You made such a long eloquent post with beautiful imagery of variety of tanks but that gf vs cw sequence you broke down was pathetic. First lets start off noting two things. 1.) the GF is IV not SM, his rotation is utter HAMSTER and he should feel bad for picking this build. 2.) the CW has shield in spell mastery.
Now in a regular scenario, u know outside of that video's depictions of how simple it is to play 2 cws with voice communications together, a guardian fighter would atleast MARK his target, then prone it to mitigate their defences, and while they are most vulnerable they will pull the soul out of any CW with a Crescendo > Anvil chain, I shouldn't have to say it but yes this should all be done within 8 seconds of casting ITF or results may vary.
Actually leme take a step back and note my personal GF is only around 14k armor pen, but the one in the video above, no way they had even 60%. Bad players fite good players, bad players will always die. Thats not a class issue, but as someone else stated previously in the thread the whole thing boils down to whos in control of the character.
It sucks because I personally think CWs are far too strong of a class but people making HAMSTER poor arguments for GFs make us look even worse.
To be fair this is an old video, and Dom is prolly running Protspec atm since his dmg is very low. But to call Dom a bad GF is just wtf, he is imo prolly the best gf in the game atm. And he dsnt play it as much since "New" GFs running Amushrings which is plain r33tarded.
I dont know that gf personally but the gameplay i watched is not up to par with a top gf, marking is very basic and his damage output isn't close to what even moderately geared gfs are capable of.
LGPG Leader Indy - XB1 & PS4 - GF xeV Indy - PS4 - TR Nde - XB1 - HR GT: its indy time PSN: itsindytime Twitch: indygoinlive The Kanye West of Neverwinter
I dont know that gf personally but the gameplay i watched is not up to par with a top gf, marking is very basic and his damage output isn't close to what even moderately geared gfs are capable of.
Two hit with warlock For a 2.5 year GF was piece of shiet. Noone even tried to take em for dungeons, cause of lack of usefullness. We had really hard time in pvp, and now after this period finally GF can hit. Wondering who is the most active in this thread - CWs or Trs maybe?
Dom is one of the top, but not the best imo. At least he is very unpredictable. Regards
the "best" GF I met was in incewinddale PVP, near 4k ambush+cowardring, PVP guild for sure.... again, we speak of one build, one tree, that needs a "tone down" for sure not the hole class, probably it would be sufficient to tone down ITF? It´s overdone imo, running PVE that buff is awesome, but objective it´s OP most of you doesn´t obviuosly know what I speak of, In your world the class needs a buff I guess? So buff it....
The video was made 04/15, mod 6 in the begining, CW was broken for a short period and dealt tons of damage by 16-18k multiprocs from storm-spell in a row , and it was fixed...even i never played CW I know about it
I thought this nerf thread would be stopped ,but ,alas,this is not the case .
I respond to this cause i deeply fear that the nerfs suggesting here (ITF,overall damage) will affect PVE(that i care about) pretty hard and adding the OP's class OPness ,the situation eventually will lead the GF class, to extinction.
@indylol Thanks for your good words. About your objections:
1.) "the GF is IV not SM, his rotation is utter **** and he should feel bad for picking this build. "
First the minor: The spesific Gf in the video runs same rotation as 90% of GFs do.ITF,Bull and Anvil.As IV(was he?) he used Impact instead of Crescendo. He did the best he could do.Bull,Impact, notice he doesn't land his Anvil ,exactly cause he wants to replenish Cw shield. He used Anvil exactly after three att wills.Yet his Anvil hit for 14,7k.Not his fault.12% Dr of Cw +25% broken shield +35% tenacity+30% Negation. CCed and with broken shield Cw was uber tanky.
The mistake(?) of the spesific Gf you claim to be ,he didn't marked , yet you see he was turtling against two Death Star CWs that were trying to get behind his shield .He could have marked ,or not ,but if one of the Cws got him Cc during his 0,7s Tab Mark animation and all would be over in 2 secs.
2.) "the CW has shield in spell mastery."
And?? The majority of Cws have shield on tab.what that proves?So if the have shield on tab then what?Gf should not be able to kill them?i cannot understand what are you implying to say.:)
Cw used a predermined encounter-power ,broken as hell,to level his weakness(?) against a tanky class(?) adversary. Since it worked we guess many Cws will continue to do so.Nothing extraordinary.
