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T6 Ships and Enhancements STO Needs

sarvour0sarvour0 Member Posts: 377 Arc User
1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
5. Assorted Enhancements

1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
Quality Overhaul of in-game models is LONG OVERDUE. This is Priority One FIRST STEP. Standard Prime Universe T6 Nova should favor Tactical over Engineering for Consoles & BOff Seating. C-store release.
1A. Mirror Universe T6 Nova would, like its T5 predecessor, favor Engineering Consoles & Seating. Advanced Prototype version can debut in a Lock Box, with a Production Version to follow as either Fleet Shipyard or C-store.

2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
IN CANON, these ships were Modular, making them Versatile, readily customized for different mission profiles. Widely used by BOTH Starfleet and Civilians. It was widespread. When Starfleet retired their Oberths they were most frequently sold off to private interests. This makes it the single-best candidate for a Starfleet-style Cross-faction ship! Variants should include choices of Nova & Intrepid-style Warp Nacelles.
First Release: Summer Event ship; Luxury Science Vessel. Favors Tactical. Background Fluff of Quark Enterprises discovering a large number of this hulls abandoned and/or forgotten in backwater merchants' yards, working with Risian Engineers & Lobi Crystal Consortium made these vessels a researcher's dream! Can slot any Risian-ship Console. Maybe slot Cannons/Dual Cannons too.
Players can choose between R.X.S. or their faction's native prefix.
Non-Fed Captains have all their faction's Materials as options, in addition to the Fed Materials.
Second Release: (FED ONLY) Pegasus-class Retrofit. Favors Science & Engineering, either evenly or slightly more Engineering. Prototype Interphase Cloak - Console - Universal. C-store release.

4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
The Original Constellation & variants shown on TNG all featured PROMINENT HANGARS. The T6 Retrofit should have 1-2 Hangars, without sacrificing weapons or Device Slots.
C-store release is most practical.
A slight quality enhancement would be welcome as well.

5. Assorted Enhancements
First and Foremost, Armor Visuals. Disturbingly few armors even have the option to Enable Visuals. This is a problem, and it needs to be fixed. If a Captain wants to show their Armor, they should be able to do so easily, for any armor they have.
Second, Personal Weapons. Many Captains have a favorite pistol/rifle/cannon/etc. that to their regret, changed appearance when the levelled up to a new Tier. Since there are Multiple Skins for each of the main ground weapons in the game, instead of forcing an arbitrary skin change on their weapons, they should be allowed to select the skin for their weapon. Simply add a NEW TAB in the TAILOR, for Armor and Weapon Visuals. Most MMOs have already implemented systems for Custom Armor & Weapons Visuals. Why STO hasn't done so, when we already had those visuals AT LAUNCH, is beyond me. This quality enhancement is as overdue as the T6 Nova. Please, someone get on this. Start a dream team to get this started. Please.

Captains and Bridge Officers have Biographies players can tell a character's story in. Starships deserve to have Biographies too.

Thank you to all the Devs & Designers that have made STO my #1 game and still one of the best MMOs of all the ones out there!
Post edited by sarvour0 on
4073703.jpg
[SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards[/SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards
=A=Commodore Joshua Daniel Sarvour, S.C.E.
U.S.S. AKAGI NX-93347, Enterprise-class Battle Cruiser =A= U.S.S. T'KORA'S WRATH NX-110047, Odyssey-class Battle Cruiser

"There Ain't No Grave, Can Hold My Body Down..."

PS - I fully support a T6 Nova, fixing the Nova skins. I am also rooting for a T6 Science Cruiser, that can use Nova/Rhode Island skins.
T6 Nova/Rhode Island, T6 Oberth & T6 Constellation are needed. Also needed a T6 Science Cruiser, that can wear any Science or Cruiser skin.
«1

Comments

  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 12,138 Arc User
    Should come as no surprise that I am going to addess the one closest to my heart - the T6 Nova.

    Whilst agree with point 1, I'm not so sure about 1a. The trouble with lock box ships is that, since lock boxes are a cash-cow, they get priority, hence the Mirror Engle class appearing before the Prime one.

    I would, personally, prefer to the Prime Nova to appear before a mirror lock box version.+-
    3U3C0SJ.jpg

  • seaofsorrowsseaofsorrows Member Posts: 6,907 Arc User
    Still would like to see a T6 Patrol Escort as well.

    But yeah.. another voice for the T6 Nova, that one first.
    wDYkQHL.jpg

    Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
  • sarvour0sarvour0 Member Posts: 377 Arc User
    edited December 2018
    reyan01 wrote: »
    Should come as no surprise that I am going to addess the one closest to my heart - the T6 Nova.

    Whilst agree with point 1, I'm not so sure about 1a. The trouble with lock box ships is that, since lock boxes are a cash-cow, they get priority, hence the Mirror Engle class appearing before the Prime one.

    I would, personally, prefer to the Prime Nova to appear before a mirror lock box version.+-

    I think you misread what I was saying. Although I made the main argument for the Prime Nova T6 first, and arguments for the Mirror Nova to also get an update, I was not prioritizing it over the Prime. I want to see them Both. I admit I am biased in my personal preference for the Engineering-centric MU version, but I was trying to make my arguments for both equally compelling and unbiased.

    Thank you for your feedback.
    In hindsight you may be right; $ could push the MU T6 out in a LB ahead of the Prime version(s) ...
    4073703.jpg
    [SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards[/SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards
    =A=Commodore Joshua Daniel Sarvour, S.C.E.
    U.S.S. AKAGI NX-93347, Enterprise-class Battle Cruiser =A= U.S.S. T'KORA'S WRATH NX-110047, Odyssey-class Battle Cruiser

    "There Ain't No Grave, Can Hold My Body Down..."

    PS - I fully support a T6 Nova, fixing the Nova skins. I am also rooting for a T6 Science Cruiser, that can use Nova/Rhode Island skins.
    T6 Nova/Rhode Island, T6 Oberth & T6 Constellation are needed. Also needed a T6 Science Cruiser, that can wear any Science or Cruiser skin.
  • lordmerc22lordmerc22 Member Posts: 30 Arc User
    I believe there is a big lack of competent carriers that belong to the empires(KDF, Fed, Rom etc) in the game too so I would had placed it up there. Most options for carrier pilots come from phoenix/lockbox/events really, some dont work well and almost all arent from the empire. As for T6 versions of beloved older ships the solution to this problem is to make new scaling ships like the one they just released. Instead for example someone to want to get every ship that can have - lets say - the galaxy skin from tier 4 onwards, they could make a scaling ship for every one. We wouldnt mind certainly if they got more expensive - if that meant to have them forever usable
  • avoozuulavoozuul Member Posts: 2,074 Arc User
    edited December 2018
    Why did you put the Oberth third? The Oberth seems more likely than the science cruisers you said since the Oberth and the Nova were two remaining ships on a four ship poll which haven't been released in T6 form, the other two the ambassador and vorcha have already been released in T6 form since. It seems very likely that the Oberth and Nova will be next in whichever order the devs choose, but it may be after all the discovery ships are released. They will never put a secondary deflector on a cruiser since it's a science ship feature, but if they did they will likely be promo or lockbox ships.
  • leemwatsonleemwatson Member Posts: 2,957 Arc User
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    5. Assorted Enhancements

    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    Quality Overhaul of in-game models is LONG OVERDUE. This is Priority One FIRST STEP. Standard Prime Universe T6 Nova should favor Tactical over Engineering for Consoles & BOff Seating. C-store release.
    1A. Mirror Universe T6 Nova would, like its T5 predecessor, favor Engineering Consoles & Seating. Advanced Prototype version can debut in a Lock Box, with a Production Version to follow as either Fleet Shipyard or C-store.

