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Am I being naive by choosing greed on dungeons?
kralmoe
Member Posts: 42 Arc User
I find this need or greed system rather annoying.
I started doing dungeons lately and as the party often say "everything greed ppl" I choose every single time "greed". I have the strong feeling that I am being very naive by choosing this 'greed' every time because I almost dont get any item at all (never ever I got an epic one, only once or twice I got a worthless item) while the rest of the party are getting lots of good items. I suspect other members of the party are choosing 'need'. I dont really mind if I dont get a blue item but I do mind when they are epic.
My question is: how do I know when people are choosing 'need' or 'greed'? and am I being really naive?
I started doing dungeons lately and as the party often say "everything greed ppl" I choose every single time "greed". I have the strong feeling that I am being very naive by choosing this 'greed' every time because I almost dont get any item at all (never ever I got an epic one, only once or twice I got a worthless item) while the rest of the party are getting lots of good items. I suspect other members of the party are choosing 'need'. I dont really mind if I dont get a blue item but I do mind when they are epic.
My question is: how do I know when people are choosing 'need' or 'greed'? and am I being really naive?
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If you are doing the honorable thing, and sticking to the terms agreed to ahead of time, then all you are doing by remaining with the rest of the team is helping them to line their own pockets. I will add one addendum - if this is during a dungeon delve, and the timer won't permit you to join another dungeon delve team, then it may be worth it to stick things out so you can at least get your DD chest at the end.
If all else fails, try to find some people that *do* stick to the loot rules they agreed to, and add them as friends - try to grow your group of "trustworthy adventurers" and stick to teaming with them whenever possible. I also recommend trying out the legit channel (see my sig) as those folks have been very good about sticking to the agreed-upon loot rules.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
The two easiest ways to tell right there. You might just have really bad luck. As for getting stuff not worth a lot, welcome to dungeons!
But in the end it's your decision, since you can click either option.
And if you Need on an item when the party was advertised as a Greed party, then you've just shown your party and yourself that your words are worth lesser than a virtual item, which is a joke.
If I am on a so-called 'greed run' from LFG, and a T2 armor piece I genuinely need drops (i.e. I am going to wear it), do I have any moral obligation to greed, or is it generally accepted that I am morally right to roll need?
This question frustrates me because I am running dungeons to get better gear, not just for the AD. But it seems 90% of the LFG population already got what they need a long time ago, and are just running dungeons for the money. Some people say "you should greed BOE epics and just get your stuff from the BOP DD chest". Well, I dont know about this considering T2 set drop rates aren't fantastic.
What's your take?
But since when needing an item that I will actually use and equip qualify as ninja-loot? Anyway,the best course of action is to inform the group beforehand that you need that particular item.
If you weren't aware, 4 greeds and 1 need is an automatic win for you.
So no, it's actually lying/cheating. if the agreed upon looting was greed, then you either agree, tell the other players that "If X drops (be specific), i'm going to need it, it's what I'm looking for" or find a party that are okay with needing.
Its what someone would call being ethical, what you're describing is called ninja mentality, poor sportsmanship, or deception.
To agree to greed and then need, is straight up messed up and will get you kicked, ignored, or shamed.
If nothing was said, then go ahead and need, but to be asked, agree, and then need is betraying the group, they could have needed, too, but you just cheated your way to the drop.
A party only works if there is trust.
If you intentionally press "Need" when you agreed to only press "Greed", you break this trust and this can and may result in possible backlash such as
(i) The "All Greed" agreement breaks down and everyone "Needs" for the rest of the loot from that point onwards.
(ii) Some players feel cheated and leave, resulting in the breakdown of the party and being short of people.
(iii) Some players may intentionally grieve you during the rest of the dungeon. For instance, the cleric may "forget" to heal you or the GWF or CW may only "come to life" after you aggroed the enemies and died.
(iv) You get kicked out of the party.
For someone who doesn't care about others but just want to get loot and clear the dungeon, (i) might be the best outcome but irregardless of the outcome, you are now remembered by the others in that party that you cannot be trusted.
How long they remember depends on the individual.
Some have lists, some just remember by memory and some don't care.
I personally feel you should not treat others the way you would not want to be treated but since this is the internet and a video game, there is an amount of anonymity and most people may behave in a more opportunistic and less socially acceptable manner.
So, just do what you feel is right for you.
It's this kind of attitude that annoys other players spoiling the fun in this 'freakin' game as this one calls it...
No. Players who want Greed runs want the loot for their other characters. They want to play with their best character to collect gear for their weaker characters.
The problem is that they will end up with i.e. a healer as their second character, all with good epics, but are unable to play it right, because they never played much with it and all they know about it is from some other player's guide, where they don't know yet if the build they have is actually right for them or just bad.
They simply do not deserve it when they did not get it on that particular char. This is why I laugh and do not support Greed runs. If I would let them have their Greed runs will this only lead to more bad players who did not learn to play a class right.
I do press Pass on green stuff though. :cool:
What do you mean by "No"? Are you saying that is right to lie to the other players and steal the loot just because you 'think' 'they' want to run a dungeon for their others characters?