For the others posters:
"Video is old" :
Video is relative, since its publicement ,Gf did not get any damage buffs.Only a ninja nerf to Aod range. Nothing changed from then ,concerning the relative themes i wanted to highlight.
Gf damage is the same,CW tankiness is the same.
"Gf was one shot wander ,and fine in mod1/2 ,very bad in mod3":
All wrong.
Mod1: Gf was for a very small period of time viable cause of Stalwark bulwark effect set armor.The set was giving +5% of max hp in combat ,as power ,stacking up to 5 times and lasted 8 seconds. Cws claimed it was OP back then ,the set was nerfed.
Cws were the main advocated of the nerf ,cause "tanks did too much damage".The devs nerfed the set. (And gave them +25% base Dr as shield two mods later-I guess "DPS are too tanky" is balanced.
Mod2 : Gf was in the worst position ever,literally under extinction.Gf was nowhere to be found in lfg,even in legit ,parties will take him as a good will favor, and was a show of good character to take one with them.Its dps was abysmal,he was slow,and his buffs not needed cause 5 cw parties just sing all mobs from D2D. In an infogram posted by cryptic prior to mod3 release only 13% of players played Gf including alts http://gamingphanatic.com/2014/03/26/dungeons-dragons-neverwinter-shadowmantle-infographic/
The situation was so dire that let to the Gf whole rework in beta-prior Mod3 period.Few changes happen to Gf since. (mostly nerfs,SoS ,no Ap gain during daily etc....)
Mod3 initial release:The best period of Gf ever.He was on par with other classes ,yet cause very few people were playing it,none noticed.GWfs/Cws would come to grips vs Gf with out dodging or encircling.Gf score impressive DtK ratios.
^^^ these for historical reasons
"As for who complains about GFs, it's obviously most of all the classes." Who class complaints the most?
3 CWs,one CW/Sw ,1 SW ,and one GWF just made a general comment.
Each of the antiGF nerf posters made 4 +posts each to make sure its voice nerf will be heard.Nothing wrong about it ,but we can count and see who insists and put work behind his post.
"CW was broken for a short period"
Cw Srorm Spells crit lasted for 2 modules.2 or 3? I have lost count
It was fixed after it was discovered in pve it was doing 35-45% of its DPS.If not CWs will still be melting people.Short period......3 mods.Storm Spell crit multi procs lasted more than a "short period" to me.
Edit:Sorry for my long post and my english.:) I wish good loot to you all and many orange rings! \o/
I guess i needed to be more clear, that GF using iron vanguard means he isn't able to "latch" onto someone with crescendo the second their proned, which if u don't understand prone mechanics, mean their deflection has been turned off. So then the only factors are "how much armor pen did the GF have?" And by the looks of that video, not nearly enough.
and the CW running a Shield in Spell Mastery is very relevant if you want to list off the numbers a GF can put into it, again another indicator that the GF is poorly built and doesn't deal the damage any moderately geared GF could do. The shield isn't the issue, its the fact the GF is simply out geared and its very obvious by the gameplay and the numbers.
Thats what a properly geared GF does and those numbers are the reason this thread is on page 6. Don't try to pass off subpar players as an example of what an entire class represents.
LGPG Leader Indy - XB1 & PS4 - GF xeV Indy - PS4 - TR Nde - XB1 - HR GT: its indy time PSN: itsindytime Twitch: indygoinlive The Kanye West of Neverwinter
Mod1: Gf was for a very small period of time viable cause of Stalwark bulwark effect set armor.The set was giving +5% of max hp in combat ,as power ,stacking up to 5 times and lasted 8 seconds. Cws claimed it was OP back then ,the set was nerfed.
Cws were the main advocated of the nerf ,cause "tanks did too much damage".The devs nerfed the set. (And gave them +25% base Dr as shield two mods later-I guess "DPS are too tanky" is balanced.
Durin mod0 and half of the duration of mod1, GFs were MONSTERS on both PvP AND PvE, not thanks to Bulkwark (which also made them MONSTERS) but thanks to Tenebrous enchant before devs nerf it by making it doing "actual HP as damage" instead of "max HP as damage" and rising its ICD. Some time after that nerf, a dev improved it (the enchant) by making it able to "multi proc" if you weared more than one. Meaning: a GF could proc all 5 Tenes on a single hit while on full HP, dealing massive damage each 20 or 30 seconds (dont remember right now the exact ICD it had back then)
About the bug with Bulkwark's set was pretty obvious: 5 GF could finish CN in less than 40 mins. Reason? Easy: Bulkwark buffed the whole party and stacked with itself. Meaning: 5 GFs using the set granted to the whole party 125% of HP as damage... taking into account that the HP Pool for GFs back there were like 12ks, you can do your own numbers about 5 members getting over 20k on power.
