I'll admit that I find it ironic that a class of ship that, in canon, was newer and more advanced than it's contemporaries (the Miranda and Constitution classes) lags behind both classes, in terms of performance and versatility, in STO.
The "canon" iterations of the Excelsior, Constitution, and Miranda fall under Tiers 3, 2, and 1 respectively. What you're comparing are the T6 retrofits which pretty much hand wave the diegetic problems of supporting decades old ships with new tech to somehow bring them up to modern standards (as if the US Air Forces stock of B-52's are being treated the same way a car enthusiast approaches a rebuild and update of their classic jag or mustang, with those somehow meeting and potentially exceeding the full span of modern car design).
The result is unreal performance figures decoupled from their canon appearance for the sake of gameplay and marketing. It's pretty intrinsic to end-game STO (see. the basic point that we're flying ships from across many different eras and disparate factions without that carrying consistent compromises at the T6 level, as if there has been no in-universe progress in over a century of Star Trek within or between factions. Core design is arbitrary.)
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
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I really don't see the point of this **** polishing exercise, you can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear and until they do something about the Boff layout and add a useful trait/console it will remain in the C Store for the vast majority, only the die hard Excelsior fans will buy it and they probably had it already. So they spent who knows how much getting Richter to remodel this thing and probably sold none at all. Either a new version is coming soon or Cryptic's business plan is written by a four year old.
Why, they sold at least 1 today... to me. It's pretty.
> @rattler2 said: > I wouldn't say pointless. While I agree the BOff layout is rather unforgiving, it was the only canon ship I can remember that got a T6 WITHOUT even a texture revamp. Every other canon ship with a T6 upgrade got a model revamp.
Every other canon ship also got a universal... except the excel.
> @seaofsorrows said: > It just sucks that it's nothing more then a cosmetic update. > > I appreciate the work, I really do.. but I need a mix of Aesthetics and performance. I personally like the Excelsior and I am sure the new model will look great as always, but in order to get me to buy a resolute, they would need to at least make that Ensign slot a universal. I would deal with the sub par console/trait.. that's fine, but the Resolute BoFF layout is too restrictive and no cosmetic update will fix that. > > Honestly, even if they made that change, it would still be inferior to the Archon but it would help quite a bit. I like the Excelsior, but I am afraid a cosmetic update alone just isn't enough for me.
Pretty much this... while I already own the resolute I never fly it. I did briefly yesterday after the graphic update and was reminded rather quickly why I stopped using it. It's probably the worst t6 cruiser in the game at this point.
Discharged all my Excelsior's this morning, even the older tiers on my FED's.
Just can't get over the seriously horribleness of what they did. This is what happens when you let the one who stuffed up DS9 lose with a crayon.
What are you talking about? The new model looks amazing, that's not the issue, the issue is it's well below par performance. What's wrong with DS9? All the feedback I see is that it looks and feels very close to the show and that the work done was superb.
Flown one for 8 years, always had a feel, now it's gone. I tried to get it back in the ship tailor, but to no effect.
I was outside EDS trying on my new T6 Sov ( a freebie in a email a few months ago ) when one parked her self beside me. God, she was so bland, even with that paint job so bright, she looked terrible. I knew one day I would have to give mine up like my beloved T5 Vor'cha, so taking her to ESD to be decommissioned was a downer.
I'd rather remember her as my queen of the galaxy and not the cheap space tramp Cryptic turned her into.
DS9 is too narrow and crowded with NCP's now. Ever tried to navigate a Gorn? Even my Catians have problems. Lose about 50% of the NCP's and maybe it will be better. Unless I have to go to ops ( thank god for the direct beam in ) there's no other reason what so ever for me to go there.
Booooo! I had flown the Galaxy Class since Beta Release, it looked horrible but had a certain charm.. Sometimes I actually miss it, so I look at the artwork in the STO DVD I bought on release, since it has a picture of the beta style Galaxy Class.
It looked horrible, but had a charm. But the new one kicks butt, just like the new Excelsior.
> @avoozuul said: > Well I don't agree with it being the worst, there's plenty of other cruisers which I don't like and prefer the Resolute in Fleet form over them.
Well sounds like a challenge! How about you list 3 t6 cruisers worse than the excelsior? Looking at boff layout, console layout, special console, trait...etc.
I'm not saying the excelsior is total garbage... just that it's one of the worst available. It has a fairly standard console layout. A restrictive boff layout with weak specialization (should have been pilot so it could use fly her apart). Average shield and hull modifier, slightly above average maneuverability. A forgettable trait and console. It's just super meh.
I am now reminded why a rarely come to the forums anymore. Some people just won't be happy no matter what good comes their way. And still others let the anonymity of the internet override their good manners.
I appreciate the work put into the model and look forward to flying her when I get back to the game.
