Well I just hope it will be set in the prime verse, after TNG/DS9/VOY/NEMESIS but linked to them, Enterprise and movies in some way link it has done before. Not to far in to the future also, would be a good idea to have the previous crew make guest appearances and passing on their knowledge and experiences to the new crew. Also have the scientific proven knowledge and theories added.
I'm hoping for either this, or a show set entirely in the Mirror Universe.
I'm really glad Fuller is on-board, even though when you look at the episodes he was involved in, I think you could randomly select any similar-sized group and do much better. Living Witness is a masterpiece, naturally, and Drone is good, but the others? Oof.
And, yes it is off-topic, but whether or not the JJ-verse is canon depends on how Worf fared in the tournament on Forcas III. Did he win, or did he come in ninth? If the JJ-verse is canon, your answer must be "both."
I'm really glad Fuller is on-board, even though when you look at the episodes he was involved in, I think you could randomly select any similar-sized group and do much better. Living Witness is a masterpiece, naturally, and Drone is good, but the others? Oof.
And, yes it is off-topic, but whether or not the JJ-verse is canon depends on how Worf fared in the tournament on Forcas III. Did he win, or did he come in ninth? If the JJ-verse is canon, your answer must be "both."
I like where you're at there...but the answer is yes. No need to get cute with it. That episode (TNG: "Parallels") firmly establishes the idea of quantum realities (which is a legit theory in quantum physics). Dialogue in Star Trek [2009] firmly establishes that it is an example of those universes. The Mirror Universe is also an example, but people accept that universe's canonicity without question.
I'm really glad Fuller is on-board, even though when you look at the episodes he was involved in, I think you could randomly select any similar-sized group and do much better. Living Witness is a masterpiece, naturally, and Drone is good, but the others? Oof.
And, yes it is off-topic, but whether or not the JJ-verse is canon depends on how Worf fared in the tournament on Forcas III. Did he win, or did he come in ninth? If the JJ-verse is canon, your answer must be "both."
I like where you're at there...but the answer is yes. No need to get cute with it. That episode (TNG: "Parallels") firmly establishes the idea of quantum realities (which is a legit theory in quantum physics). Dialogue in Star Trek [2009] firmly establishes that it is an example of those universes. The Mirror Universe is also an example, but people accept that universe's canonicity without question.
People accept it without question, because it's shown in the episodes, thus making it canon... Aspects of the other quantum realities seen (or spoken about) in Parallels are canon, but not all events or aspects of those realities is canon, because it hasn't been formally broadcast...
The closest example to something non-broadcast being canon I can think of, is the TNG Companion clarrifies Ro's not-naming names name-drop reference of her ATT Instructor, was actually referring to Chakotay. That thread was never picked up in Voyager to make it canon, but it was the intent of the producers and writers, that he was who she was talking about, even if not named directly...
I'm really glad Fuller is on-board, even though when you look at the episodes he was involved in, I think you could randomly select any similar-sized group and do much better. Living Witness is a masterpiece, naturally, and Drone is good, but the others? Oof.
And, yes it is off-topic, but whether or not the JJ-verse is canon depends on how Worf fared in the tournament on Forcas III. Did he win, or did he come in ninth? If the JJ-verse is canon, your answer must be "both."
I like where you're at there...but the answer is yes. No need to get cute with it. That episode (TNG: "Parallels") firmly establishes the idea of quantum realities (which is a legit theory in quantum physics). Dialogue in Star Trek [2009] firmly establishes that it is an example of those universes. The Mirror Universe is also an example, but people accept that universe's canonicity without question.
People accept it without question, because it's shown in the episodes, thus making it canon... Aspects of the other quantum realities seen (or spoken about) in Parallels are canon, but not all events or aspects of those realities is canon, because it hasn't been formally broadcast...
Huh? Who said anything about the quantum realities not seen on screen? "Parallels" gives the canonical basis for the Abrams universe to exist, was my point. Spock Prime ending up in that quantum reality legitimizes its canonicity.
The closest example to something non-broadcast being canon I can think of, is the TNG Companion clarrifies Ro's not-naming names name-drop reference of her ATT Instructor, was actually referring to Chakotay. That thread was never picked up in Voyager to make it canon, but it was the intent of the producers and writers, that he was who she was talking about, even if not named directly...
First of all, if it wasn't on screen, it isn't canon. Deleted scenes, producer's notes, or forgotten plot threads don't count. I think it was also intended for the colony in "Journey's End" to be Chuckles' colony in the DMZ... but, that was never mentioned on screen, either.
