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PVE-only suggestions for new TR builds
donsolo96
Member Posts: 17 Arc User
OK, so the official feedback thread is for just that - feedback to the Devs. And the "Worried about new TR changes" seems focused on fretting and is pretty heavy on PVP-oriented theorycrafting/complaining. As a PVE-exclusive player, both those threads are very hard to parse.
So I was hoping this could be a thread to start discussing actual builds that people are not only testing but feel like they are actually going to use come Mod5, ESPECIALLY after the latest round of updates which I *think* should have went into Preview today (I know that when I was in Preview last night, the latest changes communicated by gentlemancrush in the main feedback thread were NOT there yet).
Mod5 is only 3 weeks away and I feel like I still don't have a good grasp on what I should do once it happens. I have always loved my TR, but the significant changes to my current MI Executioner path mean that I will have to completely change the way I play (no one explains my feelings on this better than the posts from naicalus in the main feedback thread).
If someone wants to post a similar thread for PVP builds, I say go for it.
So I was hoping this could be a thread to start discussing actual builds that people are not only testing but feel like they are actually going to use come Mod5, ESPECIALLY after the latest round of updates which I *think* should have went into Preview today (I know that when I was in Preview last night, the latest changes communicated by gentlemancrush in the main feedback thread were NOT there yet).
Mod5 is only 3 weeks away and I feel like I still don't have a good grasp on what I should do once it happens. I have always loved my TR, but the significant changes to my current MI Executioner path mean that I will have to completely change the way I play (no one explains my feelings on this better than the posts from naicalus in the main feedback thread).
If someone wants to post a similar thread for PVP builds, I say go for it.
Post edited by donsolo96 on
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I foresee a lot of rogues using the executioner path for its ease of use and the fact that it is most tailored to emphasize that which the rogue was originally intended which is a single target high damager.
best advice would honestly be to get on preview server and dabble a little bit with each of the paths to see which one is going to best suit your needs and your play style.as for me I plan to utilize the saboteur line because in multiple CN that I've done with some of my guildmates such as Kaelac, with parsed data I was able to maintain an overall crit rating above 85% and total over 35 million in damage second only to his BiS CW that ran with the group. It naturally fit my play style to use stealth as an augment instead of a crutch and also be mindful of positioning. But that's just me.
I can easily see Scoundrel synergizing very well into the current meta though and won't be surprised if many gravitate towards it.
Gloom level 60 Control Wizard
Dusk level 60 Trickster Rogue
Dawn level 60 Devoted Cleric
Eclipse level 60 Hunter Ranger
Wrath level 60 Great Weapon Fighter
Jinx level 60 Scourge Warlock
SAMOTHRACE
Trickster Rogue
────────────────────────────
Here is my build:
It’s pretty simple to use.
In Dungeon with Trash-Monsters we use the Ecounters: Shadow Strike, Dazing Strike and Blitz.
You go in stealth and hit as many monsters with Dazing Strike as possible (needs a bit practice) after this you attack the same monsters with Blitz and attack one monster with your Duelist Flurry (still our number one At-Will). Then you use Shadow Strike to re-stealth and repeat with going in stealth, use Dazing Strike, etc.
If you fight against bigger monsters or Boss Monsters you use Wicked Reminder instead of Blitz and use only Dazing Strike if you are attacked by too many Trash-Monsters.
The reason of this attack style is pretty simple. We try to activate the feat „Vicious Pursuit“ for us and our group as often as possible, which grants everyone +5% Damage on the monster for 6 seconds we are attacking.
We attack with encounters out of stealth to activate our T5 Feat „Shadow Of Demise“ as often as possible, because it grants a debuff for 6 seconds and after the Debuff the monster get additional damage (50% of the damage that it got in the 6 seconds time span from our TR. This damage is penetration damage, which means it bypass every defense and deflect).
With the changes in dodge, our TR now can dodge 4 times in a row, which means we have plenty of defensive power without ITC (you should say goodby to this skill).
I tested it in CN, TOS and eLOL on the Preview Server.
