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Op paladin

deanblockley89deanblockley89 Member Posts: 61 Arc User
On pc have there been any patches that affect the paladin class? I don't like creating posts that encourage the nerfing of classes. But having played on the xbox, where very few can manage to legit complete t2 dungeons, I have seen what I can only describe as one of the most broken mechanics in any mmo. So I can only assume that there have been some changes since mod 7 hit pc.???

The oathbound paladin tank build (also known as the bubble build or immortal paladin) when you have a group of 2 paladin tanks and one haste cleric, you can literally breeze through the hardest t2 dungeons, without taking any damage whatsoever. You could literally run these 3 classes and 2 level 1s and still complete them. Never before have I seen a build that absorbs any damage and dishes out the same damage back. It literally makes dps, tanks and healers obscelete on the game as you take no damage and encourage everyone to stand in the red.

It's broken beyond belief... surely there have been some changes in the last few months of pc??
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Comments

  • eion311eion311 Member Posts: 338 Arc User
    The OP continues to be over powered with no sign of being adjusted.
  • deanblockley89deanblockley89 Member Posts: 61 Arc User
    Really? That'd stupid. 2 tank paladins are immortal. Nobody takes damage since they absorb it all. So there is no need for tanks or healers. They out dps any class as they attack bosses with their own damage absorbed. So there is no need for dps. Why not everyone just make paladins? Or was this how the developers intended for the game to be played? 2 paladins and haste clerics per group?

    I cannot for the life of me figure out how this is still a possible build. The point of the life steal/regen changes were to make tanks and healers more useful in dungeons. But the bubble tank build you take no damage so why bother with healers or tanks? And they walk all over everyone in dps. Broken as!!!
  • regenerderegenerde Member Posts: 3,048 Arc User
    Everything might change for Oathbound Paladins, when the next new class is being released...
    I do believe in killing the messenger...
    Want to know why?
    Because it sends a message!
  • deanblockley89deanblockley89 Member Posts: 61 Arc User
    God I dread to think what flawed game design the next class has installed. The op is a broken class and I can't believe the dev's ever thought it would be a good idea to design an immortal class that can out dps every class. Every class should have their weaknesses. You don't see dps classes able to out heal healers, or out tank tanks. Yet the divine protector paladin has made every other class obscelete. That in itself is broken
  • regenerderegenerde Member Posts: 3,048 Arc User
    The Devs should really start with bug fixing, before they go into nerfing classes based on broken things.
    New content and new classes are fine too, but bug fixing should get a higher priority here.
    I do believe in killing the messenger...
    Want to know why?
    Because it sends a message!
  • silence1xsilence1x Member Posts: 1,503 Arc User

    You don't see dps classes able to out heal healers . . .

    You must not have been around when the Warlocks first came out.

    I aim to misbehave
  • dsn1118dsn1118 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 682 Arc User
    Come on guys,New classes are the bread and butter of Cryptic's income.They generally keep most of classes buffed up until the next one comes.Then they pull old ones to reasonable levels.Paladin already hit nerf hammer once for excessive damage and I am sure next nerf is already ready but they will keep milking that cow until new breed of cow comes to age
  • grimahgrimah Member Posts: 1,658 Arc User
    dsn1118 said:

    Come on guys,New classes are the bread and butter of Cryptic's income.They generally keep most of classes buffed up until the next one comes.Then they pull old ones to reasonable levels.Paladin already hit nerf hammer once for excessive damage and I am sure next nerf is already ready but they will keep milking that cow until new breed of cow comes to age

    This doesn't make sense, making one class more powerful pushes away the players who choose or like other classes. I wonder how many players have quit who enjoy pve HR or TR throughout the mods, or at the beginning where everyone wanted CWs, all the other players who wanted to play other classes probably moved onto other games rather than stick around.
    Creator of the featured survival horror foundry: "The Silence of Haydenwick" Video Review
    and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
  • schweifer1982schweifer1982 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,662 Arc User

    Really? That'd stupid. 2 tank paladins are immortal. Nobody takes damage since they absorb it all. So there is no need for tanks or healers. They out dps any class as they attack bosses with their own damage absorbed. So there is no need for dps. Why not everyone just make paladins? Or was this how the developers intended for the game to be played? 2 paladins and haste clerics per group?



    I cannot for the life of me figure out how this is still a possible build. The point of the life steal/regen changes were to make tanks and healers more useful in dungeons. But the bubble tank build you take no damage so why bother with healers or tanks? And they walk all over everyone in dps. Broken as!!!