    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
    As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
    Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
    Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    IN CANON, these ships were Modular, making them Versatile, readily customized for different mission profiles. Widely used by BOTH Starfleet and Civilians. It was widespread. When Starfleet retired their Oberths they were most frequently sold off to private interests. This makes it the single-best candidate for a Starfleet-style Cross-faction ship! Variants should include choices of Nova & Intrepid-style Warp Nacelles.
    First Release: Summer Event ship; Luxury Science Vessel. Favors Tactical. Background Fluff of Quark Enterprises discovering a large number of this hulls abandoned and/or forgotten in backwater merchants' yards, working with Risian Engineers & Lobi Crystal Consortium made these vessels a researcher's dream! Can slot any Risian-ship Console. Maybe slot Cannons/Dual Cannons too.
    Players can choose between R.X.S. or their faction's native prefix.
    Non-Fed Captains have all their faction's Materials as options, in addition to the Fed Materials.
    Second Release: (FED ONLY) Pegasus-class Retrofit. Favors Science & Engineering, either evenly or slightly more Engineering. Prototype Interphase Cloak - Console - Universal. C-store release.

    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    The Original Constellation & variants shown on TNG all featured PROMINENT HANGARS. The T6 Retrofit should have 1-2 Hangars, without sacrificing weapons or Device Slots.
    C-store release is most practical.
    A slight quality enhancement would be welcome as well.

    5. Assorted Enhancements
    First and Foremost, Armor Visuals. Disturbingly few armors even have the option to Enable Visuals. This is a problem, and it needs to be fixed. If a Captain wants to show their Armor, they should be able to do so easily, for any armor they have.
    Second, Personal Weapons. Many Captains have a favorite pistol/rifle/cannon/etc. that to their regret, changed appearance when the levelled up to a new Tier. Since there are Multiple Skins for each of the main ground weapons in the game, instead of forcing an arbitrary skin change on their weapons, they should be allowed to select the skin for their weapon. Simply add a NEW TAB in the TAILOR, for Armor and Weapon Visuals. Most MMOs have already implemented systems for Custom Armor & Weapons Visuals. Why STO hasn't done so, when we already had those visuals AT LAUNCH, is beyond me. This quality enhancement is as overdue as the T6 Nova. Please, someone get on this. Start a dream team to get this started. Please.

    Captains and Bridge Officers have Biographies players can tell a character's story in. Starships deserve to have Biographies too.

    Thank you to all the Devs & Designers that have made STO my #1 game and still one of the best MMOs of all the ones out there!

    Refits will get done as and when the Dev's have time to do so, as refits of current ships are usually done during someone's free time.

    As for the Science cruisers....we already have them, but a 4/4 with Sec Deflector will be a step to far. We already have 4/3 with Sec deflector and that, for my Sci main is enough.
    "You don't want to patrol!? You don't want to escort!? You don't want to defend the Federation's Starbases!? Then why are you flying my Starships!? If you were a Klingon you'd be killed on the spot, but lucky for you.....you WERE in Starfleet. Let's see how New Zealand Penal Colony suits you." Adm A. Necheyev.
  • sarvour0sarvour0 Member Posts: 377 Arc User
    avoozuul wrote: »
    Why did you put the Oberth third? The Oberth seems more likely than the science cruisers you said since the Oberth and the Nova were two remaining ships on a four ship poll which haven't been released in T6 form, the other two the ambassador and vorcha have already been released in T6 form since. It seems very likely that the Oberth and Nova will be next in whichever order the devs choose, but it may be after all the discovery ships are released. They will never put a secondary deflector on a cruiser since it's a science ship feature, but if they did they will likely be promo or lockbox ships.

    While I may have ordered them to my personal preference, 'my' ranking was not intended to dictate relative importance. My intent, was to convey that everything on this list was equally important and needed. In hindsight I should have perhaps taken a little extra time to relearn how to do bullet points/lists in the forum.
    leemwatson wrote: »
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    5. Assorted Enhancements

    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    Quality Overhaul of in-game models is LONG OVERDUE. This is Priority One FIRST STEP. Standard Prime Universe T6 Nova should favor Tactical over Engineering for Consoles & BOff Seating. C-store release.
    1A. Mirror Universe T6 Nova would, like its T5 predecessor, favor Engineering Consoles & Seating. Advanced Prototype version can debut in a Lock Box, with a Production Version to follow as either Fleet Shipyard or C-store.

    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
    As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
    Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
    Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    IN CANON, these ships were Modular, making them Versatile, readily customized for different mission profiles. Widely used by BOTH Starfleet and Civilians. It was widespread. When Starfleet retired their Oberths they were most frequently sold off to private interests. This makes it the single-best candidate for a Starfleet-style Cross-faction ship! Variants should include choices of Nova & Intrepid-style Warp Nacelles.
    First Release: Summer Event ship; Luxury Science Vessel. Favors Tactical. Background Fluff of Quark Enterprises discovering a large number of this hulls abandoned and/or forgotten in backwater merchants' yards, working with Risian Engineers & Lobi Crystal Consortium made these vessels a researcher's dream! Can slot any Risian-ship Console. Maybe slot Cannons/Dual Cannons too.
    Players can choose between R.X.S. or their faction's native prefix.
    Non-Fed Captains have all their faction's Materials as options, in addition to the Fed Materials.
    Second Release: (FED ONLY) Pegasus-class Retrofit. Favors Science & Engineering, either evenly or slightly more Engineering. Prototype Interphase Cloak - Console - Universal. C-store release.

    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    The Original Constellation & variants shown on TNG all featured PROMINENT HANGARS. The T6 Retrofit should have 1-2 Hangars, without sacrificing weapons or Device Slots.
    C-store release is most practical.
    A slight quality enhancement would be welcome as well.

    5. Assorted Enhancements
    First and Foremost, Armor Visuals. Disturbingly few armors even have the option to Enable Visuals. This is a problem, and it needs to be fixed. If a Captain wants to show their Armor, they should be able to do so easily, for any armor they have.
    Second, Personal Weapons. Many Captains have a favorite pistol/rifle/cannon/etc. that to their regret, changed appearance when the levelled up to a new Tier. Since there are Multiple Skins for each of the main ground weapons in the game, instead of forcing an arbitrary skin change on their weapons, they should be allowed to select the skin for their weapon. Simply add a NEW TAB in the TAILOR, for Armor and Weapon Visuals. Most MMOs have already implemented systems for Custom Armor & Weapons Visuals. Why STO hasn't done so, when we already had those visuals AT LAUNCH, is beyond me. This quality enhancement is as overdue as the T6 Nova. Please, someone get on this. Start a dream team to get this started. Please.

    Captains and Bridge Officers have Biographies players can tell a character's story in. Starships deserve to have Biographies too.

    Thank you to all the Devs & Designers that have made STO my #1 game and still one of the best MMOs of all the ones out there!

    Refits will get done as and when the Dev's have time to do so, as refits of current ships are usually done during someone's free time.

    As for the Science cruisers....we already have them, but a 4/4 with Sec Deflector will be a step to far. We already have 4/3 with Sec deflector and that, for my Sci main is enough.

    I have had ideas for a proper, full-on Science Cruiser for some time. With the introduction of the new Juggernaut type, my dream for the Science Cruiser seems a bit closer. As for already having them I disagree. The only Science Vessels with 4/3 weapons that I know of are the Crossfield and the Dyson in Tactical Mode; the latter of which is 3/3 by default. Tactical has been getting a bit of everything for a while now, so something like a Science Cruiser hybrid is overdue.
    4073703.jpg
    [SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards[/SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards
    =A=Commodore Joshua Daniel Sarvour, S.C.E.
    U.S.S. AKAGI NX-93347, Enterprise-class Battle Cruiser =A= U.S.S. T'KORA'S WRATH NX-110047, Odyssey-class Battle Cruiser

    "There Ain't No Grave, Can Hold My Body Down..."

    PS - I fully support a T6 Nova, fixing the Nova skins. I am also rooting for a T6 Science Cruiser, that can use Nova/Rhode Island skins.
    T6 Nova/Rhode Island, T6 Oberth & T6 Constellation are needed. Also needed a T6 Science Cruiser, that can wear any Science or Cruiser skin.
  • dracounguisdracounguis Member Posts: 5,363 Arc User
    If this is gonna be another Nova rant thread, it needs to be merged with the other one.
    Sometimes I think I play STO just to have something to complain about on the forums.
  • maxthedog5maxthedog5 Member Posts: 16 Arc User
    I like the idea of a ship that scales up as you gain rank and abilities. Right now, if you like a ship such as the Nova, like I do, after a full upgrade it does not cut it anymore and you may dry dock it, or get rid of it as it cannot compete with the higher missions. So this idea of a ship that will scale with you is something I look forward to. I think it is a nice upgrade. One thing I would suggest is that STO have one not in a lock box.
  • westmetalswestmetals Member Posts: 2,879 Arc User
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    .....
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
    As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
    Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
    Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

    Never going to happen. In several different ways.

