Ah my time to reiterate how much I absolutely despise time travel and temporal mechanics.
However, nicely written, great story, really enjoyed it. Walker has a got a whip smart crew there, himself included. Curious about this relationship with his Cardassian Officer though. And a Lefler. Fascinating. I'm sure the family rule book has expanded exponentially with temporal based rules.
It would be interesting to see a distinction between the various timestreams and the concept of the multiverse. Being able to monitor multiple possibilities is difficult enough to grasp let alone multiple universes at the same time, but any reference would be nice.
As I understand it, each multiverse has its own set of multiple time streams, which is why Crisis on Infinite Earths never reset Marvel.
Look at it this way. The episode Parallels where Worf was bouncing across quantum realities. Those were all different parallel timelines. But none of those were the Mirror Universe, which while part of the Star Trek Multiverse, has its own set of distinct timestreams associated with it.
If it wasn't already known that the T6 constitution class was a no go then it would by now be ranked as the most likely vessel for the anniversary.
Wells class is also not a likely candidate. Better continue speculating for now.
Although...
Using the Defiant (NCC-1764) which is from the Mirror Universe, could conceivably be a possible way for Cryptic to skirt around the T-5/6 issue. Technically, it's possible it is no longer considered a Constitution Class vessel, as the Mirror Universe folks could have upgraded it to be a much more capable 24th century ship.
We might just end up having our Anniversary Cake and eating it too.
Umm no.
The Terrans steal technology, developing it really isn't their style. They lack the innovation of their Prime Universe counterparts. Like Klingons they're much more interested in conquest and taking technology that interests them rather than making it themselves.
How funny! I was just talking with the team re: pushing for another one of those for our next set of blogs!
Say, any chance we can get these awesome behind-the-scenes stories added in-game for those poor folks who don't frequent the forums? There is a lot of really rich lore here that helps make sense of what is happening in-game. It would be great to re-open and make Memory Alpha the in-game place to find it:
If it wasn't already known that the T6 constitution class was a no go then it would by now be ranked as the most likely vessel for the anniversary.
Wells class is also not a likely candidate. Better continue speculating for now.
Although...
Using the Defiant (NCC-1764) which is from the Mirror Universe, could conceivably be a possible way for Cryptic to skirt around the T-5/6 issue. Technically, it's possible it is no longer considered a Constitution Class vessel, as the Mirror Universe folks could have upgraded it to be a much more capable 24th century ship.
We might just end up having our Anniversary Cake and eating it too.
not really, anything pertaining directly to the connie in any shape or form is locked down by cbs and paramount in both cases. there is no technicality i can see even if the class name was changed because visually its the connie that everyone knows.
So name it "Mirror universe adapted light cruiser" and give it a unique (optional!) skin. Not the Defiant, and not a Connie, but the Terran's initial attempt to reproduce it. A Connie with an NX-class aesthetic and a Terran Empire emphasis on tactical systems.
That makes no sense, we know that they mastered construction of the Constitution class by the mid 23rd century, when the class would've naturally appeared. Upgrading it to a 24th century ship would just make an Ambassador or Galaxy class.
So the Na'kuhl want to restart the Yesterday's Enterprise timeline? Interesting. And wasn't it the Dominion that conquered the Alpha/Beta Quadrants in that timeline? The Tholians just got a chunk of space for helping out.
And it's interesting that they chose to bring up the U.S.S. Defiant. If they pursue a story arc based on The Tholian Web/In a Mirror Darkly it might conflict with my Foundry mission. :P
That is correct, the Tholians signed a non aggression pact and the Dominion split Romulan, Klingon, and Federation space with them for being a friend.
If you look closely at this story, it seems to bring up something I've been suspicious of for some time: Not just one but two (at least) alternate timelines/universes at play here. The first one involves the Defiant, which ends up in the classic Mirror Universe where you've got the Terran Empire and Mirror-Leeta. The second one that we are reminded of in this story is the one that involves the Enterprise-C which, according to the "Temporal Ambassador" episode, makes a [brief] stop in another timeline where the Terran Empire doesn't exist, and the Tholians are one of the major powers in the quadrant. It's this second timline that's made me wonder whether or not it's the reason the Tholians are so involved in the current STO storyline. We could end up in a three-way battle between "us," the Mirror Universe, and the Tholians
No. The Mirror Universe doesn't interact with the Tholians Rule Universe. They come from two separate temporal events. Through interphasic space the Tholians do have access to the Mirror Universe, but that had nothing to do with Temporal Ambassador.
Though as I understand it, the Tholians have a multidimensional Assembly, their territory doesn't just exist in one timeline or quantum reality. Which is a great way to have more space without controlling more territory really.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
We know the original Connie was shot down for a time. There are reasonable guesses that it was something CBS shot down to give Paramount more room to license the 2009 Connie.
CBS shooting it down at that time didn't mean CBS was forever against it. It doesn't mean the reason CBS was against it was "canon reasons" or plausibility. It might have simply been to try to encourage TOS fans to try 2009 Star Trek video games to get their fix. "If we take bacon off the menu, maybe we can sell more ham."
