I wonder will they? Last faction specific Carrier went to the Feds in the Atrox...the KDF hasn't gotten a Carrier in a long time and the RR has never gotten one.
So I can't help but wonder if they will get the shaft or just not the kind of attention the Fed one is getting?
Do the KDF and RR need yet another carrier? It's a minor challenge to name KDF ships which do not fall in the flight deck cruiser or carrier category.
The RR also have access to several own designs with carrier pets. It is also a fair question of a full carrier would be compatible with the general play style of the Romulans.
And all this even before someone asks the question if adding a carrier would be worth the investment in time and money considering the relatively small communities.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
See here's the thing, yeah maybe we'll get KDF and Romulan equivalent ships.. but why not let fans design them too?
Given Fed players are already spoiled for choice design wise both in game and canon, why not let players contribute to the other factions?
Honestly I can't think of a single Cryptic KDF ship I like, and maybe one or two Romulan ships that are okay.
Simple, because the contest is more work than just creating a single ship with no fan input. Making it three times also triples this extra work. And will this be rewarded by far higher sales than ever before for a KDF or RR ship?
Probably not.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
I wonder will they? Last faction specific Carrier went to the Feds in the Atrox...the KDF hasn't gotten a Carrier in a long time and the RR has never gotten one.
So I can't help but wonder if they will get the shaft or just not the kind of attention the Fed one is getting?
Do the KDF and RR need yet another carrier? It's a minor challenge to name KDF ships which do not fall in the flight deck cruiser or carrier category.
The RR also have access to several own designs with carrier pets. It is also a fair question of a full carrier would be compatible with the general play style of the Romulans.
And all this even before someone asks the question if adding a carrier would be worth the investment in time and money considering the relatively small communities.
Does the Federation?
If anything the only side that doesn't have a Carrier is the RR...both Fed and KDF have one but RR doesn't.
How would it conflict...instead of decloaking and shooting a lot of weapons you can decloak and shoot your weapons along with dropping your fighters and or frigates...still a ambush.
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
What is completely irrelevant that there were no Carriers in canon or that Star Fleet Battles had loads? SFB is irrelevant to this game but that is where you find them, not from the TV shows or Movies. So, by that manner you can say that there is no basis from the TV Shows or Movies, but we got some. But having got some anyway does not require that they provide one to the Romulans.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I'll likely get a new KDF carrier should it appear, but what I'd really like would be an updated Kar'fi, potentially with the engineer boosted to LtCom command or something.
What did Spock say in 'Amok Time' - 'After a time, you may find that having is not so pleasing a thing after all as wanting. It is not logical, but it is often true.'
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
What is completely irrelevant that there were no Carriers in canon or that Star Fleet Battles had loads? SFB is irrelevant to this game but that is where you find them, not from the TV shows or Movies. So, by that manner you can say that there is no basis from the TV Shows or Movies, but we got some. But having got some anyway does not require that they provide one to the Romulans.
While all of that is technically correct, the fact remains that since they (Cryptic) went down that road and introduced carriers to STO a long time ago - it's just poor form to deprive a part of the playerbase from that gameplay option just out of spite.
Now, if Cryptic actually cared about creating, maintaining and preserving faction diversity like they used to do a looong time ago - you may have had a case here. As it stands nowadays everything is more or less the same for everyone with only small 'touch-ups' as nods that there is something that is supposed to portray different factions around here. So, in the current STO where they've essenitally killed faction diversity, saying that Romulans shouldn't have carriers because there was no basis from the shows (which is btw - correct) - therefore they're not required to make one for the Romulan players would be spiteful.
The assumption that all factions should have equivalent ships is fundamentally flawed, because it assumes that all factions adhere to the same concepts of power projection, strategy & tactics. There is a place for some limited overlap in fleet functions, but I would expect Romulan doctrine to be quite different from Klingon or Federation, based on their characteristics & personal traits.
Frankly, in most Trek series & films, the Klingons are portrayed as rash & overconfident, irrespective of their available combat assets. Romulans are depicted as cunning & subversive, but also overly dogged in the face of overwhelming odds. Federation captains seem to hold a confidence in the back of their mind that if things get out of hand, help is not far away, but their assets are superior enough to hold on until the cavalry arrives.
Cryptic has actually not done a bad job of building some of these biases into the available faction fleets, but many non-Federation players perceive this as a StarFleet preference. I'm personally satisfied with having wider fleet options (outside the Federation) through cross-faction ships, especially since this plays well with the opportunism of the KDF & RR factions.
Expendables Fleet: Andrew - Bajoran Fed Engineer Ken'taura - Rom/Fed Scientist Gwyllim - Human Fed Delta Tac Savik - Vulcan Fed Temporal Sci Dahar Masters Fleet: Alphal'Fa - Alien KDF Engineer Qun'pau - Rom/KDF Engineer D'nesh - Orion KDF Scientist Ghen'khan - Liberated KDF Tac Welcome to StarBug Online - to boldly Bug where no bug has been before!
