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Official Feedback Thread: Hunter Ranger changes

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  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User

    ghoulz66 said:

    ghoulz66 said:

    ghoulz66 said:


    These changes should pretty much square up the trappers. Good work. Maybe a little tweaking, but damage should be decent and the playstyle preserved. A little tweaking maybe necessary but it looks great on paper. Bugs fixed, seems balanced as far as I can tell.

    Let's get to the crux of the issue here though.

    Combat needs love - better capstone, more useful feats. My suggestions is move the piercing damage to the capstone and make it 100% piercing for all melee attacks. Make a feat increase melee encounter damage by damage by 2-300%. This should give combat HR's some big burst damage.

    Archery - needs love too. change the capstone - 100% piercing damage for all ranged attacks. ranged at wills can be fired on the run. make a feat increase ranged encounter damage by 2-300%.

    This will help those trees compete with the very desirable quick rotations, aspect of serpent, throrned roots, HAMSTER capstone of the trapper.

    Sleek Pepper
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    A 100% piercing 300% buffed tactical plant growth nuke in PVE and PVE is making the top scientists quake in their boots.

    This just isn't going to work. Plant growth does NOT need any further buffs to it. It's damage more than performs well. Gushing wound with the same treatment is just begging for trouble to happen. They do not need any buffs. It's the at-wills that are underperforming at an extreme.
    The increase could only apply to the initial hit. We just need some burst potential. Let trappers do consistent damage. Let combat and archery have damage come out a little more bursty. Even with my proposed change we wouldnt have the burst of a GF, nor the tankiness of one. Just might be more fun and diverse to play. And that's the goal. Competitive options.
    Uhhh, 100% piercing buffed powers..... I'm sure the GWF would enjoy being annihilated by that.
    I'm not really worried about BiS GWF's. They currently melt an HR in seconds. Why are you on this thread worried about GWF's. Go troll elsewhere.
    Why don't you give some reasonable suggestions then while you're trolling here yourself?
    Seriously, go play your GWF. Get out of this thread. What fun is it to keep HR's weak? You think HR's doing laughable damage is good for this game?
    I have been here since the start trying to help the HR. I'm here for suggestions, not outrageous buff 300% on everything kind of nonsense that would make the rebalancing pointless in the end.
  • hastur905hastur905 Member Posts: 173 Arc User
    I have tested archery path using atwill for pathfinder (name escapes me atm), I have 2 points in the feat for this and am running a critical sev build with a greater vorpal totaling 168% severity. With that the atwill climbs in damage to a high of 6k damage non critical and just over 12k critical, solo I am testing this in WoD. My hope is this illustrates the problem with archery atm.
  • amenaramenar Member, NW_CrypticDev Posts: 90 Arc User
    Hey all, another small list of upcoming changes:
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Battle Crazed: Now grants bonus melee damage with every stack as well. Duration increased to 6s, up from 3s.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Hasty Retreat: Now also increases your movement speed by a small amount at all times, in addition to the existing proc effect.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Unflinching Aim: Aimed Shot now reduces the CD of your currently recharging Encounter powers (no longer just Ranged powers) by 0.2/0.4/0.6/0.8/1.0s (up from 0.1/0.2/0.3/0.4/0.5s).
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Longshot: Damage dealt by this feat increased to 20/40/60/80/100% of Weapon Damage, up from 10/20/30/40/50%. In addition, this is now actually Piercing damage, instead of having an undocumented feature of behaving somewhat like Piercing damage.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Scoundrel Training: No longer affects the damage displayed on the tooltips of your At-Will powers.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Lucky Blades: When Lucky Blades is triggered, it now also increases your Encounter power damage by 3/6/9/12/15%.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Lucky Blades: Tooltip properly reports a 6s duration, instead of listing 4s.
  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User
    edited July 2016
    amenar said:

    Hey all, another small list of upcoming changes:

