they haven't scrapped the design, unless the federation cruisers have changed the basic lay out and I'm unaware of it. Just the look of it, the design is still valid, We still have a saucer, neck, primary hull, two uprights, and two warp nacelles. Wheres the design scrap?
Modern "state of the art" airplanes still have a fuselage, two wings, two horizontal stabilizers, tailfin and engines.
Whats your point?
And actually, your kind of wrong there.
Canonicly late 24th century starships have completely done away with the "neck".
The Sovereign, Intrepid, Nova, Prometheus, Akira, Defiant, Saber and Norway have "all" done away with the traditional neck.
Modern "state of the art" airplanes still have a fuselage, two wings, two horizontal stabilizers, tailfin and engines.
Whats your point?
And actually, your kind of wrong there.
Canonicly late 24th century starships have completely done away with the "neck".
The Sovereign, Intrepid, Nova, Prometheus, Akira, Defiant, Saber and Norway have "all" done away with the traditional neck.
That it is a VALID design feature. What was yours?
At least the pain of defeat wouldnt sting so bad if the Connie that pwned you was the same size as you and carried the same amount of weapon slots.
As I implied in the other thread, Kirk would gizz himself to command a Connie that size.
There are a few really good-looking Enterprise-F contest entries that have a profile that would be suited to Connie skin components.
One thing I would expect - more as an anti-laziness issue than anything else - is for a super-sized Connie to have deck and window elements of the skin in-scale.
a super-sized Constitution makes me think of JJ's... thing. With a proper TMP saucer but everything else just wrong, including the hot-rod nacelles. It's like something out of the starship version of the Uncanny Valley.
(Lest you doubt my own dedication to Trek, the very first words out of my mouth upon watching that first trailer? "Font's wrong.")
It give you a Viable Connie that you could kill with at Endgame.
And it gives a little to the Anti-Refitters to keep them happy
And if the community as a whole (pro, anti, and everyone in between) on the forums were to come together and support it, besides a few naysayers, it stands a much stronger chance of coming and making the most people happy.
It give you a Viable Connie that you could kill with at Endgame.
And it gives a little to the Anti-Refitters to keep them happy
And if the community as a whole (pro, anti, and everyone in between) on the forums were to come together and support it, besides a few naysayers, it stands a much stronger chance of coming and making the most people happy.
I see where you are coming from, honestly, but i have to ask, Why is your idea of compromise always to impose limitations on what a huge chuck of the player base wants?
In all reality, it has no bearing on anyone's play style( if they are based around the same tier abilities). If you like a Classic looking ship, the player can have it. If someone doesn't like it, they don't get it.
That is the true compromise, nothing is forced on anyone, a new feature is added that increases the likely hood that more will play, and there is a new element to game play. It truly is a win win for all, unless some don't want new features that improve the game experience. and i hope we all could agree we don't want that.
I would gladly moneysink as to have a constitution refit that can be used by admirals.
though I want you to do me a favor as well. See my "Heavy Cruiser T5" Idea in my sig. Do you think that is good?
Not bad, although I'd be more in favor of them adding it as a T3 Skin and then using the Retrofit system you could then upgrade it to the higher Tier and use it as Admiral.
Those specs could even be the PreSet specs you use at Tier 5 when you access the Tier 5 Store.
The beauty (imho) of my system is that it means everybody can get there ship their way but they have to work real hard at it and there are small, realistic, tradeoffs when it comes to the ships
The PreSet refits give a predetermined "Starfleet" made option that will be the most effective available for refitting.
The total customization lets you trade customizability for total power. You can customize it more, but there is the tradeoff it won't be as effective.
Lastly, the normal ship for the selected Tier will be the most powerful as it will be the one specifically designed for that purpose.
So, the anti refitters get the realism they want, you get an Admiral level viable ship.
The best part is that this is better than a simple T5 Connie in that you get to keep it at each Tier.
I see where you are coming from, honestly, but i have to ask, Why is your idea of compromise always to impose limitations on what a huge chuck of the player base wants?