> @ruinthefun said: > nikephorus wrote: » > > Well sounds like a challenge! How about you list 3 t6 cruisers worse than the excelsior? Looking at boff layout, console layout, special console, trait...etc. > > > > 3 T6 cruisers worse than the Excelsior? Easy: Samsar, ECBC, SCBC. All 3 of these are terrible: They're cruisers, that are lacking any access whatsoever to FAW3, with the Samsar being the worst of them since it can't even manage better than FAW1 if it wants to keep an attack pattern. Some of them can be stripped for parts, but as ships, all of these are AWFUL. > > The Excelsior, on the other hand, is merely slightly subpar, it doesn't have any really crippling defects, only some clear shortcomings. It isn't even the worst in the C-Store: ECBC and SCBC have it beat easily.
Samsar has a good console tho and was free, but I'll give you that one. It's pretty bad. I dunno about the other two. They seem slightly better then the excel. They have a hangar... similar consoles layout to the excelsior, similar maneuverability, consoles and traits are subpar tho, but at least they are already fleet level. Sci and eng cruisers, and most escorts for that matter, are almost always bad tho.
> @ruinthefun said: > nikephorus wrote: » > > I dunno about the other two. They seem slightly better then the excel. They have a hangar... similar consoles layout to the excelsior, similar maneuverability, consoles and traits are subpar tho, but at least they are already fleet level. Sci and eng cruisers, and most escorts for that matter, are almost always bad tho. > > > > They suffer the same obvious problem as the Samsar: A FAWboat that cannot FAW for ****. > > These ships mostly escape their deserved oppobrium because they're either freebies that most people can't even get anymore, or viewed as simply a source of components to strip for real ships. But you won't see many who are actually FLYING these for realsies.
You don't see many excelsiors either... not generally anyway. Will probably see a few in the next month or so because of the graphic update, but in general they pretty rare.
Man, these new visuals look great! Please, PLEASE fix the boff layout. I don't care if it's lock box, lobi or even promo. Just do it.
I'm trapped in a cycle of hell!
I can feel its hideous squared nacelles digging into my flesh!
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Why are folks hating on this ship so much? I don't find it 'underperforming' at all. Which is to say, it performs about the same as its T5-U predecessor I had. And, for me, that means making a solid a2b build out of it (with BFAW3, APB1, and TT1). With Cold-Hearted and Regroup Trait as well, I have Structural Integrity Collapse and Endothermic Inhibiting Beam almost on perma-global, as well as 2 copies of the old Directed Energy Modulation. Works just fine for me. Yes, you're losing *some* resists when aux goes down, but nothing a battery can't fix; and the ship itself comes with extra resists in its Mastery.
Is the ship the best there is? Probably not (I'm not among the 'best' players, so I couldn't tell, even if it were). But, relative to myself, I can say it performs as expected. Wouldn't have minded, say, a universal Ensign station or something (KCLW1, ftw!), as 3x Engi (read: 3x not an Embassy boff for a Fed) is taking quite a hit, and not really necessary either.
As for the new skin, can't say as I like it. It looks waaaay too much like a Command ship that way. And I wanted to keep the 'feel' of the old Excelsior.
Why are folks hating on this ship so much? I don't find it 'underperforming' at all. Which is to say, it performs about the same as its T5-U predecessor I had. And, for me, that means making a solid a2b build out of it (with BFAW3, APB1, and TT1). With Cold-Hearted and Regroup Trait as well, I have Structural Integrity Collapse and Endothermic Inhibiting Beam almost on perma-global, as well as 2 copies of the old Directed Energy Modulation. Works just fine for me. Yes, you're losing *some* resists when aux goes down, but nothing a battery can't fix; and the ship itself comes with extra resists in its Mastery.
Is the ship the best there is? Probably not (I'm not among the 'best' players, so I couldn't tell, even if it were). But, relative to myself, I can say it performs as expected. Wouldn't have minded, say, a universal Ensign station or something (KCLW1, ftw!), as 3x Engi (read: 3x not an Embassy boff for a Fed) is taking quite a hit, and not really necessary either.
As for the new skin, can't say as I like it. It looks waaaay too much like a Command ship that way. And I wanted to keep the 'feel' of the old Excelsior.
It Looks EXACTLY like the Excelsior iossupposed to look like
Comments
Too bad they didn't fix the BoFF layout while they were at it.
The "canon" iterations of the Excelsior, Constitution, and Miranda fall under Tiers 3, 2, and 1 respectively. What you're comparing are the T6 retrofits which pretty much hand wave the diegetic problems of supporting decades old ships with new tech to somehow bring them up to modern standards (as if the US Air Forces stock of B-52's are being treated the same way a car enthusiast approaches a rebuild and update of their classic jag or mustang, with those somehow meeting and potentially exceeding the full span of modern car design).