    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Battle Crazed: Now grants bonus melee damage with every stack as well. Duration increased to 6s, up from 3s.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Hasty Retreat: Now also increases your movement speed by a small amount at all times, in addition to the existing proc effect.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Unflinching Aim: Aimed Shot now reduces the CD of your currently recharging Encounter powers (no longer just Ranged powers) by 0.2/0.4/0.6/0.8/1.0s (up from 0.1/0.2/0.3/0.4/0.5s).
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Longshot: Damage dealt by this feat increased to 20/40/60/80/100% of Weapon Damage, up from 10/20/30/40/50%. In addition, this is now actually Piercing damage, instead of having an undocumented feature of behaving somewhat like Piercing damage.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Scoundrel Training: No longer affects the damage displayed on the tooltips of your At-Will powers.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Lucky Blades: When Lucky Blades is triggered, it now also increases your Encounter power damage by 3/6/9/12/15%.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Lucky Blades: Tooltip properly reports a 6s duration, instead of listing 4s.
    That's nice, but when are the at-wills truly going to receive attention? The changes really aren't doing anything different to help combat. Just further buffs for plant growth and gushing wound, their only viable DPS sources. The at-wills are still performing poorly and this just leaves the tree in the same ditch it's already in.


    Slapping more flat buffs on the tree is not getting to the real issues of combat. Combat has at-wills that are over 1/3 the damage output of a GWF and even GF. They are simply not viable where they're at now. Gushing wound and plant growth just throw us into a CD of laughable DPS output while other classes blow combat HRs away while they can do just about nothing while waiting.
  • hastur905hastur905 Member Posts: 173 Arc User
    Thanks @amenar these additional changes look very interesting, can't wait to test these.

    I think I mentioned scoundrel feat earlier, could we change it to be when noticed your at wills will do more damage instead of when you remain unnoticed. More damage output when fighting for your life is better than when some one else holding agro imho.
  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User
    Plant growth for combat is already receiving the the buff of the T4 feat. It also grants the 40-50% piercing damage on each tick of plant growth's DoT. If you test it on live, it already performs more than adequately.

    We don't need flat buffs on the combat tree, especially for encounters only. We need underperforming powers buffed only, not everything. Some powers like the at-wills likely need a double buff to become viable for a combat build in PVE. Then we have lackluster powers like thorn strike and a couple single target encounters. They're not going to be viable for PVE, and they need a flat buff to them anyway for PVP, similar too all these damage buffs to Commanding Shot or Longstriders. Buffs to the powers themselves, not tiny little buffs to the tree that do NOT benefit all the vastly underperforming powers and further boosting the already fine preforming powers.
  • beckylunaticbeckylunatic Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 14,231 Arc User
    hastur905 said:

    Thanks @amenar these additional changes look very interesting, can't wait to test these.



    I think I mentioned scoundrel feat earlier, could we change it to be when noticed your at wills will do more damage instead of when you remain unnoticed. More damage output when fighting for your life is better than when some one else holding agro imho.

    It's a shared feat with Trickster Rogues, and a way of implementing something like "Sneak Attack", pretty much straight out of the D&D handbook.
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  • zonoske#5272 zonoske Member Posts: 86 Arc User
    I'm pretty sure battled crazed buffs melee At-wills. It stacks up to 5 times @ 3% each.
  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User

    I'm pretty sure battled crazed buffs melee At-wills. It stacks up to 5 times @ 3% each.

