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The Temporal Cold War and Restoring Romulus

We can assume there is no Sela in the Yesterday's Enterprise timeline. We know that Sela is responsible for the Iconian vendetta against the Romulans and their targeting of Romulus. We can infer that timelines and universes without a Sela generally should have an intact Romulus. The loss of Romulus should be specific to timelines with a Sela. (And, confusingly the Mirror Universe and others might or may not have their own Sela, although I'd say there's a good chance most of them don't and therefore have a Romulus in 2410.)

Okay. We know from the dev blogs that the Yesterday's Enterprise timeline (which is overrun by Tholians) can be visited using future tech because the Na'kuhl are attacking it.

So here's a nutty pitch:

A sequel to Temporal Ambassador where Sela, perhaps curious about her human ancestry, makes a pilgrimage to her mother's timeline.

There, she finds an intact Romulus... although it is likely scarred or enslaved by war with the Tholians.

There is a way to hit two birds with one stone, addressing both the Tholian occupation and the Prime Universe's lack of a Romulus:

Hijack the Tholian technology (which can transport large things like starships and starbases between universes, as we've seen) to transport THAT Romulus into the Prime Universe. This allows them to escape Tholian occupation and it should create a major opportunity to re-establish the Star Empire here; a damaged and recovering Romulus is still a better power base than none at all. And it would be, in some sense, Sela bridging the two worlds of her parents in a way that fulfills her character arc.

Honestly, if you wanted to kill her off, that would be about the dramatically most satisfying way to do it as well. The loss of Prime Romulus was her fault and her atonement/final sacrifice could be to bring us a Romulus from her mother's universe, replacing what she inadvertantly destroyed. It's penance.

Thoughts?

Comments

  • thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,166 Arc User
    It is an interesting idea, but the most important question is whether CBS would allow them to do something this major. I'm thinking not.

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  • thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,166 Arc User
    That said, this might be a good move, because it would almost certainly contradict any future Trek canon set in the same time period as STO, and therefore put a rest to any debate about whether STO is canon or not.

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  • bardbrain#1199 bardbrain Member Posts: 22 Arc User
    It is an interesting idea, but the most important question is whether CBS would allow them to do something this major. I'm thinking not.

    From what I have heard, CBS will allow a great many things provided they can be undone. Hence, the novels were able to kill Janeway but they subsequently brought her back. From what I've heard, you can kill just about anybody or do just about anything on two conditions as a licensee:

    1) You have a reset button. In this case, being an alternate Romulus that was stolen is a fine built-in reset button. It doesn't negate Romulus being blown up. It can go back where it came from at any time.

    2) They think the story has thematic merit. And, well, this is a convoluted idea on certain levels but the idea of Sela being responsible for the loss of Romulus and repaying that debt after a pilgrimage to fully grasp both sides of her heritage is, well... It's a story with some thematic depth.

    You have Sela apparently sacrifice herself to bring the other Romulus over. If and when CBS says it has to go back, you send it back and (potentially) bring back Sela.
  • twg042370twg042370 Member Posts: 2,312 Arc User
    We don't need the RSE back. New Romulus is already playing power broker in two quadrants, which is far better than Sela and Hakeev ever did. Leave it dead.
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  • rattler2rattler2 Member, Star Trek Online Moderator Posts: 58,667 Community Moderator
    The power requirements for bringing a planet from one timeline to another is... I don't think ANYTHING has that much power. And don't say Omega or Triolic Waves, as Omega could only move a Dyson Sphere from one location to another IN THE SAME TIMELINE, and Triolic Waves are dangerous to humanoid life.

    Also... the fact that the previous Romulus and Remus are still there, as a debris field, means not only do you risk having the planet materialize INSIDE the debris field, if it somehow does come through without chunks inside TRIBBLE with the planet, its going to get hammered by the debris from the previous planet falling into its gravitational field.
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  • bardbrain#1199 bardbrain Member Posts: 22 Arc User
    twg042370 wrote: »
    We don't need the RSE back. New Romulus is already playing power broker in two quadrants, which is far better than Sela and Hakeev ever did. Leave it dead.

    New Romulus doesn't have buildings! :-)

    But, really, I'm thinking more about how fun it would be to pump the RSE back up as an adversarial faction to the RR, the KDF, and the Feds. Not necessarily friend or foe but formidible, without relying on Iconian or Borg backing. An adventure zone where the people you're helping might doublecross you seems fun to me.
  • vegeta50024vegeta50024 Member Posts: 2,336 Arc User
    twg042370 wrote: »
    We don't need the RSE back. New Romulus is already playing power broker in two quadrants, which is far better than Sela and Hakeev ever did. Leave it dead.