    No Paladin hit my GF's dps no one will ever do this i am 100% sure.

    You alway say bubble build here there.

    There is no bubble build .

    You need 3 thing legendary grade ap gain artifact neck / slug/ DC artifact my....
    This is the perma bubble if you want to nerf somthing first start with those cuz .
    Any class can spam her daly with those under 15 sec. No AP nerf in the word will adjust paladins ap gain .
    First thing need to be done is to reduce those ap stuff.

    But will never happen cuz almost anyone use those and do y know what this community will be brutal upset if they change those stuff. I am almost sure.

    GWF 3700Ilvl Éjsötét & ProPala 3200Ilvl Menydörgés (main) & Szürkefarkas 2600 ilvl
  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User

    Really? That'd stupid. 2 tank paladins are immortal. Nobody takes damage since they absorb it all. So there is no need for tanks or healers. They out dps any class as they attack bosses with their own damage absorbed. So there is no need for dps. Why not everyone just make paladins? Or was this how the developers intended for the game to be played? 2 paladins and haste clerics per group?



    I cannot for the life of me figure out how this is still a possible build. The point of the life steal/regen changes were to make tanks and healers more useful in dungeons. But the bubble tank build you take no damage so why bother with healers or tanks? And they walk all over everyone in dps. Broken as!!!

    No Paladin hit my GF's dps no one will ever do this i am 100% sure.

    You alway say bubble build here there.

    There is no bubble build .

    You need 3 thing legendary grade ap gain artifact neck / slug/ DC artifact my....
    This is the perma bubble if you want to nerf somthing first start with those cuz .
    Any class can spam her daly with those under 15 sec. No AP nerf in the word will adjust paladins ap gain .
    First thing need to be done is to reduce those ap stuff.

    But will never happen cuz almost anyone use those and do y know what this community will be brutal upset if they change those stuff. I am almost sure.

    No protection paladin will do more dps then your gf, try comparing with a devotion paladin and you will fall woefully short.
  • schweifer1982schweifer1982 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,662 Arc User
    edited October 2015

    Really? That'd stupid. 2 tank paladins are immortal. Nobody takes damage since they absorb it all. So there is no need for tanks or healers. They out dps any class as they attack bosses with their own damage absorbed. So there is no need for dps. Why not everyone just make paladins? Or was this how the developers intended for the game to be played? 2 paladins and haste clerics per group?



    I cannot for the life of me figure out how this is still a possible build. The point of the life steal/regen changes were to make tanks and healers more useful in dungeons. But the bubble tank build you take no damage so why bother with healers or tanks? And they walk all over everyone in dps. Broken as!!!

    No Paladin hit my GF's dps no one will ever do this i am 100% sure.

    You alway say bubble build here there.

    There is no bubble build .

    You need 3 thing legendary grade ap gain artifact neck / slug/ DC artifact my....
    This is the perma bubble if you want to nerf somthing first start with those cuz .
    Any class can spam her daly with those under 15 sec. No AP nerf in the word will adjust paladins ap gain .
    First thing need to be done is to reduce those ap stuff.

    But will never happen cuz almost anyone use those and do y know what this community will be brutal upset if they change those stuff. I am almost sure.

    No protection paladin will do more dps then your gf, try comparing with a devotion paladin and you will fall woefully short.
    hahahahahahaaaaa this is the funnyes commet of all .

    Show me one i even downgrade my gf to accept the challenge .

    Have you ever done 3 mill anvil/kneebreaker (encounter)? Or 400 k at will i dont think so.
    I can even outdps some 3k GWF's.
    GWF 3700Ilvl Éjsötét & ProPala 3200Ilvl Menydörgés (main) & Szürkefarkas 2600 ilvl
  • romotheoneromotheone Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 729 Arc User
    act log or it didn't happen
  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User
    edited October 2015

    Really? That'd stupid. 2 tank paladins are immortal. Nobody takes damage since they absorb it all. So there is no need for tanks or healers. They out dps any class as they attack bosses with their own damage absorbed. So there is no need for dps. Why not everyone just make paladins? Or was this how the developers intended for the game to be played? 2 paladins and haste clerics per group?



    I cannot for the life of me figure out how this is still a possible build. The point of the life steal/regen changes were to make tanks and healers more useful in dungeons. But the bubble tank build you take no damage so why bother with healers or tanks? And they walk all over everyone in dps. Broken as!!!