    You don't get it. A 15% buff isn't going to make something like rapid strike viable which is dealing almost half the damage of at-wills of other classes. The tree isn't underperforming because it lacks proper buffs, it's underperforming because the vast majority of powers are.
  • whitespicyricewhitespicyrice Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 21 Arc User
    edited July 2016
    amenar said:

    Hey all, another small list of upcoming changes:

    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Battle Crazed: Now grants bonus melee damage with every stack as well. Duration increased to 6s, up from 3s.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Hasty Retreat: Now also increases your movement speed by a small amount at all times, in addition to the existing proc effect.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Unflinching Aim: Aimed Shot now reduces the CD of your currently recharging Encounter powers (no longer just Ranged powers) by 0.2/0.4/0.6/0.8/1.0s (up from 0.1/0.2/0.3/0.4/0.5s).
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Longshot: Damage dealt by this feat increased to 20/40/60/80/100% of Weapon Damage, up from 10/20/30/40/50%. In addition, this is now actually Piercing damage, instead of having an undocumented feature of behaving somewhat like Piercing damage.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Scoundrel Training: No longer affects the damage displayed on the tooltips of your At-Will powers.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Lucky Blades: When Lucky Blades is triggered, it now also increases your Encounter power damage by 3/6/9/12/15%.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Lucky Blades: Tooltip properly reports a 6s duration, instead of listing 4s.

    It has always been piercing damage, ever since it came out, nobody else realized that. I have tested it a lot and it was always that way. This 50% buff on it is very nice, great job on that, and the aim shot reducing all cool downs. You acknowledged that super fast when i suggested it, i'm seriously impressed.

    Hasty Retreat feat change is most definitely a must, that needed the correct change exactly and i didn't even think about that.^

    That Combat feat change is also good, but still not enough. Increase it by another 10%.

    I really don't want to buff them that much because still currently HRs can kill low geared players without insignias.
    So, I would think 10% additional buff to that feat would be good balancing and not over powering it.


  • krondhorkrondhor Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 150 Arc User
    edited July 2016
    amenar said:

    Hey all, another small list of upcoming changes:

    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Battle Crazed: Now grants bonus melee damage with every stack as well. Duration increased to 6s, up from 3s.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Hasty Retreat: Now also increases your movement speed by a small amount at all times, in addition to the existing proc effect.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Unflinching Aim: Aimed Shot now reduces the CD of your currently recharging Encounter powers (no longer just Ranged powers) by 0.2/0.4/0.6/0.8/1.0s (up from 0.1/0.2/0.3/0.4/0.5s).
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Longshot: Damage dealt by this feat increased to 20/40/60/80/100% of Weapon Damage, up from 10/20/30/40/50%. In addition, this is now actually Piercing damage, instead of having an undocumented feature of behaving somewhat like Piercing damage.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Scoundrel Training: No longer affects the damage displayed on the tooltips of your At-Will powers.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Lucky Blades: When Lucky Blades is triggered, it now also increases your Encounter power damage by 3/6/9/12/15%.
    • Hunter Ranger: Feat: Lucky Blades: Tooltip properly reports a 6s duration, instead of listing 4s.
    Some nice changes here, the capstone feats (Combat/Archery) still need a rework/boost and we should be slowly there.

    By the way can you please tell us in details, concerning Battle Crazed, how much is the melee damage bonus it grants with every stack?
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  • lirithiellirithiel Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,482 Arc User
    edited July 2016
    landelmer said:

    ralexinor said:

    @amenar



    I think you need to disable at wills and dailies reducing cooldowns for pvp at least, and also by doing this you're putting combat and archery ages away from trapper again.



    By doing this you're introducing the permadaze meta back into pvp again especially with the fixes to dazes and roots.



    Additionally, if you're going ahead with this, please consider toning down the damage of Thorned Roots or you'll have too much imbalance between paths again. Buff the base damage of the hr class so the trapper tree doesn't see any net changes, but swiftness of the fox and thorned roots will set the path well and above archery and combat unless you give them a 100-200% damage bonus.

    For a person that no longer plays the game several of your suggestions were instituted.
    Let's let the PS guys and gals test out the changes before you want to NERF the trapper in PvP. The Dev restored my faith in his work and now I am confident he will do this correctly.