STO player since November 2013
I wonder will they? Last faction specific Carrier went to the Feds in the Atrox...the KDF hasn't gotten a Carrier in a long time and the RR has never gotten one.
So I can't help but wonder if they will get the shaft or just not the kind of attention the Fed one is getting?
Do the KDF and RR need yet another carrier? It's a minor challenge to name KDF ships which do not fall in the flight deck cruiser or carrier category.
The RR also have access to several own designs with carrier pets. It is also a fair question of a full carrier would be compatible with the general play style of the Romulans.
And all this even before someone asks the question if adding a carrier would be worth the investment in time and money considering the relatively small communities.
Does the Federation?
If anything the only side that doesn't have a Carrier is the RR...both Fed and KDF have one but RR doesn't.
How would it conflict...instead of decloaking and shooting a lot of weapons you can decloak and shoot your weapons along with dropping your fighters and or frigates...still a ambush.
As far as i am concerned they don't need one, but at least for the federation the product is aimed at roughly 60-70% of the players where the KDF and RR are only good for 30-40% combined.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
The assumption that all factions should have equivalent ships is fundamentally flawed, because it assumes that all factions adhere to the same concepts of power projection, strategy & tactics. There is a place for some limited overlap in fleet functions, but I would expect Romulan doctrine to be quite different from Klingon or Federation, based on their characteristics & personal traits.
You're completely right and I would have totally agreed with you a while ago. But I didn't start the assumption that apart from minor touch-ups like cloak/battlecloak, crew size and shield mod all factions should have equivalent ships/assets - Cryptic did with the manner in which they're developing STO. So what I'm doing here is advocating that if the direction we seem to be set in is the factions having equivalent assets apart from minor details that give flavor - it should be a two way street. Not Federation gets everything considered KDF/Romulan exclusive before that exchange while the other two get the middle finger, which is the case with T6 science ships for example.
I agree and understand your point about different doctrine in universe. In STO, however, it's a fully fledged mess. I mean, the Federation has a raider. Yes, let that one sink in - a raider! What could possibly be further apart from Federation doctrine and ethical values?
I would LOVE to see a full carrier that can launch while cloaked the same way the T'Varo can use Torps while cloaked.
Ah yes, the legendary R.R.W. Death Wish/Flying Coffin! (Referring to the fact that shields will be down, while the ship temporarily de-cloaked when launching pets - which in case with carriers is quite often)
I wonder will they? Last faction specific Carrier went to the Feds in the Atrox...the KDF hasn't gotten a Carrier in a long time and the RR has never gotten one.
So I can't help but wonder if they will get the shaft or just not the kind of attention the Fed one is getting?
Do the KDF and RR need yet another carrier? It's a minor challenge to name KDF ships which do not fall in the flight deck cruiser or carrier category.
The RR also have access to several own designs with carrier pets. It is also a fair question of a full carrier would be compatible with the general play style of the Romulans.
And all this even before someone asks the question if adding a carrier would be worth the investment in time and money considering the relatively small communities.
Does the Federation?
If anything the only side that doesn't have a Carrier is the RR...both Fed and KDF have one but RR doesn't.
How would it conflict...instead of decloaking and shooting a lot of weapons you can decloak and shoot your weapons along with dropping your fighters and or frigates...still a ambush.
As far as i am concerned they don't need one, but at least for the federation the product is aimed at roughly 60-70% of the players where the KDF and RR are only good for 30-40% combined.
And that means the other factions don't deserve a product they haven't received in a long time or ever received?
The Feds got the last faction carrier...and the KDF has had this same carriers since before I started playing...we aren't talking about random escort #35 or random cruiser #43...we're talking about a Carrier...something one faction hasn't seen in a long time and other hasn't ever seen.
Feds have 14 T5 to T6 ships with a hangar, KDF has 12, and RR has 10...Feds outnumber the original carrier faction.
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
I wonder will they? Last faction specific Carrier went to the Feds in the Atrox...the KDF hasn't gotten a Carrier in a long time and the RR has never gotten one.
So I can't help but wonder if they will get the shaft or just not the kind of attention the Fed one is getting?
Do the KDF and RR need yet another carrier? It's a minor challenge to name KDF ships which do not fall in the flight deck cruiser or carrier category.
The RR also have access to several own designs with carrier pets. It is also a fair question of a full carrier would be compatible with the general play style of the Romulans.
And all this even before someone asks the question if adding a carrier would be worth the investment in time and money considering the relatively small communities.
Does the Federation?
If anything the only side that doesn't have a Carrier is the RR...both Fed and KDF have one but RR doesn't.
