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Does mod16 do anything about the RQ bot infestation?

utookmynickutookmynick Posts: 152Member Arc User
edited March 16 in General Discussion (PC)
The leveling RQ is just filled with them now.

Comments

  • namelesshero347namelesshero347 Posts: 1,962Member Arc User
    You sure they are bots? I have found myself solo carrying four lowbies in MotH and DL most days now. My guess is people are running their invoke/trash alts through RLQ to extract the bonus RAD while it is easy to do. Come mod 16 with the level scaling, you won't be able to speed run any RQ and even RLQ will be more of a chore.
  • mentinmindmakermentinmindmaker Posts: 848Member Arc User
    And anyways, yes it will be harder to be a bot in RLQ with mod 16.

    With scaling it will be much more noticeable if anyone is not doing their job properly, and bots are not really known for being good players. So it will be easier to see and catch the bots, and that should lead to more kicks.
  • motu999#9953 motu999 Posts: 104Member Arc User
    Bots mostly in RLQ (leveling queue), seems to be much more frequent now.

    In RIQ (intermediate queue) almost every second instance has people queuing with multiple accounts 2-3, but only playing one toon at a given time (all others sitting at the rez circle or occasionally moved to make it more difficult to spot the multiple accounts). Very annoying.

    Bots in RLQ are rather easy to identify, because they tend to move in the same way. I quit when I see them (taking the leaver penalty, because you cannot be 100% sure if they are just maybe on a 1% chance legit).

    Multiple accounts, there is not much you can do. Not even sure if it is a violation of the ToS. Its a rather efficient form of leeching (let others do the work, only action is to reap the rewards), but leeching can be done with a single account as well. One could report the 1-3 leechers, but its a hassle because the game does not help you in any way. Takes ~5 min for a report. Furthermore, even multiple reports do not seem to have any effect. Some leechers / double-triple accounts are already so familiar, you see the name(s) and just shrug it off.

    Might become better in MOD 16, if all 5 players are actually required to beat the instance. Likely that leeching as tank or healer will not work, but dps probably will still be "good" leechers.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Posts: 6,338Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User


    Multiple accounts, there is not much you can do. Not even sure if it is a violation of the ToS. Its a rather efficient form of leeching (let others do the work, only action is to reap the rewards), but leeching can be done with a single account as well. One could report the 1-3 leechers, but its a hassle because the game does not help you in any way. Takes ~5 min for a report. Furthermore, even multiple reports do not seem to have any effect. Some leechers / double-triple accounts are already so familiar, you see the name(s) and just shrug it off.

    Multiple account may not be but what you described is multi-boxing which is a violation.
  • motu999#9953 motu999 Posts: 104Member Arc User


    what you described is multi-boxing which is a violation.

    Mmh, I always thought a multiboxer uses software (in violation of the ToS), so that all toons move simultaneously in the same way, attacking at the same time.

    What I often see in RIQ is 3 toons, only one moving at a given time, the other two standing still doing nothing. Obviously there is only a single guy that controls them and he is not using software, at least as far as I can tell (otherwise all toons would at least do something). Not sure, however, what multiboxing actually is or how it works in detail.

    What happens in RIQ, I would call "dual or triple leeching", because only one character is actually played, with two others sitting in the same instance doing nothing (except, at the very end, opening the chest, one toon at a time). The leecher reaps triple rewards, but only contributes to the effort like a single player. The two characters doing nothing could also be two "solo" leechers, that just happened to the thrown into the same instance by chance. But if you always see the same three (and they have similar character-names/handles or are in the same guild), it is quite likely a single player queuing with multiple accounts into the instance.

    In any case, leeching (solo, dual, triple, whatever) seems an "unfair advantage", because the leech does not contribute anything to the party effort, and all other players must work harder.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Posts: 6,338Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User


    what you described is multi-boxing which is a violation.

    Mmh, I always thought a multiboxer uses software (in violation of the ToS), so that all toons move simultaneously in the same way, attacking at the same time.

