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imperialgeminiimperialgemini Member Posts: 44 Arc User
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  • lathaislathais Member Posts: 121 Arc User
    I think you heavily overuse the word need. Yes, if you want to complete projects, you do need the items, but do you really need to complete those projects? Will you die if you don't complete them?

    I think you hit the nail on the head right at the start of your post. If it's not fun to you, then don't play. If you feel you are addicted, seek help. Addiction is a real and true medical condition and deserves medical attention if you are truly addicted.
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  • pwstolemynamepwstolemyname Member Posts: 1,417 Arc User
    edited February 2017
    Sounds like you need to change your strategy. You said you had a fleet of friends, that's grate, you can definatly get everything you need and you don't really need any DPS at all.

    You and your friends should train their boffs in tractor beam repulsers. Any ship with a Lt sci or universal slot can use this so that should be easy. Also emergency power to engines one, all ships can use that too.

    If you have a Lt.Com or commander slot that can take a gravity well ability train that as well, and if you do then Pop some graviton generator or other CtrlX boosting consoles.

    Ok now pull your weapons power down to minimum, you wont need it.

    Alright, its gravity kills time. Are you any good at pool?

    Push the enemies into the black hole for the opening wave., remember if you have a gravity well you can push one enemy a ways. then use a well it to pull other enemies there too, repeat when the well wears off. If you use both emergency power to engines and evasive while you have tractor repulsers up you can push an enemy a very long way though, pushing them too far might mean your gravity wll wont reach their friends, so you will have to make some tactical choices and co-ordinate with your friends.

    Once the protect and shuttle omega particles bit is up its fairly simple, every time you drop off a particle place a heal on the carrier if you don't need it for yourself, and use the repulsers and the well to simply keep enemies out of range of the carrier, shouldn't be an issue, same goes for those guarding the particles, just move them away from where you can shoot them. During this stage you don't actualy have to kill anything.

    Final stage, push dreadnaught into black hole. Done.


    Ok now go do that and just try to tell me you didn't have fun.
  • davefenestratordavefenestrator Member Posts: 10,753 Arc User
    Exactly. Trade 100 regular marks once a day for an elite mark. You can get regular marks from a Borg red alert.
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  • leemwatsonleemwatson Member Posts: 5,558 Arc User
    Whilst generally I do agree OP, the need to earn the Protomatter isn't as hard as you think. Earn marks and convert them to Protomatter in the Rep menu.

    I also agree that Cryptic has pandered to power creep far too long. The new Advanced Queues, in my opinion, are excellent, and yes the process of gathering being interrupted can be irritating, but you must remember that if an STF becomes too easy, people migrate to that sole STF, as is such with CCA at the moment. How many times during a fight on-screen do you here such and such system is down during a fight. Invunerability should really never be available.

    Now, personally I love challenging fights in this game, but they are too rare. It beggars belief that people find macro'ing all their abilities to space bar so they can just sit there and do the least possible, as fun of any kind. Fun for me is flying around, triggering abilities as I see fit, going into a panic when I'm about to die or outnumbered, something that triggers even the slightest bit of adrenaline!

    "You don't want to patrol!? You don't want to escort!? You don't want to defend the Federation's Starbases!? Then why are you flying my Starships!? If you were a Klingon you'd be killed on the spot, but lucky for you.....you WERE in Starfleet. Let's see how New Zealand Penal Colony suits you." Adm A. Necheyev.
  • pwstolemynamepwstolemyname Member Posts: 1,417 Arc User
    coldnapalm wrote: »

    But but...thinking and skills...you really expect somebody like the OP to do those things? Somebody who doesn't even understand what the word need means? And wants everything handed to him on a silver platter no matter how bad he is?

    Also, yeah TBR is hilariously fun in this mission.

    I live in hope that one day some one will rise to my expectations.

  • goodscotchgoodscotch Member Posts: 1,680 Arc User
    They're definitely tough, but easier if you have better gear and are spec'ed well. If you're having survival issues, what I would recommend is, first, respec for higher shields and hull. This may give you a better shot at surviving the "relentless and never ending waves of enemies." Second, I would try to better your gear, engines, shields, consoles, weapons, etc. This will also help you survive and do better. Just two basic things that may give you a more successful playing experience. You may have to grind some easier play in order to build up energy credits or dilithium or whatever in order to procure better gear. So, try to be at peace with that possibility. Most players who have higher end gear have had to deal with it. And you may very well have to experiment with combinations of gear to see which load out fits your playing style. I think every player would admit that they feel a bit more comfortable in a particular type of ship. Some folks do well with battlecruisers while others prefer escorts or Birds of Prey while still others like a big carrier or dreadnought type ship. What ship do you generally feel is a good fit for your playing style?