(A slightly better example of your premise, however, would be the Defiant we get in the final two episodes of DS9. The Sao Paulo was supposed to be the Defiant-A, but the only reason why it wasn't was due to the reuse of effects footage to save money. The gaffe is minor, but hard canon is hard canon... and there was no "A" on that hull.)
Abramsverse is canon because the TPTB says it is canon. There is no asterisk nor a notation next to it. The Abramsverse is no different from the Mirror Universe, the AGT Future Universe, the Endgame Future Universe, the timeline where Earth is not the center of the Federation from DS9's Little Green Men, and so on. I find these arguments about the canonicity of various universe so pointless. The Transformers fans don't have these types of arguments nor does the even worse with the various Universes Gundam fans. Those two franchises have more series reboots while having the other older lines still being continued than Treks, but apparently some Trek fans' head just explode from the thought that another alternate universe exists.
I seriously hope this will not be enterprise 2.0 again! But I will keep my fingers crossed that it becomes a good series hopefully we see some of the legends from the previous trek franchises appear as cameos or simply be given an appearance non cameo wise. They should of chosen Ira Behr to write this series.
I seriously hope this will not be enterprise 2.0 again! But I will keep my fingers crossed that it becomes a good series hopefully we see some of the legends from the previous trek franchises appear as cameos or simply be given an appearance non cameo wise. They should of chosen Ira Behr to write this series.
They haven chosen the writers yet. Ira still could write for the sow. Fuller i the show runner...which means he sets the overall tone an pace for the show
Your pain runs deep.
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
I seriously hope this will not be enterprise 2.0 again! But I will keep my fingers crossed that it becomes a good series hopefully we see some of the legends from the previous trek franchises appear as cameos or simply be given an appearance non cameo wise. They should of chosen Ira Behr to write this series.
Cameo huh? Maybe this one could START with Riker walking INTO the Holodeck, instead of the other way around
Abramsverse is canon because the TPTB says it is canon. There is no asterisk nor a notation next to it.
i dont consider jjcrapverse canon at all. i never will no matter what heretical writings you put in front of me no matter who argues what. since this has nothing to do with CBS or their new series as jjcrapverse is paramount owned, this is a pointless debate unless CBS and/or paramount state it themselves there is a partnership on the new series.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Then that is your headcanon, mirror. Please stop trying to argue as if your headcanon were in fact the official interpretation - it's more than a little arrogant, and rather grating as well.
Abramsverse is canon because the TPTB says it is canon. There is no asterisk nor a notation next to it.
i dont consider jjcrapverse canon at all. i never will no matter what heretical writings you put in front of me no matter who argues what. since this has nothing to do with CBS or their new series as jjcrapverse is paramount owned, this is a pointless debate unless CBS and/or paramount state it themselves there is a partnership on the new series.
What you consider canon and what CBS/Paramount consider canon are two different things.
Your pain runs deep.
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
Huh? Who said anything about the quantum realities not seen on screen? "Parallels" gives the canonical basis for the Abrams universe to exist, was my point. Spock Prime ending up in that quantum reality legitimizes its canonicity.
Sorry, I had read your point as being 'why do people treat the Mirror Universe as canon, but not other quantum realities?' (with the mention of Parallels) The fact that Spock Prime winds up in it, has nothing to do with the JJVerse's canonicity... It's canon, because it was an official Star Trek Screen Release. No other qualifier is needed... As a writer, I like the idea of parallel verses, because it opens up more creative possibilities. As a reader/viewer, I actually largely tend to ignore them as 'it's not in my backyard, so who gives a rat's a55 what happens there...' sometimes, I will accept it as a way of justifying differences in characterization/reboot/remakes, such as Starsky and Hutch. Occasionally, I even view them as moral cowardice on the part of a writer who may want to write a piece with one of their characters, but not have the commitment to make it a permanent aspect of the character's saga, so they say it's 'alternaverse', so they can just ignore it when they want. I can accept them as being legitimate and being what they are, but mostly, as mentioned, I just ignore them...
First of all, if it wasn't on screen, it isn't canon. Deleted scenes, producer's notes, or forgotten plot threads don't count. I think it was also intended for the colony in "Journey's End" to be Chuckles' colony in the DMZ... but, that was never mentioned on screen, either.
