C - place it among the other heavy hitters out there, but by doing so justify it with a heavy cost?

Solution A would have pissed people off because now all of their characters which relied on doing nothing but hitting the 2 key all day is now "totally useless". Solution B is ridiculous because then the power is just overpowered. Before anyone says "No, B is fine, leave it like it is and then just buff everything else to be on par," that is even more ridiculous. If all powers start doing more damage just because of one ham-fisted buff that happened a few years ago, then all characters will be ridiculously overpowered, and then content needs to be adjusted around those changes. This is literally readjusting the game around one power. So, no. Solution C is what they went with. The same amount of people are pissed as if they went with A, but now the power is justifiably powerful.

However, the reason I don't like it? Little tiny pistols are now the strongest guns in the game. Someone missed the forest for the trees, and just paid attention to two-gun mojo in a vacuum. If you were to stand in front of a rhino with a couple of pistols and someone next to you is standing in front of a rhino with a minigun, guess who's going to have Cream of Rhino soup first?

In Champions, it's pistol guy.

Reasonable. However, I would like to wage this counter-point(which will more than likely be ignored but hey!). You say changing the game to one power? I agree, ludicrous!, But, what do you think they're doing now?. Literally, they are shoe-horning builds, some will tell you 'no', but they aren't affected(yet) or more likely adapted and where shoe-horned willingly or unaware.(survival=CON for example). Some will say they are fine(and that's fine! .) but, being shoe-horned is easier on the player, and instinctively, if it's easier and there's no evident penalty, why not?. But, there is a penalty. And it's a word not many on this forum know what it means, Build Diversity. That is not to say leave OP, OP. But be careful with how much and how frequently you do nerfs. Also, remember, nerf is 50%, buff is the other 50. If you do one or the other too much, then the whole game gets adjusted around nerfed or buffed powers in that at that point, everything becomes much more of a chore than it should be, and the game's dynamic can shift for the worse. However, same is for Buffs. You buff everything? Too easy. Now, I know that some will use that buff statement to justify nerfing everything, but don't. Your wrong. Buffing, say, AoAC? Not too bad an idea, but be careful by how much. Buffing CC? Do it. Just Do it.(shia labeu gif inserted here). It sucks, everyone knows it sucks. But PvP is scared, so it got shanked. Time to bring it back(but again, be careful by how much). You see how this can go both ways Biff? So people can stop saying nerf nerf nerf is okay and start asking for both?.

kemmicals

I think I have more confidence in the dev team than the community in general.

biffsmackwell

xcelsior41 said:

Reasonable. However, I would like to wage this counter-point(which will more than likely be ignored but hey!). You say changing the game to one power? I agree, ludicrous!, But, what do you think they're doing now?. Literally, they are shoe-horning builds, some will tell you 'no', but they aren't affected(yet) or more likely adapted and where shoe-horned willingly or unaware.(survival=CON for example). Some will say they are fine(and that's fine! .) but, being shoe-horned is easier on the player, and instinctively, if it's easier and there's no evident penalty, why not?. But, there is a penalty. And it's a word not many on this forum know what it means, Build Diversity. That is not to say leave OP, OP. But be careful with how much and how frequently you do nerfs. Also, remember, nerf is 50%, buff is the other 50. If you do one or the other too much, then the whole game gets adjusted around nerfed or buffed powers in that at that point, everything becomes much more of a chore than it should be, and the game's dynamic can shift for the worse. However, same is for Buffs. You buff everything? Too easy. Now, I know that some will use that buff statement to justify nerfing everything, but don't. Your wrong. Buffing, say, AoAC? Not too bad an idea, but be careful by how much. Buffing CC? Do it. Just Do it.(shia labeu gif inserted here). It sucks, everyone knows it sucks. But PvP is scared, so it got shanked. Time to bring it back(but again, be careful by how much). You see how this can go both ways Biff? So people can stop saying nerf nerf nerf is okay and start asking for both?.