    No Paladin hit my GF's dps no one will ever do this i am 100% sure.

    You alway say bubble build here there.

    There is no bubble build .

    You need 3 thing legendary grade ap gain artifact neck / slug/ DC artifact my....
    This is the perma bubble if you want to nerf somthing first start with those cuz .
    Any class can spam her daly with those under 15 sec. No AP nerf in the word will adjust paladins ap gain .
    First thing need to be done is to reduce those ap stuff.

    But will never happen cuz almost anyone use those and do y know what this community will be brutal upset if they change those stuff. I am almost sure.

    No protection paladin will do more dps then your gf, try comparing with a devotion paladin and you will fall woefully short.
    hahahahahahaaaaa this is the funnyes commet of all .

    Show me one i even downgrade my gf to accept the challenge .

    Have you ever done 3 mill anvil/kneebreaker (encounter)? Or 400 k at will i dont think so.
    I can even outdps some 3k GWF's.
    Hit me up in game and we can run an elol where I can show you, I myself will not be playing devotion, I am currently testing different tank builds so I can update my guide to incorporate both paths, but I got friends that do and they can come along. Read DPS as damage over time and not spike damage and you will get some idea of what I mean. Also, there is no need to downgrade your GF, it will be your GF vs a 2k OP. Bear in mind, this is a pve subsection, so I am not talking about in 1v1 pvp, I will concede there a GF does more damage, but in a dungeon group.
  • grimahgrimah Member Posts: 1,658 Arc User


    hahahahahahaaaaa this is the funnyes commet of all .

    Show me one i even downgrade my gf to accept the challenge .

    Have you ever done 3 mill anvil/kneebreaker (encounter)? Or 400 k at will i dont think so.
    I can even outdps some 3k GWF's.

    The ignorance is strong in this one.

    Creator of the featured survival horror foundry: "The Silence of Haydenwick" Video Review
    and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
  • kolatmasterkolatmaster Member Posts: 3,111 Arc User
    grimah said:


    The ignorance is strong in this one.



    va8Ru.gif
  • lemonchilllemonchill Member Posts: 523 Arc User
    not only that but paladins can also be major dps and still be tanks i met a paladin today at pvp with 14k arp!!!!! that dude melted my hp b4 i even managed to get close to him.
  • flanniganbkflanniganbk Member Posts: 15 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    Did spider queen (clean run no wipe) on my pally... Had 522.7m dmg done... 522.3 m dmg taken. And did 19m heals (to thehealers 17m... ) at just over 2k gs.....on Xbox one...
  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User

    Did spider queen (clean run no wipe) on my pally... Had 522.7m dmg done... 522.3 m dmg taken. And did 19m heals (to thehealers 17m... ) at just over 2k gs.....on Xbox one...

    Can I just ask, how horrible were the dps....that is like 5x the damage of the entire instance so to do that much, they must have been abysmal.
  • bedwyerbedwyer Member Posts: 85 Arc User
    Seriously, will there be anything changing anytime soon that would possibly bring players back to the game? IDK like maybe delete OP altogether...this class is a trainwreck.

    Is the OP getting my armor pen from my attacks and reflecting damage based on my armor pen? There are some OP out there that are making the game unplayable...might be why SO MANY PEOPLE ARE QUITTING NEVERWINTER...please, please, PLEASE do something about OP and soon.
    Silverhand
  • dufistodufisto Member Posts: 537 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    sounds like someone got spanked in pvp.
    all i can say is if aura of vengence is killing you. perhaps you should look into what you are doing.
  • bedwyerbedwyer Member Posts: 85 Arc User
    dufisto said:

    sounds like someone got spanked in pvp.
    all i can say is if aura of vengence is killing you. perhaps you should look into what you are doing.