    So please relax and make more suggestions on how to improve the other trees, thanks!
    @landelmer shut your face. You can't see past your own nose. I'll say it once again. Regardless of whether or not @ralexinor still plays she knows more on about this game and HRs than you know about yourself. She is by far and away the most knowledgeable person here so she has every right to speak up. You on the other hand...

    I'm sorry for ranting but I can only take so much from one imbecile.
    Our pain is self chosen.

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  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User



    That Combat feat change is also good, but still not enough. Increase it by another 10%.

    No, just no.

    Please, enough of these pointless buffs! We need underperforming powers have their base damage buffed! Slapping a 15% and another 15% isn't going to help them.

    All we're going to see is the majority of DPS come from plant growth and gushing wound on bosses. Just like it CURRENTLY is!

  • whitespicyricewhitespicyrice Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 21 Arc User
    edited July 2016
    ghoulz66 said:





    That Combat feat change is also good, but still not enough. Increase it by another 10%.

    No, just no.

    Please, enough of these pointless buffs! We need underperforming powers have their base damage buffed! Slapping a 15% and another 15% isn't going to help them.

    All we're going to see is the majority of DPS come from plant growth and gushing wound on bosses. Just like it CURRENTLY is!

    I did say buff the current encounter powers by 50% - 100%. Like he did with commanding shot by 300% but 300% is too much because Trappers would benefit too much from that.

    I only said to buff it by 10% because of the combat tree, in addition to the other buffs i have suggested.

    Go back to what I have said before and you will see.
  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User

    ghoulz66 said:





    That Combat feat change is also good, but still not enough. Increase it by another 10%.

    No, just no.

    Please, enough of these pointless buffs! We need underperforming powers have their base damage buffed! Slapping a 15% and another 15% isn't going to help them.

    All we're going to see is the majority of DPS come from plant growth and gushing wound on bosses. Just like it CURRENTLY is!

    I did say buff the current encounter powers by 50% - 100%. Like he did with commanding shot by 300% byt 300% is too much because Trappers would benefit too much from that.

    Go back to what I have said before and you will see.
    The tree does not need further damage buffs to it. You haven't ever used a longstrider's buffed plant growth have you? It is MORE than enough. We don't need to be tossing more unnecessary buffs for powers that are already in line.
  • flowcytoflowcyto Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 196 Arc User
    Not a big fan of Archery becoming more anchored to Aimed Shot, but eh. I don't think the goal of the non-Trapper trees should be to reduce encounter cds by that much, as one can always play as a Trapper for that sort of playstyle.

    And yeah I generally agree that the issue w/ Combat isn't w/ lacking in general dmg boosts as much as too many attacks in its base repertoire being weak. Plant Growth already hits hard; we don't need it to hit harder since the tree is already reliant upon it and Gushing Wound for any amount of competitive dmg (unless ya like switching to Ranged frequently and using CoA, Rain of Arrows, and/or Thorn Ward, and that point ya mine as well play the other trees- Trapper if ur stance-dancing so often, Archery if ur relying on 3 decent-dps ranged attack powers to stay afloat).
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  • genjundeadgenjundead Member Posts: 372 Arc User
    edited July 2016
    ghoulz66 said:

    ghoulz66 said:





    That Combat feat change is also good, but still not enough. Increase it by another 10%.

    No, just no.

    Please, enough of these pointless buffs! We need underperforming powers have their base damage buffed! Slapping a 15% and another 15% isn't going to help them.

    All we're going to see is the majority of DPS come from plant growth and gushing wound on bosses. Just like it CURRENTLY is!

    I did say buff the current encounter powers by 50% - 100%. Like he did with commanding shot by 300% byt 300% is too much because Trappers would benefit too much from that.

    Go back to what I have said before and you will see.
    The tree does not need further damage buffs to it. You haven't ever used a longstrider's buffed plant growth have you? It is MORE than enough. We don't need to be tossing more unnecessary buffs for powers that are already in line.
    ghoulz66 is just thinking about hr as a whole how to make the hr better and he is right about what he said. and lot have said the same thing.

    trapper is sup par to other classes and the archery and combat tree is sup par to the trapper tree. the best way to fix this is focus on at wills as that is the main source of damage archery and combat have were as trappers don't benefit from using.