    Also related...it's a big STO universe. Perhaps replaying a few older missions to get some piece of equipment as a reward that would help you would be a good thing to do. Then, when you have some new consoles or engines or shields, you could revisit the newer content to see how you fare.

    In any case...Warp Speed, comrade!
    klingon-bridge.jpg




  • gaevsmangaevsman Member Posts: 3,190 Arc User
    Just use the singularity projection console, my son and i have one, so we take turns, and we send the enemies away pretty quick, its fun actually..
    The forces of darkness are upon us!
  • lathaislathais Member Posts: 121 Arc User
    goodscotch wrote: »
    They're definitely tough, but easier if you have better gear and are spec'ed well. If you're having survival issues, what I would recommend is, first, respec for higher shields and hull. This may give you a better shot at surviving the "relentless and never ending waves of enemies." Second, I would try to better your gear, engines, shields, consoles, weapons, etc. This will also help you survive and do better. Just two basic things that may give you a more successful playing experience. You may have to grind some easier play in order to build up energy credits or dilithium or whatever in order to procure better gear. So, try to be at peace with that possibility. Most players who have higher end gear have had to deal with it. And you may very well have to experiment with combinations of gear to see which load out fits your playing style. I think every player would admit that they feel a bit more comfortable in a particular type of ship. Some folks do well with battlecruisers while others prefer escorts or Birds of Prey while still others like a big carrier or dreadnought type ship. What ship do you generally feel is a good fit for your playing style?

    Also related...it's a big STO universe. Perhaps replaying a few older missions to get some piece of equipment as a reward that would help you would be a good thing to do. Then, when you have some new consoles or engines or shields, you could revisit the newer content to see how you fare.

    In any case...Warp Speed, comrade!

    But grinding isn't fun....now you are telling him that he needs to do yet something else not fun....
  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 9,427 Arc User
    You don't NEED to do anything in this game.
  • bossheisenbergbossheisenberg Member Posts: 603 Arc User
    I don't get it. What is the problem? The new stfs are easy as cake. I go in with my small escort or raider and take on whole mobs and leave the place looking like wolf 359. What makes the game fun for me is that it forces you to get better - the fun is in tweaking your build and gradually improving. If you're getting smashed in the new queues then you got a lot of room for improvement, which means you got a lot to work towards and there's still some challenge left. I always look forward to any new content in this game no matter what it is, and think about how it will affect my build and the existing meta. Having friends in the game really helps to motivate you and share secrets and strategies.
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  • crypticarmsmancrypticarmsman Member Posts: 4,115 Arc User
    Question to the OP: If you don't get any enjoyment from completing aspects of the game, why do you continue to play? I'm not being snarky. In the end this IS a game. At the point you're at now, you don't 'need' anything to be able to complete the PvE content.

    So in the end, if you're not getting some sort of enjoyment/fun/good feeling from STO - why play something you don't enjoy?
    (And if you do enjoy some aspects of the game, stick with/play those - and don't worry about the other stuff.)
    Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012
    TOS_Connie_Sig_final9550Pop.jpg
    PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
  • nickodaemusnickodaemus Member Posts: 711 Arc User
    Need.

    I "need" to be able to exchange marks in reverse of the "100-for-1" so that I can get more common marks in some cases where my characters have more than enough of the elite thinga-ma-jigs.

    Also, I'd like to be able to craft an upgrade that binds things to account vs. to character so I can share unused older gear among my various 'toons. Just a thought.

    I play the old STF missions for fun, because to me, they are. And I like the death star one, too vs. the Voth. Counterpoint is a drudgery to meh, and so is Disconnected. I play those from necessity atm.

    But the whole thing is for fun, and isn't that what we really "need" anyways?
  • lathaislathais Member Posts: 121 Arc User
    edited February 2017
    But the whole thing is for fun, and isn't that what we really "need" anyways?