    Standard troll comment...yes, I did kill myself on reflect damage from an OP, had nothing to do with skill on the OP part, never does...OP doesn't take any sort of skill, well maybe counting to eight...other than that it's just stupid...but hey, you're right, I'm probably just whining like the hundreds of others that have left...
    Silverhand
  • dufistodufisto Member Posts: 537 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    bedwyer said:


    yes, I did kill myself on reflect damage from an OP,

    end of discussion. you would either have to have no hp or spent a good deal of time beating against him for the aura to kill you. its not like its a 1 shot or 2 shot deal.

    yes pali bubble needs to be toned. down. but aura of vengence? give me a break.
  • nosimonosimo Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 48 Arc User
    Damage absorbed by divine protector shows up on the paingiver chart as damage done by the pally. I guess Xboxers can't run ACT so they don't see how much it falsely inflates their dps. A good GF CAN wreck a pally in dps but they can't put the whole party into god mode like an op.
  • bkt5789bkt5789 Member Posts: 131 Arc User
    I'm on Xbox, my formula to get an approximate of the tankadins true damage is to take the pain giver and minus it by immovable object. You have to give and take a bunch of numbers though so it's not accurate but if you're pain giver is 105mill but immovable object is 100mil for example then you've definitely done at least 5mill.
  • kemnimtarkaskemnimtarkas Member Posts: 838 Arc User




    It's broken beyond belief... surely there have been some changes in the last few months of pc??

    Remember the Paladin class was built for EE when it first came out, when even minor EE trash had massive HP. Remember how bad it was? - no one ventured forth into IWD or WoD because a single trash mob could do one shot kill level 70 anything. Except Paladins - barely.

    But since they fixed the overpowered EE mobs, the Pally now has a decided advantage (because while they nerfed the EE enemies, they appear to have left the Paladin class alone).

    What amazes me is how many complain about how OP the Pally class is. So funny to hear TRs and CWs whine when some OTHER class enjoys an OP advantage. I think it's sour grapes - they are so used to having that status to themselves - they hate it when some other class has that over them.

    I'm sure Cryptic will nerf the Pally eventually, just as they did the TR and CW (though some would argue the perma-stealth TR isn't nerfed at all).
  • dufistodufisto Member Posts: 537 Arc User
    bkt5789 said:

    I'm on Xbox, my formula to get an approximate of the tankadins true damage is to take the pain giver and minus it by immovable object. You have to give and take a bunch of numbers though so it's not accurate but if you're pain giver is 105mill but immovable object is 100mil for example then you've definitely done at least 5mill.

    basically divide immovable object by 2. then remove that from paingiver. that's a fairly reasonable rough estimate on my tankadin. depending on whether or not i let oath explode. if i let it explode its about 40% less than paingiver.

    my healadin (2.2k) is good middle of the pack dps. the more folks around the higher his dps is. and the more dev pali's you throw at something the higher thier individual dps on an exponential scale .
  • thefabricantthefabricant Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 5,248 Arc User
    Or you could just refer to ACT :p then its not a guessing game.
  • obsidiancran3obsidiancran3 Member Posts: 1,823 Arc User
    edited October 2015
    dufisto does use ACT, so a shorthand as well is handy. I really need to figure out ACT so I can get a more detailed understanding of things for my own tinkering.

    That said I run a tier 2 OP (Bulwark) and the fact is that even with a tier 2 build its still broken. Nothing short of huge damage spikes of over 1 million poses a threat to the character while Divine Protector is up, and without a Snail or and just a Purple AP neck I am pretty close to perma-bubble.

    Consider that the only way to actually test builds is to get into T2s and solo them... (if you don't have ACT of course).
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  • dufistodufisto Member Posts: 537 Arc User

    Or you could just refer to ACT :p then its not a guessing game.

    plenty of xboxers read this forum and dont have any access to act.
    my rough estimate was based on my parses. take it for what you will.
  • deanblockley89deanblockley89 Member Posts: 61 Arc User
    People saying players whine about all classes. ... hardly! I don't complain about the puppet for warlocks even though many say it's "overpowered". I don't complain about the lostmouth set making great weapon fighters hit like a truck. Why? Because they are dps classes that are spec into dealing damage.

    My issue with the paladin is that no tank should be able to out dps the damage or glass cannon classes. That's not their role. It's a design fault and that's my issue. You don't need to run anything other than 2 pally and a haste cleric. They are god mode. So it makes ALL other classes and roles obscelete.

    When the dev's changed life steal it was to make tanks and healers needed in party's. But now you run with 2 tanks and haste cleric that is your source of dps and survivability and clerics are now simply a tool to refill their daily. You never saw tank gf's being able to out dps glass cannon classes because it's not their role!

    My suggestion... make it so the protection daily doesn't stack with 2 pally present. And reduce the damage of the reflection it gives back to attackers. That way you will still need dps you still need healers. And we can stop with the constant "need 2 bubble pally and haste" in chat
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