    EDIT:
    trappers can still use at wills but gets nothing from using it
    archers can still use melee skills but also gets nothing from it
    combat can use range skills but still get nothing from it
    buffing at wills will help archery and combat but not trapper and hopefully bring all the 3 trees on par with each other, then we just have to make the hr on par with other classes.
  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User
    All these changes in their current form will only drive combat builds towards combat archery hybrids for the longshot buff because let's face it, we need more damage from somewhere and rain of arrows certainly can fit the bill because everything else you can find in the melee arsenal won't be helping you.

    That's exactly what I would be doing. I'd ignore battlecrazed and lucky blades still in favor of ranged powers and longshot. That's how poorly weak the underperforming melee powers are.
  • whitespicyricewhitespicyrice Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 21 Arc User
    ghoulz66 said:

    ghoulz66 said:





    That Combat feat change is also good, but still not enough. Increase it by another 10%.

    No, just no.

    Please, enough of these pointless buffs! We need underperforming powers have their base damage buffed! Slapping a 15% and another 15% isn't going to help them.

    All we're going to see is the majority of DPS come from plant growth and gushing wound on bosses. Just like it CURRENTLY is!

    I did say buff the current encounter powers by 50% - 100%. Like he did with commanding shot by 300% byt 300% is too much because Trappers would benefit too much from that.

    Go back to what I have said before and you will see.
    The tree does not need further damage buffs to it. You haven't ever used a longstrider's buffed plant growth have you? It is MORE than enough. We don't need to be tossing more unnecessary buffs for powers that are already in line.
    I am talking PvP sense. HRs seem fine to me for PvE, you get buffs from companions, GFs, DCs, etc. And yet you guys still enough damage. I am no longer replying to your post because you're just gonna talk about the PvE aspect of the changes, which is not that needed.

    PvP HRs need a flat damage buff on mostly everything, encounters, feats, etc.
  • genjundeadgenjundead Member Posts: 372 Arc User

    ghoulz66 said:

    ghoulz66 said:





    That Combat feat change is also good, but still not enough. Increase it by another 10%.

    No, just no.

    Please, enough of these pointless buffs! We need underperforming powers have their base damage buffed! Slapping a 15% and another 15% isn't going to help them.

    All we're going to see is the majority of DPS come from plant growth and gushing wound on bosses. Just like it CURRENTLY is!

    I did say buff the current encounter powers by 50% - 100%. Like he did with commanding shot by 300% byt 300% is too much because Trappers would benefit too much from that.

    Go back to what I have said before and you will see.
    The tree does not need further damage buffs to it. You haven't ever used a longstrider's buffed plant growth have you? It is MORE than enough. We don't need to be tossing more unnecessary buffs for powers that are already in line.
    I am talking PvP sense. HRs seem fine to me for PvE, you get buffs from companions, GFs, DCs, etc. And yet you guys still enough damage. I am no longer replying to your post because you're just gonna talk about the PvE aspect of the changes, which is not that needed.

    PvP HRs need a flat damage buff on mostly everything, encounters, feats, etc.
    yeah not a big pvper all i know is i que for pvp then get one shot but as noted i am not a big pvper. i do love watching players stand still and heal from any damage i deal.
  • whitespicyricewhitespicyrice Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 21 Arc User
    metalldjt said:

    just a friendly reminder, when the changes will go on preview shard, please test those piercingdamage feats and see if they multiprocc or not, we dont want to end up gettin killed and ask for nerfs to hr ^^ , better have it work in a one go.

    Yes, I agree. You know I always test every module for HR even if i don't play it :)
  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User
    edited July 2016

    ghoulz66 said:

    ghoulz66 said:





    That Combat feat change is also good, but still not enough. Increase it by another 10%.

