Completed FBI for the first time this weekend, received epic ring of Dod, 435 Power, 435 Crit 3℅ resist, 2 enchantment slots Offense/Defense. Best drop I've received from any Dungeon.
A much more rational solution is to lower refinement requirements, and ward and mark prices. Make it easier to get to 3.1k for those who are struggling.
There are double refinements about once a month now, which reduces the refinement cost significantly, and these people still can't get to 3.1k. I dont think this would do anything for those people.
''double refinements about once a month now, which reduces the refinement cost significantly''.... I was farming three whole months resonance stones from leadership and some thaumaturge and when double refinement event came out i used all these stones to my epic level 39 arti waist, only just to realize that i could refine it to level 43 out of 59... four meager refinement levels after three whole months of farming for only just one epic artifact equipment....
I'm sorry but there is no way in hell this is true... I farm Leadership for months and I have 3 sets of Legendary Artefact Equipment and 6 Mythic Artefacts. Plus I sold millions and millions of AD worth of Refinement stones.
Edit... actually my bad, I have 7 Alt's who also farm Leadership and send over the Stones to my main on double RP events.
Main - Rydia (HR70) - Xbox One Player only Alts : Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
Member of Q-Snipe
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micky1p00Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,594Arc User
well yes, the truth is that one-two hours of grinding is not enough for upgrading to legendary... but on the other hand why you have to be enforced to have equipped high rank artifacts in order to get in a new dungeon...the requirements still need to be reduced to 2.7k iL lets say to be fair with all players,not mention that you need 30k voniblood only for shirt/pants + kits...
What is that fair to all players? Lets be fair to all players, including well geared players, who have absolutely nothing to do in the game and running ToS in 5 minutes is not interesting enough. So if there will be some content for geared end-game, none will die from it. Gear up, join. At least you have something to aim towards. (Or ignore based on FBI loot)
3100 seems so far away - and yet I don't want them to lower it.
It gives me something to work toward. My friends and I left our last game after we did everything, there was nothing left to do other than become more and more OP. Yes for those of us on the PS4 who didn't spend a ton of $$, it does seem a long way off. But I also expect it to be insanely difficult once I get there. I plan on tons of wipes while we figure it all out together. I just hope the goodies I get from it are worth it once I get there.
Founding Member of "Wrong Side of the Stronghold" Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
I have long said this game needs to make a choice. Cater to casual players, or cater to hardcore players. They sort of float around the middle and go back and forth, and this just makes people mad.
The game started very casual friendly. Quick dungeons that didn't require the trinity to complete. Lots of solo content. You could really feel like you made progress with 15-20 mins in game and you may even have some stuff to auction to make a decent profit. The downside of this is, you had hardcore players sitting at the BIS level, soloing dungeons and bored out of their minds...
Now its shifting to a more hardcore-centered model. Extremely rare drops, lots of farming to progress, necessary classes for dungeons. Lots of campaigns, as well as time gates on them to limit progress. Dungeons that only really advanced players can enter and complete....and the casual folks start complaining that it is too hard. Sort of funny when you think about it, cause from what I hear, every other game is going to a more casual friendly format.
In the end, I guess I'd prefer they create hard dungeons for BIS people, and then a reduced version for more casual people to play and experience the instance. This doesn't seem like it would be all that hard...reduce the HP and damage of all creatures, lower the loot table, and be done with it. This seems like the best solution to this.
In the end, i think everyone should be able to experience the punishment equally of what you get when you ask for hard content with a high level cap, and tell the devs you'll take it even if the loot sucks....we asked and we got.
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
I think everyone tends to forget that the game *started* with players struggling to complete Mad Dragon, and strategizing to pull single hulks in Throne of Idris because you'd wipe if you got swarmed.
Solo CN runs were the manifestation of multiple modules of power creep and not much added to do with it.
I don't think the requirements for FBI should be lowered. The devs in this case have tried to provide a realistic view of what will be needed for a successful run (or chance at one). NW's queues are notorious for underestimating in order to let people in the door, and that's fine if you've got a solid group to carry you in the name of gearing up, but it also means complaints when the entire party just barely makes the entry requirements and are not necessarily playing optimally. It's far better in this case to not allow entry to anyone who is likely to need to be carried.
I do not envy the balancing act of content design. Ideally, they have to come up with scenarios that make failure fun, at least fun enough to keep trying. If success comes too easily, then the game is boring. But it can't seem unbeatable either. Tough job.
