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FLAGSHIPS: The Best of Times and the Worst of Times
thetanine
Member Posts: 1,367 Arc User
FLAGSHIPS: The Best of Times and the Worst of Times: Message? YES.
The new flagships are a mixed bag for me. The FED ships are freaking awesome. Majestic, even.
The KDF Flagships are a bit too cumbersome for me.
The ROM Flagships seem to be the worst deal, for me especially, since my "main" player character is ROM. The Scimitar, to me, evokes a step backwards for the REPUBLIC. The Scimitar was a monster, a PREDATOR in the words of Picard. It seems to me that making the Scimitar the new ROM flagship should have made the Soverign the FED Flagship. My point here is the Scimitar is an ANACHRONISM.
That's a pretty harsh charge since this season is all about TIME: Travel, Events, History, Futures...
I feel like Cryptic did a fantastic job for the FED Flagship. OK for the KDF. And Badly for the ROM REPUBLIC.
How about you?
The new flagships are a mixed bag for me. The FED ships are freaking awesome. Majestic, even.
The KDF Flagships are a bit too cumbersome for me.
The ROM Flagships seem to be the worst deal, for me especially, since my "main" player character is ROM. The Scimitar, to me, evokes a step backwards for the REPUBLIC. The Scimitar was a monster, a PREDATOR in the words of Picard. It seems to me that making the Scimitar the new ROM flagship should have made the Soverign the FED Flagship. My point here is the Scimitar is an ANACHRONISM.
That's a pretty harsh charge since this season is all about TIME: Travel, Events, History, Futures...
I feel like Cryptic did a fantastic job for the FED Flagship. OK for the KDF. And Badly for the ROM REPUBLIC.
How about you?
STAR TREK
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Comments
Personally, I find the "T6" Romulan-ified Scimitar (ie, same "bat shape" with lots of foldy-wings but done up in "smooth" Romulan lines/bird motif vs. Bat) as the current "ultimate" expression of Reman ship design fused with Romulan aesthetics.
Which is a central tenet of the Republic, right? One big happy (and equal) Republic instead of a domineering Empire?
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
The T6 Scimitar just looks bad. It fits perfectly in a Batman Universe.
So what if they are just lackeys to the federation now.
Maybe if we were talking about the Romulans from the mainline movies and TV shows, because STO's Romulans are nothing at all like what you described. They are footrests for the Federation and Klingon Empire in STO, a very pale copy of the Federation on top of that.
Lies! They are merely awaiting for the proper time to strike!
I'm a little bit different but my feelings on the Flagships?
First, "cumbersome." NONE of the Flagships handle well. They never did even at T5, so people expecting anything vastly different from that should have known better. The Odyssey even before T6 faced superior handling Fed Cruisers that could hit just as hard and take as much punishment as they did. The same persisted for the Bortasqu' for the KDF. The Roms are so loaded with TAC heavy ships that the options are overflowing, but at least the Scimitar had insane hitting power and survivability to make up for the cumbersome handling.
Odyssey
The KDF & Rom Flagships however are where things get interesting, at least to me when you compare the Fed Flagships to them. Let's start with the Elephant in the room.
Scimitar
With the visuals out of the way, you cannot argue however about STATS. The T5U Scimitars have long had the reputation ingame for hitting like a truck, even with the advent of T6 ships and the T6 versions are improved on that. Period.
The Scimitars, regardless of tier are the RRW's truly unique ship that nobody else can replicate. I equate this "uniqueness" to the KDF's unique ship, the Birds of Prey. Nobody has the same total package of what the BOP offers outside the KDF. For the Scimitar series, the uniqueness of a combo of Cruiser-like staying power and 8 weapon slots, Cmdr TAC stations, Battle Cloak, and the luxury of stuffing Full SRO BOFF layout as RRW. Nothing in the game replicates that, not in the C-Store, Lockbox, Event, or even Promo Pack ships.
I prefer the raw power of the TAC version, but I know people swear by the SCI version, even back in the T5 days.