    What I often see in RIQ is 3 toons, only one moving at a given time, the other two standing still doing nothing. Obviously there is only a single guy that controls them and he is not using software, at least as far as I can tell (otherwise all toons would at least do something). Not sure, however, what multiboxing actually is or how it works in detail.

    What happens in RIQ, I would call "dual or triple leeching", because only one character is actually played, with two others sitting in the same instance doing nothing (except, at the very end, opening the chest, one toon at a time). The leecher reaps triple rewards, but only contributes to the effort like a single player. The two characters doing nothing could also be two "solo" leechers, that just happened to the thrown into the same instance by chance. But if you always see the same three (and they have similar character-names/handles or are in the same guild), it is quite likely a single player queuing with multiple accounts into the instance.

    In any case, leeching (solo, dual, triple, whatever) seems an "unfair advantage", because the leech does not contribute anything to the party effort, and all other players must work harder.
    From wiki,

    Multiboxing refers to playing as multiple separate characters concurrently in an MMORPG. This can either be achieved by using multiple separate machines to run the game or by running multiple separate instances of the game. Multiboxing might be considered a form of cheating.
  • utookmynickutookmynick Posts: 152Member Arc User
    edited March 17

    You sure they are bots?

    Their movements and patterns are unmistakable, especially when they are of the same class. Seeing one following another exactly just a step behind and executing the exact same encounters a fraction of a second after. If you wanted to illustrate ghosting on a monitor in an exaggerated way, show someone this.

  • greywyndgreywynd Posts: 4,091Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    Sounds like multiboxing.
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  • sandukutupusandukutupu Posts: 1,232Member Arc User
    Bots in dungeons normally get stuck walking into walls. They will stop at campfires for no reason and continue after a moment. Bots don't fight often, they just follow the party. Bots never talk to you.

    My solution to kick bots to the curb is pretty simple and I have suggested it before. The game should ask a simple question only a human understands when the player is a suspected botter. An example would be; If you are human what is the 4th word in this sentence? This could be displayed as a graphic image so a bot cannot read it. Random questions posted before the player joins the que would identify possible bots. Then you allow the bot to join a bot filled dungeon without rewards. That means the bot could carry out their task for many hours and the botter get nothing.
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  • greywyndgreywynd Posts: 4,091Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    Except all that would do is lead to a bit more monitoring of the bots beyond loading them up.
    Better to be a white knight than a knight with no honor.

    With your shield or on it.
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Posts: 3,341Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    Mod 16 is going to.bring more bots..
    We get a new mount bonus that gives raw ad.. good luck
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  • kharkov58kharkov58 Posts: 218Member Arc User
    We already have a mount bonus that gives RAD. It is not new to mod 16.
  • sandukutupusandukutupu Posts: 1,232Member Arc User
    greywynd said:

    Except all that would do is lead to a bit more monitoring of the bots beyond loading them up.

    The idea behind running a bot, is not to be there. The botter is off at school or work. In this example, the botter runs the game and starts his bot. After a run or two, the bot is hit up with a question but cannot read it. The message times out the bot is sent to the bot prison that appears to be the dungeon but is not. The difference is all players within that dungeon are not players but captured bots. At the end of the fake dungeon no rewards are received. A real player at the keyboard would spot the message and respond, even if they didn't, they would realize they were sent to a prison for bots and exit. What would be the point of monitoring your bot or even botting without rewards? Are they actually going to sit there and watch the bot play all day? Personally once caught botting, I would have a zero tolerance policy. Perma-ban from the game, fines, and ISP instructed by law to apply appropriate penalties where applicable.

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  • greywyndgreywynd Posts: 4,091Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    Wouldn't bother me any. If I'm in a game, I'm sitting here.
    Better to be a white knight than a knight with no honor.

    With your shield or on it.
  • motu999#9953 motu999 Posts: 104Member Arc User
    The problem of bots is mostly in RLQ.

    In RIQ its players queuing with multiple accounts, only player playing one character (out of 2, 3 or more) at a given time, but cycling through them if necessary or faster. For instance, these players often skip cutscenes, which quite obviously requires them to cycle through all of their accounts and hit esc/space.