The result is unreal performance figures decoupled from their canon appearance for the sake of gameplay and marketing. It's pretty intrinsic to end-game STO (see. the basic point that we're flying ships from across many different eras and disparate factions without that carrying consistent compromises at the T6 level, as if there has been no in-universe progress in over a century of Star Trek within or between factions. Core design is arbitrary.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Why, they sold at least 1 today... to me.
> I wouldn't say pointless. While I agree the BOff layout is rather unforgiving, it was the only canon ship I can remember that got a T6 WITHOUT even a texture revamp. Every other canon ship with a T6 upgrade got a model revamp.
Every other canon ship also got a universal... except the excel.
> It just sucks that it's nothing more then a cosmetic update.
>
> I appreciate the work, I really do.. but I need a mix of Aesthetics and performance. I personally like the Excelsior and I am sure the new model will look great as always, but in order to get me to buy a resolute, they would need to at least make that Ensign slot a universal. I would deal with the sub par console/trait.. that's fine, but the Resolute BoFF layout is too restrictive and no cosmetic update will fix that.
>
> Honestly, even if they made that change, it would still be inferior to the Archon but it would help quite a bit. I like the Excelsior, but I am afraid a cosmetic update alone just isn't enough for me.
Pretty much this... while I already own the resolute I never fly it. I did briefly yesterday after the graphic update and was reminded rather quickly why I stopped using it. It's probably the worst t6 cruiser in the game at this point.
Booooo! I had flown the Galaxy Class since Beta Release, it looked horrible but had a certain charm.. Sometimes I actually miss it, so I look at the artwork in the STO DVD I bought on release, since it has a picture of the beta style Galaxy Class.
It looked horrible, but had a charm. But the new one kicks butt, just like the new Excelsior.
> Well I don't agree with it being the worst, there's plenty of other cruisers which I don't like and prefer the Resolute in Fleet form over them.
Well sounds like a challenge! How about you list 3 t6 cruisers worse than the excelsior? Looking at boff layout, console layout, special console, trait...etc.
I'm not saying the excelsior is total garbage... just that it's one of the worst available. It has a fairly standard console layout. A restrictive boff layout with weak specialization (should have been pilot so it could use fly her apart). Average shield and hull modifier, slightly above average maneuverability. A forgettable trait and console. It's just super meh.
I appreciate the work put into the model and look forward to flying her when I get back to the game.
> nikephorus wrote: »
>
> Well sounds like a challenge! How about you list 3 t6 cruisers worse than the excelsior? Looking at boff layout, console layout, special console, trait...etc.
>
>
>
> 3 T6 cruisers worse than the Excelsior? Easy: Samsar, ECBC, SCBC. All 3 of these are terrible: They're cruisers, that are lacking any access whatsoever to FAW3, with the Samsar being the worst of them since it can't even manage better than FAW1 if it wants to keep an attack pattern. Some of them can be stripped for parts, but as ships, all of these are AWFUL.
>
> The Excelsior, on the other hand, is merely slightly subpar, it doesn't have any really crippling defects, only some clear shortcomings. It isn't even the worst in the C-Store: ECBC and SCBC have it beat easily.
Samsar has a good console tho and was free, but I'll give you that one. It's pretty bad. I dunno about the other two. They seem slightly better then the excel. They have a hangar... similar consoles layout to the excelsior, similar maneuverability, consoles and traits are subpar tho, but at least they are already fleet level. Sci and eng cruisers, and most escorts for that matter, are almost always bad tho.
> nikephorus wrote: »
>
> I dunno about the other two. They seem slightly better then the excel. They have a hangar... similar consoles layout to the excelsior, similar maneuverability, consoles and traits are subpar tho, but at least they are already fleet level. Sci and eng cruisers, and most escorts for that matter, are almost always bad tho.
>
>
>
> They suffer the same obvious problem as the Samsar: A FAWboat that cannot FAW for ****.
>
> These ships mostly escape their deserved oppobrium because they're either freebies that most people can't even get anymore, or viewed as simply a source of components to strip for real ships. But you won't see many who are actually FLYING these for realsies.
You don't see many excelsiors either... not generally anyway. Will probably see a few in the next month or so because of the graphic update, but in general they pretty rare.
I'm trapped in a cycle of hell!
I can feel its hideous squared nacelles digging into my flesh!
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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Is the ship the best there is? Probably not (I'm not among the 'best' players, so I couldn't tell, even if it were). But, relative to myself, I can say it performs as expected. Wouldn't have minded, say, a universal Ensign station or something (KCLW1, ftw!), as 3x Engi (read: 3x not an Embassy boff for a Fed) is taking quite a hit, and not really necessary either.
As for the new skin, can't say as I like it. It looks waaaay too much like a Command ship that way. And I wanted to keep the 'feel' of the old Excelsior.
I was talking about the newly added Resolute skin.
It Looks EXACTLY like the Excelsior iossupposed to look like
ANd I am afraid the only good thing from the Resolute is probably the neck. Everything else just doesn't work for me. (Or maybe the Pylons, too?)