    - "All the inherent abilities of cruisers and science vessels"? Meaning cruiser commands AND subsystem targeting? They're not going to give you a ship that does both.
    - 4/4 weapons AND a secondary deflector? Secondary deflectors (and the escort equivalent Experimental Weapon slots) were explictly given to those ship types in order to try to bring them into greater equality with eight-weapon cruisers. They're not going to give you a ship that does both.
    - "they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to"... There is not a single example of this, or anything even approaching it, in game already, and I really, really doubt they're going to break that pattern. If such a ship existed (which it won't, see my other points), it would be restricted to one build-style, though (like the Galaxy or Intrepid or whatnot) that style might include several slightly different hull options.
    - "Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting." What? From a ship?
  • westmetalswestmetals Member Posts: 2,879 Arc User
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    ......
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
    As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
    Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
    Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

    This is never ever ever going to happen for multiple reasons:

    - "all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels"? Meaning cruiser commands AND subsystem targeting? They're not going to make a ship with both.
    - For that matter, it would also need to have Cmdr Eng and Cmdr Sci BOFF seats, which itself is highly unlikely. There's only (I believe) one or two ships with two Cmdr seats at all.
    - "4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector" Never going to happen. Secondary deflectors and experimental weapons were introduced specifically in order to try to balance out science vessels and escorts, against 8-weapon cruisers. An 8-weapon ship having either of those would be overpowered.
    - "access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to". This is never ever going to happen. There's a reason that ships are limited to one hull-type (even when, in some cases, that hull-type may have several different specific options). This proposed ship will never exist (see my other points), but even if it did, they're not going to let you have access to the dozens of different skins you're referring to.
    - "Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting." What? From a ship?
  • ichaerus1ichaerus1 Member Posts: 703 Arc User
    leemwatson wrote: »
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    5. Assorted Enhancements

    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    Quality Overhaul of in-game models is LONG OVERDUE. This is Priority One FIRST STEP. Standard Prime Universe T6 Nova should favor Tactical over Engineering for Consoles & BOff Seating. C-store release.
    1A. Mirror Universe T6 Nova would, like its T5 predecessor, favor Engineering Consoles & Seating. Advanced Prototype version can debut in a Lock Box, with a Production Version to follow as either Fleet Shipyard or C-store.

    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
    As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
    Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
    Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    IN CANON, these ships were Modular, making them Versatile, readily customized for different mission profiles. Widely used by BOTH Starfleet and Civilians. It was widespread. When Starfleet retired their Oberths they were most frequently sold off to private interests. This makes it the single-best candidate for a Starfleet-style Cross-faction ship! Variants should include choices of Nova & Intrepid-style Warp Nacelles.
    First Release: Summer Event ship; Luxury Science Vessel. Favors Tactical. Background Fluff of Quark Enterprises discovering a large number of this hulls abandoned and/or forgotten in backwater merchants' yards, working with Risian Engineers & Lobi Crystal Consortium made these vessels a researcher's dream! Can slot any Risian-ship Console. Maybe slot Cannons/Dual Cannons too.
    Players can choose between R.X.S. or their faction's native prefix.
    Non-Fed Captains have all their faction's Materials as options, in addition to the Fed Materials.
    Second Release: (FED ONLY) Pegasus-class Retrofit. Favors Science & Engineering, either evenly or slightly more Engineering. Prototype Interphase Cloak - Console - Universal. C-store release.

    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    The Original Constellation & variants shown on TNG all featured PROMINENT HANGARS. The T6 Retrofit should have 1-2 Hangars, without sacrificing weapons or Device Slots.
    C-store release is most practical.
    A slight quality enhancement would be welcome as well.

    5. Assorted Enhancements
    First and Foremost, Armor Visuals. Disturbingly few armors even have the option to Enable Visuals. This is a problem, and it needs to be fixed. If a Captain wants to show their Armor, they should be able to do so easily, for any armor they have.
    Second, Personal Weapons. Many Captains have a favorite pistol/rifle/cannon/etc. that to their regret, changed appearance when the levelled up to a new Tier. Since there are Multiple Skins for each of the main ground weapons in the game, instead of forcing an arbitrary skin change on their weapons, they should be allowed to select the skin for their weapon. Simply add a NEW TAB in the TAILOR, for Armor and Weapon Visuals. Most MMOs have already implemented systems for Custom Armor & Weapons Visuals. Why STO hasn't done so, when we already had those visuals AT LAUNCH, is beyond me. This quality enhancement is as overdue as the T6 Nova. Please, someone get on this. Start a dream team to get this started. Please.

    Captains and Bridge Officers have Biographies players can tell a character's story in. Starships deserve to have Biographies too.

    Thank you to all the Devs & Designers that have made STO my #1 game and still one of the best MMOs of all the ones out there!

    Refits will get done as and when the Dev's have time to do so, as refits of current ships are usually done during someone's free time.

    As for the Science cruisers....we already have them, but a 4/4 with Sec Deflector will be a step to far. We already have 4/3 with Sec deflector and that, for my Sci main is enough.

    There's also the science version of the Bortasqu'(I don't know if there's any others that have the ship analysis toggle) being the Gorkon variant.

    Now to the rest of the topic:
    To the OP: You might want to rethink the KDF possible sci cruiser being based off the K'tinga to the Kamarag instead. I know @where2r1 would be very happy for something like that.

    I'd rather see KDF get an actual T6 carrier(in the form of a Ferasan, Karfi, or Vo'quv), and Roms also get a T6 carrier before a sci cruiser cross-faction stillborn gets birthed by Cryptic(because you know that they're going to drek the bed somehow on that).

    I agree 100% that the Nova should be at the forefront, but package it with ships from the other factions as well. It's a prime opportunity to include a T6 Ha'nom in there for example, yes? But then, what would you suggest for KDF? Or the Jem'hadar?

    Regarding the Oberth thing. That mention sounded like "Oh hey, we'll make the Oberth cross-faction, so that we can dump that **** on the other factions. Can't let them have their own stuff. KDF and Roms will LOOOOOOVE having their ships looking all Starfleet proper." That right there would go as well as having a bowel movement on the altar of some religious place of worship. Or did you not notice the ire of multiple players complaining when their rom and kdf ships wore the Fed outfit in the Battle of Binary Stars TFO?

    For the 2nd release option(with the Pegasus), nice to omit other factions. I'm seeing a request to widen the gap between what the Feds and Fed-Nots have, right there.

    For point No. 4, see previous statement. Back to drawing board for you.
  • ichaerus1ichaerus1 Member Posts: 703 Arc User
    sarvour0 wrote: »

    I have had ideas for a proper, full-on Science Cruiser for some time. With the introduction of the new Juggernaut type, my dream for the Science Cruiser seems a bit closer. As for already having them I disagree. The only Science Vessels with 4/3 weapons that I know of are the Crossfield and the Dyson in Tactical Mode; the latter of which is 3/3 by default. Tactical has been getting a bit of everything for a while now, so something like a Science Cruiser hybrid is overdue.

    The Karfi is a 4/3 sci ship. But knowing that would require you to step outside the Fed bubble.
  • sarvour0sarvour0 Member Posts: 377 Arc User
    edited December 2018
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    leemwatson wrote: »
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    5. Assorted Enhancements

    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    Quality Overhaul of in-game models is LONG OVERDUE. This is Priority One FIRST STEP. Standard Prime Universe T6 Nova should favor Tactical over Engineering for Consoles & BOff Seating. C-store release.
    1A. Mirror Universe T6 Nova would, like its T5 predecessor, favor Engineering Consoles & Seating. Advanced Prototype version can debut in a Lock Box, with a Production Version to follow as either Fleet Shipyard or C-store.

