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Break toys of others if you can't use it?
erikosss
Member Posts: 65 Arc User
So I guess this is the way players work with others now?
If a toy (crit'ing plasma explosions) only works for FAW players and not other players, lets break it for FAW players too.
This is the new "ethics" we will follow in future.
Great.
This sure follows the Star Trek way we have been taught over the generations of series and movies ... not.
If a toy (crit'ing plasma explosions) only works for FAW players and not other players, lets break it for FAW players too.
This is the new "ethics" we will follow in future.
Great.
This sure follows the Star Trek way we have been taught over the generations of series and movies ... not.
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See even tho you're pissed they won't fix a bugged console you're ready to open your wallet for a new scimitar!
In short, they don't have time to fix it. If they did nothing then beam users would still benefit more from it than non-beam users. The temporary fix makes it so it works the same for everybody.
Not to mention the damage output from these consoles were as much as ship mounted weapons.
The biggest problem this game has are ppl like erikosss who keep spending and spending money on this game even though its laggy and the devs dont really do what players expect from them.
Ah, but they are finding the time. Actually, they've found it already. In fact, they're probably working on it right now. You know, these kind of things don't get fixed just because someone wishes it to be fixed. Someone has to go to work, change code, test changes to make sure nothing else was broken, compare results to other references, do more changes to the code, test those changes, and then rinse and repeat.
In essence, adding and balancing new variables (ability for crits to happen with cannons, ability to crit under CSV /CRF, factoring in skill points in part gens or whatever boosts the ability) are all much more complex than simply reducing damage and removing the ability to crit.
So please, stop flaming on people who are human beings, who have lives, and can't cater to your every wish on a whim. The devs are employed by Cryptic, and Cryptic is owned by PWE. Take your griefs up to PWE, instead of lashing out at the devs.
K'Nor - IKS Ch'Tang, Mat'Ha Raptor T6: http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=ikschtang_8710
No, it makes it so it doesn't work for anyone.
There were many better ways to handle the problem other then this lazy and half assed excuse for a 'fix.' It's not like it's a new thing either, it's been that way for months, but as someone else pointed out.. they're too busy churning out T6 Cash Cow ships to be bothered with things like proper bug fixes.
It's easier to hit it with the nerf bat, tell people it's 'temporary,' then just continue to ignore it while they make more ships.
Well we hoped thats how they work but they dont. They are so extremely chaotic its not even funny any more as evidencef by the number of fixed bugs returning in later patches or the amout of game breaking bugs that make it to the live servers even after being reported and the sheer number of abilities that are broken.
So yeah would be nice if what you describe is true but sadly it isnt. Thats why we are complaining.
Everybody makes mistakes but the number of mistakes repeated over and over again points to the sad truth that they dont work as diligently as they should and even more sad is the part where they dont learn from previous mistakes.
Yes it does work the same for everybody. The problem was it only critted with fire-at-will, meaning it didn't crit for cannons. Now it doesn't crit at all no matter what type of weapons you use, thus working the same for everyone.
Obviously people failed to fully read my post where I quoted what bort said.
Edit: I'm fine with the temporary fix to be honest. My only gripe, and I agree with you, is that it was reported for the last several months as a bug that it only critted with FAW. This is something they should have fixed right away, or at least put out this temporary fix some time ago. People kept complaining on the forums about it so I'm pretty sure they knew damn well about it for quite a while.
The timing does seem suspicious though. Had they put out this temporary fix before the bonus upgrade weekend, players wouldn't have upgraded their consoles because the consoles would have been useless and some may have just hung onto their dil instead of spending it. So they go and "fix" this thing after people spent their dil to upgrade them.
So all in all I can understand how players are upset about it.
The fix, or nerf, doesn't bother me at all. I'm only peeved they didn't do something about it sooner. If they put out the temporary fix months ago they may have found the time to fully fix it before the bonus upgrade weekend happened.
However, word on the forums is that, supposedly, a dev said a while back that the console was working exactly as intended in response to why it was only critting with FAW. I don't recall seeing such a post, but if true it could mean this was a sudden decision. Possibly they decided to shut people up about FAW being too op because of the console by making it not crit with anything. I don't know. Bort's explanation seems reasonable though.
^^ This, a lot.
Bollocks. I've reported bugs since launch that hasn't been fixed and have now started to send one bug report then one of the same to support. And we're not talking the odd one, or a handful here. I reminded them the other day about the Piercing Tetryon upgrade bug f.ex. that was reported over a year ago. Not fixed. Oddly enough, but "harassing" support I did manage to bring attention to a bug otherwise ignored.
