2. Since the maps were all pre-generated, it completely missed the exponential potential of real procedural content. You could count on one hand the number of mission templates and the only variables in any of them would be the graphics. We went to a red planet to shoot borg and then a brown planet to shoot orions and a different brown planet to shoot blargonians. Or scan some rocks, scan some plants, scan some alien thingamajigs. They were all exactly the same mission and it was blatantly obvious the moment you started.
Procedural content wouldn't really change that, since the developers
A. Still have to create the basic mission perimeters for the system to work with, meaning you would still run into what amounted to the same handful of missions over and over like in any procedural content.
Not necessarily. Exponential growth of possible combinations quickly outpaces a player's ability to go through scenarios, if there are enough variables at play. The problem with the exploration system was that other than the graphics there pretty much were no variables at all. So you got different a different-looking map, a different-looking alien to kill, a different looking trinket to scan, but the actual gameplay was exactly the same each time.
None of the enemies ever did anything but stand there waiting for you, none of the scanned objects ever did anything at all, there were never any friendlies around to defend or interact with, no buildings that weren't inert scenery, no puzzles, etc. Procedural content gets it's benefits from combining variables, and the exploration clusters didn't do that. Couldn't do that, because they weren't generated on the fly so if there were a million combinations they'd have to store a million pre-generated maps.
Cryptic would have to make up, design, and program all of those scenarios, buildings, puzzles, and other elements for the procedural system to be able to add them into whatever it makes in the first place.
That falls back into what I said in my previous post's point B, that, due to highly diverse nature of Trek, and thus STO, most of the elements they have built for all of the story missions, and patrols, really wouldn't work in most procedural generated scenarios. The amount of new assets needed to make a system that wasn't just a mind numbingly simple as the old one would be massive, almost an entire other game's worth.
I disagree. Even the assets that existed in the old system would have been enough to create a reasonably diverse mission range, if they had simply been used better. And there is no reason they couldn't use most if not all the assets produced for the normal missions either.
Not to mention the sheer amount of sanity checks that would be necessary to prevent "Third Borg dynasty" or fighting a generic alien ship, boarding it, and then bizarrely finding yourself in a Tholian ship interior, and other such similar situations.
The third borg dynasty was funny. It would be stupid to go out of their way to prevent that.
Using just what they have now, the only "puzzles" one would find in these procedural missions are the isolinear chip puzzle.
I can quickly remember at least 8 distinct stock puzzles and minigames that appear in a separate window that the game has used in various places. In addition, there are several set-piece puzzles like standing boffs on tiles and such in many missions.
I disagree. Even the assets that existed in the old system would have been enough to create a reasonably diverse mission range, if they had simply been used better.
I simply can't agree, a bunch of flat maps with some basic rocks of trees don't make for very diverse missions unless those missions are simply "scan five things" or "kill five groups"
You can make a whole lot more interesting missions than that, just by varying behavior, triggers and responses. Or, well, I could at least.
And there is no reason they couldn't use most if not all the assets produced for the normal missions either.
Sure there are, most of the assets are made for specific species, and specific senarions. You wouldn't, or shouldn't use Tholian interiors in the Delta Quadrant, or Vaadwaur structures in the Gamma quadrant. You wouldn't see Tzenkethi style interiors outside of their ships or space stations, etc. etc. Most of STO's assets are built of specific races, and specific reasons, to take them out out of those races and out of the context they were originally made for, just creates a Frankenstein situation where these procedurally created maps are just mishmashes of things obviously made for something else and just thrown into this system.
I totally would use them. And it would be awesome.
Reusing sets and props is an age-old tradition in entertainment the world over. You put on some new paint, move some bits around and there, it's all new. It's how they get new aliens, tech, planets, ships, whatever on TV every week. By not reinventing the wheel every time.
The third borg dynasty was funny. It would be stupid to go out of their way to prevent that.
It would be stupid to put effort into a system and NOT take the time to make sure those sorts of things don't happen. Things like that are indicative of low effort, low quality, garbage, which I would hope a new exploration system wouldn't be.
Stopping things like that is indicative of low imagination, low creativity, anti-fun tyranny which I would hope nothing would be.
I can quickly remember at least 8 distinct stock puzzles and minigames that appear in a separate window that the game has used in various places. In addition, there are several set-piece puzzles like standing boffs on tiles and such in many missions.
And many of those are made for specific missions/scenarios, and wouldn't make sense out of said mission/scenario. I wouldn't expect to see the same Preserver tile puzzle they used to hide part of their super important star chart just randomly somewhere else for something far less important.