I would love to see requirements removed for private groups - if there are a bunch of us who want to go in and get our rear ends handed to us at IL 2500, we should be allowed that joy. As long as we aren't messing up someone who's serious about it's time.
We have to make private matches in LoL all the time when none of our tanks are on - we take 4 DPS and a healer. It makes for a very interesting experience.
Founding Member of "Wrong Side of the Stronghold" Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
Please leave this dungeon as is. IMO all dungeons IL should be adjusted upward. With the base dungeons needing to be at 2K, masters requiring 2.5K. That would be better IMO but I don't see them doing that as a group of 1600 can beat all the base dungeons if the players know what they are doing.
FBI should be left where it is at. Not many players have that IL for good reason, time and money. If you don't have much time or money to invest into a MMO the game should not cater to you simply because you want to run something. In fact if you invested more time or money you may get into the dungeon. Both require an investment and if you are not willing to invest one or the other or both, you should be excluded from the dungeon.
I'm not at 3.1 yet and I have seen a few videos on and watch quite a few videos of players complaining about the loot. I actually like this idea with FIB. It is more about the challenge than than gear. I like that and hopefully soon I can play it and try it out.
I have long said this game needs to make a choice. Cater to casual players, or cater to hardcore players. They sort of float around the middle and go back and forth, and this just makes people mad.
The game started very casual friendly. Quick dungeons that didn't require the trinity to complete. Lots of solo content. You could really feel like you made progress with 15-20 mins in game and you may even have some stuff to auction to make a decent profit. The downside of this is, you had hardcore players sitting at the BIS level, soloing dungeons and bored out of their minds...
Now its shifting to a more hardcore-centered model. Extremely rare drops, lots of farming to progress, necessary classes for dungeons. Lots of campaigns, as well as time gates on them to limit progress. Dungeons that only really advanced players can enter and complete....and the casual folks start complaining that it is too hard. Sort of funny when you think about it, cause from what I hear, every other game is going to a more casual friendly format.
In the end, I guess I'd prefer they create hard dungeons for BIS people, and then a reduced version for more casual people to play and experience the instance. This doesn't seem like it would be all that hard...reduce the HP and damage of all creatures, lower the loot table, and be done with it. This seems like the best solution to this.
In the end, i think everyone should be able to experience the punishment equally of what you get when you ask for hard content with a high level cap, and tell the devs you'll take it even if the loot sucks....we asked and we got.
Quick Dungeons in the early days?
You have to be kidding me... sometimes it would take over an Hour, for instance, just to get through and complete one.... like that dungeon with the big worm boss thing at the end.
That was when the game was really good, when the Dungeons actually had lots to explore and secret zones and bosses etc. Tactics and team work got you through... then they started changing things
Main - Rydia (HR70) - Xbox One Player only Alts : Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
I have long said this game needs to make a choice. Cater to casual players, or cater to hardcore players. They sort of float around the middle and go back and forth, and this just makes people mad.
The game started very casual friendly. Quick dungeons that didn't require the trinity to complete. Lots of solo content. You could really feel like you made progress with 15-20 mins in game and you may even have some stuff to auction to make a decent profit. The downside of this is, you had hardcore players sitting at the BIS level, soloing dungeons and bored out of their minds...
Now its shifting to a more hardcore-centered model. Extremely rare drops, lots of farming to progress, necessary classes for dungeons. Lots of campaigns, as well as time gates on them to limit progress. Dungeons that only really advanced players can enter and complete....and the casual folks start complaining that it is too hard. Sort of funny when you think about it, cause from what I hear, every other game is going to a more casual friendly format.
In the end, I guess I'd prefer they create hard dungeons for BIS people, and then a reduced version for more casual people to play and experience the instance. This doesn't seem like it would be all that hard...reduce the HP and damage of all creatures, lower the loot table, and be done with it. This seems like the best solution to this.
In the end, i think everyone should be able to experience the punishment equally of what you get when you ask for hard content with a high level cap, and tell the devs you'll take it even if the loot sucks....we asked and we got.