This game, Star Trek Online, is like a drug. All MMO's are. Most of us like to feel we're in control, we only play when we want and the game has no influence over when we do. We're not any kind of addicts. Yeah, right. If we were to have a fruitful and successful line of communication with PWE and tell them to get this sorted or else, then they would simply shut down the game.
It's like this: Money first over anything, adjusted by factors so that money will always come first. Customer satisfaction is only important as long as it is perceived as such on the other end (us) and as long as it does not deduct too much from income. To maintain an inflated sense of customer satisfaction they only need to release new items and ships regularly and some people will be happy. Especially those that does not stretch the game to the limit and are content as long as they are in their spaceship or running around on the ground playing dress-up.
Fixing bugs is only important as long as it keeps the game afloat. If fixing bugs really was important they would have started long, long, time ago and done it right. They are now approaching and entering a code-critical-mass where compound bugs are starting to interact with each other on a whole new level. People with coding experience started to notice this over a year ago and it was predicted long before then.
Who knows where it all went to hell. Perhaps their own bug-reporting tool is just unusable and has been all along, and/or sends it all to /dev/null, that they simply just gave in at some point and are just keeping the boat afloat. If they do not take compound bugs serious at some point there will be a bug that brings the game to its knees for a few days, if they're lucky not more than a few days. That will be the point of no return, it's then either rewrite code or shut down. And as it's all about the cash it will be shut down, "gracefully" mind you. It will be patched up so they can announce STO 2 being released, and everyone that's a Lifetime sub'er in STO will get a 5% discount on the first 3 ships we buy. Then it all starts again.
It is possible for a game to keep the issues down to a minimum, but you need to start early and nip things in the bud. One example, World of Tanks which has a rather huge audience world wide is a game where the bugs get fixed in the fly. WarGaming, the company, is just as money-hungry as PWE and are throwing the same raw deals out there except WG understood from the start that bugs needed to be squatted as soon as they arise.
So, as Sano said, a company.....no, a good and serious company will find the time to fix their bugs. Others are in the money-grab industry.
Your logic is flawed.
how can they hire more people if players dont spend money.
weather or not that money is spent on hiring devs to fix bugs if no one paid for anything then the game would stop.
"It appears we have lost our sex appeal, captain."- Tuvok
Indeed I am, one is PWE and the other is WG. Both are just as hungry for our cash and time, but the latter works for both parts. The former only works for the company, and in the short run.
We're not fooling ourselves, we know companies are in it for the money, but it can be done in a way where both parties win and it's being done elsewhere.
Well that was my additional 2 cents, now heading off to work.
This does seem to be a reoccurring problem. Something broken is allowed to go on until it becomes the norm and then one day, here comes the fix.
Although, the one thing I've focused on is what seems to be a hint of understanding that we are nearly at a point of One Build for All. Which is my biggest concern. I don't want every ship on every captain I have to be AP+DBB+BFAW because that's the only way to play effectively.
I strive for variety in my builds and it's not easy because a lot of what's out there is junk and has never been updated for the new end game. Even though I have assembled some capable builds, it doesn't mean much when players come in with "The Build" and vaporize everything in seconds.
And I did just take several of these consoles Epic with the Upgrade weekend, for use in The Build. If we can get something resembling balance in the game though, I'll get over it.
Ehm.. the Star Trek I watched never focused on killing as many aliens as you could. The Star Trek I watched never even mentioned DPS or damage output from ships (not in the least because such a thing would be difficult to define). The Trek I watched had Picard saying only once or twice during an entire episode or movie 'Fire at will' and not every 15 seconds.
Honestly, if you're going to complain that this game is moving away from the ideals and canon of Star Trek, there are some better points to start at instead of the fact that your 'toy' won't be as good after this patch as it is now. Indeed, you probably wouldn't even have had that toy in the first place...
Exactly. When the "fix" finally comes after players are so use to things being a certain way, they scream "NERF" and raise holy hell about it. They really need to start fixing things before they become the norm.
As far as builds go I make my own. I've always preferred to come up with something that works for me instead of going with the metagame. I can't stand the thought of doing something just because it "works" and everyone else is doing it. When coming up with my own build I'm familiar with it and know how it works through trial and error. If I just copy someone else's build I won't know how to use it and look like a complete noob.