It was a bog-standard stand-on-tiles puzzle that's "randomly" appeared a bazillion times in a bazillion games with absolutely nothing whatsoever "made for specific" about it. In fact, STO itself has used similar puzzle more than once.
Yes, there should be a new and improved exploration system. But it doesn't seem to be coming any time soon.
However, there is one thing that the devs have already done years ago, and that is: Random exchange of some elements in a certain type of mission, namely, the Delta quadrant patrols. One time you fight Kazon, next time Hirogen, then another time it's yet another species, etc. Unfortunately, they way they structured the mission journal back then forced everyone to play these things once, and many of those, resulting in general disappointment with them, so the overall feedback was negative, and they did not go on with that approach, which is a pity.
In fact, just giving every story mission a few additional or even just replaced random elements would help a lot with making them less repetitive.
That's what we want, right? Some illusion of variance, some individual story, even if that is just a "skin" to the mission, so to speak.
yeah, we want malon freighters with kazon hailing pictures.
I think its time that we should have Deep Space Exploration in Star Trek Online to Explore Strange New Worlds Seek Out New Civilizations Boodle Go Were no Player as Gone Before it dose not have to have a story-line to go with it just explore space and allow new Endenvers Perks go along with it
I honestly don't know why they could not implement some form of open trade system like the original Elite had. There's hundreds of planets in the galactic map give them all randomly generated and dynamic needs for various resources and allow players to get rich trading between star systems. Link it to the GPL market, EC generation, heck even player housing and the fleet system.
There's a literal galaxy out there and we know a lot about it but STO concentrates only on small scale 5-15 min combats for 90% of the content.
As other have said, they have done some things right. The two things I've seen in the past few years, that they got right, Gravity Kills and Arena of Sompek.
Gravity Kills, because it can go wrong, real fast. Especially with the environmental hazard of getting sucked in to the black hole.
Arena of Somek, because it present a challenge. Granted, not a very big one. The crew I run with here tends to consist of a 3 man core, so we can carry 2 others to 100+ rounds. Now imagine if they did this as a progress TFO, starting with like Beach Assault, each map representing a skull. This would give that power creep a place to shine.
Think on it.
You have a 5-man crew, or they could make it a 10-man raid.
You start at you Infiltration/Assault point.
Then you have to fight your way through progressively harder enemies and maps, to get to final objective.
Imagine it kind of like a Kobali Prime, with Arena of Sompek scaling enemies and more environmental hazards as you progress through it.
For normal, cap it at 3 skulls, for the easy mode.
Advanced and Elite would get the full amount of skulls.
Add in ship and uniform/armor visuals for the completion accolade, i.e you can't get this appearance via reputation. Of course, it would need a reputation to go with it. Along with a small chance to drop Unbound Lobi, Lohlunat, Winter, and the upcoming Halloween event outfit boxes, and you'd always have people playing this.
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None of the enemies ever did anything but stand there waiting for you, none of the scanned objects ever did anything at all, there were never any friendlies around to defend or interact with, no buildings that weren't inert scenery, no puzzles, etc. Procedural content gets it's benefits from combining variables, and the exploration clusters didn't do that. Couldn't do that, because they weren't generated on the fly so if there were a million combinations they'd have to store a million pre-generated maps.
The third borg dynasty was funny. It would be stupid to go out of their way to prevent that.
I can quickly remember at least 8 distinct stock puzzles and minigames that appear in a separate window that the game has used in various places. In addition, there are several set-piece puzzles like standing boffs on tiles and such in many missions.
I totally would use them. And it would be awesome.
Reusing sets and props is an age-old tradition in entertainment the world over. You put on some new paint, move some bits around and there, it's all new. It's how they get new aliens, tech, planets, ships, whatever on TV every week. By not reinventing the wheel every time.
Stopping things like that is indicative of low imagination, low creativity, anti-fun tyranny which I would hope nothing would be.
It was a bog-standard stand-on-tiles puzzle that's "randomly" appeared a bazillion times in a bazillion games with absolutely nothing whatsoever "made for specific" about it. In fact, STO itself has used similar puzzle more than once.
yeah, we want malon freighters with kazon hailing pictures.
There's a literal galaxy out there and we know a lot about it but STO concentrates only on small scale 5-15 min combats for 90% of the content.
For normal, cap it at 3 skulls, for the easy mode.
Advanced and Elite would get the full amount of skulls.
Add in ship and uniform/armor visuals for the completion accolade, i.e you can't get this appearance via reputation. Of course, it would need a reputation to go with it. Along with a small chance to drop Unbound Lobi, Lohlunat, Winter, and the upcoming Halloween event outfit boxes, and you'd always have people playing this.