EDIT: But its pretty obvious, even for newbies, that you are trolling the post... Don't know the reason behind it. Thats why i just explained that part and not things like "old vid".
talking about pvp gf never really sucked, their worst mod was mod 2 and far from being useless by the way. the one rotation thing is going on from mod 4 if i remember correctly and just became always 100% reliable after recent buffs.
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lonewolfmk1Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 137Arc User
edited January 2016
Ok to start, my GF has been my main char since the release of the game, rebuild many times and often used in PVP and PVE and is pretty much BIS at this point.
That vid posted a couple of posts above is a joke. I mean seriously, that GF oneshotted some opponets with 66k hits... Even my CW with guild armour and no radiants to increase his HP has around 80k HP... So the fight was basically pug stomping, who probably had little to no tenecity. Also hitting with that bullcharge against an experienced pvp player is easier said than done. Show me a vid where a GF does the same thing against an EOA/Absolute or other strong PVP guild member and you might have a point. Onerotating everything 100% of the time as also posted above is HAMSTER. GFs are strong in PVP no doubt, but they are not the dominating class, more on equal footing with the top.
To the bulwark set side discussion, Knight Captain was the really broken GF set before its nerf and the main reason why people even bothered with taking a GF into a dungeon run in late mod 1and mod 2 (40% powerbuff, 15% to deff, stackable if several chars where wearing it iirc). In PVP a GF has been powerfull until the rework of the tenebrous enchants and the conquerer tree, which basically doubled their power (as the shield prior to mod 3 was so useless that you only used it to block those hits that would really hurt or cc you in pvp). Still, the GF was never really weak in pvp in my estimation (like the SW when it made its first appearence in pvp games) but travelling between mid and top tier.
Mod 3 made GFs usefull in dungeon again, mostly due to the rework of the shield meachanic. That was also the time when i rebuild my char from a offensive to a fully defensive/support role. And it works great, people often still think that an OP is a better choice for a dungeon run, but the biggest thing he does is making the party invincible most of the time, which is nice. A support GF can also make the party harder to kill (KV + damage reduction aura + feat for tab mechanic + arguably being better at keeping aggro), but also boosts party damage (with my GF by about 79% (ITF + ITF feat) + tab mechanic), increases runspeed and AP generation (Tactitian capstone + feat + itf). So in PVE i believe the GF is in a good spot. Shame you rarely see a good support GF anymore.
Ok to start, my GF has been my main char since the release of the game, rebuild many times and often used in PVP and PVE and is pretty much BIS at this point.
That vid posted a couple of posts above is a joke. I mean seriously, that GF oneshotted some opponets with 66k hits... Even my CW with guild armour and no radiants to increase his HP has around 80k HP... So the fight was basically pug stomping, who probably had little to no tenecity. Also hitting with that bullcharge against an experienced pvp player is easier said than done. Show me a vid where a GF does the same thing against an EOA/Absolute or other strong PVP guild member and you might have a point. Onerotating everything 100% of the time as also posted above is HAMSTER. GFs are strong in PVP no doubt, but they are not the dominating class, more on equal footing with the top.
To the bulwark set side discussion, Knight Captain was the really broken GF set before its nerf and the main reason why people even bothered with taking a GF into a dungeon run in late mod 1and mod 2 (40% powerbuff, 15% to deff, stackable if several chars where wearing it iirc). In PVP a GF has been powerfull until the rework of the tenebrous enchants and the conquerer tree, which basically doubled their power (as the shield prior to mod 3 was so useless that you only used it to block those hits that would really hurt or cc you in pvp). Still, the GF was never really weak in pvp in my estimation (like the SW when it made its first appearence in pvp games) but travelling between mid and top tier.