Any build can work if you use it right. If anybody has a problem with me not having super high DPS.....well they can go pound salt for all I give a damn.
I think this argument is flawed as well. You are basing it on the assumption that the studio operates so close to being bankrupt the moment people decie to spent less because they are dissatisfied with the product. Companies, big and small, like to portray it like that of course, especially the large ones at the stock exchanges will treat a .01 decrease in profits as total bankrupcy (and blame some form of social politics for it, like minimum wage or health care) but if it were the truth all of them were extremely unstable and effectively failed enterprises.
Customer sttisfaction is essential for providing long-term income. If you "vote with your wallet" (and even provide feedback what you thin needs to be improved) you can make yourself heard to some degree. If you give feedback but steadily throw money at the product regardless there is no need to take your feedback seriously. The game doesn't get shut down the moment profits don't rise, don't be afraid about that.
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Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
Just go away, seriously give all your stuff away and leave the game.
Further, it was never the fact that they could Crit that was the problem, it was simply a matter of how hard.
Its just feels, sly, under handed, sneaky, deceitful and i feel cheated out of the money i spent to upgrade said consoles to Epic. Only to find out it was a wasted purchase.
It's like buying a mobile phone with a good tariff and finding you have no signal but you still have the phone, but can't use phone for purposes it was bought for until the mast is fixed
I did understand what you posted, apologies if I failed to show that in my reply, that wasn't my intent.
Techincally.. we're both 'right' it's just a different way of looking at it. You could combine both of our statements and say "They made it work the same way for everyone by making sure the consoles are broken universally for all builds."
When you say "The temporary fix makes it so it works the same for everybody." that's an accurate statement.
When I say "They just broke it for everyone," that is also an accurate statement.
Believe me, I understand your point I just see it from a different perspective. Even though I don't hold the same view on it as you, I honestly can't say you're wrong.. because you're not.
Sure its the most potent, and scores highest DPS wise. But there are a plethora of options available to choose from.
Maybe some of us have forgotten that. Or have grown so accustomed to the massive spike damage, that anything else seems a bland by comparison.. Sure that may be the case.
But you can still succeed (easily) in PvE queues with other build types ! Don't act like this was the ONLY way to succeed, because that is a blatant lie.
And I myself have been using this beams/embassy console (x3) FaW, setup for a few months now.
BUT there are other ways...its not as if other builds are a dead end.
The upgrade costs may be disappointing for some users, but if you look at it honestly, they are one of the cheapest items to bring to epic, and are still quite functional even with the crits turned off (you may not want to use 3 or 4 after this, but hey, they'll still be a very useable item).
It could've been much worse in terms of wasted resources, what if they nerfed the iconian warp core for example ? The cost for upgrading those is STAGGERING in comparison.
It takes a couple days of refining to bring the embassy consoles to epic...its really not a catastrophic loss by comparison.
Also, who knows, Bort did say this was temporary.. So it may be back at some point.
Just giving some perspective here.
I don't necessarily like it either, but its really a first world problem. And shouldn't bring people to fits of rage, there are more note worthy issues to get angry about.
If people are worried about DPS loss, don't stress, the leaderboards will be reset most likely. According to Porch, the new parser will have a fresh leaderboard in the near future, so everyone will be back at the same point.
Okay then. Where's my option to get an extra ship trait without farming fleet credits and joining a fleet that happens to have a tier 3 research lab?
Maybe I don't want to join a fleet? Maybe I don't want to join a big fleet?
I'm not saying I don't by the way. I'm just saying my options are limited because guess what? Options are always limited.
I therefore find this excuse to nerf our dps while they keep making STFs with conditions like "defeat 5 billion ships with more hull health than God in 30 seconds" to be spurious at best.
My opinion? I used the plasma consoles with beams and cannons (and parsed both), and I feel that those consoles should never have been able to crit at all. Having that kind of damage coming from a console proc really makes those expensive space guns rather unimportant. I've actually had 30k crits from those consoles, much higher damage output than the beam that procced it. Not cool. More so, my parses with cannons actually indicated that they proc less often, and don't crit. (The less often part could just be RNG not being nice)
Honestly, I'm ok with the loss of crits, and the minor damage reduction, I actually stopped using more than one or two plasma consoles in the past few weeks... It just feels like a cheat getting so much damage from a couple of console procs...
Would it make you happier, if if took an hour to eliminate the 5 billion ships, with the God health?
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!