Bortasqu'
Statistically? Only 2 versions are worthy of being mentioned. The TAC and SCI version, just as it did at the T5 versions.
The TAC version makes it a Battlecruiser that has 5 TAC consoles. There is NO Crusier, Battlecruiser, Cruiser-styled Warbird anywhere in the game that has that feature.
The SCI version is also a member of a very small club. Cruisers with Sensor Analysis. There are only 3 members of that club.
SCI Odyssey (T5 & T6) 5 ENG, 4 SCI, 2 TAC Consoles
Tal Shiar Adapted Battlecruiser (T5 only) 4 ENG, 4 SCI, 3 TAC Consoles
SCI Bortasqu (T5 & T6) 4 ENG, 3 SCI, 4 TAC Consoles
The SCI Bortasqu' has a very balanced Console layout and of the Cruiser family with Sensor Analysis, she is the only one with 4 TAC Consoles. Her 3 SCI Consoles is not that bad for the guys that like high TAC & SCI Console Slot Counts for their ships. Overall, she is a pretty special package and actually a worthy contender to the 5 TAC Bortasqu'.
Epohhs! Would you like an Epohh friend?
That doesn't bring up any questions in your mind? Every flag officer of both major powers having an irresistibly cute pet, provided at cost by their new Romulan friends, following them around wherever they go? Ok. I guess I agree -- Romulans have been neutered; TNG Romulans would be using ridiculously complicated espionage tactics, whereas STO Romulans are just nice, friendly people with no ulterior motives or shadowy schemes whatsoever.
As for the flagships, I'm still not on board with the Romulans flying around with Thalaron reactors at all, but the visual changes to the Scimitar are a definite improvement over what they had before. The Nemesis version was worthy of the movie. Now it feels more like a genuine Romulan ship, at least.
Fortunately even us nice STO Romulans still don't care if the feddybears are "on board" with our weapons.
Don't kid yourself. Fed/KDF are the lackeys in this alliance. It's the Romulans who get access to allied facilities, fly allied ships, command allied personnel. Fed/KDF dudes get...to tag epohh's in our backyard.
Batman scimitar... I actually approve. lol.
Can I like.. quote you everywhere on this?
"He shall be my finest warrior, this generic man who was forced upon me.
Like a badass I shall make him look, and in the furnace of war I shall forge him.
he shall be of iron will and steely sinew.
In great armour I shall clad him and with the mightiest weapons he shall be armed.
He will be untouched by plague or disease; no sickness shall blight him.
He shall have such tactics, strategies and machines that no foe will best him in battle.
He is my answer to cryptic logic, he is the Defender of my Romulan Crew.
He is Tovan Khev... and he shall know no fear."
Pfft. You have to let the little kids to come home somewhere, after all.
Here's a good place to see where the Romulan Republic's standing is between the Klingon Empire and Federation. Go play "Surface Tension" mission. D'Tan starts going on about how the Romulan Republic can lead forays in the new Sphere. But Ambassador S'taass of the Klingon Empire immediately butts in and starts getting onto the Federation on an admission that the Federation TRIBBLE up with their actions (or more exactly, inaction) with the Undine threat years ago when the Klingons, under Chancellor Martok at the time, were trying to get them aboard on a joint effort. The conversation immediately went solely to the grown ups in this group, the true power holders.
D'Tan simply had to wait it out and let true power sort things out.
If you switch to a regular Romulan bridge, you won't have the Thalaron reactor anymore
Art is subjective, fortunately you don't have to use the new skins so I fail to see the problem. KDF ships are always hideously ugly that's kind of the point, they are designed with only utilitarianism in mind.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I know i would never accept gifts from them...
They're all solid ships, IMO.
But if you're chasing stats for performance, except for the Scimitar with the Roms*, there are already better TAC Cruisers for the Feds and TAC Battlecruisers for the KDF at T6. Namely:
Eclipse
T6 Avenger
Qib
T6 Mogh
... Notice the patterns?