Mod 3 made GFs usefull in dungeon again, mostly due to the rework of the shield meachanic. That was also the time when i rebuild my char from a offensive to a fully defensive/support role. And it works great, people often still think that an OP is a better choice for a dungeon run, but the biggest thing he does is making the party invincible most of the time, which is nice. A support GF can also make the party harder to kill (KV + damage reduction aura + feat for tab mechanic + arguably being better at keeping aggro), but also boosts party damage (with my GF by about 79% (ITF + ITF feat) + tab mechanic), increases runspeed and AP generation (Tactitian capstone + feat + itf). So in PVE i believe the GF is in a good spot. Shame you rarely see a good support GF anymore.
didn´t he say he is xbox? so mod 6 arround...
here some real pug stomp from Dom at mod 7 the same who lost against obsy in mod 6 300k+ crits lol (by sure target has zero tenacity, yes yes yes..) some of these guys were 3k+ at that time btw. I like it, more the ironical note, but did not take part
again, hypervorlains video post, it was that small window at the beginning of mod 6 everyone was complainig about CW´s everywhere PVE-PVP, I can remember , you not?
@indylol in case you are xbox just wait till mod 8, 167k crits against BIS warlocks with AoD as finisher will be save that time there will be nothing left from NWO PVP on PC so byby "beta-version " ...sadly
I think the main problem is the way GF buffs scale with the much higher stats they have now. Nothing changed for GF since the major buffs they got a few mods back but, suddenly they hit much harder.
I got one-shot more than one time. 155k bull charge, 166k anvil of doom from full health, 218k anvil (crit, mitigated down from 485k !!!) are just a few. This is on full Lionsmane gear + 30% dmg resist from stats. No question here, GF burst damage needs to be addressed.
It's more than just ITF. Mark =~ 20% Villain's Menace = ? ITF = 40%+ (depending on DR) Combat Superiority = 15% Shield Warrior's Wrath = 20% Knight's Challenge = 100% (usually used against DCs, OPs) Conqueror Capstone = 25% Feytouched = 18% (assuming it works as it says. might be more)
It's more than just ITF. Mark =~ 20% Villain's Menace = ? ITF = 40%+ (depending on DR) Combat Superiority = 15% Shield Warrior's Wrath = 20% Knight's Challenge = 100% (usually used against DCs, OPs) Conqueror Capstone = 25% Feytouched = 18% (assuming it works as it says. might be more)
edit: forgot the fire buff
Mark lowers defense so it's not exactly a damage buff. Right now my mark adds about 10% damage against that practice dummy and that's with enhanced mark and enhanced mark power on my shield. Just to be fair, every class has their feats and skills that adds damage so it's hard point in this general direction as the problem. From what I hear the problem seems to be that devs decided for GF's to be capable of one rotating people, this is probably because they wanted GF to be the sort of tank you can't ignore, while OP's are the type of tank that makes everyone invincible. Now whether the decision here to make GF's work that way is beneficial for pvp is what this colorful debate is all about.
I'm not going to say anyone is wrong here, but maybe if you take away GF's capacity to one rotate:
1.) Everyone might just end up bypassing GF's and killing everyone else, as GF's might become a slight annoyance instead of a real threat.
2.) If you enter Domination and see 2 GF's in your party, then you'd probably end up just sitting in base because you know you can't win.
Now I'm ok with changing the way GF's work like instead of being strikers they would have AoE stuns, or create burning areas on the ground that deal massive damage if you walk on it, that would probably promote a more team-oriented fight. I hope we really look into changing pvp mechanics, we're all using the same gears, we're all thinking about 1 on 1 damage capacity, maybe it's time the devs took a closer look at the "action" part of PVP here, and make PVP more team-oriented and a little slower. Just a thought.
"As the good archmage often admonishes me, I ought not to let my mind wander, as it's too small to go off by itself." -Danilo Thann[/quote]
Or you can put the GF out of the game by putting a TR on him. GFs are not so stronk as ppl may think, maybe in Pugmatches but every class with BiS reck pugs anyway..
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ionvnegativoMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 119Arc User
Or you can put the GF out of the game by putting a TR on him. GFs are not so stronk as ppl may think, maybe in Pugmatches but every class with BiS reck pugs anyway..