Yeah, it goes both ways, and that's what you call "balance" which is what the team's been doing. They buff stuff, nerf stuff, at the end of the day it's just balancing. What happened to two-gun mojo though, was a weird combination of both. Initially, the power was okay. It wasn't the worst pick, it wasn't the best (it was tier zero, after all). A developer decided to buff it up to make early-game leveling more fun, but he just straight-up overdid it and punched its damage up to insane levels, without counter-balancing anything about it. What the developers recently did was add that counter-balance that should have been there all along, if the damage buff it got was to stay "as designed."

I don't think anyone's saying "nerf nerf nerf!" all the time, but when it comes to trying to balance powers, both nerfs and buffs are going to happen, and they have been. Two-gun mojo was just a strange outlier that was kept over-buffed but was given the counter-balance it always needed in order to stay that buffed. But again, I think it was an unnecessary measure; the only thing that really makes sense is to take it back to its pre-buff status.

pantagruel01

xcelsior41 said:

Build Diversity.

Build diversity occurs when there are multiple comparably effective options. You typically get more diversity out of bring down the top powers than raising the weak powers, because bringing down the top powers makes all of the middle-of-the-road powers competitive, while bringing up the weak powers only helps those specific powers.

xcelsior41 said:

Buffing CC? Do it. Just Do it.(shia labeu gif inserted here). It sucks, everyone knows it sucks. But PvP is scared, so it got shanked.

The key problem with CC is that Cryptic has always figured 'works on a player character' and 'works on a master villain' are equally valuable, and it's not even close. Thus, anything that makes CC useful in PvE makes it stupidly overpowered in PvP.

squirrelloid

So, can we stop whining about 2gm? I mean, it may not be what you wanted, but at least it was fair, kept its damage pretty much, and gained great utility and supporting powers.

But it's literally hijacking conversations we need to have about other powers, like the Skewer change, which comes with no compensatory buffs and wasn't even warranted in the first place. Or the devastator build change, which is trying to shoehorn it into being about clinging flames instead of its current knock-enrage-unstoppable energy battery. And the loud noise about 2gm drowned out the conversation we needed to have about manipulator, which is currently playable only using some ridiculous workarounds. (Manipulator, unlike 2gm, didn't get any corrections after the initial change went up on PTS - it just went through as it was despite the fact that the change to manipulator was arguably *worse* for it than 2gm's was for it). Or Mental Storm for that matter, which got its damage nerfed despite being on the *low end* of DoT DPS before the nerf. (It was only higher than the other telepathy DoTs... and people wonder why telepathy is so bad...)

beezeeze

My main used 2gm and still uses 2gm and its still doing the same damage and after a few minor tweaks I don't have too much trouble maintaining it and then adding in burst shot only made it better.

That takes a little bit of effort to work around the changes however, it is much easier to just complain that they ruined it and refuse to adapt in any way.

meedacthunist

2GM is not the only power in this game and not the most important one. Got it on a freeform and on an AT and it's playable on both of them.
This is silly.
Cryptic's not gonna revert changes anyway.

Developers could easily nerf 2GM back to its old levels (causing even greater outcry), instead they opted for keeping it useful and balanced it other way.​​

decorumfriends

I'm having no problem adapting to the new 2GM. It plays completely differently now, but it works just fine. It's just not "hold button down over and over until everyone's dead". To be frank, that was kind of boring.

spinnytop

bluegrassbeast said:

The change to 2GM made it damn near unusable.

This claim was old and tired and patently false when the change was still on PTS, before they lowered the cost, bluegrassweenie

bluegrassbeast said:

"Work around" and "totally respec and spend a fortune in G and Q to re-gear because the Devs listened to tryhard whiners" are two separate things entirely.

I do have to correct you here - the "tryhards" as you call them aren't the ones who tend to whine about things. Bit of an ironic claim for you to be making considering your posts in this thread, wouldn't you say?

spinnytop

biffsmackwell said:

[Biff's thoughts regarding 2GM changes.]

After some thought, I think I figured out why they went the way they did, raising the cost rather than lowering the damage. Think about what lowering the damage to Tier 0 appropriate levels would have done. So, you want to play a character that uses two pistols as their primary form of attack? Great, so your heavy hitting damage option for that is... a Tier-0 power that does Tier-0 damage. In other words, if they had gone that way, not only would Dual Pistols as a theme have slim pickings as far as number of powers goes, but it would objectively be a weak theme in regards to dealing damage. That would basically be really unfair to anyone who just plain wants to play that kind of character - people would say, why bother? Sure, there would be those who would say "forget performance, all I care about is looking cool" but it's not really okay to make a design decision based around the idea that "people will just ignore the reality of the mechanics". It's perfectly fine for players to make that decision, but for the game developer it really isn't.