Now, Cryptic, after being shot down, cited plausibility reasons in an "Oh, well. It probably wouldn't have worked anyway" sense. And for all we know, the reason we didn't see "anything close" was because Cryptic, after being denied the old style Connie, reasoned that introducing an updated Connie would just spark demands for a classic style Connie that they could not produce.
And I will add: CBS approved a new late 24th century Constitution Class update for Star Trek Timelines last year. Which says to me that the rejection Cryptic previously got was:
- Specific to when Cryptic asked the question. - Possibly NOT a ban on any form of Connie update, which might have been Cryptic's call to avoid similar ships if they couldn't do the main ship.
Ie. "If we can't serve bacon, let's take omelettes off the menu so we don't get swamped with bacon requests."
It's nice to know that Temporal Ambassador's getting an update. Because from the story, it definitely looks like it.
I wonder if there'll be a Temporal Agent Recruit event like the MACO and Delta Recruit events that happened before. Thing is, Delta Recruit dealt with SF, KDF, and Romulan temporal operatives.
I also wonder if this is a lead up to the second part of New Dawn, or is it the middle act?
I'd like to see T6 Timeships become available to players (that is non-Krenim).
Walker rubbed the stubble on his chin once again. Sixteen hours in the command chair wasn’t doing him any favors.
Then sleep, Walker!
I think I laughted at that more than I should've XD
So the Na'kuhl have no problems letting the xenophobic Tholians running the show in the quadrant?
Let's say they alter events in the Temporal Ambassador episode and destroy the Enterprise-C before it can escape the Tholians.
The Enterprise-C is destroyed before it could protect that Klingon colony from a Romulan ambush.
Buut... by Enterprise missing that window, we'd be back at Yesterday's Enterprise and the Klingons tearing away at the Federation. Sooo... the Temporal Ambassador episode played out in the Yesterday's Enterprise timeline?
As a side effect, Sela wouldn't be around >> she never time travels back to ancient Iconia in 2410 and the Icos won't hold a grudge against us (especially the Romulans), which would mean the Hobus Event AND the Iconian war would not happen.
Okay, dizzy now XD
But it's cool to brainstorm over it! ^^
"Ad astra audacter eamus in alis fidelium."
-
"To boldly go to the stars on the wings of the faithful."
We know the original Connie was shot down for a time. There are reasonable guesses that it was something CBS shot down to give Paramount more room to license the 2009 Connie.
CBS shooting it down at that time didn't mean CBS was forever against it. It doesn't mean the reason CBS was against it was "canon reasons" or plausibility. It might have simply been to try to encourage TOS fans to try 2009 Star Trek video games to get their fix. "If we take bacon off the menu, maybe we can sell more ham."
Now, Cryptic, after being shot down, cited plausibility reasons in an "Oh, well. It probably wouldn't have worked anyway" sense. And for all we know, the reason we didn't see "anything close" was because Cryptic, after being denied the old style Connie, reasoned that introducing an updated Connie would just spark demands for a classic style Connie that they could not produce.
And I will add: CBS approved a new late 24th century Constitution Class update for Star Trek Timelines last year. Which says to me that the rejection Cryptic previously got was:
- Specific to when Cryptic asked the question.
- Possibly NOT a ban on any form of Connie update, which might have been Cryptic's call to avoid similar ships if they couldn't do the main ship.
Ie. "If we can't serve bacon, let's take omelettes off the menu so we don't get swamped with bacon requests."
in otherwords you dont know if cbs is going to do anything with the connie. but its been shot down long ago because cbs wants to matain its exclusivity like the android race. in the end if cbs is looking to keep the connie exclusive, then it will be kept as such. but there is only one way to know and thats in september when the 50th anni arrives because if it does not turn up then, then it will never turn up.
enough derailing the thread?
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
The second one that we are reminded of in this story is the one that involves the Enterprise-C which, according to the "Temporal Ambassador" episode, makes a [brief] stop in another timeline where the Terran Empire doesn't exist,
You know, Temporal Instigations is being idiotic again, today.
Except for that "hanging around in a time-spot they don't need to be seen hanging in", who cares if they leave at "2200 Thursday 'local' time" or "0600 Friday", either way they'll show up at the precise date/moment they set their timewarper to drop them off at...
So why doesn't Walker make sure to give his crew (and him get) a full "night's" rest before every instigation...
Oh, I'm sorry - I meant "Incursion" / Correction...
Detecting big-time "anti-old-school" bias here. NX? Lobi. TOS/TMP Connie? Super-promotion-box. (aka the two hardest ways to get ships) Excelsior & all 3 TNG "big hero" ships? C-Store. Please Equalize...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
Yup, still hate the temporal cold war story line. It's a shame we now have to sort out all the loose ends forced upon Enterprise by some idiotic producers who wanted a show set in the future to be more "futuristic".