In CN i did less damage as CW and GWF, CW did like 33 Million GWF 25 Million and i did 19 Million. But to mention it the GWF has rank 10 enchantments and legendary offhand while i had my old offhand and rank 8 enchantments AND it was my first run with the new build, The damage increase was there. Most of the time i do like 9-12 Million damage in this Dungeon, which means 19 Million on the first try is great!
In TOS our CW did 15 Million, the GWF 10.5 Million and i did 10.1 Million. To my excuse i was pretty stupid and i died (i wanted to take a shortcut by jumping over the corner at the bridge which leads to deep fall :P) which means i missed the first boss fight.
In eLOL i did the most Damage of all. I did 8.5, the CW 7.8 and the GWF 6.9.
The damage increase is really great. As TR we do a good amount of small AoE attacks and our single target damage got a huge push, which means one thing: The TR is back in ACTION!!!
Using the Sabo build, you can do the above tactics (using Blitz and Dazing Strike), and because of the T5 feat, both of these initially attacks are in stealth. You can then use Wicked reminder to quickly build stealth back up in a hit or two.
But, I really need to be in a 'normal' group and do runs on both builds to know which is best.
Another Problem is the Buff. T5 Sabo Feat only activates every 15 seconds and only grants +20% damage boost. As Exectioneer you get it every time you go out of stealth with an encounter and get +50% damage that get directly on the hitpoints of the enemy (which can be 76-96K additional damage) and it is AoE compatible...
SAMOTHRACE
Trickster Rogue
────────────────────────────
Trash:
Boss:
This would go with SF or CoS arti weap and TC arti off-hand
As for PvP, this isn't the thread, but I don't really have a clue yet, anyways.
Sharra Del'Armgo - SW Trapper Hybrid HR
Ogghra Bar'Ghuzumn - MI Scoundrel TR
Vænna Thrymskjöldr - IV Protector GF
...until you meet a scoundrel TR in PvP... LoL... Nightmare for any WKs.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
I've done some testing as WK. I just haven't had enough time to get the hang of it. So, if push comes to shove, I'll use my free re-feat as my current MI, rather than changing to WK.
If I can do enough testing as WK before Nov 18 and I find myself enjoying the ranged TR playstyle, then sure, I'll swap.
Sharra Del'Armgo - SW Trapper Hybrid HR
Ogghra Bar'Ghuzumn - MI Scoundrel TR
Vænna Thrymskjöldr - IV Protector GF
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
To the critical strike question: It is important but the diminishing return point is about ~3.000 absolute max. should be 3.500 because the return of investment at this point is already pretty bad, it would be better if you keep going into power after that point but only if you have over 10.000 Power. If you have like 5.000 Power then 2.000 critical should do it.
If you want to maximize your damage, then the dexterity belt is the belt of your choice, because he close the critical strike % gap that mod 5 give us TRs.
To have optimal build with 3k crit you need around 20k power (for around 180% crit severity and without calculating critical overrun - as it is gone next mod).
For around 10k power your optimal crit is 2200, again this is with high crit severity build and no critical overrun (today to get around 180% it will be p.vorpal, crit severity pets, boons deadly momentum and brutal backstab).
So, imo, consider reducing crit.
About Dex, and rotation overall, there are rotation examples but i think most people focus on feats while the most important change was that Invis grants 100% crit chance, and that means with the same high severity build I will get +150% damage of everything i manage to do from invisibility and this is much more than the +50% from the exe capstone (just an example and I'm aware it will include the crit damage too). btw the piercing damage there is because the 50% calculated after the enemy DR reduction so it is only so it wouldn't get "defended" twice.
Bottom line, imo, it makes Dexterity much much less significant. On live today what made the minor difference between the belts is critical overrun (with high severity and it is very build specific) and with it gone, STR makes the more viable choice and the more flexible build wise, I do hope it will change as Dex is our primary attribute and fits more the "rogue" concept than strength.
As i see it and with the limited tasting I've done, sabo will have the higher sustained damage (on some boss fights) and even perhaps clearing because you can use two encounters from stealth (assured crit) back to back without slotting SS and deliver high burst even below the 6 seconds of the exe.
What i had some difficulty is to find the boss "back" to refill my stealth on some bosses, or fumbling with the timings alot as it is very different from the live rotation i use now.