    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
    As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
    Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
    Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    IN CANON, these ships were Modular, making them Versatile, readily customized for different mission profiles. Widely used by BOTH Starfleet and Civilians. It was widespread. When Starfleet retired their Oberths they were most frequently sold off to private interests. This makes it the single-best candidate for a Starfleet-style Cross-faction ship! Variants should include choices of Nova & Intrepid-style Warp Nacelles.
    First Release: Summer Event ship; Luxury Science Vessel. Favors Tactical. Background Fluff of Quark Enterprises discovering a large number of this hulls abandoned and/or forgotten in backwater merchants' yards, working with Risian Engineers & Lobi Crystal Consortium made these vessels a researcher's dream! Can slot any Risian-ship Console. Maybe slot Cannons/Dual Cannons too.
    Players can choose between R.X.S. or their faction's native prefix.
    Non-Fed Captains have all their faction's Materials as options, in addition to the Fed Materials.
    Second Release: (FED ONLY) Pegasus-class Retrofit. Favors Science & Engineering, either evenly or slightly more Engineering. Prototype Interphase Cloak - Console - Universal. C-store release.

    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    The Original Constellation & variants shown on TNG all featured PROMINENT HANGARS. The T6 Retrofit should have 1-2 Hangars, without sacrificing weapons or Device Slots.
    C-store release is most practical.
    A slight quality enhancement would be welcome as well.

    5. Assorted Enhancements
    First and Foremost, Armor Visuals. Disturbingly few armors even have the option to Enable Visuals. This is a problem, and it needs to be fixed. If a Captain wants to show their Armor, they should be able to do so easily, for any armor they have.
    Second, Personal Weapons. Many Captains have a favorite pistol/rifle/cannon/etc. that to their regret, changed appearance when the levelled up to a new Tier. Since there are Multiple Skins for each of the main ground weapons in the game, instead of forcing an arbitrary skin change on their weapons, they should be allowed to select the skin for their weapon. Simply add a NEW TAB in the TAILOR, for Armor and Weapon Visuals. Most MMOs have already implemented systems for Custom Armor & Weapons Visuals. Why STO hasn't done so, when we already had those visuals AT LAUNCH, is beyond me. This quality enhancement is as overdue as the T6 Nova. Please, someone get on this. Start a dream team to get this started. Please.

    Captains and Bridge Officers have Biographies players can tell a character's story in. Starships deserve to have Biographies too.

    Thank you to all the Devs & Designers that have made STO my #1 game and still one of the best MMOs of all the ones out there!

    Refits will get done as and when the Dev's have time to do so, as refits of current ships are usually done during someone's free time.

    As for the Science cruisers....we already have them, but a 4/4 with Sec Deflector will be a step to far. We already have 4/3 with Sec deflector and that, for my Sci main is enough.

    There's also the science version of the Bortasqu'(I don't know if there's any others that have the ship analysis toggle) being the Gorkon variant.

    Now to the rest of the topic:
    To the OP: You might want to rethink the KDF possible sci cruiser being based off the K'tinga to the Kamarag instead. I know @where2r1 would be very happy for something like that.

    I'd rather see KDF get an actual T6 carrier(in the form of a Ferasan, Karfi, or Vo'quv), and Roms also get a T6 carrier before a sci cruiser cross-faction stillborn gets birthed by Cryptic(because you know that they're going to drek the bed somehow on that).

    I agree 100% that the Nova should be at the forefront, but package it with ships from the other factions as well. It's a prime opportunity to include a T6 Ha'nom in there for example, yes? But then, what would you suggest for KDF? Or the Jem'hadar?

    Regarding the Oberth thing. That mention sounded like "Oh hey, we'll make the Oberth cross-faction, so that we can dump that **** on the other factions. Can't let them have their own stuff. KDF and Roms will LOOOOOOVE having their ships looking all Starfleet proper." That right there would go as well as having a bowel movement on the altar of some religious place of worship. Or did you not notice the ire of multiple players complaining when their rom and kdf ships wore the Fed outfit in the Battle of Binary Stars TFO?

    For the 2nd release option(with the Pegasus), nice to omit other factions. I'm seeing a request to widen the gap between what the Feds and Fed-Nots have, right there.

    For point No. 4, see previous statement. Back to drawing board for you.

    Some fair points. I agree that KDF & Rom should get their respective analogs updated and released in conjunction with the T6 Nova and Oberth. While the Romulans have the Ha'nom, the KDF's 'pure science vessels' are Gorn designs. The first true Klingon design in Science Vessel build is the Temporal one from a Lock Box. So updating the Ha'nom & Korath would be the logical choice.

    As for (limited) Faction ships being used by other factions, I will only refer to canon examples (yes there are far more examples in licensed works but those are as non-canonical as STO itself). Gul Dukat using a captured B'rel BoP for what? A whole season of DS9? Romulans capturing a Prototype Starfleet vessel in a pivotal VOY episode. And who can forget that time Ferengi used old BoPs they refurbished to try and capture the Enterprise-D? So there is a canonical basis for it.

    I will still campaign for a decent Science Cruiser.
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    sarvour0 wrote: »

    I have had ideas for a proper, full-on Science Cruiser for some time. With the introduction of the new Juggernaut type, my dream for the Science Cruiser seems a bit closer. As for already having them I disagree. The only Science Vessels with 4/3 weapons that I know of are the Crossfield and the Dyson in Tactical Mode; the latter of which is 3/3 by default. Tactical has been getting a bit of everything for a while now, so something like a Science Cruiser hybrid is overdue.

    The Karfi is a 4/3 sci ship. But knowing that would require you to step outside the Fed bubble.

    The Kar'Fi Battle Carrier is A) "Heavily based on captured Fek'Ihri ships" and as such I do not think of it as a Klingon design. B ) "Type: Carrier/Science Carrier" and "it still lags behind Klingon Battle Cruisers in maneuverability and lack of cloaking device."
    The Kar'Fi IS NOT a Science Cruiser.
    Support Vessels are only Gorn ships as you level up, and had to buy those from the c-store. Klingon designs for the Science Vessel/Support Vessel role do not appear until tiers 5 & 6, in Lock Boxes or the C-store. While I like the Gorn ships fine, I would have liked a proper Klingon design in the mix before T5.
    I have nothing against new Carriers & Carrier hybrids; I had mained a Vo'Quv for a while on my 1st KDF char. I did not include Carriers in my list because I did not feel the need, as there are a wealth of T5 & T6 Carriers in game; granted most of those are cross-faction ships.
    What I would like to see, rather than the Kar'Fi get a T6 update, is either an update to the Vo'Quv that grants it an additional Weapon Slot (and/or a Cloak). Or at least a ship that is clearly Klingon in design; not Orion or Fek'Ihri. Something between a Raptor and a Vo'Quv.
    Post edited by sarvour0 on
    4073703.jpg
    [SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards[/SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards
    =A=Commodore Joshua Daniel Sarvour, S.C.E.
    U.S.S. AKAGI NX-93347, Enterprise-class Battle Cruiser =A= U.S.S. T'KORA'S WRATH NX-110047, Odyssey-class Battle Cruiser

    "There Ain't No Grave, Can Hold My Body Down..."

    PS - I fully support a T6 Nova, fixing the Nova skins. I am also rooting for a T6 Science Cruiser, that can use Nova/Rhode Island skins.
    T6 Nova/Rhode Island, T6 Oberth & T6 Constellation are needed. Also needed a T6 Science Cruiser, that can wear any Science or Cruiser skin.
  • tom61stotom61sto Member Posts: 2,815 Arc User
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    avoozuul wrote: »
    Why did you put the Oberth third? The Oberth seems more likely than the science cruisers you said since the Oberth and the Nova were two remaining ships on a four ship poll which haven't been released in T6 form, the other two the ambassador and vorcha have already been released in T6 form since. It seems very likely that the Oberth and Nova will be next in whichever order the devs choose, but it may be after all the discovery ships are released. They will never put a secondary deflector on a cruiser since it's a science ship feature, but if they did they will likely be promo or lockbox ships.