The actual pvp is about pugging, every BiS player is in a pug match, since premades are full of god mode gear with 150k HP full regen immortal people, pug matches is the way to scale in the kills leaderboard page , and guess who troll the most in pug matches....???? tara tara tara YESSSS, "TWO shotting GFs.
honestly don´t you all think it´s a waste of time? we discuss all time, get to a conclusion or not but in the end there is and will be no feedback to all this, no forummanager, no develloper, no "official" will show any kind of interest. I spend more money in that period I played this game than for every other game til now, only to get what? no service, no feedback, no interst in players opinion and by sure no fixes or adjustements in time. PVE and PVP provides near no fun atm, PVE since there is no content and PVP since it´s all broken. PVP could be fun in this game...but that´s what I hear since the first day I played, "it could be fun if only...." In case anyone writes about disbalances ingame there will be allways a handfull of ppl who rush in to say "no my class is ok, no, no it has to be taht way" but we definitely all know it´s by sure not, most classes are broken in lots of aspects and there is nothing to discuss about it. OP , TR, DC, GWF, Hunter, GF all these classes do have tons of topics you can discuss. Everyone is able to find broken builds and run them, too many options to break this game. Do you really think there ever will be anything like a solution for these masses of problems, regarding to the very poor fixes we get every month with a delay of month to years? This game is more a pathcwork of bugs, one is fixed next two show up, sometime the same one you experienced a year ago. right, I am really fed up
The first vid i posted was a semi joke, but also that was early mod6 when most were just barely hitting 70 on xb1. My main was hitting 18k Def DCs with 3k Tenacity for about 200k in a full rotation but they survive due to gift of faith. My tank also lacks an axebeak so im only at 13k armor pen.
I agree with you that My GF will get more Rediculous in mod8, but for now i still think many classes are in a reasonable state. The devs may do more in mod 9 when they (hopefully) give all the dungeons back but we'll have to wait and see.
LGPG Leader Indy - XB1 & PS4 - GF xeV Indy - PS4 - TR Nde - XB1 - HR GT: its indy time PSN: itsindytime Twitch: indygoinlive The Kanye West of Neverwinter
"I've almost never seen unstoppable bug out for them, so while it happens, it's not a particularly big factor."
Happens all the time, very annoying.
Rolen
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soulwizzardMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 11Arc User
ok i will added to this GF and TR shouldn't beable to one shot players with better or eqaul stats. i seen these over and over in pvp. lets take a GWF that is max gear enctants and he got 150k HP and can be 1 shot by them. but that max GWF can't one shot them now where is that a balance? just saying there needs to be some sort of balance and 1 more thing get rid all these rings that u just came out with stick to the main stat for rings
ok i will added to this GF and TR shouldn't beable to one shot players with better or eqaul stats. i seen these over and over in pvp. lets take a GWF that is max gear enctants and he got 150k HP and can be 1 shot by them. but that max GWF can't one shot them now where is that a balance? just saying there needs to be some sort of balance and 1 more thing get rid all these rings that u just came out with stick to the main stat for rings
Let's not use the term "one shot" when we mean "one rotation". It is starting to get really confusing. GF's can't one shot players like TR's, it requires them a full rotation of skills. AoD that is capable of dealing 150k damage will only deal this much damage if the target is below 40% hp, if you use this off the bat it will end up only dealing half.
"As the good archmage often admonishes me, I ought not to let my mind wander, as it's too small to go off by itself." -Danilo Thann[/quote]
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ionvnegativoMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 119Arc User
Let's not use the term "one shot" when we mean "one rotation". It is starting to get really confusing. GF's can't one shot players like TR's, it requires them a full rotation of skills. AoD that is capable of dealing 150k damage will only deal this much damage if the target is below 40% hp, if you use this off the bat it will end up only dealing half.
Not really, that Ryo...GF dude from S squad, have videos where he can one shot with AoD a TR(TR from page one of top kills in leaderboard) or a CW debuffed in base 2, of course is Wheel+elven ferocity+AoD+buffs, it's not that common as SE, but yes, 1 shot GFs exists. YouTube are infested with conqueror GFs videos search the ones within a month and dont deny the facts.
ok i will added to this GF and TR shouldn't beable to one shot players with better or eqaul stats. i seen these over and over in pvp. lets take a GWF that is max gear enctants and he got 150k HP and can be 1 shot by them. but that max GWF can't one shot them now where is that a balance? just saying there needs to be some sort of balance and 1 more thing get rid all these rings that u just came out with stick to the main stat for rings
Let's not use the term "one shot" when we mean "one rotation". It is starting to get really confusing. GF's can't one shot players like TR's, it requires them a full rotation of skills. AoD that is capable of dealing 150k damage will only deal this much damage if the target is below 40% hp, if you use this off the bat it will end up only dealing half.
defenitely wrong, saw Pr.. in DOM two days ago , litterally oneshootnig a 4k TR (ok he was at about 85-90% health)... and I stood 5 feet away...after this the match was done, the TR just stopped playing , finito for the hole match 35k power selfbuffed, ITF, can´tsay if he even used fire buff, guess he didn´t huhu wake up
Comments
But to call Dom a bad GF is just wtf, he is imo prolly the best gf in the game atm. And he dsnt play it as much since "New" GFs running Amushrings which is plain r33tarded.