So basically, they went with making 2GM a nice powerful attack so that people playing a Dual Pistols character can have a nice powerful attack and won't have to make the decision to "suffer for the theme". In its place of "low cost tier-0 power" we got Burst Shot. Yes, the animation for Burst Shot isn't the greatest, but as we've all observed the name of the game right now is "asset reuse" and after trying their options, this is the one that worked, so that's the one we got. I actually suggested looking into making Burst Shot a charge power and was told they would look into it - looks like the animation just won't let it happen ( painful reality of having to work with what you've got rather than being able to request new animation assets ).

Sure they could have just made a tier-0 clone of 2GM with lower cost and damage, but let's face it that just seems like a lazy option and we both know people would just complain that they're "being forced to use the nerfed version cause of my theme, MUH BILD DIVRSTY!". Burst shot is, in my opinion at least, the more interesting option since it's not just a straight replacement and is instead its own power.

As for pistols vs gattling guns, it really depends on the situation - there are situations where gatling gun will out-dps 2gunmojo, mainly aoe situations. I guess the gatling gun power has you using a gatling gun from fallout 4... the kind that shoot a bunch of tiny bullets all over the place and in the end don't even kill stuff as fast an assault rifle or pistol would ( they make good vendor trash tho ). I mean, it's not the kind of gun that they mount on military choppers that will cut a pickup truck in half.

biffsmackwell

spinnytop said:

biffsmackwell said:

[Biff's thoughts regarding 2GM changes.]

After some thought, I think I figured out why they went the way they did, raising the cost rather than lowering the damage. Think about what lowering the damage to Tier 0 appropriate levels would have done. So, you want to play a character that uses two pistols as their primary form of attack? Great, so your heavy hitting damage option for that is... a Tier-0 power that does Tier-0 damage. In other words, if they had gone that way, not only would Dual Pistols as a theme have slim pickings as far as number of powers goes, but it would objectively be a weak theme in regards to dealing damage.

Yup, the problem is, now we're basically talking about a "dual pistol powerset" that has never existed. Dual pistols was never supposed to be the primary form of attack. Two-gun was the decent close-quarters thing, Assault Rifle for long range, SMG if you wanna kill more than one dude at once... See, it all had its place.

The Munitions powerset was never meant to be "the heavy-hitting tier-zero power as a primary form of attack." You were supposed to use bigger guns for bigger damage. SMG does more damage than pistol, assault rifle does more damage than submachine gun, friggin minigun does more damage than Assault Rifle! Your "dual pistols as a theme" only works after the power was foolishly over-buffed. Yeah, anyone could be "dual pistols" theme, and just about every non-theme character was, because what's easier than pressing 2 all night?

Before the silly over-buff, the only dual-pistol theme builds knew that they wouldn't be the best in DPS because, hey, you might as well be an Ice Blast theme build.

spinnytop said:

That would basically be really unfair to anyone who just plain wants to play that kind of character - people would say, why bother? Sure, there would be those who would say "forget performance, all I care about is looking cool" but it's not really okay to make a design decision based around the idea that "people will just ignore the reality of the mechanics". It's perfectly fine for players to make that decision, but for the game developer it really isn't.

I'd 100% agree if we could just pick any power out of any power tree and, regardless of any supporting powers, say that "A build based around this power can put out as much DPS as the most finely-tuned Force Cascade build, without putting any more thought into the build other than just pressing the button again after the maintain has ended.

Two Gun Mojo was a fine power, for its intended tier, before it was buffed, and the buff without further adjustment was irresponsible. I mean, let's make all tier-zero powers do 5k DPS, no probs. Beatdown for 3k per hit, let's do this! Forget Haymaker, let's just do Beatdown all day long, sister!

spinnytop said:

So basically, they went with making 2GM a nice powerful attack so that people playing a Dual Pistols character can have a nice powerful attack and won't have to make the decision to "suffer for the theme". In its place of "low cost tier-0 power" we got Burst Shot. Yes, the animation for Burst Shot isn't the greatest, but as we've all observed the name of the game right now is "asset reuse" and after trying their options, this is the one that worked, so that's the one we got. I actually suggested looking into making Burst Shot a charge power and was told they would look into it - looks like the animation just won't let it happen ( painful reality of having to work with what you've got rather than being able to request new animation assets ).