Speaking for myself I do not run dungeons for other characters but if anyone does it's his own business. The thing is that if you dont agree with the party to go for greed you should say so and leave. I want you to realize that if you stay and click need you are stealing the loot from me and others. In the end nobody will trust you and you will end on the ignore lists. So just reconsider your behaviour.
You haven't specified if the group (including you) all agreed to a greed run. For pug groups/not specified groups, I believe that each player should have veto power on greed runs. That way, if someone doesn't like it, they revert it back to a need run, but it must be specified by said player at the beginning of the run. I see nothing wrong with telling a group that you don't agree to a greed run and proceeding to roll need. You're being honest.
If the group (including you) agrees to a greed run, and then you roll need, that's a despicable act. Arguing that the internet gives anonymity doesn't really help, as you can tell someone's true character based on how they treat stranger. If you see someone mistreating a stranger, it usually means that they are only nice because they are afraid of the consequences, so that anytime they can get away with something they will.
The way I see rolling need in a greed run is like joining a lottery pool and then keeping all the winnings for yourself. Sure the other people might be well off, while you're struggling to pay the rent, but that's no excuse. If you didn't intend to share the winnings if you happened to win, why were you willing to take part of the winnings when someone else won?
It means I disagree with your opinion. If you do not like it then it is you who can leave. Why should I leave when it is you who wants others not to press Need when they need it? I do not care for you. You think I leave a valuable item to you just so you then like me and become my new friend?
Perhaps explain to me what I get in return when I not press Need. What is my deal here? All I see is that I get nothing. Why would I give up on a good item?? It makes no sense to me. I get that it may cause drama and grief, because of some naive and narrow-minded view of a minor group of players, but that isn't my problem. I want the item, I get the item, and I am gone. I am not even a greedy person. I simply need the item to make AD. Everybody needs AD.
Well then you fit the second paragraph I mentioned, you're a fraud. I wouldn't believe someone saying sorry for accidentally pressing need unless they gave the item to the person with the highest greed roll.
No on is forcing their decisions on you. If you want to join their run, you agree to their terms. If you don't agree to their terms, then don't join their runs and start your own. There's no difference to this than agreeing to various terms of service online (including NW), and then exploiting the game. I consider this worse than outright theft as at least someone robbing you is straight with you and what they are doing, while you are doing the same but trying to act friendly. But anyway, as I'm speaking to someone with no morals, the best argument for you is that you'll one day realize that you can't have your cake and eat it too.
What makes you think it is their run? Are you talking about guild parties or parties of friends? Why would I even get invited?? Have we stopped talking about open parties?
And where do you get the idea that people can have cake but cannot eat it? What nonsense have people been feeding you, kid?? Where does one get cake but is not allowed to eat it? What sort of cruelty is this?
I also have very strong morals. I believe you do not deserve the item and I already said why you don't deserve it.
Unfortunately, Cryptic can only do so much to prevent people like him from poisoning this game.
You could just buy the items you need for your other classes on the market, but you want them for free. I am guessing most of the Greed runners don't buy ZEN either. You want it all for free and others have to give it up so you can have it. You are like the beggars and bums of the Internet... Cryptic should implemented a tax so that they can give in-game welfare to terrible gamers. *lol*
Hell, it is just a game and not even real life. And yet you whine about dice rolls as if your actual life depended on it. It is mind boggling. Just press Need when you see a good item. Either because you need it, or perhaps you do not even know you need and just want it! Just do it ...
Life is brutal. You'll get screwed once, twice, maybe even 10 times, then you'll stop hitting greed, seeing how all you have is your "morals", that are useless in an online game. IMO it's just naive. You need a 900k cap, that drops from a boss, noone else needs it, only you. You were trying to get it for last 2 months. What do you do? You lose the opportunity because of your morals? Bull****. You hit "need" finally getting what you want. Your alleged morals don't apply in 90% of situations. I doubt any of those guys talking about morals would waste 1h of playing just to give away big profit. 99% of you are all talk, that either lie to look good on forum or you've never been in a situation like the one I described. Morals? You're all hypocrits, you'll come to realize it soon enough.
All greed run = Begging? Okay then.
Like I said @dragmosh, join a good guild, get some friends or a regular group. Pugging will eventually group you up with people like him who unfortunately pollute many a F2P games.
ironically, that happened once and i was told i still had the highest roll so i lucked out lol
Push the Need button!
I guess to remain on topic, the "greed only" usually pertains to Epics. If you're rolling greed on enchants, you're <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> yourself.
Problem is, these folks will rarely show their character names or @handles. So they have little to fear. Even if the entire forum community decided to preemptively ignore or blacklist these players. Its such a small fraction of the player base that these people will always find groups. So there is less then zero incentive for them to change.
Truth of the matter is, there will always be players like this. They wont change, no matter how well you reason your arguments, or word your debates. The rest of the community needs to adapt to it or loose out. Or we need to finally wake up and understand that the entire N/G/P system is a tired old relic and needs to be abandoned.