> @mirrorchaos said: > bardbrain bardbrain#1199 > > wrote: » > > That's potentially a huge overstatement. > > We know the original Connie was shot down for a time. There are reasonable guesses that it was something CBS shot down to give Paramount more room to license the 2009 Connie. > > CBS shooting it down at that time didn't mean CBS was forever against it. It doesn't mean the reason CBS was against it was "canon reasons" or plausibility. It might have simply been to try to encourage TOS fans to try 2009 Star Trek video games to get their fix. "If we take bacon off the menu, maybe we can sell more ham." > > Now, Cryptic, after being shot down, cited plausibility reasons in an "Oh, well. It probably wouldn't have worked anyway" sense. And for all we know, the reason we didn't see "anything close" was because Cryptic, after being denied the old style Connie, reasoned that introducing an updated Connie would just spark demands for a classic style Connie that they could not produce. > > And I will add: CBS approved a new late 24th century Constitution Class update for Star Trek Timelines last year. Which says to me that the rejection Cryptic previously got was: > > - Specific to when Cryptic asked the question. > - Possibly NOT a ban on any form of Connie update, which might have been Cryptic's call to avoid similar ships if they couldn't do the main ship. > > Ie. "If we can't serve bacon, let's take omelettes off the menu so we don't get swamped with bacon requests." > > > > > in otherwords you dont know if cbs is going to do anything with the connie. but its been shot down long ago because cbs wants to matain its exclusivity like the android race. in the end if cbs is looking to keep the connie exclusive, then it will be kept as such. but there is only one way to know and thats in september when the 50th anni arrives because if it does not turn up then, then it will never turn up. > > enough derailing the thread?
I don't they did open it last year for Timelines, supposedly after being displeased that Cryptic even had low tier Connies. (Apparently, Cryptic jumped the gun on that one which lends strength to the idea that it was about branding/marketing.)
I'll say this:
This is the 50th anniversary year. If there were ever a time to do it, even as a limited release, it would be this year. And at releasing it any time other than this year would launch a bunch of doom threads here and even on reddit, I think. Not that Cryptic any game producer can help but have doom threads but doing something you said you wouldn't do, ordinarily, drives speculation that your numbers are in trouble. See: WoW and flying mounts in the old world. A largely positive change in general (not great for open PvP but that was kind of a dying thing except as a griefing tool since players were focused elsewhere anyway). But it led to people's nostalgia getting disrupted and a lot of doom speculation (silly but real) and the net result of Cataclysm ended up being a decline. Even good changes can cost you players if they change the flavor of the game.
So, really, just my $.02 but while nobody knows if CBS will reverse the decision or Cryptic will ask again, I think the 50th anniversary year, particularly as a limited "login event release, miss it and you miss out" would be the best way to do it.
And with alternate timelines in play, maybe we could visit, say, a timeline where the Federation became nomadic and earth was destroyed so they spent 300 years upgrading a fleet of Connies during an exodus for the Delta Quadrant in that timeline because they couldn't build new ships and they couldn't stop. Think Voyager's trip in a fleet of Connies, spending 300 years upgrading while en route and without shipyard supplies once they got there.
We visit that timeline, get one of those ships, boom.
If it wasn't already known that the T6 constitution class was a no go then it would by now be ranked as the most likely vessel for the anniversary.
Wells class is also not a likely candidate. Better continue speculating for now.
Although...
Using the Defiant (NCC-1764) which is from the Mirror Universe, could conceivably be a possible way for Cryptic to skirt around the T-5/6 issue. Technically, it's possible it is no longer considered a Constitution Class vessel, as the Mirror Universe folks could have upgraded it to be a much more capable 24th century ship.
We might just end up having our Anniversary Cake and eating it too.
Since this is not only the Anniversary celebration for STO, but the 50th anniversary of Trek itself, such a ship would be REALLY fitting.
speaking as a proud Romulan Admiral, last thing I want is some retro plate-and-sausage ship We had one of those in one of the missions, and I binned it. yuk, federation tech.
We're in Post-Iconian era now, with salvaged Iconian tech, Kremin time-tech, lets have future ships. Lets move on.
LUKARI GUERILLA GARDENING MILITIA - Glowing fingers are Growing fingers!
Seventeen temporal violations for Kirk? I can only remember seven offhand: The Naked Time, Tomorrow Is Yesterday, Assignment: Earth, The City On The Edge Of Forever, All Our Yesterdays, The Voyage Home, and Generations.
Seventeen temporal violations for Kirk? I can only remember seven offhand: The Naked Time, Tomorrow Is Yesterday, Assignment: Earth, The City On The Edge Of Forever, All Our Yesterdays, The Voyage Home, and Generations.
Well, I can think of at least one more with Yesteryear in the Animated Series. Plus, we only really got to see three years of the Enterprise' historic five-year-mission. So I can certainly believe it was as high as seventeen.
If it wasn't already known that the T6 constitution class was a no go then it would by now be ranked as the most likely vessel for the anniversary.
Wells class is also not a likely candidate. Better continue speculating for now.
Although...