In all reality, it has no bearing on anyone's play style( if they are based around the same tier abilities). If you like a Classic looking ship, the player can have it. If someone doesn't like it, they don't get it.
That is the true compromise, nothing is forced on anyone, a new feature is added that increases the likely hood that more will play, and there is a new element to game play. It truly is a win win for all, unless some don't want new features that improve the game experience. and i hope we all could agree we don't want that.
Its not a win win since it ruins a nice chunk of the players game play just to make a different slice of the total players happy. The retrofit system wastes less dev time, gives you a Admiral viable ship, and injects realism to make the rest of the players happy.
Saying it improves the game experience is pure opinion, since it only improves it for some, whilst diminishing it for others.
I do have to ask though, how exactly does it "impose limitations" on your gameplay? That you have to work for it or it won't be perfectly equal to Tier 5 Specs?
Lastly, a compromise isn't you get exactly what you want and the other side deals with it, that isn't a compromise.
Lastly, a compromise isn't you get exactly what you want and the other side deals with it, that isn't a compromise.
But this is exactly what YOU want, your way is people don't get what they are asking for simply because, no other reason. Ive never stated what i wanted, Ive only said that a big enough portion of the player base wants it.
I am playing devils advocate, because i see what this can do for the game.
If its going to come in, and most likely it will, it should be able to accommodate the largest possible wants, so we are not back here 1 day after it goes live.
Bare in mind, im in no way saying a player should be able to take the current tier 1 ships and make them tier 5. The system should just introduce a new ship at whatever tier and allow it to LOOK like whatever the player wants, as long as it is the same class, ie, sci/eng/tac, and of same tier or lower.
But this is exactly what YOU want, your way is people don't get what they are asking for simply because, no other reason. Ive never stated what i wanted, Ive only said that a big enough portion of the player base wants it.
I am playing devils advocate, because i see what this can do for the game.
If its going to come in, and most likely it will, it should be able to accommodate the largest possible wants, so we are not back here 1 day after it goes live.
Bare in mind, im in no way saying a player should be able to take the current tier 1 ships and make them tier 5. The system should just introduce a new ship at whatever tier and allow it to LOOK like whatever the player wants, as long as it is the same class, ie, sci/eng/tac, and of same tier or lower.
As far as I understand it, the dev's have said a T5 connie was taken down bu CBS. Which means that it's up to CBS to say yea or nay. They said nay.
As far as I understand it, the dev's have said a T5 connie was taken down bu CBS. Which means that it's up to CBS to say yea or nay. They said nay.
Fine, then for 60k GPL, we get a holo-emitter to make that hunk-a-junk monstrosity of a T5 cruiser look like a TOS Connie for 30mins a shot. Issue resolved without anyone getting upset
Fine, then for 60k GPL, we get a holo-emitter to make that hunk-a-junk monstrosity of a T5 cruiser look like a TOS Connie for 30mins a shot. Issue resolved without anyone getting upset
I think this is like the 10th time I've heard this idea.
[Edited to remove comments that could be misconstrued as offensive]
Didnt I read somewhere that the reason they did away with the skinny necks is that it become obvious that it was too easy to snap a Connie's neck if an ememy ship went straight for the throat? So, again, cryptic's "excuses" as to why a connie is out here still in the 25th century is still bunk any way you look at it, lol.
Hence the reason I suggested a somewhat girthier neck in the OP, even though at super size dimensions, it wouldnt have been AS easy as snapping off Kirks neck in the day.
ah you people and your connie why can't you just accept that it's centuries old and out of date it has as much place in the 25th cent as a current nasa space shuttle :rolleyes:
Because they just released an even older Vulcan ship from Enterprise that is Tier 5.
I gotta say I'm in love with this one. That's what I'm talking about. Forget all this exact replica junk with more power than it has any right to have, give me new ships based on the classics.
It's a game and a business folks... Cryptic is going to add what is recognizable from the shows and movies because people want em and will buy em.