    While I may have ordered them to my personal preference, 'my' ranking was not intended to dictate relative importance. My intent, was to convey that everything on this list was equally important and needed. In hindsight I should have perhaps taken a little extra time to relearn how to do bullet points/lists in the forum.
    leemwatson wrote: »
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    5. Assorted Enhancements

    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    Quality Overhaul of in-game models is LONG OVERDUE. This is Priority One FIRST STEP. Standard Prime Universe T6 Nova should favor Tactical over Engineering for Consoles & BOff Seating. C-store release.
    1A. Mirror Universe T6 Nova would, like its T5 predecessor, favor Engineering Consoles & Seating. Advanced Prototype version can debut in a Lock Box, with a Production Version to follow as either Fleet Shipyard or C-store.

    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
    As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
    Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
    Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    IN CANON, these ships were Modular, making them Versatile, readily customized for different mission profiles. Widely used by BOTH Starfleet and Civilians. It was widespread. When Starfleet retired their Oberths they were most frequently sold off to private interests. This makes it the single-best candidate for a Starfleet-style Cross-faction ship! Variants should include choices of Nova & Intrepid-style Warp Nacelles.
    First Release: Summer Event ship; Luxury Science Vessel. Favors Tactical. Background Fluff of Quark Enterprises discovering a large number of this hulls abandoned and/or forgotten in backwater merchants' yards, working with Risian Engineers & Lobi Crystal Consortium made these vessels a researcher's dream! Can slot any Risian-ship Console. Maybe slot Cannons/Dual Cannons too.
    Players can choose between R.X.S. or their faction's native prefix.
    Non-Fed Captains have all their faction's Materials as options, in addition to the Fed Materials.
    Second Release: (FED ONLY) Pegasus-class Retrofit. Favors Science & Engineering, either evenly or slightly more Engineering. Prototype Interphase Cloak - Console - Universal. C-store release.

    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    The Original Constellation & variants shown on TNG all featured PROMINENT HANGARS. The T6 Retrofit should have 1-2 Hangars, without sacrificing weapons or Device Slots.
    C-store release is most practical.
    A slight quality enhancement would be welcome as well.

    5. Assorted Enhancements
    First and Foremost, Armor Visuals. Disturbingly few armors even have the option to Enable Visuals. This is a problem, and it needs to be fixed. If a Captain wants to show their Armor, they should be able to do so easily, for any armor they have.
    Second, Personal Weapons. Many Captains have a favorite pistol/rifle/cannon/etc. that to their regret, changed appearance when the levelled up to a new Tier. Since there are Multiple Skins for each of the main ground weapons in the game, instead of forcing an arbitrary skin change on their weapons, they should be allowed to select the skin for their weapon. Simply add a NEW TAB in the TAILOR, for Armor and Weapon Visuals. Most MMOs have already implemented systems for Custom Armor & Weapons Visuals. Why STO hasn't done so, when we already had those visuals AT LAUNCH, is beyond me. This quality enhancement is as overdue as the T6 Nova. Please, someone get on this. Start a dream team to get this started. Please.

    Captains and Bridge Officers have Biographies players can tell a character's story in. Starships deserve to have Biographies too.

    Thank you to all the Devs & Designers that have made STO my #1 game and still one of the best MMOs of all the ones out there!

    Refits will get done as and when the Dev's have time to do so, as refits of current ships are usually done during someone's free time.

    As for the Science cruisers....we already have them, but a 4/4 with Sec Deflector will be a step to far. We already have 4/3 with Sec deflector and that, for my Sci main is enough.

    I have had ideas for a proper, full-on Science Cruiser for some time. With the introduction of the new Juggernaut type, my dream for the Science Cruiser seems a bit closer. As for already having them I disagree. The only Science Vessels with 4/3 weapons that I know of are the Crossfield and the Dyson in Tactical Mode; the latter of which is 3/3 by default. Tactical has been getting a bit of everything for a while now, so something like a Science Cruiser hybrid is overdue.

    I'm a bit surprised, given that you specifically mention Cardassian ship alternates, that you don't know about the 4/3 Damar-class Intel Science Dreadnought. It's C-Store and available to all factions, though I'd recommend going for the Cardassian 4-pack, which nets you the Cardassain Intel Escort (T6), Flight-deck cruiser (T6), and T5-U Galor (as an account unlock). Each of the T6 ships has a console that you can mount on any ship, and the T5-U Galor comes with 4x Mk XII VR Spiral Wave Disruptor the first time you claim it on a given character.

    Other 4/3 Science Dreadnoughts are the Krenim Annorax (Promotion pack chance drop), Son'a Collector (Promotion too), and the Paradox Temporal Dreadnought (Lobi Store).
  • leemwatsonleemwatson Member Posts: 2,957 Arc User
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    avoozuul wrote: »
    Why did you put the Oberth third? The Oberth seems more likely than the science cruisers you said since the Oberth and the Nova were two remaining ships on a four ship poll which haven't been released in T6 form, the other two the ambassador and vorcha have already been released in T6 form since. It seems very likely that the Oberth and Nova will be next in whichever order the devs choose, but it may be after all the discovery ships are released. They will never put a secondary deflector on a cruiser since it's a science ship feature, but if they did they will likely be promo or lockbox ships.

    While I may have ordered them to my personal preference, 'my' ranking was not intended to dictate relative importance. My intent, was to convey that everything on this list was equally important and needed. In hindsight I should have perhaps taken a little extra time to relearn how to do bullet points/lists in the forum.
    leemwatson wrote: »
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    5. Assorted Enhancements

    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    Quality Overhaul of in-game models is LONG OVERDUE. This is Priority One FIRST STEP. Standard Prime Universe T6 Nova should favor Tactical over Engineering for Consoles & BOff Seating. C-store release.
    1A. Mirror Universe T6 Nova would, like its T5 predecessor, favor Engineering Consoles & Seating. Advanced Prototype version can debut in a Lock Box, with a Production Version to follow as either Fleet Shipyard or C-store.

    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
    As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
    Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
    Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    IN CANON, these ships were Modular, making them Versatile, readily customized for different mission profiles. Widely used by BOTH Starfleet and Civilians. It was widespread. When Starfleet retired their Oberths they were most frequently sold off to private interests. This makes it the single-best candidate for a Starfleet-style Cross-faction ship! Variants should include choices of Nova & Intrepid-style Warp Nacelles.
    First Release: Summer Event ship; Luxury Science Vessel. Favors Tactical. Background Fluff of Quark Enterprises discovering a large number of this hulls abandoned and/or forgotten in backwater merchants' yards, working with Risian Engineers & Lobi Crystal Consortium made these vessels a researcher's dream! Can slot any Risian-ship Console. Maybe slot Cannons/Dual Cannons too.
    Players can choose between R.X.S. or their faction's native prefix.
    Non-Fed Captains have all their faction's Materials as options, in addition to the Fed Materials.
    Second Release: (FED ONLY) Pegasus-class Retrofit. Favors Science & Engineering, either evenly or slightly more Engineering. Prototype Interphase Cloak - Console - Universal. C-store release.

    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    The Original Constellation & variants shown on TNG all featured PROMINENT HANGARS. The T6 Retrofit should have 1-2 Hangars, without sacrificing weapons or Device Slots.
    C-store release is most practical.
    A slight quality enhancement would be welcome as well.

    5. Assorted Enhancements
    First and Foremost, Armor Visuals. Disturbingly few armors even have the option to Enable Visuals. This is a problem, and it needs to be fixed. If a Captain wants to show their Armor, they should be able to do so easily, for any armor they have.
    Second, Personal Weapons. Many Captains have a favorite pistol/rifle/cannon/etc. that to their regret, changed appearance when the levelled up to a new Tier. Since there are Multiple Skins for each of the main ground weapons in the game, instead of forcing an arbitrary skin change on their weapons, they should be allowed to select the skin for their weapon. Simply add a NEW TAB in the TAILOR, for Armor and Weapon Visuals. Most MMOs have already implemented systems for Custom Armor & Weapons Visuals. Why STO hasn't done so, when we already had those visuals AT LAUNCH, is beyond me. This quality enhancement is as overdue as the T6 Nova. Please, someone get on this. Start a dream team to get this started. Please.