Yeah, already said all of that, thanks for reiterating I guess.

spinnytop said:

Sure they could have just made a tier-0 clone of 2GM with lower cost and damage, but let's face it that just seems like a lazy option and we both know people would just complain that they're "being forced to use the nerfed version cause of my theme, MUH BILD DIVRSTY!". Burst shot is, in my opinion at least, the more interesting option since it's not just a straight replacement and is instead its own power.

Heh I have a picture of a bee in my head, and it's flying in an S pattern.

You know what folks would have liked? Two Gun Mojo and TWO GUN FRIGGIN JAM-JAMS, MOFO! Who cares if two attacks use the same animation, nobody's gonna be like "THIS GAME IS UNFAIR BECAUSE I THOUGHT HE WAS USING MOJO BUT HE WAS USING JAM-JAMS." Not even in PVP. Nobody would care. Out of all the things that people have to be critical about this game, using the two-gun mojo animation on two powers is not going to be the death knell.

Bless their hearts, the burst shot animation is glam-pop without the glam or the pop. It's just "don't do this."

spinnytop said:

As for pistols vs gattling guns, it really depends on the situation - there are situations where gatling gun will out-dps 2gunmojo, mainly aoe situations. I guess the gatling gun power has you using a gatling gun from fallout 4... the kind that shoot a bunch of tiny bullets all over the place and in the end don't even kill stuff as fast an assault rifle or pistol would ( they make good vendor trash tho ). I mean, it's not the kind of gun that they mount on military choppers that will cut a pickup truck in half.

Yeah, no, let's just tell the army to stop mounting light or heavy machine guns on their trucks, and just be like "guys, use pistols, because depending on the situation..."

Shut up, man, that poo is lovin' funny.

avianos

biffsmackwell wrote: »

Shut up, man, that **** is fucking funny.

Maxwell, Language! There are Small Chillens in this site​​

xcelsior41

pantagruel01 said:

xcelsior41 said:

Build Diversity.

Build diversity occurs when there are multiple comparably effective options. You typically get more diversity out of bring down the top powers than raising the weak powers, because bringing down the top powers makes all of the middle-of-the-road powers competitive, while bringing up the weak powers only helps those specific powers.

xcelsior41 said:

Buffing CC? Do it. Just Do it.(shia labeu gif inserted here). It sucks, everyone knows it sucks. But PvP is scared, so it got shanked.

The key problem with CC is that Cryptic has always figured 'works on a player character' and 'works on a master villain' are equally valuable, and it's not even close. Thus, anything that makes CC useful in PvE makes it stupidly overpowered in PvP.

Imma take Ravens position on CC, since you don't play it.

And, as far as Build Diversity? Yeah, that's the response I get, but guess what? It isn't happening right now. Instead, do a nerf then follow up with making a weak power good. An example: You nerf 2GM, okay, bring up say...hmm..a telepathy power(they seem pretty down in the dumps) thats not been doing too well. That is catering to build diversity. That is adding options. Right now..well, somewhere in these threads I talked about shoe-horning to biff(I think he considered my stand-point, maybe.)

decorumfriends

bluegrassbeast said:

When they come for your favorite sets, I'm not saying a damn word in defense.

Were you asked to?

rap9

bluegrassbeast said:

When they come for your favorite sets, I'm not saying a damn word in defense.

The Jury is Out still on HW, but this Might be going on right now. Eruption CD for example.

And I don't see them stopping.

biffsmackwell

avianos said:

Maxwell, Language! There are Small Chillens in this site​​

What the--

Is the language filter completely off?

biffsmackwell

bluegrassbeast said:

When they come for your favorite sets, I'm not saying a damn word in defense.