At the same time, there's only so much recognizable stuff for Cryptic to add. Anything going forward (and even in between adding canon ships) will be the new 25th century ships & costumes.
Some of it will be based on classic designs: This baby is awesome in my opinion.
And others will be completely new like Perpetual's Enterprise F which reminds me of a dog who's wiping its TRIBBLE on the ground. I hate it but some people love it and want it in game.
Both classic and modern supporters will get cookies eventually.
And others will be completely new like Perpetual's Enterprise F which reminds me of a dog who's wiping its TRIBBLE on the ground. I hate it but some people love it and want it in game.
You know, I never really thought of this design like that before...and now I can't help but see it. Gee, thanks
You know, I never really thought of this design like that before...and now I can't help but see it. Gee, thanks
Like all dogs that are suffering from a debilitating illness, the Excalibur class is receiving employment as a "dirt displacement technician.".
However, I liked quite a few of the Perpetual escorts - they're much,much better than the wonky cruisers with gaps all over and drooping, saggy hull bottoms.
I gotta say I'm in love with this one. That's what I'm talking about. Forget all this exact replica junk with more power than it has any right to have, give me new ships based on the classics.
I think that concept would make for a great T5 Connie refit.
I just wrote up a proposal for a Conny refit, taking into account what might be a good role for it and the kind of specs that would make it good at T5 but not on par with Assault cruisers. Yes this is a shameless plug, but I seriously doubt anyone will get past the tl:dr aspect of it.
I think this is like the 10th time I've heard this idea.
It always gets shot down because it doesn't "feel" like a Connie.
Y'know, the more I think about it, the less I grasp that point of view.
Given that the refit crowd generally takes the position that the actual physical layout of a ship is meaningless to its performance, how could anything not 'feel' like a Connie in a meaningful way?
Comments
Modern "state of the art" airplanes still have a fuselage, two wings, two horizontal stabilizers, tailfin and engines.
Whats your point?
And actually, your kind of wrong there.
Canonicly late 24th century starships have completely done away with the "neck".
The Sovereign, Intrepid, Nova, Prometheus, Akira, Defiant, Saber and Norway have "all" done away with the traditional neck.
That it is a VALID design feature. What was yours?
There are a few really good-looking Enterprise-F contest entries that have a profile that would be suited to Connie skin components.
One thing I would expect - more as an anti-laziness issue than anything else - is for a super-sized Connie to have deck and window elements of the skin in-scale.
YES...WIN WIN
I know we're on opposite sides here but those made my laugh. I haven't laughed all day. So thank you.
(Lest you doubt my own dedication to Trek, the very first words out of my mouth upon watching that first trailer? "Font's wrong.")
You too, I just though of all that came out, this idea would probably look the absolute funniest.
Can I ask you a question, are you against this idea?
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=206913
I mean, as a whole the compromise is a bit like this (although the green circle is a bit generously to the left)
Spectrum
It give you a Viable Connie that you could kill with at Endgame.
And it gives a little to the Anti-Refitters to keep them happy
And if the community as a whole (pro, anti, and everyone in between) on the forums were to come together and support it, besides a few naysayers, it stands a much stronger chance of coming and making the most people happy.
though I want you to do me a favor as well. See my "Heavy Cruiser T5" Idea in my sig. Do you think that is good?
I see where you are coming from, honestly, but i have to ask, Why is your idea of compromise always to impose limitations on what a huge chuck of the player base wants?
In all reality, it has no bearing on anyone's play style( if they are based around the same tier abilities). If you like a Classic looking ship, the player can have it. If someone doesn't like it, they don't get it.
That is the true compromise, nothing is forced on anyone, a new feature is added that increases the likely hood that more will play, and there is a new element to game play. It truly is a win win for all, unless some don't want new features that improve the game experience. and i hope we all could agree we don't want that.
Not bad, although I'd be more in favor of them adding it as a T3 Skin and then using the Retrofit system you could then upgrade it to the higher Tier and use it as Admiral.
Those specs could even be the PreSet specs you use at Tier 5 when you access the Tier 5 Store.