I dont know that gf personally but the gameplay i watched is not up to par with a top gf, marking is very basic and his damage output isn't close to what even moderately geared gfs are capable of.
Indy - XB1 & PS4 - GF
xeV Indy - PS4 - TR
Nde - XB1 - HR
GT: its indy time
PSN: itsindytime
Twitch: indygoinlive
The Kanye West of Neverwinter
For a 2.5 year GF was piece of shiet. Noone even tried to take em for dungeons, cause of lack of usefullness. We had really hard time in pvp, and now after this period finally GF can hit.
Wondering who is the most active in this thread - CWs or Trs maybe?
Dom is one of the top, but not the best imo. At least he is very unpredictable.
Regards
again, we speak of one build, one tree, that needs a "tone down" for sure not the hole class, probably it would be sufficient to tone down ITF? It´s overdone imo, running PVE that buff is awesome, but objective it´s OP
most of you doesn´t obviuosly know what I speak of, In your world the class needs a buff I guess? So buff it....
The video was made 04/15, mod 6 in the begining, CW was broken for a short period and dealt tons of damage by 16-18k multiprocs from storm-spell in a row , and it was fixed...even i never played CW I know about it
I respond to this cause i deeply fear that the nerfs suggesting here (ITF,overall damage) will affect PVE(that i care about) pretty hard and adding the OP's class OPness ,the situation eventually will lead the GF class, to extinction.
@indylol
Thanks for your good words.
About your objections:
1.) "the GF is IV not SM, his rotation is utter **** and he should feel bad for picking this build. "
First the minor:
The spesific Gf in the video runs same rotation as 90% of GFs do.ITF,Bull and Anvil.As IV(was he?) he used Impact instead of Crescendo.
He did the best he could do.Bull,Impact, notice he doesn't land his Anvil ,exactly cause he wants to replenish Cw shield.
He used Anvil exactly after three att wills.Yet his Anvil hit for 14,7k.Not his fault.12% Dr of Cw +25% broken shield +35% tenacity+30% Negation. CCed and with broken shield Cw was uber tanky.
The mistake(?) of the spesific Gf you claim to be ,he didn't marked , yet you see he was turtling against two Death Star CWs that were trying to get behind his shield .He could have marked ,or not ,but if one of the Cws got him Cc during his 0,7s Tab Mark animation and all would be over in 2 secs.
2.) "the CW has shield in spell mastery."
And??
Cw used a predermined encounter-power ,broken as hell,to level his weakness(?) against a tanky class(?) adversary.
Since it worked we guess many Cws will continue to do so.Nothing extraordinary.
For the others posters:
"Video is old" :
Video is relative, since its publicement ,Gf did not get any damage buffs.Only a ninja nerf to Aod range.
Nothing changed from then ,concerning the relative themes i wanted to highlight.
Gf damage is the same,CW tankiness is the same.
"Gf was one shot wander ,and fine in mod1/2 ,very bad in mod3":
All wrong.
Mod1:
Gf was for a very small period of time viable cause of Stalwark bulwark effect set armor.The set was giving +5% of max hp in combat ,as power ,stacking up to 5 times and lasted 8 seconds.
Cws claimed it was OP back then ,the set was nerfed.
Cws were the main advocated of the nerf ,cause "tanks did too much damage".The devs nerfed the set.
(And gave them +25% base Dr as shield two mods later-I guess "DPS are too tanky" is balanced.
As for pve Gf was viable cause of Valiant warrior set bug.It was fixed quite fast.
About bulkwark:
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/517347/nerf-to-stalwart-bulwark/p1
Mod2 :
Gf was in the worst position ever,literally under extinction.Gf was nowhere to be found in lfg,even in legit ,parties will take him as a good will favor, and was a show of good character to take one with them.Its dps was abysmal,he was slow,and his buffs not needed cause 5 cw parties just sing all mobs from D2D.