And just a note about testing, can't compare raw damage numbers unless it is the same party, even today one can do 7k in lostmauth with one party and bellow 3k with another with exactly the same build and a smooth run.
I have been loving that flexibility since I made Judeau when WKs launched. Mod 5 is looking really good for enjoying playing him more than ever.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
I tried this build last night and enjoyed it. My only problem: You just stay in stealth for soooooo short a time that I feel like Shadow Strike wasn't even worth it. I actually swapped it out for that old standby, Lashing Blade. If stealth was up and I was surrounded by a mob, I used DS. If stealth was up around a boss, I used LB. DF activates fast enough now that it is (relatively) safe to use out of stealth compared to Live, but we are definitely still glass cannons. I also enjoyed having CoS that had no charges. Range! I will have to play with this more, but this seems like a fun possibility come 11/18. Did you go heavy on DEX or on STR?
Lesser funny in solo pve against control immune mobs.
Sorry for my poor english.
Agreed. That's why I'm thankful for the new smokebomb
Sharra Del'Armgo - SW Trapper Hybrid HR
Ogghra Bar'Ghuzumn - MI Scoundrel TR
Vænna Thrymskjöldr - IV Protector GF
"damages against a target is up by 25% when daze effect failed" ?
Sorry for my poor english.
No we don't. If we meet a CC immune mobs, we simply consider that as our natural limits and use our skill to compensate for loss of efficiency. Other TR build paths would do better against those.
We can't have everything. If we're awesome against certain mobs/players, then we're not so awesome against others.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
But where is the interest of focused control tree when majority of new mobs ( golems, dragons, Skirmish and dungeons boss ) are immune to control ?
Scoundrel is funny with a CW, is funny in 1vs1 pvp, but inoffensive in many dailys situations. I don't want break control immunity, i want a little alternative for a littlte utility of this tree in thoses dailys situations.
Sorry for my english.
Golems = easy
Dragons = easy
Dungeon Boss = team content, get a tank to grab aggro
The utility of Scoundrel is that its got a lot of CCs for mobs that get CCd. Just like the utility of the Sab would be that it can go into stealth often, or the utility of the WK would be its got one big, mean punch.
When the Sab meets mobs that see through stealth, then its utility diminishes.
When the Exec meets a mob with a huge HP pool and defense, then its utility diminishes.
When the Sco meets a mob that is immune to CCs, then its utility diminishes.
In a content that can be cleared solo, your skill is what makes up for diminished utility.
In a content that the mob is so strong that you cannot clear alone with diminished utility, then that's where parties come in.
....
IMO the shi**y trend with NW is that everyone sees balance as a point where you can do everything and anything just as every and any other class in the game. So if someone sees some other class doing higher DPS, then he comes to the boards screaming that his own class is weak. When someone sees a tank character fighting 5, 6 mobs at a time and he can't, then he comes screaming to the boards that his class has too low defense. When that someone sees anything some other class can do and he can't, then he feels his class sucks.
In reality, that's a very unfortunate way of thinking caused by the game being so easy, casual, and newbie-friendly. The content is designed to cater even the most daft of players, that when someone with enough skill/gear plays it, they can do some amazing/abnormal feats with this easy game, and someone sees that, and thinks that's what every class should be doing.
Man.... around 10 years back when the MMOGs used to not cuddle the newbies so much with its carebear content, the concept of "learning curve" was all that mattered, and everyone took it down and accepted the hard fact some classes do some things better than others, some content can be cleared easier with others, and some classes are better in PvP while others are in PvE. Back then, the party content was usually much tougher, and the only standard of determining who did better in PvE was how he actually played.
it didn't matter no stupid random numbers like "DPS" -- what mattered more was whether the players in party PvE content were smart, and reacted correctly to all sorts of tough situations, because in those days, dungeons or instances couldn't be cleared with just cookie cutter DPS steamroller parties, and it actually required a balanced party where everyone was keen on improvising -- because when the game is tough enough, all sorts of danger situations happen. In those games a player that intervenes and saves a friendly is much more worthy than some idiot, stupid DPS machine with target fixation and has zero idea about what's going on about him.
...but I digress.
My opinion is, if there are mobs that are immune to control, then you just kil lit without control. Problem solved.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'