I agree, they don't count, but equally, I think that some concepts (ie the Chuckles example) deserve to be given more credence than being dismissed as 'it's not on screen so it's not canon', in the same way as things like headcanon and theory-crafting are dismissed for not being on screen, simply because the original intent was there, but never followed through on. Deleted scenes are a slightly trickier proposition, as the criteria then needs to be one of 'why was the scene deleted?' If it deliberately cut, then that is something the director has intentionally removed, therefore removing its importance/validity. If it was simply cut for time, then the director's intent was for it to be there, so in that case, I tend to think that consideration of validity should still be extended... [Edit to add] And with a series as inconsistently written as Voyager was, something like the Chuckles Scenario, was probably 'just forgotten' due to lack of cohesive focus by the writing staff.
(A slightly better example of your premise, however, would be the Defiant we get in the final two episodes of DS9. The Sao Paulo was supposed to be the Defiant-A, but the only reason why it wasn't was due to the reuse of effects footage to save money. The gaffe is minor, but hard canon is hard canon... and there was no "A" on that hull.)
Exactly... The budgetary constriction was the reason. On the flipside, if I recall, the Sao Paulo had a different color sceme to the bridge, which would be an example of proof as to it being a different ship (such as the rumor that the Titanic was actually the sister ship renamed) even if it was externally identical. Ultimately, it is an inconsistency to Trek's established pattern, and which requires headcanon hand-wavium to truly address, but equally, it wouldn't be the only time Trek has done something stupid or made a mistake...
Comments
I'm hoping for either this, or a show set entirely in the Mirror Universe.
And, yes it is off-topic, but whether or not the JJ-verse is canon depends on how Worf fared in the tournament on Forcas III. Did he win, or did he come in ninth? If the JJ-verse is canon, your answer must be "both."
I like where you're at there...but the answer is yes. No need to get cute with it.
The closest example to something non-broadcast being canon I can think of, is the TNG Companion clarrifies Ro's not-naming names name-drop reference of her ATT Instructor, was actually referring to Chakotay. That thread was never picked up in Voyager to make it canon, but it was the intent of the producers and writers, that he was who she was talking about, even if not named directly...
Huh? Who said anything about the quantum realities not seen on screen? "Parallels" gives the canonical basis for the Abrams universe to exist, was my point. Spock Prime ending up in that quantum reality legitimizes its canonicity.
First of all, if it wasn't on screen, it isn't canon. Deleted scenes, producer's notes, or forgotten plot threads don't count. I think it was also intended for the colony in "Journey's End" to be Chuckles' colony in the DMZ... but, that was never mentioned on screen, either.
(A slightly better example of your premise, however, would be the Defiant we get in the final two episodes of DS9. The Sao Paulo was supposed to be the Defiant-A, but the only reason why it wasn't was due to the reuse of effects footage to save money. The gaffe is minor, but hard canon is hard canon... and there was no "A" on that hull.)
Face palming the enemy one at a time.
They haven chosen the writers yet. Ira still could write for the sow. Fuller i the show runner...which means he sets the overall tone an pace for the show
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
Cameo huh? Maybe this one could START with Riker walking INTO the Holodeck, instead of the other way around
i dont consider jjcrapverse canon at all. i never will no matter what heretical writings you put in front of me no matter who argues what. since this has nothing to do with CBS or their new series as jjcrapverse is paramount owned, this is a pointless debate unless CBS and/or paramount state it themselves there is a partnership on the new series.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
What you consider canon and what CBS/Paramount consider canon are two different things.
Let us explore it... together. Each man hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me... and gain strength from the sharing.
I agree, they don't count, but equally, I think that some concepts (ie the Chuckles example) deserve to be given more credence than being dismissed as 'it's not on screen so it's not canon', in the same way as things like headcanon and theory-crafting are dismissed for not being on screen, simply because the original intent was there, but never followed through on. Deleted scenes are a slightly trickier proposition, as the criteria then needs to be one of 'why was the scene deleted?' If it deliberately cut, then that is something the director has intentionally removed, therefore removing its importance/validity. If it was simply cut for time, then the director's intent was for it to be there, so in that case, I tend to think that consideration of validity should still be extended... [Edit to add] And with a series as inconsistently written as Voyager was, something like the Chuckles Scenario, was probably 'just forgotten' due to lack of cohesive focus by the writing staff.
Exactly... The budgetary constriction was the reason. On the flipside, if I recall, the Sao Paulo had a different color sceme to the bridge, which would be an example of proof as to it being a different ship (such as the rumor that the Titanic was actually the sister ship renamed) even if it was externally identical. Ultimately, it is an inconsistency to Trek's established pattern, and which requires headcanon hand-wavium to truly address, but equally, it wouldn't be the only time Trek has done something stupid or made a mistake...