I stated this in other MMO game forums and I will state it here as well. Devs have to design their game for both casual and hardcore players. In other games the devs create ELITE content which is the same dungeon as the normal but with harder enemies and more mechanics. If NW did this I would be ok with it. I mean imagine a Master ELOL. ELOL right now for the most part is a joke if you know what you are doing or so I have been told. If that is the case, a Master one would have a IL of say 2.5K and it would be significantly harder. The loot drop would be a bit higher but it would be the same gear. Kinda like Master Demo vs. NDemo.
Back to casual vs hardcore. Hardcore players want harder and challenging content. Casual want a game that is fun and where they can hang out with their friends. Hardcore players are the first to reach end game and tend to buy stuff that mainly focuses on improving their character. Casual players hit the average IL and typically buy stuff for cosmetics vs. increasing IL.
Both are profitable and both bring in revenue. Therefore the game has to cater to both or the game loses its profitability.
More people die to the parcour in LoL than anything else... that is where you make it a Master LoL - all doors lead to the left door, and the left door gets even worse
Founding Member of "Wrong Side of the Stronghold" Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
There are days when LoL seems super simple, then there are other days when it's like that dragon put his big boy pants on and came out to unleash some holy vengeance on us. Haven't figured out what triggers one vs the other - maybe easy parcour = jerk of a dragon?
Founding Member of "Wrong Side of the Stronghold" Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
If they lower the requirements for FBI it wont change anything. 99% if not all of the ppl here would enter it and then leave it since they wont even be abel to reach the 1st boss.
I think the public requirements should be left as is, but if you want a private match that requirements should be dropped. That way you aren't hosing up someone else's experience. As a group, my friends and I love to try things that are way too hard for us and see if we can teamwork our way through them.
Founding Member of "Wrong Side of the Stronghold" Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
It is meant as top content, its supposed to be hard and it is, its there for top ppl to have some challenge. If it were up to me i would raise the IL req even more, to 3.5k, at least for the dps classes. Personally i am 3.6-3.7k and im really disappointed how bad my dps is in there, maybe because its (imo) a really unfriendly dungeon for close range class like TR, cuz most of time on the climb i'm dodging to survive and on final boss i dont have time for 1 atwill because boss is very mobile. Also second boss stacking the slam buffs (wai or not) is most of time wiping low dps parties so lowering the IL req would solve nothing.
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micky1p00Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,594Arc User
It is meant as top content, its supposed to be hard and it is, its there for top ppl to have some challenge. If it were up to me i would raise the IL req even more, to 3.5k, at least for the dps classes. Personally i am 3.6-3.7k and im really disappointed how bad my dps is in there, maybe because its (imo) a really unfriendly dungeon for close range class like TR, cuz most of time on the climb i'm dodging to survive and on final boss i dont have time for 1 atwill because boss is very mobile. Also second boss stacking the slam buffs (wai or not) is most of time wiping low dps parties so lowering the IL req would solve nothing.
It's a TR issue, can't stack bleeds and our great burst wont even tingle their pinky. Other classes, even as melee don't have the same issue, both because of easier mobility and they don't need so long to setup for their damage. (Yes GWFs I'm looking at you, lucky HAMSTER)
Those bosses (except the second) move way to much. Also notice if your companion is unsummoned diving into the big blue drink especially at the turtle. And with it the bondings buff. I had to bind the summon button to a key so I can ressumon it on the mine phases.
It would be great if they introduce dungeons, maybe epic ones to help get Enchantments above level 7 with IL requirements lower than FBI, say around the range of 2400 to 2500... to help make the transition from 2500 to 3100 easier or better planned out instead of Grinding endlessly for AD to purchase rank 12 enchantments and refinement items for Artifacts.
Frankly from what I am reading and given their history I suspect 3100 will be too low for this (on Xbone so this puppy drops tomorrow for us), going to be interesting to see how this pans out that's for sure!
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santralafaxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,896Arc User
Comments
Edit... actually my bad, I have 7 Alt's who also farm Leadership and send over the Stones to my main on double RP events.
Alts :
Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
Member of Q-Snipe
So if there will be some content for geared end-game, none will die from it. Gear up, join. At least you have something to aim towards.
(Or ignore based on FBI loot)
It gives me something to work toward. My friends and I left our last game after we did everything, there was nothing left to do other than become more and more OP. Yes for those of us on the PS4 who didn't spend a ton of $$, it does seem a long way off. But I also expect it to be insanely difficult once I get there. I plan on tons of wipes while we figure it all out together. I just hope the goodies I get from it are worth it once I get there.
Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR
Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
The game started very casual friendly. Quick dungeons that didn't require the trinity to complete. Lots of solo content. You could really feel like you made progress with 15-20 mins in game and you may even have some stuff to auction to make a decent profit. The downside of this is, you had hardcore players sitting at the BIS level, soloing dungeons and bored out of their minds...
Now its shifting to a more hardcore-centered model. Extremely rare drops, lots of farming to progress, necessary classes for dungeons. Lots of campaigns, as well as time gates on them to limit progress. Dungeons that only really advanced players can enter and complete....and the casual folks start complaining that it is too hard. Sort of funny when you think about it, cause from what I hear, every other game is going to a more casual friendly format.
In the end, I guess I'd prefer they create hard dungeons for BIS people, and then a reduced version for more casual people to play and experience the instance. This doesn't seem like it would be all that hard...reduce the HP and damage of all creatures, lower the loot table, and be done with it. This seems like the best solution to this.
In the end, i think everyone should be able to experience the punishment equally of what you get when you ask for hard content with a high level cap, and tell the devs you'll take it even if the loot sucks....we asked and we got.
Solo CN runs were the manifestation of multiple modules of power creep and not much added to do with it.
I don't think the requirements for FBI should be lowered. The devs in this case have tried to provide a realistic view of what will be needed for a successful run (or chance at one). NW's queues are notorious for underestimating in order to let people in the door, and that's fine if you've got a solid group to carry you in the name of gearing up, but it also means complaints when the entire party just barely makes the entry requirements and are not necessarily playing optimally. It's far better in this case to not allow entry to anyone who is likely to need to be carried.
I do not envy the balancing act of content design. Ideally, they have to come up with scenarios that make failure fun, at least fun enough to keep trying. If success comes too easily, then the game is boring. But it can't seem unbeatable either. Tough job.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
We have to make private matches in LoL all the time when none of our tanks are on - we take 4 DPS and a healer. It makes for a very interesting experience.
Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR
Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
FBI should be left where it is at. Not many players have that IL for good reason, time and money. If you don't have much time or money to invest into a MMO the game should not cater to you simply because you want to run something. In fact if you invested more time or money you may get into the dungeon. Both require an investment and if you are not willing to invest one or the other or both, you should be excluded from the dungeon.
I'm not at 3.1 yet and I have seen a few videos on and watch quite a few videos of players complaining about the loot. I actually like this idea with FIB. It is more about the challenge than than gear. I like that and hopefully soon I can play it and try it out.
You have to be kidding me... sometimes it would take over an Hour, for instance, just to get through and complete one.... like that dungeon with the big worm boss thing at the end.
That was when the game was really good, when the Dungeons actually had lots to explore and secret zones and bosses etc. Tactics and team work got you through... then they started changing things
Alts :
Storm (SW70), Edge (TR70), AD Farm (CW70), Grunt (GF70), Rosa (DC70), AD AD AD (GWF70), Your Mum (OP70)
Member of Q-Snipe
Back to casual vs hardcore. Hardcore players want harder and challenging content. Casual want a game that is fun and where they can hang out with their friends. Hardcore players are the first to reach end game and tend to buy stuff that mainly focuses on improving their character. Casual players hit the average IL and typically buy stuff for cosmetics vs. increasing IL.
Both are profitable and both bring in revenue. Therefore the game has to cater to both or the game loses its profitability.
Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR
Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR
Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
Ravenskya - TR / Krisha Chaos - OP / Waffles - GF / Dex Domitor - HR
Becky the trendy GWF - GWF / Too Toasty - SW / Falcor - DC / Morrigan - CW / Sir Didymus - OP
Personally i am 3.6-3.7k and im really disappointed how bad my dps is in there, maybe because its (imo) a really unfriendly dungeon for close range class like TR, cuz most of time on the climb i'm dodging to survive and on final boss i dont have time for 1 atwill because boss is very mobile.
Also second boss stacking the slam buffs (wai or not) is most of time wiping low dps parties so lowering the IL req would solve nothing.
Other classes, even as melee don't have the same issue, both because of easier mobility and they don't need so long to setup for their damage. (Yes GWFs I'm looking at you, lucky HAMSTER)
Those bosses (except the second) move way to much.
Also notice if your companion is unsummoned diving into the big blue drink especially at the turtle. And with it the bondings buff. I had to bind the summon button to a key so I can ressumon it on the mine phases.