    Captains and Bridge Officers have Biographies players can tell a character's story in. Starships deserve to have Biographies too.

    Thank you to all the Devs & Designers that have made STO my #1 game and still one of the best MMOs of all the ones out there!

    Refits will get done as and when the Dev's have time to do so, as refits of current ships are usually done during someone's free time.

    As for the Science cruisers....we already have them, but a 4/4 with Sec Deflector will be a step to far. We already have 4/3 with Sec deflector and that, for my Sci main is enough.

    I have had ideas for a proper, full-on Science Cruiser for some time. With the introduction of the new Juggernaut type, my dream for the Science Cruiser seems a bit closer. As for already having them I disagree. The only Science Vessels with 4/3 weapons that I know of are the Crossfield and the Dyson in Tactical Mode; the latter of which is 3/3 by default. Tactical has been getting a bit of everything for a while now, so something like a Science Cruiser hybrid is overdue.

    The Paradox AND the Cardi Intel Sci Dread are 4/3 Science ships and they have a Hangar, which equivilates a 4/4 Cruiser.
    "You don't want to patrol!? You don't want to escort!? You don't want to defend the Federation's Starbases!? Then why are you flying my Starships!? If you were a Klingon you'd be killed on the spot, but lucky for you.....you WERE in Starfleet. Let's see how New Zealand Penal Colony suits you." Adm A. Necheyev.
  • avoozuulavoozuul Member Posts: 2,074 Arc User
    edited December 2018
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    I agree 100% that the Nova should be at the forefront
    Well since the Oberth has been stuck at T1 for the longest time ever and how the Nova at least got a T2 and Fleet T5/U I am inclined to disagree. But these are just our opinions.

  • sarvour0sarvour0 Member Posts: 377 Arc User
    edited December 2018
    I am aware of the Science Dreadnoughts, which are close to the Science Cruisers I am proposing, but not the same thing.
    I fully intend to get the Delta mega bundle that includes the Cardassian ships. And when I can save up enough EC or am blessed with a fortuitous R&D Promo pack draw, get the Krenim Annorax Science Dreadnought, a ship I was actively campaigning for in the forums. Ironically it was brought into the game during my forced hiatus, but the fact remains a ship I was championing, and demanding and arguing for in the forums, is now in the game!

    So I will keep on pushing for the changes & additions I want, and supporting other good ideas.
    And yes, I should have included KDF Battlecruisers & whichever Warbird is most analogous to the Heavy Cruisers. I am sorry I do not know my warbirds as well as the hardcore Romulan players do, despite my sizeable number of Rom Republic characters. So I will look into it to revise & expand that part of this manifesto, and I welcome suggestions on which Warbird(s) Rom players think is the better Warbird Cruiser. A Rom D6/D7 is tempting but i'll give it some thought, especially since those are on-screen canon ships, not in the game yet. On the Klingon side I would like a T6 that can wear D7, K't'inga & Kamarag skins.
    4073703.jpg
    [SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards[/SIGPIC]Sarvour Shipyards
    =A=Commodore Joshua Daniel Sarvour, S.C.E.
    U.S.S. AKAGI NX-93347, Enterprise-class Battle Cruiser =A= U.S.S. T'KORA'S WRATH NX-110047, Odyssey-class Battle Cruiser

    "There Ain't No Grave, Can Hold My Body Down..."

    PS - I fully support a T6 Nova, fixing the Nova skins. I am also rooting for a T6 Science Cruiser, that can use Nova/Rhode Island skins.
    T6 Nova/Rhode Island, T6 Oberth & T6 Constellation are needed. Also needed a T6 Science Cruiser, that can wear any Science or Cruiser skin.
  • tom61stotom61sto Member Posts: 2,815 Arc User
    I suppose that since Dual Commander BOff ships are a thing now (see Jem'Hadar Light Battlecruiser,) they could come out with a ship that has a Science Commander and a Engineering Commander, which should qualify it as both a Science ship and a Engineering ship and get the features of both, though they usually knock down a Cruiser Command aura or two as a 'compromise'. I don't think that Sci + Eng Commanders would be very popular, compared to Tactical or Universal, unless at least one was an in-demand Hybrid (like Miracle Worker, granting an extra console slot for being Commander). Or they could ignore the rules set by them, which yields things like the Enterprise-J having full set of Cruiser Commands and two hangars.
  • ichaerus1ichaerus1 Member Posts: 703 Arc User
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    leemwatson wrote: »
    sarvour0 wrote: »
    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    5. Assorted Enhancements

    1. Nova/Rhode Island Refits & Retrofits
    Quality Overhaul of in-game models is LONG OVERDUE. This is Priority One FIRST STEP. Standard Prime Universe T6 Nova should favor Tactical over Engineering for Consoles & BOff Seating. C-store release.
    1A. Mirror Universe T6 Nova would, like its T5 predecessor, favor Engineering Consoles & Seating. Advanced Prototype version can debut in a Lock Box, with a Production Version to follow as either Fleet Shipyard or C-store.

    2. Science Cruisers (Fed & KDF, with Cardassian & Romulan to follow)
    This is a dedicated Cruiser, with all the inherent abilities of Cruisers & Science Vessels. 4/4 Weapons, a Secondary Deflector, 4 Device Slots.
    As these are based on Advanced Refits of various Cruisers and Science Vessels, they should have access TO ALL SKINS of Cruisers & Science Vessels a Character already has access to (even if it's exotic; IF a Character has an APU Cruiser or a Galor, they can use that skin on their Science Cruiser).
    Innate bonus to R&D Projects & Crafting.
    Fed Version based on T2 Cruisers, KDF based on K't'inga, Cardassian version based on Galor, RRF based on the Dhelan Warbird.

    3. Oberth Refits & Retrofits
    IN CANON, these ships were Modular, making them Versatile, readily customized for different mission profiles. Widely used by BOTH Starfleet and Civilians. It was widespread. When Starfleet retired their Oberths they were most frequently sold off to private interests. This makes it the single-best candidate for a Starfleet-style Cross-faction ship! Variants should include choices of Nova & Intrepid-style Warp Nacelles.
    First Release: Summer Event ship; Luxury Science Vessel. Favors Tactical. Background Fluff of Quark Enterprises discovering a large number of this hulls abandoned and/or forgotten in backwater merchants' yards, working with Risian Engineers & Lobi Crystal Consortium made these vessels a researcher's dream! Can slot any Risian-ship Console. Maybe slot Cannons/Dual Cannons too.
    Players can choose between R.X.S. or their faction's native prefix.
    Non-Fed Captains have all their faction's Materials as options, in addition to the Fed Materials.
    Second Release: (FED ONLY) Pegasus-class Retrofit. Favors Science & Engineering, either evenly or slightly more Engineering. Prototype Interphase Cloak - Console - Universal. C-store release.

    4. Constellation/Stargazer/Cheyenne/Dakota
    The Original Constellation & variants shown on TNG all featured PROMINENT HANGARS. The T6 Retrofit should have 1-2 Hangars, without sacrificing weapons or Device Slots.
    C-store release is most practical.
    A slight quality enhancement would be welcome as well.

    5. Assorted Enhancements
    First and Foremost, Armor Visuals. Disturbingly few armors even have the option to Enable Visuals. This is a problem, and it needs to be fixed. If a Captain wants to show their Armor, they should be able to do so easily, for any armor they have.
    Second, Personal Weapons. Many Captains have a favorite pistol/rifle/cannon/etc. that to their regret, changed appearance when the levelled up to a new Tier. Since there are Multiple Skins for each of the main ground weapons in the game, instead of forcing an arbitrary skin change on their weapons, they should be allowed to select the skin for their weapon. Simply add a NEW TAB in the TAILOR, for Armor and Weapon Visuals. Most MMOs have already implemented systems for Custom Armor & Weapons Visuals. Why STO hasn't done so, when we already had those visuals AT LAUNCH, is beyond me. This quality enhancement is as overdue as the T6 Nova. Please, someone get on this. Start a dream team to get this started. Please.

    Captains and Bridge Officers have Biographies players can tell a character's story in. Starships deserve to have Biographies too.