In an infogram posted by cryptic prior to mod3 release only 13% of players played Gf including alts
http://gamingphanatic.com/2014/03/26/dungeons-dragons-neverwinter-shadowmantle-infographic/
The situation was so dire that let to the Gf whole rework in beta-prior Mod3 period.Few changes happen to Gf since.
(mostly nerfs,SoS ,no Ap gain during daily etc....)
Mod3 initial release:The best period of Gf ever.He was on par with other classes ,yet cause very few people were playing it,none noticed.GWfs/Cws would come to grips vs Gf with out dodging or encircling.Gf score impressive DtK ratios.
^^^
these for historical reasons
"As for who complains about GFs, it's obviously most of all the classes." Who class complaints the most?
3 CWs,one CW/Sw ,1 SW ,and one GWF just made a general comment.
Each of the antiGF nerf posters made 4 +posts each to make sure its voice nerf will be heard.Nothing wrong about it ,but we can count and see who insists and put work behind his post.
"CW was broken for a short period"
Cw Srorm Spells crit lasted for 2 modules.2 or 3? I have lost count
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/539544/official-feedback-thread-control-wizard-changes/p29
^^^
Mod3 beta notes.
It was fixed after it was discovered in pve it was doing 35-45% of its DPS.If not CWs will still be melting people.Short period......3 mods.Storm Spell crit multi procs lasted more than a "short period" to me.
Edit:Sorry for my long post and my english.:) I wish good loot to you all and many orange rings! \o/
I guess i needed to be more clear, that GF using iron vanguard means he isn't able to "latch" onto someone with crescendo the second their proned, which if u don't understand prone mechanics, mean their deflection has been turned off. So then the only factors are "how much armor pen did the GF have?" And by the looks of that video, not nearly enough.
and the CW running a Shield in Spell Mastery is very relevant if you want to list off the numbers a GF can put into it, again another indicator that the GF is poorly built and doesn't deal the damage any moderately geared GF could do. The shield isn't the issue, its the fact the GF is simply out geared and its very obvious by the gameplay and the numbers.
Thats what a properly geared GF does and those numbers are the reason this thread is on page 6. Don't try to pass off subpar players as an example of what an entire class represents.
Indy - XB1 & PS4 - GF
xeV Indy - PS4 - TR
Nde - XB1 - HR
GT: its indy time
PSN: itsindytime
Twitch: indygoinlive
The Kanye West of Neverwinter
the one rotation thing is going on from mod 4 if i remember correctly and just became always 100% reliable after recent buffs.
That vid posted a couple of posts above is a joke. I mean seriously, that GF oneshotted some opponets with 66k hits... Even my CW with guild armour and no radiants to increase his HP has around 80k HP... So the fight was basically pug stomping, who probably had little to no tenecity. Also hitting with that bullcharge against an experienced pvp player is easier said than done. Show me a vid where a GF does the same thing against an EOA/Absolute or other strong PVP guild member and you might have a point. Onerotating everything 100% of the time as also posted above is HAMSTER. GFs are strong in PVP no doubt, but they are not the dominating class, more on equal footing with the top.
To the bulwark set side discussion, Knight Captain was the really broken GF set before its nerf and the main reason why people even bothered with taking a GF into a dungeon run in late mod 1and mod 2 (40% powerbuff, 15% to deff, stackable if several chars where wearing it iirc). In PVP a GF has been powerfull until the rework of the tenebrous enchants and the conquerer tree, which basically doubled their power (as the shield prior to mod 3 was so useless that you only used it to block those hits that would really hurt or cc you in pvp). Still, the GF was never really weak in pvp in my estimation (like the SW when it made its first appearence in pvp games) but travelling between mid and top tier.
Mod 3 made GFs usefull in dungeon again, mostly due to the rework of the shield meachanic. That was also the time when i rebuild my char from a offensive to a fully defensive/support role. And it works great, people often still think that an OP is a better choice for a dungeon run, but the biggest thing he does is making the party invincible most of the time, which is nice. A support GF can also make the party harder to kill (KV + damage reduction aura + feat for tab mechanic + arguably being better at keeping aggro), but also boosts party damage (with my GF by about 79% (ITF + ITF feat) + tab mechanic), increases runspeed and AP generation (Tactitian capstone + feat + itf). So in PVE i believe the GF is in a good spot. Shame you rarely see a good support GF anymore.
here some real pug stomp from Dom at mod 7 the same who lost against obsy in mod 6
some of these guys were 3k+ at that time btw.