Using the Defiant (NCC-17 64) which is from the Mirror Universe, could conceivably be a possible way for Cryptic to skirt around the T-5/6 issue. Technically, it's possible it is no longer considered a Constitution Class vessel, as the Mirror Universe folks could have upgraded it to be a much more capable 24th century ship.
We might just end up having our Anniversary Cake and eating it too.
I believe I just heard all the TOS fans wetting themselves.
If it wasn't already known that the T6 constitution class was a no go then it would by now be ranked as the most likely vessel for the anniversary.
Wells class is also not a likely candidate. Better continue speculating for now.
Although...
Using the Defiant (NCC-1764) which is from the Mirror Universe, could conceivably be a possible way for Cryptic to skirt around the T-5/6 issue. Technically, it's possible it is no longer considered a Constitution Class vessel, as the Mirror Universe folks could have upgraded it to be a much more capable 24th century ship.
We might just end up having our Anniversary Cake and eating it too.
not really, anything pertaining directly to the connie in any shape or form is locked down by cbs and paramount in both cases. there is no technicality i can see even if the class name was changed because visually its the connie that everyone knows.
So name it "Mirror universe adapted light cruiser" and give it a unique (optional!) skin. Not the Defiant, and not a Connie, but the Terran's initial attempt to reproduce it. A Connie with an NX-class aesthetic and a Terran Empire emphasis on tactical systems.
Seventeen temporal violations for Kirk? I can only remember seven offhand: The Naked Time, Tomorrow Is Yesterday, Assignment: Earth, The City On The Edge Of Forever, All Our Yesterdays, The Voyage Home, and Generations.
Well, I can think of at least one more with Yesteryear in the Animated Series. Plus, we only really got to see three years of the Enterprise' historic five-year-mission. So I can certainly believe it was as high as seventeen.
I'm surprised they haven't realized that there were more than 17 - that number came from a DS9 episode, and not all of Kirk's adventures would have been well-documented.
So the Na'kuhl (i'm assuming future versions on them), bitter at their world's destruction by the Tholians are seeding temporal operatives throughout time to what, destabilize timelines and bring the Tholians into conflict with the Federation?
Are they trying to wipe both sides out in the same conflict by manipulating from behind the scenes?
Or are they just trying to kill off the Federation as they blame us for their worlds destruction because future Fed dude developed the weapon that did the damage?
Also, doesn't this whole "we're upset our world got nuked so were going to get revenge" thing sound a bit too close to the Iconians who we just had to fight off?
Seventeen temporal violations for Kirk? I can only remember seven offhand: The Naked Time, Tomorrow Is Yesterday, Assignment: Earth, The City On The Edge Of Forever, All Our Yesterdays, The Voyage Home, and Generations.
Well, I can think of at least one more with Yesteryear in the Animated Series. Plus, we only really got to see three years of the Enterprise' historic five-year-mission. So I can certainly believe it was as high as seventeen.
One doesn't even have to stretch to that. I would imagine that it would be possible to commit more than one violation in one single time-travel instance. For example:
Person travels to the past using a Federation Starship:
Violation 1: Travelling in time in the first place (contradicts the temporal prime directive)
Viloation 2: Using Starfleet property to faciliate time travel in contradiciton of the temporal prime directive
Viloation 3: interfering with events in that timeline
Violation 4: causing a predestination paradox
(example only - not exhaustive).
So that = four violations for one time-travel event.
Possibly. But the line "seventeen seperate violations," which is the original quote from DS9, seems to imply seventeen different incidents, at least to me.
My real point is, I like lines that imply events happening outside of what we've seen in the show/movies. And it seems fairly reasonable to assume that Kirk had other time travel incidents happen to him. For example, there's a fairly large amount of time between the end of TOS and Kirk being promoted to Admiral which we basically know nothing about. And Kirk could have been involved in time travel incidents before he even became Captain.
Actually, I wonder if Assignment: Earth would even be included in the list of violations, considering the Enterprise specifically went back in time to observe that incident, on orders from Starfleet no less.
Another idea would be to finally release that old Typhoon model with mirror battleship skin. Don't give it any trait unlocks or universal consoles. Just a solid console/BO layout.
Walker rubbed the stubble on his chin once again. Sixteen hours in the command chair wasn’t doing him any favors.
Then sleep, Walker!
I think I laughted at that more than I should've XD
So the Na'kuhl have no problems letting the xenophobic Tholians running the show in the quadrant?
Let's say they alter events in the Temporal Ambassador episode and destroy the Enterprise-C before it can escape the Tholians.
The Enterprise-C is destroyed before it could protect that Klingon colony from a Romulan ambush.
Buut... by Enterprise missing that window, we'd be back at Yesterday's Enterprise and the Klingons tearing away at the Federation. Sooo... the Temporal Ambassador episode played out in the Yesterday's Enterprise timeline?
Actually yes. That was made implicit in Temporal Ambassador. It's the bad future after Yesterday's Enterprise.
As a side effect, Sela wouldn't be around >> she never time travels back to ancient Iconia in 2410 and the Icos won't hold a grudge against us (especially the Romulans), which would mean the Hobus Event AND the Iconian war would not happen.