You think the only people that are okay with this change are ones who don't use Munitions?

jaazaniah1

I figure that once they are done (sometime in the fall?) all my characters will have been affected to some degree. How much they will be nerfed or buffed I can't say, but I'll do my best to adapt to whatever the new meta is.

kemmicals

As far as power changes go, I'll probably end up doing what I normally do; Adapt to the changes and find new ways to do stuff.

spinnytop

biffsmackwell said:

Shut up, man, that poo is lovin' funny.

Geez, I think you might actually be the saltiest person when it comes to the 2GM change. Well, I tried to just have a nice mature conversation with you about it, and you talked about poo a bunch. I'm okay with what that says about each of us as people.

bluegrassbeast said:

When they come for your favorite sets, I'm not saying a damn word in defense.

I am looking forward to what they're going to do with the powers I commonly use. You know why? Because all I've seen are positive changes. Not only have the powers they've changed become more balanced, they've become more interesting and just plain cooler. I'm not sure what you mean by "my favorite sets", but I'm already starting to favor the idea of using the stuff that's been changed. So, by the time they "come for" the stuff I'm using now, I'll already have switch to the ones they "came for" before... and then, if the changes they make to the stuff I'm using are in any way as cool as what they've done to things already, I'll likely switch back.

While you're running from the changes, I'm diving into them. Take note of the fact that while we're taking these separate actions, your face looks like this >:C and my face looks like this C:

And yes, I'm glad I'm having fun too.

decorumfriends

That's so DOOMy I could just plotz. Yes, that's exactly what's going to happen. The game is going to die because it doesn't suit your personal build preference any more. **eyeroll**

magpieuk2014

The game has a bit of a new player retention problem and hacking off a sizeable percentage of the existing ones won't help keep it going. People invest time and effort in making characters and builds and that does need to be respected when changes are being made to the game; it's easy to lose player goodwill and without that things will empty out quite quickly. Wind-up forums tactics and stock cynicism don't help; people getting cross with change is inevitable, and that just needs to be left to burn through, not have someone throwing fuel on the fire by insisting that everyone else is wrong/mistaken/a bad player/etc.

The devs could certainly try to explain where they're going with all this and what the intentions are rather than leaving it to players to speculate - that never ends well. And user feedback needs to be accepted for what it is - people reacting to changes and proposing ideas without a developers' knowledge. Sometimes that leads to daft, unworkable ideas; sometimes it just points out that things which make sense to devs and number-crunching hyper-builders just don't give the same impression to the average player.

decorumfriends

magpieuk2014 said:

The game has a bit of a new player retention problem and hacking off a sizeable percentage of the existing ones won't help keep it going.

Except there's no evidence that that is or will happen (every time there's some nerf, DOOM is cried loudly and nothing comes of it). Some people get upset and quit. Most others just shrug and adapt, as is evidenced by most of the posts in this thread (for whatever that's worth).

xcelsior41

bluegrassbeast said:

A tiny fraction of a tiny fraction is okay with it, according to this thread.

Everything must be fine! **eyeroll**

decorumfriends said:

magpieuk2014 said:

The game has a bit of a new player retention problem and hacking off a sizeable percentage of the existing ones won't help keep it going.

Except there's no evidence that that is or will happen (every time there's some nerf, DOOM is cried loudly and nothing comes of it). Some people get upset and quit. Most others just shrug and adapt, as is evidenced by most of the posts in this thread (for whatever that's worth).

There's evidence. It's in game, as teams become a bit more difficult to form(quite a bit, recently) during random times of the day on weekends. Also, random ?: How do I make signatures?

bazodee

Well, I'll give a hard example: Mine. All of my gaming time was spent on Champions Online. It was the first game I've played in a looong time that I liked and stuck with... for 3+ yrs!

Since devs direction seem to be focused on grind and team up in addition to the power balancing changes, which so far have been messing with my favourite toons (out of 30+ themed cross-framework FFs), I'll wait till the dust settles to return in full force and monetary backing

For now, I'll devote most of my gaming time to the two new games I've joined (1 purchased and another f2p). It's not a doom story, it's not nay saying, just one concrete example of the not so vocal player base who is not so happy with CO at this point in time.

My leisure time should be fun.

Hopefully, the dust will settle soon and I can go back to having fun again with CO.