I like it, more the ironical note, but did not take part
again, hypervorlains video post, it was that small window at the beginning of mod 6 everyone was complainig about CW´s everywhere PVE-PVP, I can remember , you not?
@indylol in case you are xbox just wait till mod 8, 167k crits against BIS warlocks with AoD as finisher will be save
that time there will be nothing left from NWO PVP on PC so byby "beta-version " ...sadly
I got one-shot more than one time.
155k bull charge, 166k anvil of doom from full health, 218k anvil (crit, mitigated down from 485k !!!) are just a few. This is on full Lionsmane gear + 30% dmg resist from stats.
No question here, GF burst damage needs to be addressed.
thats the big and wrong deal.
you dont go giving to a 200k HP paladin a damage boost based on those HP.
you dont go giving DC a damage boost based on heals done.
you want damage, build for damage. Thats the point.
ITF should not affect the GF itself.
Mark =~ 20%
Villain's Menace = ?
ITF = 40%+ (depending on DR)
Combat Superiority = 15%
Shield Warrior's Wrath = 20%
Knight's Challenge = 100% (usually used against DCs, OPs)
Conqueror Capstone = 25%
Feytouched = 18% (assuming it works as it says. might be more)
edit: forgot the fire buff
Ok sure.
But the devs are gunshy to buff the SW because they don't want to "break" anything.
LOL
Sopi SW Youtube channel pvp brickabrack
I'm not going to say anyone is wrong here, but maybe if you take away GF's capacity to one rotate:
1.) Everyone might just end up bypassing GF's and killing everyone else, as GF's might become a slight annoyance instead of a real threat.
2.) If you enter Domination and see 2 GF's in your party, then you'd probably end up just sitting in base because you know you can't win.
Now I'm ok with changing the way GF's work like instead of being strikers they would have AoE stuns, or create burning areas on the ground that deal massive damage if you walk on it, that would probably promote a more team-oriented fight. I hope we really look into changing pvp mechanics, we're all using the same gears, we're all thinking about 1 on 1 damage capacity, maybe it's time the devs took a closer look at the "action" part of PVP here, and make PVP more team-oriented and a little slower. Just a thought.
we discuss all time, get to a conclusion or not but in the end there is and will be no feedback to all this, no forummanager, no develloper, no "official" will show any kind of interest.
I spend more money in that period I played this game than for every other game til now, only to get what?
no service, no feedback, no interst in players opinion and by sure no fixes or adjustements in time.
PVE and PVP provides near no fun atm, PVE since there is no content and PVP since it´s all broken.
PVP could be fun in this game...but that´s what I hear since the first day I played, "it could be fun if only...."
In case anyone writes about disbalances ingame there will be allways a handfull of ppl who rush in to say "no my class is ok, no, no it has to be taht way" but we definitely all know it´s by sure not, most classes are broken in lots of aspects and there is nothing to discuss about it.
OP , TR, DC, GWF, Hunter, GF all these classes do have tons of topics you can discuss. Everyone is able to find broken builds and run them, too many options to break this game.
Do you really think there ever will be anything like a solution for these masses of problems, regarding to the very poor fixes we get every month with a delay of month to years?
This game is more a pathcwork of bugs, one is fixed next two show up, sometime the same one you experienced a year ago.
right, I am really fed up
The first vid i posted was a semi joke, but also that was early mod6 when most were just barely hitting 70 on xb1. My main was hitting 18k Def DCs with 3k Tenacity for about 200k in a full rotation but they survive due to gift of faith. My tank also lacks an axebeak so im only at 13k armor pen.
@schietindebux
I agree with you that My GF will get more Rediculous in mod8, but for now i still think many classes are in a reasonable state. The devs may do more in mod 9 when they (hopefully) give all the dungeons back but we'll have to wait and see.
Indy - XB1 & PS4 - GF
xeV Indy - PS4 - TR
Nde - XB1 - HR
GT: its indy time
PSN: itsindytime
Twitch: indygoinlive
The Kanye West of Neverwinter
Happens all the time, very annoying.
Rolen
35k power selfbuffed, ITF, can´tsay if he even used fire buff, guess he didn´t
huhu wake up