How would it conflict...instead of decloaking and shooting a lot of weapons you can decloak and shoot your weapons along with dropping your fighters and or frigates...still a ambush.
As far as i am concerned they don't need one, but at least for the federation the product is aimed at roughly 60-70% of the players where the KDF and RR are only good for 30-40% combined.
And that means the other factions don't deserve a product they haven't received in a long time or ever received?
The Feds got the last faction carrier...and the KDF has had this same carriers since before I started playing...we aren't talking about random escort #35 or random cruiser #43...we're talking about a Carrier...something one faction hasn't seen in a long time and other hasn't ever seen.
Feds have 14 T5 to T6 ships with a hangar, KDF has 12, and RR has 10...Feds outnumber the original carrier faction.
It means that new ships for the federation are simply more economically viable and thus likely to return the development team investment in time/money. It's a cold hard fact.
Aside from that, you should read this post:
The assumption that all factions should have equivalent ships is fundamentally flawed, because it assumes that all factions adhere to the same concepts of power projection, strategy & tactics. There is a place for some limited overlap in fleet functions, but I would expect Romulan doctrine to be quite different from Klingon or Federation, based on their characteristics & personal traits.
Frankly, in most Trek series & films, the Klingons are portrayed as rash & overconfident, irrespective of their available combat assets. Romulans are depicted as cunning & subversive, but also overly dogged in the face of overwhelming odds. Federation captains seem to hold a confidence in the back of their mind that if things get out of hand, help is not far away, but their assets are superior enough to hold on until the cavalry arrives.
Cryptic has actually not done a bad job of building some of these biases into the available faction fleets, but many non-Federation players perceive this as a StarFleet preference. I'm personally satisfied with having wider fleet options (outside the Federation) through cross-faction ships, especially since this plays well with the opportunism of the KDF & RR factions.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
Hey the monster sized D'deridex has an enormous sized flight deck between the upper and lower wing decks. You could easily get Launch Bay elevators on the lower deck to bring units up to the flight deck. Then off you go. Plenty of space to land there too and be brought back inside.
By the way, I am not being spiteful, my first character and my most played was a Romulan. Just you can't count on Cryptic for one.
Post edited by ltminns on
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I suspect the klingons at the very least will be receiving a t6 voquv upgrade in the near future, perhaps the karfi, but I would suspect voquv to match the federations "true-fed carrier" as the "true-klingon carrier." I imagine they will probably be launched as a pack because cryptic loves packs, but I suspect they will launch together so the devs can slap the same trait on both.
I know the devs didn't want to put out a romulan carrier because they felt the battle cloaking intrinsic to romulans would be unfair on a carrier or something. (They wouldn't even give the klingon carrier a normal cloak siting "too big" only to slap one on the much larger bortas.) Perhaps they will at least give the romulans a carrier but not let it battle cloak, I dunno. As long as it can't launch pets while cloaked I don't really see how it's any different than any other ship with battle cloak.
The Nebula-configured Odyssey needs to be a thing.
6% more critH
15% more crtD
Longer cloaking and more cloaking dmg buff
Free battle cloak on most multi faction ships
Sure...we only lose 40 power...have some of the weakest hull and shield mods...don't get me started on how crappy Singularty cores are compared to M/AM cores...
Still the age old weak argument for some people because they truly have nothing better lol.
The free battle cloak on multi faction ships has me really confused...because I don't know what in thee blue hell you're talking about...piloted by a Human, Klingon, or Romulan multi faction ships are identical to each other.
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
I'm not as optimistic that KDF or Roms will get a carrier, especially if the result of the current Fed carrier contest gets sold alone. From there, I can face the reality far better than most who play carrier, because I never like playing anything bigger than a cruiser. I am just overall not fond of the fact that we only get ships when Feds do, or not even then at times. As for science? I'm not holding my breath for that either. I may decide to roll a Klingon sci if they release a Bird of Prey of comparable size to the Qa'tel raptor. There at least with an abundance of univerals, I can put what ever boff in whatever seat I choose, instead of having to keep my sci boff out of the top spot. Even then, I'm not overly optimistic about that at all.
Also, your sig... OMFG yes! It's going on 4 seasons now of having to listen to that fed voice nonsense. It's bad enough that my Marauder FDC's ship icon on the hud is a fed one, but this female fed cpu voice has got to change.
Comments
Ahh, to be young and full of hope again.
Miracles happen every now and then...even with Cryptic.
Do the KDF and RR need yet another carrier? It's a minor challenge to name KDF ships which do not fall in the flight deck cruiser or carrier category.
The RR also have access to several own designs with carrier pets. It is also a fair question of a full carrier would be compatible with the general play style of the Romulans.
And all this even before someone asks the question if adding a carrier would be worth the investment in time and money considering the relatively small communities.
Probably not.
Does the Federation?