    Thank you to all the Devs & Designers that have made STO my #1 game and still one of the best MMOs of all the ones out there!

    Refits will get done as and when the Dev's have time to do so, as refits of current ships are usually done during someone's free time.

    As for the Science cruisers....we already have them, but a 4/4 with Sec Deflector will be a step to far. We already have 4/3 with Sec deflector and that, for my Sci main is enough.

    There's also the science version of the Bortasqu'(I don't know if there's any others that have the ship analysis toggle) being the Gorkon variant.

    Now to the rest of the topic:
    To the OP: You might want to rethink the KDF possible sci cruiser being based off the K'tinga to the Kamarag instead. I know @where2r1 would be very happy for something like that.

    I'd rather see KDF get an actual T6 carrier(in the form of a Ferasan, Karfi, or Vo'quv), and Roms also get a T6 carrier before a sci cruiser cross-faction stillborn gets birthed by Cryptic(because you know that they're going to drek the bed somehow on that).

    I agree 100% that the Nova should be at the forefront, but package it with ships from the other factions as well. It's a prime opportunity to include a T6 Ha'nom in there for example, yes? But then, what would you suggest for KDF? Or the Jem'hadar?

    Regarding the Oberth thing. That mention sounded like "Oh hey, we'll make the Oberth cross-faction, so that we can dump that **** on the other factions. Can't let them have their own stuff. KDF and Roms will LOOOOOOVE having their ships looking all Starfleet proper." That right there would go as well as having a bowel movement on the altar of some religious place of worship. Or did you not notice the ire of multiple players complaining when their rom and kdf ships wore the Fed outfit in the Battle of Binary Stars TFO?

    For the 2nd release option(with the Pegasus), nice to omit other factions. I'm seeing a request to widen the gap between what the Feds and Fed-Nots have, right there.

    For point No. 4, see previous statement. Back to drawing board for you.

    Some fair points. I agree that KDF & Rom should get their respective analogs updated and released in conjunction with the T6 Nova and Oberth. While the Romulans have the Ha'nom, the KDF's 'pure science vessels' are Gorn designs. The first true Klingon design in Science Vessel build is the Temporal one from a Lock Box. So updating the Ha'nom & Korath would be the logical choice.

    As for (limited) Faction ships being used by other factions, I will only refer to canon examples (yes there are far more examples in licensed works but those are as non-canonical as STO itself). Gul Dukat using a captured B'rel BoP for what? A whole season of DS9? Romulans capturing a Prototype Starfleet vessel in a pivotal VOY episode. And who can forget that time Ferengi used old BoPs they refurbished to try and capture the Enterprise-D? So there is a canonical basis for it.

    I will still campaign for a decent Science Cruiser.
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    sarvour0 wrote: »

    I have had ideas for a proper, full-on Science Cruiser for some time. With the introduction of the new Juggernaut type, my dream for the Science Cruiser seems a bit closer. As for already having them I disagree. The only Science Vessels with 4/3 weapons that I know of are the Crossfield and the Dyson in Tactical Mode; the latter of which is 3/3 by default. Tactical has been getting a bit of everything for a while now, so something like a Science Cruiser hybrid is overdue.

    The Karfi is a 4/3 sci ship. But knowing that would require you to step outside the Fed bubble.

    The Kar'Fi Battle Carrier is A) "Heavily based on captured Fek'Ihri ships" and as such I do not think of it as a Klingon design. B ) "Type: Carrier/Science Carrier" and "it still lags behind Klingon Battle Cruisers in maneuverability and lack of cloaking device."
    The Kar'Fi IS NOT a Science Cruiser.

    Support Vessels are only Gorn ships as you level up, and had to buy those from the c-store. Klingon designs for the Science Vessel/Support Vessel role do not appear until tiers 5 & 6, in Lock Boxes or the C-store. While I like the Gorn ships fine, I would have liked a proper Klingon design in the mix before T5.
    I have nothing against new Carriers & Carrier hybrids; I had mained a Vo'Quv for a while on my 1st KDF char. I did not include Carriers in my list because I did not feel the need, as there are a wealth of T5 & T6 Carriers in game; granted most of those are cross-faction ships.
    What I would like to see, rather than the Kar'Fi get a T6 update, is either and update to the Vo'Quv that grants it an additional Weapon Slot (and/or a Cloak). Or at least a ship that is clearly Klingon in design; not Orion or Fek'Ihri. Something between a Raptor and a Vo'Quv.

    Now you're backpedaling. You lamented not knowing of more than two SCIENCE VESSELS that were 4/3, and one was identified in the Kar'Fi, which counts. Nowhere did I say that the Kar'Fi was a science cruiser. Nothing was said about it having to be a science cruiser, science dreadnought, or science battlecruiser. Then you decided to move the goalposts by whipping out the "canon" or "Klingon design" caveat. Along with science cruiser/battlecruiser requirement. The only science cruiser I specified, was the Gorkon variant of the Bortasqu' battlecruiser. Because it is a 4/4, comes with sensor analysis, an LTC sci seat, and 3 cruiser auras. Cloaking device, dual cannon mounting capability. There you go. And you can unlock it for your account.

    The reason why the sci ships are Gorn, is because the KDF taps into various races to handle what they don't really delve into. Just like how the Orions have the majority of the space peanut FDCs, or the Nausicaans have destroyers.

    Also, not counting the T5/T6 cross-faction Carriers, how many KDF faction specific carriers can you name, that the KDF gets access to? Not counting dreadnoughts, or flight-deck cruisers? The Kar'Fi and Vo'quv, along with the Mirror Vo'quv, the Fleet Vo'quv, Fleet Kar'Fi, right? Each one is a science ship.

    What reason would the Vo'quv(The IKS Get Out and Push, for how slow and cumbersome it is) have, to deserve an additional weapon slot? It's got worse turnrate and inertia than the Kar'Fi. Which means unless you are feeling like loading abilities such as Emergency Power to Engines and Aux2ID/Attack Pattern Omega 1, on top of Pilot specialization for your captain, it's going to take forever for you to waddle to a fight to catch up w/ your pets. Like the Kar'Fi, it doesn't have a cloak.

    Have you taken a peek at the Ytijara yet?

    Just to let you know, the Karfi has a base move of 8. The Gorkon has a base move of 6.5, as a battlecruiser. Do you even know what really makes a ship a battlecruiser?

    Increased Warp Core power, 3 device slots, only 3 cruiser auras instead of 4, ability to mount dual cannons and dual heavy cannons. And they're supposed to be big.

    Back to the drawing board for you. And to study and do homework.
  • rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 46,497 Arc User
    A Science Cruiser as proposed would be OP as all hell. There would be no point in flying anything else unless you want to limit yourself or like escorts. Not only that... they're not going to release a T6 variant of the T2 cruiser in the C-Store. They're already making loads of money off the Temporal Connie, which has access to the T2 Cruiser parts. A C-Store version would probably cut into that, and make less money. From a business standpoint that is bad. From a license standpoint, odds are CBS is still telling Cryptic "No C-Store variant". We used to have all kinds of threads asking for an endgame connie. To the point it went into the FCT. Finally we got the Kelvin Connie, and after that the Temporal. Both are Connies, Both are endgame, but they are NOT C-Store.

    I don't agree with making an Oberth variant a cross faction design either. Especially with turning around and giving Feds a C-Store T6 right after that. It would feel like a slap in the face for KDF side to not only get a Fed design, but get snubbed by Feds getting a C-Store one that is superior.

    The Constellation is smaller than a Galaxy. If it was to get any hanger slots... it would only get one. She'd basically be a Pocket Carrier, aka Flight Deck Cruiser. Not a full Carrier.