On top of that, the above ships, especially the Eclipse and Qib, have outstanding handling characteristics and fly so smoothly, quickly, while still hitting extremely hard. The one issue all the Flagships have in common is that they're sturdy but sluggish fliers.
Even then, the Flagships offer merely another option for players to fly, especially if they liked what the T5 versions offered to begin with since the T6 ones are improved over them.
* Scimitar for all intents and purposes is a massive Escort with 8 weapon slots and Battle Cloak. The Roms are absolutely loaded with excellent T6 Escorts like the Mogai but none of them have 8 weapon slots. The Mogai however can slot OSS3...
I'm not a min/maxer, I just play for fun. And to me(key word), slow bulky ships aren't fun to fly. Again, to me(key word).
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
FED: Very good looking, decent performance numbers and can take punishment while dishing it back out. I would like to see some changes....
Yes, I known that those with access to the original T5s' can get their hands on an Aquarius pet; but still....
And finally...
KDF: I like the improvements in performance, especially given how inferior the original Bortasque was when compared to The Oddessy, it flew circles around it's KDF counterpart.
However, the designs on the new Flagships are just...ugly. Then again, most KDF Capital ships are ugly (probably cause the Klingons are trying to make them more fortress like); at least the smaller and faster vessels look so much better. Still, it is a nice improvement over the original design, yet remain true to it's Klingon philosophy and heritage.
Bottom line, not bad, not bad at all.....for a Klingon vessel.
Oh, and some Hangers for Carrier Pets could help.
ROM: The best Designs I've seen yet. A perfect mix of Romulan and Reman Architechure and Tech. And they already come with their own Carrier Pets too. NICE!!
Even so, they're underpowered (as it is with all Romulan vessels) due to the inefficiency of their Singularity type Warp cores. Then again, Romulans are known for harnessing the otherwise waisted energy into unique powers and abilities that other factions can only dream about.
That got me imagining a Giant sized Batman Flying around some Space hub in a T6 Simitar like Batwing; if only I were an artist....
Ok, I had to read this post 3 times just to make sure you were really saying what I thought you were saying.
If they did what you were asking for the Fed ships, it would completely invalidate any other ship. Every ship has to have strengths and weaknesses, it's what set the ships apart. What you're doing here is cherry picking the best of the best and asking for it all on one ship, that's simply not going to happen, nor should it. The Odyssey is the 'Flagship' because that's what class the Enterprise is, not because it's the 'be all end all' or the 'best ship' you can get. It should have trade offs like every other ship in the game.
The Romulan part.. wow. The thought that Romulan ships are under powered is simply mind blowing. I honestly don't even know how to address that part. I will just take the high road here and say that I very strongly disagree.
Okay, maybe I should clarify something:
Most ships have a base power level of 50 for their subsystem powers; that';s assuming the vessel has balanced power settings, (before skill, bonuses and other modifiers come into play). Romulan ships have a base power level of 40.
Having said that, that missing 10 in each subsystem is being redirected towards empowering the so called Singularity abilities that have a great area affect in Space. that's what I was talking about. Think of it as a outsiders point of view if you will.
....Yeah you're probably right. Although to be fair, they kind of did a "jack of all trades" vessels with the Command BattleCruisers.
I get that, and at one point you were absolutely right. The thing is, there are now so many methods in this game to mitigate power costs that the Singularity is not a very big deal anymore. When you look at the trade off that Romulans get in exchange, things like Superior Romulan Operative BoFFs they come out way ahead. Especially in the case of the Scimitar that has the 5 forward weapons, commander tactical station, 5 tac consoles and a hangar bay. You get a lot when you consider that it's tradeoffs (Singularity and slow turn rate) can both be pretty easily mitigated.
On the Fed sides, the Command Ships sacrifice the best cruiser command (Weapon Systems Efficiency) in exchange for it's lackluster hangar bay. It's minimal, but it's something. The Command Ships are pretty solid all around, that's for sure.