    These players are rather obviously behind the keyboard for all or most of the instance, and are very well capable to answer any question(s) for the three accounts they are controlling. Although I find the idea of a check-for-human question at the beginning AND end of an instance a good idea, it will only kill the fully automated bots. I would rather have an easy report function that allows us to report "suspected botter" and "leecher", via a right-click on the character portrait or a menu-item on the F=inspect key.
  • bigman99#8273 bigman99 Posts: 223Member Arc User
    Its a problem in RAQ as well. People(might be bots) que and re-que for RAQ until they get an Edemo or SVA that they cant be kicked from or just sit at the beginning of the 5-man instance until they can be kicked, 15 minutes.
  • motu999#9953 motu999 Posts: 104Member Arc User
    It is sometimes really difficult to tell, what the reason is why a couple of players do not contribute at all to the work:
    - it could be one or more real players afk, or twiddling their thumbs enjoying to see others work for them,
    - it could be a multiboxer without software, queuing with 2-3 accounts into the instance, doing nothing at all or playing one character at a time,
    - it could be simple bot, programmed to queue into the instance and then wait until the instance finishes (through the efforts of the real players in that instance), getting the "automatic rewards"

    Another problem is, that it is not entirely clear, what is a violation of the ToS and what not. Multiboxing is not explicitly mentioned in the ToS, or is it? An "unfair advantage" is mentioned, but is already afk'ing to pee or to answer the phone or doorbell an "unfair advantage".

    Furthermore, kicking often does not work, because when a player (or bots) queue into a dungeon with multiple accounts, the multiple accounts / bots obviously protect each other, voting down every kick-vote.

    If you are not sure if a certain behavior is a violation, or if you are unsure if it is botting/multiboxing or just multiple players afk'ing at the same time, you are unsure if you should report them at all, because you could also be banned for "false reports".

    So what I would really like to see from Cryptic is a clear statement, which behavior is allowed and which not.
    Furthermore, there should be an easy reporting function, that lists the types of not acceptable behavior.
    Finally, we should be allowed to kick afk players after less than five minutes (I suggest two) and there should be some mechanism that avoids multiple accounts queuing into an instance to "protect" themselves by voting down the kick-votes.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Posts: 6,338Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User

    It is sometimes really difficult to tell, what the reason is why a couple of players do not contribute at all to the work:
    - it could be one or more real players afk, or twiddling their thumbs enjoying to see others work for them,
    - it could be a multiboxer without software, queuing with 2-3 accounts into the instance, doing nothing at all or playing one character at a time,
    - it could be simple bot, programmed to queue into the instance and then wait until the instance finishes (through the efforts of the real players in that instance), getting the "automatic rewards"

    Another problem is, that it is not entirely clear, what is a violation of the ToS and what not. Multiboxing is not explicitly mentioned in the ToS, or is it? An "unfair advantage" is mentioned, but is already afk'ing to pee or to answer the phone or doorbell an "unfair advantage".

    Furthermore, kicking often does not work, because when a player (or bots) queue into a dungeon with multiple accounts, the multiple accounts / bots obviously protect each other, voting down every kick-vote.

    If you are not sure if a certain behavior is a violation, or if you are unsure if it is botting/multiboxing or just multiple players afk'ing at the same time, you are unsure if you should report them at all, because you could also be banned for "false reports".

    So what I would really like to see from Cryptic is a clear statement, which behavior is allowed and which not.
    Furthermore, there should be an easy reporting function, that lists the types of not acceptable behavior.
    Finally, we should be allowed to kick afk players after less than five minutes (I suggest two) and there should be some mechanism that avoids multiple accounts queuing into an instance to "protect" themselves by voting down the kick-votes.

    I guess they changed the ToS because last time I checked, multi-boxing and unauthorized 3rd party program were clearly mentioned in their ToS.