Okay, dizzy now XD
But it's cool to brainstorm over it! ^^
Yup, still hate the temporal cold war story line. It's a shame we now have to sort out all the loose ends forced upon Enterprise by some idiotic producers who wanted a show set in the future to be more "futuristic".
Someone who obviously knew nothing about sci fi. Time travel is old hat. Ask HG Wells. So some TRIBBLE turned a television show that was supposed to be about the birth of the Federation and turned it into a screwed up time travel story in places. Some kinda genius. Try him and Hang him.
Well.. Robin Lefler was played by Ashley Judd(back when she was around 21). She's 47 now.
I don't know. It seems at times that everyone has done Star Trek. Even the world's biggest movie star The Rock, has done his Star Trek round. I see it as a right of passage.
Judd might be able to stop by a voice acting studio for a few minutes. Assuming it's Robin and not her great great great great great great great great granddaughter.
If it wasn't already known that the T6 constitution class was a no go then it would by now be ranked as the most likely vessel for the anniversary.
Wells class is also not a likely candidate. Better continue speculating for now.
Although...
Using the Defiant (NCC-1764) which is from the Mirror Universe, could conceivably be a possible way for Cryptic to skirt around the T-5/6 issue. Technically, it's possible it is no longer considered a Constitution Class vessel, as the Mirror Universe folks could have upgraded it to be a much more capable 24th century ship.
We might just end up having our Anniversary Cake and eating it too.
Since this is not only the Anniversary celebration for STO, but the 50th anniversary of Trek itself, such a ship would be REALLY fitting.
Well that particular anniversary isn't until September though right?
Though I'm not against an all year celebration.
What about a mission with all seven Enterprises. That said, you'd want all six Captains too.
Seventeen temporal violations for Kirk? I can only remember seven offhand: The Naked Time, Tomorrow Is Yesterday, Assignment: Earth, The City On The Edge Of Forever, All Our Yesterdays, The Voyage Home, and Generations.
You do realize that you've only seen three years and a few weeks of Kirk's total adventures. You're not citing The Animated Series, or the five year mission after the Motion picture.
So the Na'kuhl (i'm assuming future versions on them), bitter at their world's destruction by the Tholians are seeding temporal operatives throughout time to what, destabilize timelines and bring the Tholians into conflict with the Federation?
Are they trying to wipe both sides out in the same conflict by manipulating from behind the scenes?
Or are they just trying to kill off the Federation as they blame us for their worlds destruction because future Fed dude developed the weapon that did the damage?
Also, doesn't this whole "we're upset our world got nuked so were going to get revenge" thing sound a bit too close to the Iconians who we just had to fight off?
My head hurts....
Basically. They've decided not to be victims of temporal technology by becoming aggressors with temporal technology. I would imagine that their destruction of the Federation is by necessity. Look at what the future Federation is doing, TRIBBLE up their plans left and right. Get rid of the Federation. I imagine they then have a plan for the Tholians that plays out later. Curious enough though, by destroying the Federation they should prevent the creation of the Tox Uthat, thus creating a timeline where they don't lose their star and homeworld which is likely the true goal.
Seventeen temporal violations for Kirk? I can only remember seven offhand: The Naked Time, Tomorrow Is Yesterday, Assignment: Earth, The City On The Edge Of Forever, All Our Yesterdays, The Voyage Home, and Generations.
Well, I can think of at least one more with Yesteryear in the Animated Series. Plus, we only really got to see three years of the Enterprise' historic five-year-mission. So I can certainly believe it was as high as seventeen.
One doesn't even have to stretch to that. I would imagine that it would be possible to commit more than one violation in one single time-travel instance. For example:
Person travels to the past using a Federation Starship:
Violation 1: Travelling in time in the first place (contradicts the temporal prime directive)
Viloation 2: Using Starfleet property to faciliate time travel in contradiciton of the temporal prime directive
Viloation 3: interfering with events in that timeline
Violation 4: causing a predestination paradox
(example only - not exhaustive).
So that = four violations for one time-travel event.
This is true. Though it's funny since Kirk chronologically discovered time travel, the charges are retroactive since they preceded the law. Of course...you can do that with time travel.
Seventeen temporal violations for Kirk? I can only remember seven offhand: The Naked Time, Tomorrow Is Yesterday, Assignment: Earth, The City On The Edge Of Forever, All Our Yesterdays, The Voyage Home, and Generations.
Well, I can think of at least one more with Yesteryear in the Animated Series. Plus, we only really got to see three years of the Enterprise' historic five-year-mission. So I can certainly believe it was as high as seventeen.
One doesn't even have to stretch to that. I would imagine that it would be possible to commit more than one violation in one single time-travel instance. For example:
Person travels to the past using a Federation Starship:
Violation 1: Travelling in time in the first place (contradicts the temporal prime directive)
Viloation 2: Using Starfleet property to faciliate time travel in contradiciton of the temporal prime directive
Viloation 3: interfering with events in that timeline
Violation 4: causing a predestination paradox
(example only - not exhaustive).