    I don't understand the idea of armor visuals on ships. We get that already with shield visuals. So armor visuals are redundant. Which would have priority? The Armor or the Shield? If you're referring to ground armor... check the Tailor. ALL the old armor and kit visual parts were put in there. For the armor, check the tight categories. And the weapons... it is a means of determining what mark level the weapon is. Besides there are all kinds of weapons available now that don't have all the extra bits, like the Assault Phaser Pistol (ST5/6 pistol). Want to get your TNG on? There's an actual TNG rifle available in Beyond the Nexus.
    66998372863950ee98cf7da9786e2ea9-db80k0m.png
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out a Delta Pack, Temporal Pack, and Gamma Pack
    The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
  • crm14916crm14916 Member Posts: 1,078 Arc User
    Hey, no one mentioned a T6 Vulcan ship... ;)
    sto-sig-pic.png
  • rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 46,497 Arc User
    crm14916 wrote: »
    Hey, no one mentioned a T6 Vulcan ship... ;)

    You just did. :p
    66998372863950ee98cf7da9786e2ea9-db80k0m.png
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out a Delta Pack, Temporal Pack, and Gamma Pack
    The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
  • patrickngopatrickngo Member Posts: 9,727 Arc User
    reyan01 wrote: »
    Should come as no surprise that I am going to addess the one closest to my heart - the T6 Nova.

    Whilst agree with point 1, I'm not so sure about 1a. The trouble with lock box ships is that, since lock boxes are a cash-cow, they get priority, hence the Mirror Engle class appearing before the Prime one.

    I would, personally, prefer to the Prime Nova to appear before a mirror lock box version.+-

    I think most of us would agree on a Tier Six Nova, even a few diehards on KDF side. as the only faction with standalone releases, I'd go so far as to suggest it shouldn't be bundled with anything else.

    But then, that wouldn't necessarily be popular. Then again, my own ideas most certainly would not be popular. a Bird of Prey that isn't a B'rel retread but instead, an update of the Haj/Hegh'ta with a console that grants sensor analysis and a layout of 3/4/4 (3 engineering consoles, 4 sci, 4 tac) and a Norgh-style seating arrangement and i'd be fine (my needs are simple.)

    KDF: Not supported by Cryptic, because according to them, we're not 'Real' Star Trek fans.

    Well, TRIBBLE them, I'll play KDF anyway.

    "We are the Federation. Resistance is futile, we will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own."-Cryptic Studios

    Advocacy
    simple logic process:

    The body is filled with so much blood...It's always more than you think!! -Dr. Dinosaur

  • startrekronstartrekron Member Posts: 201 Arc User
    edited December 2018
    I wouldn't hold my breathe for anything on your list since Cryptic won't be working on anything but ST:D content for at least the next 6 months.


    "Live Long and Prosper but always carry a fully charged phaser, just in case!". Arrr'ow

    Co-Leader of Serenity's Grasp
  • spiritbornspiritborn Member Posts: 1,216 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »
    A Science Cruiser as proposed would be OP as all hell.
    Isn't the "science cruiser" essentially a ship with all the strong points of both a cruiser and a science ships with none of the weaknesses of either type?

    Cryptic devs explained in the ten forward stream that they have sort of "stat budget" when designing ships and if a ship is really powerful in someway it most be weak in other ways to compensate, so that there's never a "one ship to rule them all" that would be the only real choice.

  • ichaerus1ichaerus1 Member Posts: 703 Arc User
    spiritborn wrote: »
    rattler2 wrote: »
    A Science Cruiser as proposed would be OP as all hell.
    Isn't the "science cruiser" essentially a ship with all the strong points of both a cruiser and a science ships with none of the weaknesses of either type?

    Cryptic devs explained in the ten forward stream that they have sort of "stat budget" when designing ships and if a ship is really powerful in someway it most be weak in other ways to compensate, so that there's never a "one ship to rule them all" that would be the only real choice.

    *looks at the recent ships that have come out* Their "stat budget" must've gotten a stimulus pork barrel package recently, with the Juggernaut coming, and some of the MW ships, for example. But then again, when was the last time we had a modicum of "balance" in the game? The first week or so of...Season 13?
  • patrickngopatrickngo Member Posts: 9,727 Arc User
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    spiritborn wrote: »
    rattler2 wrote: »
    A Science Cruiser as proposed would be OP as all hell.
    Isn't the "science cruiser" essentially a ship with all the strong points of both a cruiser and a science ships with none of the weaknesses of either type?

    Cryptic devs explained in the ten forward stream that they have sort of "stat budget" when designing ships and if a ship is really powerful in someway it most be weak in other ways to compensate, so that there's never a "one ship to rule them all" that would be the only real choice.

    *looks at the recent ships that have come out* Their "stat budget" must've gotten a stimulus pork barrel package recently, with the Juggernaut coming, and some of the MW ships, for example. But then again, when was the last time we had a modicum of "balance" in the game? The first week or so of...Season 13?

    two weeks. It took them two weeks to roll that back.
    KDF: Not supported by Cryptic, because according to them, we're not 'Real' Star Trek fans.

    Well, TRIBBLE them, I'll play KDF anyway.

    "We are the Federation. Resistance is futile, we will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own."-Cryptic Studios

    Advocacy
    simple logic process:

    The body is filled with so much blood...It's always more than you think!! -Dr. Dinosaur

  • ichaerus1ichaerus1 Member Posts: 703 Arc User
    patrickngo wrote: »
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    spiritborn wrote: »
    rattler2 wrote: »
    A Science Cruiser as proposed would be OP as all hell.
    Isn't the "science cruiser" essentially a ship with all the strong points of both a cruiser and a science ships with none of the weaknesses of either type?

    Cryptic devs explained in the ten forward stream that they have sort of "stat budget" when designing ships and if a ship is really powerful in someway it most be weak in other ways to compensate, so that there's never a "one ship to rule them all" that would be the only real choice.

    *looks at the recent ships that have come out* Their "stat budget" must've gotten a stimulus pork barrel package recently, with the Juggernaut coming, and some of the MW ships, for example. But then again, when was the last time we had a modicum of "balance" in the game? The first week or so of...Season 13?

    two weeks. It took them two weeks to roll that back.

    Just like how long it took for them to stuff the competitive marks option into newer STFs and RAs, right?
  • patrickngopatrickngo Member Posts: 9,727 Arc User
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    patrickngo wrote: »
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    spiritborn wrote: »
    rattler2 wrote: »
    A Science Cruiser as proposed would be OP as all hell.
    Isn't the "science cruiser" essentially a ship with all the strong points of both a cruiser and a science ships with none of the weaknesses of either type?

    Cryptic devs explained in the ten forward stream that they have sort of "stat budget" when designing ships and if a ship is really powerful in someway it most be weak in other ways to compensate, so that there's never a "one ship to rule them all" that would be the only real choice.

    *looks at the recent ships that have come out* Their "stat budget" must've gotten a stimulus pork barrel package recently, with the Juggernaut coming, and some of the MW ships, for example. But then again, when was the last time we had a modicum of "balance" in the game? The first week or so of...Season 13?

    two weeks. It took them two weeks to roll that back.

    Just like how long it took for them to stuff the competitive marks option into newer STFs and RAs, right?

    mmm, pretty close, it was actually three weeks for that-beginning with the rushed-out Mirror event (where they put competitive marks on first with the RA's. it was three months until they were releasing Comp. marks with the next STF.)

    the rollback wasn't uniformly executed, either; They kept the limit on Immunities until after they'd sold the requisite number of Miracle Worker ships with the MW spec that basically replaced the loss of stacked immunities, then quietly rolled that part back too just a few months before AoD released. It's a great case-study of card-game marketing as a replacement for game balancing, where a balance pass is set up to be undone by the next release as a means of guaranteeing sales. While the dev who did the legwork might've been sincere, in the case of Season 13, people who actually have the power to make decisions only allowed it to facilitate sales of the next iteration of powercreep.

    The season 13 "balance pass" was never, in other words, serious. It was always just cosmetic, as have been the OTHER 'balance passes' done historically by Cryptic. this probably contributed to the departure of developers who actually understand games balancing like AdjudicatorHawk.

    So yeah, the 'Stat budget' thing? it's not a real thing, it may have been back in 2010, but it isn't now.




    KDF: Not supported by Cryptic, because according to them, we're not 'Real' Star Trek fans.

    Well, TRIBBLE them, I'll play KDF anyway.

    "We are the Federation. Resistance is futile, we will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own."-Cryptic Studios

    Advocacy
    simple logic process:

    The body is filled with so much blood...It's always more than you think!! -Dr. Dinosaur

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