If anything the only side that doesn't have a Carrier is the RR...both Fed and KDF have one but RR doesn't.
How would it conflict...instead of decloaking and shooting a lot of weapons you can decloak and shoot your weapons along with dropping your fighters and or frigates...still a ambush.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
While all of that is technically correct, the fact remains that since they (Cryptic) went down that road and introduced carriers to STO a long time ago - it's just poor form to deprive a part of the playerbase from that gameplay option just out of spite.
Now, if Cryptic actually cared about creating, maintaining and preserving faction diversity like they used to do a looong time ago - you may have had a case here. As it stands nowadays everything is more or less the same for everyone with only small 'touch-ups' as nods that there is something that is supposed to portray different factions around here. So, in the current STO where they've essenitally killed faction diversity, saying that Romulans shouldn't have carriers because there was no basis from the shows (which is btw - correct) - therefore they're not required to make one for the Romulan players would be spiteful.
Frankly, in most Trek series & films, the Klingons are portrayed as rash & overconfident, irrespective of their available combat assets. Romulans are depicted as cunning & subversive, but also overly dogged in the face of overwhelming odds. Federation captains seem to hold a confidence in the back of their mind that if things get out of hand, help is not far away, but their assets are superior enough to hold on until the cavalry arrives.
Cryptic has actually not done a bad job of building some of these biases into the available faction fleets, but many non-Federation players perceive this as a StarFleet preference. I'm personally satisfied with having wider fleet options (outside the Federation) through cross-faction ships, especially since this plays well with the opportunism of the KDF & RR factions.
Savik - Vulcan Fed Temporal Sci
Dahar Masters Fleet: Alphal'Fa - Alien KDF Engineer Qun'pau - Rom/KDF Engineer D'nesh - Orion KDF Scientist Ghen'khan - Liberated KDF Tac
Welcome to StarBug Online - to boldly Bug where no bug has been before!
STO player since November 2013
My character Tsin'xing
As far as i am concerned they don't need one, but at least for the federation the product is aimed at roughly 60-70% of the players where the KDF and RR are only good for 30-40% combined.
You're completely right and I would have totally agreed with you a while ago. But I didn't start the assumption that apart from minor touch-ups like cloak/battlecloak, crew size and shield mod all factions should have equivalent ships/assets - Cryptic did with the manner in which they're developing STO. So what I'm doing here is advocating that if the direction we seem to be set in is the factions having equivalent assets apart from minor details that give flavor - it should be a two way street. Not Federation gets everything considered KDF/Romulan exclusive before that exchange while the other two get the middle finger, which is the case with T6 science ships for example.
I agree and understand your point about different doctrine in universe. In STO, however, it's a fully fledged mess. I mean, the Federation has a raider. Yes, let that one sink in - a raider! What could possibly be further apart from Federation doctrine and ethical values?
Ah yes, the legendary R.R.W. Death Wish/Flying Coffin!
And that means the other factions don't deserve a product they haven't received in a long time or ever received?
The Feds got the last faction carrier...and the KDF has had this same carriers since before I started playing...we aren't talking about random escort #35 or random cruiser #43...we're talking about a Carrier...something one faction hasn't seen in a long time and other hasn't ever seen.
Feds have 14 T5 to T6 ships with a hangar, KDF has 12, and RR has 10...Feds outnumber the original carrier faction.
Roms have the potential to get:
6% more critH
15% more crtD
Longer cloaking and more cloaking dmg buff
Free battle cloak on most multi faction ships
It means that new ships for the federation are simply more economically viable and thus likely to return the development team investment in time/money. It's a cold hard fact.
Aside from that, you should read this post:
By the way, I am not being spiteful, my first character and my most played was a Romulan. Just you can't count on Cryptic for one.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I know the devs didn't want to put out a romulan carrier because they felt the battle cloaking intrinsic to romulans would be unfair on a carrier or something. (They wouldn't even give the klingon carrier a normal cloak siting "too big" only to slap one on the much larger bortas.) Perhaps they will at least give the romulans a carrier but not let it battle cloak, I dunno. As long as it can't launch pets while cloaked I don't really see how it's any different than any other ship with battle cloak.
The Nebula-configured Odyssey needs to be a thing.
Sure...we only lose 40 power...have some of the weakest hull and shield mods...don't get me started on how crappy Singularty cores are compared to M/AM cores...
Still the age old weak argument for some people because they truly have nothing better lol.
The free battle cloak on multi faction ships has me really confused...because I don't know what in thee blue hell you're talking about...piloted by a Human, Klingon, or Romulan multi faction ships are identical to each other.
Also, your sig... OMFG yes! It's going on 4 seasons now of having to listen to that fed voice nonsense. It's bad enough that my Marauder FDC's ship icon on the hud is a fed one, but this female fed cpu voice has got to change.