So that = four violations for one time-travel event.
Possibly. But the line "seventeen seperate violations," which is the original quote from DS9, seems to imply seventeen different incidents, at least to me.
My real point is, I like lines that imply events happening outside of what we've seen in the show/movies. And it seems fairly reasonable to assume that Kirk had other time travel incidents happen to him. For example, there's a fairly large amount of time between the end of TOS and Kirk being promoted to Admiral which we basically know nothing about. And Kirk could have been involved in time travel incidents before he even became Captain.
Actually, I wonder if Assignment: Earth would even be included in the list of violations, considering the Enterprise specifically went back in time to observe that incident, on orders from Starfleet no less.
No. It wouldn't be before. Remember they discovered time travel in TOS. Before that it was just theoretical.
Technically it was supposed to be just once, but because it was hard to get serialized TV on 60s television they actually did it twice. The first and original only, was supposed to be the controlled implosion method to restart the cold warp core that sent them back in time. While in the episode it was only three days, originally it was supposed to send them into Tomorrow is Yesterday. But since that didn't happen they discovered the massive stellar body slingshot method by accident and reproduced it to get home.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
I hate time travel when used in television and games. The one thing that bugs me the most about it is that after the time travel event has occurred and the "problem" has been solved you are left back where you started with no real change or advancement in the overall subject. Case in point, the "Year of Hell" episode of Voyager, they went through all that and at the end of the episode you were left back on the bridge, they went nowhere, they learned nothing and we find out that the entire episode just didn't happen. I hate time travel, it is always such a waste.
I hate time travel when used in television and games. The one thing that bugs me the most about it is that after the time travel event has occurred and the "problem" has been solved you are left back where you started with no real change or advancement in the overall subject. Case in point, the "Year of Hell" episode of Voyager, they went through all that and at the end of the episode you were left back on the bridge, they went nowhere, they learned nothing and we find out that the entire episode just didn't happen. I hate time travel, it is always such a waste.
Depends on how the mechanic is used in my opinion.
Because Voyager destroyed Annorax's ship, all the changes the guy made over the decades in the area gets undone, true, BUT we get a new scenario where Voyager gets a warning that its entering a disputed area, then avoids the region altogether >> Voyager's course gets altered and its interactions with the Krenim remain minimal, non-confrontational. They may have even avoided additional delays, detours, or certain death by not crossing Krenim space into a more dangerous sector.
Another example is to use time travel to explain why something happens; to finally give a cause to the effect and come full circle -- see Midnight.
Or here's another from Butterfly: at the end of the episode we are left with a universe where we don't know what exactly changed -- every reference to the universe before the change is in that shielded computer core and we have no idea how "good" the fix actually is. We do know that the Tuterians (the way things stand at this point after the Stormfront episode) have been assimilated by the Borg and their only contribution to the Annorax time ship project are Clauda's files in the shielded core. Also, there may be more surprises coming down the pipe. We are not back at square one.
"Ad astra audacter eamus in alis fidelium."
-
"To boldly go to the stars on the wings of the faithful."
Comments
However, nicely written, great story, really enjoyed it. Walker has a got a whip smart crew there, himself included. Curious about this relationship with his Cardassian Officer though. And a Lefler. Fascinating. I'm sure the family rule book has expanded exponentially with temporal based rules.
Recruiting locals smart move.
As I understand it, each multiverse has its own set of multiple time streams, which is why Crisis on Infinite Earths never reset Marvel.
Look at it this way. The episode Parallels where Worf was bouncing across quantum realities. Those were all different parallel timelines. But none of those were the Mirror Universe, which while part of the Star Trek Multiverse, has its own set of distinct timestreams associated with it.
Umm no.
The Terrans steal technology, developing it really isn't their style. They lack the innovation of their Prime Universe counterparts. Like Klingons they're much more interested in conquest and taking technology that interests them rather than making it themselves.
Indeed, Memory Alpha is supposed to be for that anyway.
That's why time travel is my Captain's personal nightmare. That makes no sense, we know that they mastered construction of the Constitution class by the mid 23rd century, when the class would've naturally appeared. Upgrading it to a 24th century ship would just make an Ambassador or Galaxy class.
You're grasping at microscopic straws here.
That is correct, the Tholians signed a non aggression pact and the Dominion split Romulan, Klingon, and Federation space with them for being a friend.
No. The Mirror Universe doesn't interact with the Tholians Rule Universe. They come from two separate temporal events. Through interphasic space the Tholians do have access to the Mirror Universe, but that had nothing to do with Temporal Ambassador.
Though as I understand it, the Tholians have a multidimensional Assembly, their territory doesn't just exist in one timeline or quantum reality. Which is a great way to have more space without controlling more territory really.
We know the original Connie was shot down for a time. There are reasonable guesses that it was something CBS shot down to give Paramount more room to license the 2009 Connie.