    No, just no.

    Please, enough of these pointless buffs! We need underperforming powers have their base damage buffed! Slapping a 15% and another 15% isn't going to help them.

    All we're going to see is the majority of DPS come from plant growth and gushing wound on bosses. Just like it CURRENTLY is!

    I did say buff the current encounter powers by 50% - 100%. Like he did with commanding shot by 300% byt 300% is too much because Trappers would benefit too much from that.

    Go back to what I have said before and you will see.
    The tree does not need further damage buffs to it. You haven't ever used a longstrider's buffed plant growth have you? It is MORE than enough. We don't need to be tossing more unnecessary buffs for powers that are already in line.
    I am talking PvP sense. HRs seem fine to me for PvE, you get buffs from companions, GFs, DCs, etc. And yet you guys still enough damage. I am no longer replying to your post because you're just gonna talk about the PvE aspect of the changes, which is not that needed.

    PvP HRs need a flat damage buff on mostly everything, encounters, feats, etc.
    Ya, pvp. But we only need flat base damage buffs.

    What would also be helping you for pvp is battlecrazed granting deflect instead of LS. LS is useless in pvp, and the 5% is more than enough with a little more LS investment for PVE. That and the wild medicine getting fixed. With a buff to deflect and wild medicine would help for PVP a bit. Though the HR's movement speed is HAMSTER still so you can't really kite a GWF or SW much while buying time.

    Battle crazed granting 15% deflect upon being struck or dealing damage and another 15-25% deflect severity instead of a pointless damage buff would buff survivability for both PVP and PVE.

    Get boar charge fixed and such as marauder's rush and other underperforming attacks getting base damage buffs. Combat can quickly get in for damage, kite around a bit.

    Maybe buff aimed strike's damage slightly and give it a speed buff so you could land it after a boar charge while getting buffed by flurry to hit another player hard enough with some ArP investment and the piercing blades buff.


    These extra damage buffs aren't providing any synergy for the tree. We need more things like extra deflect, ect.
  • rayrdanrayrdan Member Posts: 5,410 Arc User
    edited July 2016
    im starting to figure out my glass cannon build... thorn ward needs fast animation for that or maybe to tick two times as fasst or at the very least hit 3 enemy for full damage instead of one
  • rayrdanrayrdan Member Posts: 5,410 Arc User
    i didnt test because nothing is up yet but i have that kind of knowledge to recognize when somthing may work or not.
    just up HR base weapon damage at this pointt and rework battlehoned and cruel recovery
  • zonoske#5272 zonoske Member Posts: 86 Arc User
    I'm interested in an combat with long shot hybrid for PvP.
  • ghoulz66ghoulz66 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,748 Arc User

    I'm interested in an combat with long shot hybrid for PvP.

    Thorn Ward and Split the Sky?

    But this is silly, we should be trying to fix and promote pure combat as being viable :/
  • lirithiellirithiel Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,482 Arc User
    amenar said:


    Hunter Ranger: Feat: Scoundrel Training: No longer affects the damage displayed on the tooltips of your At-Will powers.
    Would someone mind clarifying this one for me please? I don't know what @amenar means by this.
    Our pain is self chosen.

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  • genjundeadgenjundead Member Posts: 372 Arc User
    ghoulz66 said:

    I'm interested in an combat with long shot hybrid for PvP.

    Thorn Ward and Split the Sky?

    But this is silly, we should be trying to fix and promote pure combat as being viable :/
    +1 to pure combat
  • bunchofrocks505bunchofrocks505 Member Posts: 15 Arc User
    i did a test on some dummies for the tracker dps, 3 minutes all in all, sadly the bear trap buggs out at the dummies after it works a few times then it simply ignores the traps, so i probably missed a chunk of dmg somewhere.
    imgur.com/a/0AjHy
This discussion has been closed.