The beauty (imho) of my system is that it means everybody can get there ship their way but they have to work real hard at it and there are small, realistic, tradeoffs when it comes to the ships
The PreSet refits give a predetermined "Starfleet" made option that will be the most effective available for refitting.
The total customization lets you trade customizability for total power. You can customize it more, but there is the tradeoff it won't be as effective.
Lastly, the normal ship for the selected Tier will be the most powerful as it will be the one specifically designed for that purpose.
So, the anti refitters get the realism they want, you get an Admiral level viable ship.
The best part is that this is better than a simple T5 Connie in that you get to keep it at each Tier.
Its not a win win since it ruins a nice chunk of the players game play just to make a different slice of the total players happy. The retrofit system wastes less dev time, gives you a Admiral viable ship, and injects realism to make the rest of the players happy.
Saying it improves the game experience is pure opinion, since it only improves it for some, whilst diminishing it for others.
I do have to ask though, how exactly does it "impose limitations" on your gameplay? That you have to work for it or it won't be perfectly equal to Tier 5 Specs?
Lastly, a compromise isn't you get exactly what you want and the other side deals with it, that isn't a compromise.
Sounds easy enough.
Its a poor fix for a much bigger problem.
If they do that, a week if we are lucky will go buy, and then a whole group of people will demand a new retrofit.
Cryptic needs to stop doing retrofits that only patch up the pipe and replace the stupid thing.
And add a retrofit system. (Like mine).
But this is exactly what YOU want, your way is people don't get what they are asking for simply because, no other reason. Ive never stated what i wanted, Ive only said that a big enough portion of the player base wants it.
I am playing devils advocate, because i see what this can do for the game.
If its going to come in, and most likely it will, it should be able to accommodate the largest possible wants, so we are not back here 1 day after it goes live.
Bare in mind, im in no way saying a player should be able to take the current tier 1 ships and make them tier 5. The system should just introduce a new ship at whatever tier and allow it to LOOK like whatever the player wants, as long as it is the same class, ie, sci/eng/tac, and of same tier or lower.
As far as I understand it, the dev's have said a T5 connie was taken down bu CBS. Which means that it's up to CBS to say yea or nay. They said nay.
Fine, then for 60k GPL, we get a holo-emitter to make that hunk-a-junk monstrosity of a T5 cruiser look like a TOS Connie for 30mins a shot. Issue resolved without anyone getting upset
I think this is like the 10th time I've heard this idea.
[Edited to remove comments that could be misconstrued as offensive]
Hence the reason I suggested a somewhat girthier neck in the OP, even though at super size dimensions, it wouldnt have been AS easy as snapping off Kirks neck in the day.
Because they just released an even older Vulcan ship from Enterprise that is Tier 5.
I gotta say I'm in love with this one. That's what I'm talking about. Forget all this exact replica junk with more power than it has any right to have, give me new ships based on the classics.
(FYI, the DVD does confirm she is that size).
At the same time, there's only so much recognizable stuff for Cryptic to add. Anything going forward (and even in between adding canon ships) will be the new 25th century ships & costumes.
Some of it will be based on classic designs: This baby is awesome in my opinion.
And others will be completely new like Perpetual's Enterprise F which reminds me of a dog who's wiping its TRIBBLE on the ground. I hate it but some people love it and want it in game.
Both classic and modern supporters will get cookies eventually.
You know, I never really thought of this design like that before...and now I can't help but see it. Gee, thanks
However, I liked quite a few of the Perpetual escorts - they're much,much better than the wonky cruisers with gaps all over and drooping, saggy hull bottoms.
You have been warned
I think that concept would make for a great T5 Connie refit.
http://www.startrekonline.com/enterprise/sites/default/files/imagecache/preview/ent-f_final_small.jpg
Y'know, the more I think about it, the less I grasp that point of view.
Given that the refit crowd generally takes the position that the actual physical layout of a ship is meaningless to its performance, how could anything not 'feel' like a Connie in a meaningful way?