    Nope. The only thing you need is food, water and shelter. Anything and everything else is just a want.

    Now this next part is not aimed at anyone in particular, just the interwebs in general. I know they did not stop teaching this stuff in school as my daughter is 6 and has learned the differences between want and need in school already. Are there that many people out there that just did not go to school or something? So much so that they really think they need things like entertainment? These are not needs people. These are wants. My 6 year old daughter in first grade can tell the difference.
  • trejgontrejgon Member Posts: 323 Arc User
    meanwhile I'm sitting here wondering how the heck could OP manage to get oneshotted in t6 ship in Gravity Kills Advanced......

    apart from flying into the black hole that is....
    and then I've seen someone actually tanking the black hole and afaik Cath is not really a min-maxer....

    The_Science_Channel_Signature_Gen_2_-_Elenortirie_xSmall.png
  • hillard1959hillard1959 Member Posts: 197 Arc User
    You don't really need a great build to do an advanced STF. There's plenty of weapons and engine sets that you can get from episode replays that will get you through advanced difficulty and into your reputation gear. It's even easier if you're part of a fleet and have access to the fleet stores with advanced fleet weapons. Hitting 10k DPS is laughably easy to do, and it's all you really need to do for advanced without dragging the team down.
  • feiqafeiqa Member Posts: 2,410 Arc User
    This might sound off. But you don't have to run the Lukari specific Ques at all. Just do the random borg popup and you get the marks to level the Lukari rep. And as has been stated you can burn 100 marks per day to get the rep special currency. It takes longer to grind. But totally doable if you are not comfortable in advanced or higher ques that drop them. With the borg incursion available every thirty minutes you can get marks for all the reps if you have the time.

    Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
    Network engineers are not ship designers.
    Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
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  • drazursouthclawdrazursouthclaw Member Posts: 223 Arc User
    First if you disagree with me fine. I already know there are a lot of insensitive a-holes who will come on here and post replies with the sole purpose of making themselves feel superior by disparaging the feelings I have posted here.

    That sounds like me, but today I will be making myself feel superior by having actually read what you've written, unlike most of the other posters in this thread.
    The fact is that I am addicted to this game. I am sick and disabled and so have a lot of free time and this game is usually a release for me. So I know there will be those who tell me not to play if I do not like it, etc, etc. That is not the point and I am entitled to my thoughts and opinions on the game play.

    It sucks that you're sick, dude. It also sucks that you're disabled. But more than anything, it sucks that you're addicted to THIS game of all games. Also, does the nature of your disability make it physically hard for you to play games? Because I imagine that may be adding to the already-high frustration factor of this game.

    Consider writing Foundry missions as well, which can be good FUN, and you can write them around your circumstances. Perhaps other like you will find them and love them!

    But this isn't really your point, is it?
    Now, the main point of a game is to entertain and have fun. The goal that the developers constantly express, is their desire for players to feel immersed and to enjoy themselves. So when the outcome is frustration and anger, that is the OPPOSITE of their goal and they need to know about it.

    Right. There's the issue, RIGHT THERE, my friend.

    That's only what the Devs SAY. That has NO bearing on actual reality.

    This is a company who 'celebrates' annual events by making us grind. Imagine if your parents/friends made you work for your birthday present, and then pretended that it was a celebration. This shows the wrongness of their mentality:

    they either:

    1) Genuinely believe that people find it fun to do boring repetitive tasks that would put OCD fiends to sleep, or

    2) Just don't care.

    (and also I guess a 3rd possibility is that this stuff actually IS fun, but people like you and I don't find it fun.)

    That stuff that they say, they only say that so that we will keep giving them money, or playing, or whatever. Because that is how the world works, and that is their job.

    To people like this, promise of fun is actually a LOT more important than the delivery of fun.
    That being said I am frustrated at their PvE, especially the new Lukari missions. I am using my two level 60 captains with t^ ships and rare to ultra rare weapons, equipment and consoles. No I am not a SUPER DPS machine that has all epic loadouts. But I should not have to be in order to find success in a mission or enjoyment in the game. (polite snip of rest of post)

    Games aren't designed for minorities, you must realise that, surely. And it's not like the Devs will come here and comment, or even change anything about the game based on your input. If sick & disabled gamers represented a major financial community, then it would be different for Cryptic.