CBS shooting it down at that time didn't mean CBS was forever against it. It doesn't mean the reason CBS was against it was "canon reasons" or plausibility. It might have simply been to try to encourage TOS fans to try 2009 Star Trek video games to get their fix. "If we take bacon off the menu, maybe we can sell more ham."
Now, Cryptic, after being shot down, cited plausibility reasons in an "Oh, well. It probably wouldn't have worked anyway" sense. And for all we know, the reason we didn't see "anything close" was because Cryptic, after being denied the old style Connie, reasoned that introducing an updated Connie would just spark demands for a classic style Connie that they could not produce.
And I will add: CBS approved a new late 24th century Constitution Class update for Star Trek Timelines last year. Which says to me that the rejection Cryptic previously got was:
- Specific to when Cryptic asked the question.
- Possibly NOT a ban on any form of Connie update, which might have been Cryptic's call to avoid similar ships if they couldn't do the main ship.
Ie. "If we can't serve bacon, let's take omelettes off the menu so we don't get swamped with bacon requests."
I wonder if there'll be a Temporal Agent Recruit event like the MACO and Delta Recruit events that happened before. Thing is, Delta Recruit dealt with SF, KDF, and Romulan temporal operatives.
I also wonder if this is a lead up to the second part of New Dawn, or is it the middle act?
I'd like to see T6 Timeships become available to players (that is non-Krenim).
Then sleep, Walker!
I think I laughted at that more than I should've XD
So the Na'kuhl have no problems letting the xenophobic Tholians running the show in the quadrant?
Let's say they alter events in the Temporal Ambassador episode and destroy the Enterprise-C before it can escape the Tholians.
The Enterprise-C is destroyed before it could protect that Klingon colony from a Romulan ambush.
Buut... by Enterprise missing that window, we'd be back at Yesterday's Enterprise and the Klingons tearing away at the Federation. Sooo... the Temporal Ambassador episode played out in the Yesterday's Enterprise timeline?
As a side effect, Sela wouldn't be around >> she never time travels back to ancient Iconia in 2410 and the Icos won't hold a grudge against us (especially the Romulans), which would mean the Hobus Event AND the Iconian war would not happen.
Okay, dizzy now XD
But it's cool to brainstorm over it! ^^
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"To boldly go to the stars on the wings of the faithful."
in otherwords you dont know if cbs is going to do anything with the connie. but its been shot down long ago because cbs wants to matain its exclusivity like the android race. in the end if cbs is looking to keep the connie exclusive, then it will be kept as such. but there is only one way to know and thats in september when the 50th anni arrives because if it does not turn up then, then it will never turn up.
enough derailing the thread?
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
The Federation, not the Terran Empire
Except for that "hanging around in a time-spot they don't need to be seen hanging in", who cares if they leave at "2200 Thursday 'local' time" or "0600 Friday", either way they'll show up at the precise date/moment they set their timewarper to drop them off at...
So why doesn't Walker make sure to give his crew (and him get) a full "night's" rest before every instigation...
Oh, I'm sorry - I meant "Incursion" / Correction...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
...or a ball of string?
Voice acting possibility?
Also: Dr Who anyone? Turns out it's not a good idea...
My character Tsin'xing
> bardbrain bardbrain#1199
>
> wrote: »
>
> That's potentially a huge overstatement.
>
> We know the original Connie was shot down for a time. There are reasonable guesses that it was something CBS shot down to give Paramount more room to license the 2009 Connie.
>
> CBS shooting it down at that time didn't mean CBS was forever against it. It doesn't mean the reason CBS was against it was "canon reasons" or plausibility. It might have simply been to try to encourage TOS fans to try 2009 Star Trek video games to get their fix. "If we take bacon off the menu, maybe we can sell more ham."
>
> Now, Cryptic, after being shot down, cited plausibility reasons in an "Oh, well. It probably wouldn't have worked anyway" sense. And for all we know, the reason we didn't see "anything close" was because Cryptic, after being denied the old style Connie, reasoned that introducing an updated Connie would just spark demands for a classic style Connie that they could not produce.
>
> And I will add: CBS approved a new late 24th century Constitution Class update for Star Trek Timelines last year. Which says to me that the rejection Cryptic previously got was:
>
> - Specific to when Cryptic asked the question.
> - Possibly NOT a ban on any form of Connie update, which might have been Cryptic's call to avoid similar ships if they couldn't do the main ship.
>
> Ie. "If we can't serve bacon, let's take omelettes off the menu so we don't get swamped with bacon requests."
>
>
>
>
> in otherwords you dont know if cbs is going to do anything with the connie. but its been shot down long ago because cbs wants to matain its exclusivity like the android race. in the end if cbs is looking to keep the connie exclusive, then it will be kept as such. but there is only one way to know and thats in september when the 50th anni arrives because if it does not turn up then, then it will never turn up.
>
> enough derailing the thread?
I don't they did open it last year for Timelines, supposedly after being displeased that Cryptic even had low tier Connies. (Apparently, Cryptic jumped the gun on that one which lends strength to the idea that it was about branding/marketing.)