    I guess all these are now under the general umbrella of:
    15.2.k cheat or utilize unauthorized exploits in connection with the Games or the Service;
  • cdnbisoncdnbison Posts: 776Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User

    You sure they are bots? I have found myself solo carrying four lowbies in MotH and DL most days now. My guess is people are running their invoke/trash alts through RLQ to extract the bonus RAD while it is easy to do. Come mod 16 with the level scaling, you won't be able to speed run any RQ and even RLQ will be more of a chore.

    Seeing a player act odd once is iffy. In the last couple days, though, I've encountered what are likely bots in both ndemo and Artificer's Workshop. The ndemo toon stood off the platform, then wandered off and ran into a corner before things started - and did this both times I was in a queue with them.

    The Artificer's Workshop bot got outed when the circle under the Beholder Tank appeared off-centre, and they were outside of it. I ended up in the same instance as them later that night, and wouldn't you know it - they went to the same spot under the Tank, and took the same weird route to the final chest, including a weird 90-degree turn.


  • greywyndgreywynd Posts: 4,091Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    That's why I tend to do those private.

    Ran Malabog's Castle the other day. OP came in, stood around the campfire. Bypassed all the towers when he finally decided to move and ran straight for the gate. And stood there.

    We did get him to talk. "Come on, man. This is easy content." Good thing he was only our healer and not anyone important. Jackass.
    Better to be a white knight than a knight with no honor.

    With your shield or on it.
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Posts: 3,341Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    > @greywynd said:
    > That's why I tend to do those private.
    >
    > Ran Malabog's Castle the other day. OP came in, stood around the campfire. Bypassed all the towers when he finally decided to move and ran straight for the gate. And stood there.
    >
    > We did get him to talk. "Come on, man. This is easy content." Good thing he was only our healer and not anyone important. Jackass.

    Now imagine mod 16 and needing a real healer not a bot
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  • marvyn#9793 marvyn Posts: 15Member Arc User
    Have encountered the 'bots' in RLQs - most frequently seems to occur in Master of the Hunt or Dread Legion. You can usually identify them as they all move in a very robotic type way, following each other around, and seem to be limited to using At Wills. It's slightly irritating, but hasn't bothered me too much.

    But I've now started encountering AFK players in Demogorgon in the RIQ queue. Players entering the instance, standing on the start circle and then not moving for the entire duration of the run. This just makes the whole thing take longer for everyone else.

    In the last run I did, there were 3 players that didn't move from the start circle at all. But they were all active at once over the chests as soon as the run was complete. I reported them in-game.

    I think something needs to be done about this. Players shouldn't be able to just idle through content collecting AD through other people's efforts. And this isn't a complatint about players not playing well, or being undergeared. I'm talking about players that just don't play at all, but want to collect the rewards.
  • cherryman1cherryman1 Posts: 303Member Arc User
    cdnbison said:

    You sure they are bots? I have found myself solo carrying four lowbies in MotH and DL most days now. My guess is people are running their invoke/trash alts through RLQ to extract the bonus RAD while it is easy to do. Come mod 16 with the level scaling, you won't be able to speed run any RQ and even RLQ will be more of a chore.

    Seeing a player act odd once is iffy. In the last couple days, though, I've encountered what are likely bots in both ndemo and Artificer's Workshop. The ndemo toon stood off the platform, then wandered off and ran into a corner before things started - and did this both times I was in a queue with them.

    The Artificer's Workshop bot got outed when the circle under the Beholder Tank appeared off-centre, and they were outside of it. I ended up in the same instance as them later that night, and wouldn't you know it - they went to the same spot under the Tank, and took the same weird route to the final chest, including a weird 90-degree turn.


    I had this exact same thing happen to me with what I think was a bot. Player walked into the corner of the map and stayed in that position. Then about 10 to 15 seconds later moved back across the platform in demo to another corner. All the while everyone in the instance was complaining about them not getting on the platform. Then it finally walked onto the platform and stood there for us to start the match. I then watched as it ran around in the lobby area as the rest of us completed it.

    I have also noticed an up tick in bots in the last week or two of the game as I have started running more randoms to get rAD for the next mod.
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