    Friend, you say you're 'addicted'.

    I propose to you that the fact that you realize that you're addicted actually mean you're no longer as addicted as you were. The cracks are starting to appear in the armour of your respect for Cryptic. And believe me, the company will do nothing - NOTHING - to patch it back up.

    That frustration you feel isn't aimed at the game: it's aimed at YOU. It's YOU asking yourself if it's 'really worth it'

    Now let me ask you some questions. I don't return to posts, so these questions are for you to think about.

    - If it's not FUN, then why are you even playing? I want you to REALLY think about that.
    - How ignored do you need to feel before you will quit for good?
    - Would you put up with this 'work first, play second' attitude from literally ANY other entertainment?

    Look, I'm NOT trying to get you to quit. I just want you to KNOW WHY YOU PLAY, so you can know how much grinding to put up with. Because that's what the rest of us do.

    But you only need to answer one question really: Why do you NEED that stuff? So you can do even more grindy content? So you can have a cool looking thing?

    Because if it's just 'survivability', then you can do MUCH better, gearwise.

    I went through all of that 'Fun Vs Need' issue myself, and now I have a full set of Borg Ship Gear, after literal *years* of grinding solo content. And now I never play that character, the only one who has that set, because I'm STILL sick of looking at that character.

    So yeah - time might not be the only 'cost'.

    Realistically, you have 3 options:

    1) Walk away
    2) Re-evaluate your grinding timetable, and adapt it to something more appropriate (people have mentioned swapping marks, that works, that's how I got my Borg gear)
    3) Keep playing, but ignore the gear completely, because it's not really that good.

    You'll notice that "get the gear while having fun" wasn't an option.

    I 100% agree with you that games should be FUN.
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  • jaguarskxjaguarskx Member Posts: 5,945 Arc User
    edited February 2017
    There is a difference between "need" and "want".

    You do not need Reputation (or Fleet) gear to play the game. The majority of my max captains do not use any Reputation (or Fleet) gear beyond a few torpedoes. I am quite able to hand Advanced STFs without them. I have not even bothered to allocate any Specialization Points either.

    You have a case of "want" not "need".

    However, what you "need" is an understanding of tactics and prioritizing objectives. They endlessly respawning ships are a diversion. They are to ignored unless they are attacking the Jupiter or the station.

    Sure the black hole (singularity) can slow you down, or destroy you if you get too close. But there are was to speed up your ship such as by redirecting power to engines rather than to weapons. You can also use Evasive Maneuvers, Emergency Power to Engines, Engine Batteries and Deuterium Surplus to speed up your ship.

    Post edited by jaguarskx on
  • peterconnorfirstpeterconnorfirst Member Posts: 6,225 Arc User
    edited February 2017
    The fact is that I am addicted to this game. I am sick and disabled and so have a lot of free time and this game is usually a release for me.

    I read your OP and have a question before I can reply honetsly.

    What exactly is it here that hinders you to become good at the game you play and like so much? If you are you can have all you want or need and will have fun in getting it!
    Post edited by peterconnorfirst on
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    felisean wrote: »
    teamwork to reach a goal is awesome and highly appreciated
  • tempus64tempus64 Member Posts: 806 Arc User
    This thread like so, so many is just humorous. So the OP says the queues won't get played down the road as they're not designed well for "fun". Then there's another group of people that also say the queues won't get played down the road as they're not designed to reward adequately for the amount of effort you have to put into them. What's the take away for me? That these things don't seem to be designed for anyone of the various groups that play the game. But instead of actually discussing the design aspect of these things, it turns into an "attack" on the OP.
  • lordsteve1lordsteve1 Member Posts: 3,492 Arc User
    I think the general consensus i'm seeing is that these new queues are the best for a long time.
    No time gates, fairly manageable objectives even for pugs, nice attractive maps, enemies that you need to think about, new mechanics, reasonable rewards.