I'll say this:
This is the 50th anniversary year. If there were ever a time to do it, even as a limited release, it would be this year. And at releasing it any time other than this year would launch a bunch of doom threads here and even on reddit, I think. Not that Cryptic any game producer can help but have doom threads but doing something you said you wouldn't do, ordinarily, drives speculation that your numbers are in trouble. See: WoW and flying mounts in the old world. A largely positive change in general (not great for open PvP but that was kind of a dying thing except as a griefing tool since players were focused elsewhere anyway). But it led to people's nostalgia getting disrupted and a lot of doom speculation (silly but real) and the net result of Cataclysm ended up being a decline. Even good changes can cost you players if they change the flavor of the game.
So, really, just my $.02 but while nobody knows if CBS will reverse the decision or Cryptic will ask again, I think the 50th anniversary year, particularly as a limited "login event release, miss it and you miss out" would be the best way to do it.
And with alternate timelines in play, maybe we could visit, say, a timeline where the Federation became nomadic and earth was destroyed so they spent 300 years upgrading a fleet of Connies during an exodus for the Delta Quadrant in that timeline because they couldn't build new ships and they couldn't stop. Think Voyager's trip in a fleet of Connies, spending 300 years upgrading while en route and without shipyard supplies once they got there.
We visit that timeline, get one of those ships, boom.
Since this is not only the Anniversary celebration for STO, but the 50th anniversary of Trek itself, such a ship would be REALLY fitting.
We're in Post-Iconian era now, with salvaged Iconian tech, Kremin time-tech, lets have future ships. Lets move on.
Well, I can think of at least one more with Yesteryear in the Animated Series. Plus, we only really got to see three years of the Enterprise' historic five-year-mission. So I can certainly believe it was as high as seventeen.
God I hope not.. I am firmly against T6 Connie/NX
I'm surprised they haven't realized that there were more than 17 - that number came from a DS9 episode, and not all of Kirk's adventures would have been well-documented.
Are they trying to wipe both sides out in the same conflict by manipulating from behind the scenes?
Or are they just trying to kill off the Federation as they blame us for their worlds destruction because future Fed dude developed the weapon that did the damage?
Also, doesn't this whole "we're upset our world got nuked so were going to get revenge" thing sound a bit too close to the Iconians who we just had to fight off?
My head hurts....
Possibly. But the line "seventeen seperate violations," which is the original quote from DS9, seems to imply seventeen different incidents, at least to me.
My real point is, I like lines that imply events happening outside of what we've seen in the show/movies. And it seems fairly reasonable to assume that Kirk had other time travel incidents happen to him. For example, there's a fairly large amount of time between the end of TOS and Kirk being promoted to Admiral which we basically know nothing about. And Kirk could have been involved in time travel incidents before he even became Captain.
Actually, I wonder if Assignment: Earth would even be included in the list of violations, considering the Enterprise specifically went back in time to observe that incident, on orders from Starfleet no less.
Even drunk, Counselor Troi is right. There's never enough time!
Also correct.
Someone who obviously knew nothing about sci fi. Time travel is old hat. Ask HG Wells. So some TRIBBLE turned a television show that was supposed to be about the birth of the Federation and turned it into a screwed up time travel story in places. Some kinda genius. Try him and Hang him.
I don't know. It seems at times that everyone has done Star Trek. Even the world's biggest movie star The Rock, has done his Star Trek round. I see it as a right of passage.
Judd might be able to stop by a voice acting studio for a few minutes. Assuming it's Robin and not her great great great great great great great great granddaughter.
Well that particular anniversary isn't until September though right?
Though I'm not against an all year celebration.
What about a mission with all seven Enterprises. That said, you'd want all six Captains too.
You do realize that you've only seen three years and a few weeks of Kirk's total adventures. You're not citing The Animated Series, or the five year mission after the Motion picture.
Basically. They've decided not to be victims of temporal technology by becoming aggressors with temporal technology. I would imagine that their destruction of the Federation is by necessity. Look at what the future Federation is doing, TRIBBLE up their plans left and right. Get rid of the Federation. I imagine they then have a plan for the Tholians that plays out later. Curious enough though, by destroying the Federation they should prevent the creation of the Tox Uthat, thus creating a timeline where they don't lose their star and homeworld which is likely the true goal.
This is true. Though it's funny since Kirk chronologically discovered time travel, the charges are retroactive since they preceded the law. Of course...you can do that with time travel.
No. It wouldn't be before. Remember they discovered time travel in TOS. Before that it was just theoretical.
Technically it was supposed to be just once, but because it was hard to get serialized TV on 60s television they actually did it twice. The first and original only, was supposed to be the controlled implosion method to restart the cold warp core that sent them back in time. While in the episode it was only three days, originally it was supposed to send them into Tomorrow is Yesterday. But since that didn't happen they discovered the massive stellar body slingshot method by accident and reproduced it to get home.
:: rubs eyes, turns to a pile of sand ::
Depends on how the mechanic is used in my opinion.
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"To boldly go to the stars on the wings of the faithful."