    New Romulus doesn't have buildings! :-)

    But, really, I'm thinking more about how fun it would be to pump the RSE back up as an adversarial faction to the RR, the KDF, and the Feds. Not necessarily friend or foe but formidible, without relying on Iconian or Borg backing. An adventure zone where the people you're helping might doublecross you seems fun to me.

    If you're talking about New Romulus in terms of the small portion we see in the adventure zone, that's not much to go by.

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  • lordvalecortezlordvalecortez Member Posts: 479 Arc User
    Romulus won't get restored. It's too big of a thing to happen. Plus it would detract from the refugee state of the RR, which is only surviving thanks to it playing the Feds and KDF against each other. The Romulans as a proper galactic power won't be a thing for a long, long, long, long, time. After all, it's only been a year in the timeline. One simply does not go from fledgling refugee state to major galactic power in a year. The suspension of disbelief required for that was used up when a midshipman graduated and made it up to vice admiral in a year, and up to fleet admiral soon after.
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  • bardbrain#1199 bardbrain Member Posts: 22 Arc User
    Romulus won't get restored. It's too big of a thing to happen. Plus it would detract from the refugee state of the RR, which is only surviving thanks to it playing the Feds and KDF against each other. The Romulans as a proper galactic power won't be a thing for a long, long, long, long, time. After all, it's only been a year in the timeline. One simply does not go from fledgling refugee state to major galactic power in a year. The suspension of disbelief required for that was used up when a midshipman graduated and made it up to vice admiral in a year, and up to fleet admiral soon after.

    A year? Romulus blew up something like 23 years ago. I'd imagine many of the RR's recruits were born after Romulus blew up.
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  • lordvalecortezlordvalecortez Member Posts: 479 Arc User
    The RR got a homeworld in 2409. They have had a year to: Settle the planet, attract settlers, build infrastructure, build a shipyard, build ships from said shipyard, train personnel to man said ships. Prior to the founding of New Romulus, the RR was a rag tag flotilla of ships. That was their "secure" power base.

    Did they have sympathetic planets that might have helped them? Sure. But those planets belonged to the RSE which was actively trying to hunt down their rebel problem, ie the Republicans.

    Even if the Tal Shiar were bad at it, being a nomadic fleet does not make you a Superpower able to project force on a galactic level. Nor does have a planet for a year. They aren't self sufficient by a long shot and just barely began to have a hope of producing their own, well, everything. Everything they have is stolen from the RSE.

    The RR is a buffer state between the Fed and the KDF. In 20 years it might be a local power if it can attract more RSE worlds to its banner. It just lacks the everything right now to be anything more than a buffer state.

    And for the record I would love nothing more than the RSE to be restored to its proper and rightful imperial glory. But "Republic" is one of those things that absolutely has to be shown as the true and proper way because democracy is the only proper form of government any sane individual should ever want. While "Empire" is evil and bad and must be put down wherever possible.
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  • lianthelialianthelia Member Posts: 7,896 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »
    The power requirements for bringing a planet from one timeline to another is... I don't think ANYTHING has that much power. And don't say Omega or Triolic Waves, as Omega could only move a Dyson Sphere from one location to another IN THE SAME TIMELINE, and Triolic Waves are dangerous to humanoid life.

    Also... the fact that the previous Romulus and Remus are still there, as a debris field, means not only do you risk having the planet materialize INSIDE the debris field, if it somehow does come through without chunks inside TRIBBLE with the planet, its going to get hammered by the debris from the previous planet falling into its gravitational field.

    Yeah...can't imagine that would be pretty, all that planetary debris, crashing down...killing all those people...probably kill everyone...would make the ground below look like swiss cheese, plus kick up all that dust from all those impacts.

    Someone willing to kill millions to billions of people to get their planet back? Plus who knows how habitable it would be after such a intense bombardment.
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  • lordinsanelordinsane Member Posts: 274 Arc User
    It is certainly possible to leapfrog in power and influence if you can inherit already established infrastructure - which of course is something the Republic has been implied to have done after the RSE's post-Sela collapse (even before her disappearance there were worlds of the pre-Hobus RSE openly looking into joining the Republic, and that's not going to look less attractive with their main competitors falling apart into infighting). Stolen doesn't exactly apply in circumstances like that.
    lianthelia wrote: »
    Yeah...can't imagine that would be pretty, all that planetary debris, crashing down...killing all those people...probably kill everyone...would make the ground below look like swiss cheese, plus kick up all that dust from all those impacts.

    Someone willing to kill millions to billions of people to get their planet back? Plus who knows how habitable it would be after such a intense bombardment.
    It would probably have to be scaled up to switch Romulus as in the system, which of course makes the power needs even more ridiculous.
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