    I'm not struggling and I really don't care what my DPS is. I know my ship can do 60K in HSE or ISA and probably a lot more in CCA but i really don't care.
    These new enemies require some thought and tactics to get the best out of them. You don't just fly in all guns blazing, you have to plan the attack because certain angles waste your shots or certain abilities (like GW) will only make them tougher.
    I love that to be honest and I mean no offense when i say this, but I'm loving seeing the forum rage by people whining they are too hard.
    It's about dammed time players started using their heads to win fights rather than relying on some ridiculous cookie cutter BFAW spam-fest which requires no thought/piloting/knowledge of the game mechanics.
    SulMatuul.png
  • trejgontrejgon Member Posts: 323 Arc User
    tempus64 wrote: »
    This thread like so, so many is just humorous. So the OP says the queues won't get played down the road as they're not designed well for "fun". Then there's another group of people that also say the queues won't get played down the road as they're not designed to reward adequately for the amount of effort you have to put into them. What's the take away for me? That these things don't seem to be designed for anyone of the various groups that play the game. But instead of actually discussing the design aspect of these things, it turns into an "attack" on the OP.

    well I could argue with the OP that I have fun in those new ques as long as Orion is not flying his shockwave+TBR+certain command spec skill build again, and that he is having fun especially in those super-anti-team builds......

    but that's really matter of tastes so I won't be arguing over if the design is "fun" or not

    but I would be willing to argue is the statement of OP that he get oneshotted with T5-U and T6 ships in gravity kills advanced without even a chance to use eng captain healing skills

    and I would be willing to do so because I have been sittingduck tanking these guys in T5 ship and I can't call my gear all that super-OP..

    and I didn't even adapted my build i nany way to those specific foes
    I've just grabbed out of curiosity a ship that was not so long time ago given away to everyone who cared to login and click "claim" button slapped first default build of mine I could think of and went to the que with friends
    and that build is one of those I should not show up with on any DPS talks because I'd be eaten alive at the very first sight due to how that build looks like.

    so you see that seeing someone whining that the que is not fun and listing being oneshotted in ships of higher grade than the one I currently use as one of reasons sounds... well.... irrational to say the least

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  • nickodaemusnickodaemus Member Posts: 711 Arc User
    edited February 2017
    lathais wrote: »
    But the whole thing is for fun, and isn't that what we really "need" anyways?

    Nope. The only thing you need is food, water and shelter. Anything and everything else is just a want.

    Now this next part is not aimed at anyone in particular, just the interwebs in general. I know they did not stop teaching this stuff in school as my daughter is 6 and has learned the differences between want and need in school already. Are there that many people out there that just did not go to school or something? So much so that they really think they need things like entertainment? These are not needs people. These are wants. My 6 year old daughter in first grade can tell the difference.


    Did you notice that "need" was in quotes? O.o Guess you missed that.

    Perhaps "not yet" in this school your kid goes too, but in yours (if you didn't miss that too) they should have taught you that people do not live by bread alone. People "need" entertainment and enjoyment of life to hit the top tier of this:

    http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

    People playing this game are putting some effort into the creative & expressive aspects of their lives for enjoyment because they already have the things which rank below. You wouldn't have internet or time for games if you are struggling for food, air, and water.

    You've taken quite a leap from the topic to try & make some point, but I think you've actually jumped way over it. We weren't discussing needs in real life, just some things people might like to see in this game.
  • peterconnorfirstpeterconnorfirst Member Posts: 6,225 Arc User
    edited February 2017
    I think what is “fun”, what is “want” and what is “need” in a mmopg is a nonsensical discussion.

    Games like these thrive upon the players urge to progress, to develop ones characters. That’s the common thing all such games and the players who play it share. To reach ones goals is fun but more important how to get there is supposed to be as well. Of course this is more or less subjective, the right mix is tricky.

    I was really hoping for a more detailed explanation what exactly it is that is holding the OP back here. He mentioned something of an addiction, illness and disability. Now if any of this hinders him to play some mildly engaging content like the new queued PvE maps I understand his frustration and I feel deeply sorry for him.

    However if not I don’t understand his attitude to the slightest.

    The content of this game as well as the means to progress ones characters in it are laughably easy. The new PvE are no exception here.

    Cryptic tried to bring it hard on us two years ago with Delta Rising, failed miserably and then reverted so much of it up to now that every child and ever grandpa can play this game and be successful in it again!

    If players are not, under whatever circumstances, it’s not the games fault!

    In 99% of the cases it’s plain and simple laziness and the growing cancer of more and more folks not wanting to simply earn their rewards anymore.

    That is the reason why queued maps are empty.
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    Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
    felisean wrote: »
    teamwork to reach a goal is awesome and highly appreciated
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