I can't take P1 serious anymore. It seems if someone is not a mouthpiece then you are booted.
I haven't taken P1 seriously in nearly most the time it has been going, and while I don't always agree with SD on stuff this is one of those occasions where I have to say that he's done a much better job on his stint of the show than the rest of the presenters ever did put together.
Most other MMO's (or games with large communities in general) have their ways of holding the developers to account, and there are some particularly well known examples of what can happen when communities get their voices heard. Truth is P1 keeps making claim that they represent the community, but they never have done except in a lip-service kind of manner that merely results in the real issues being brushed under the rug.
What SD has done is represent the community properly, something the other presenters would do well to learn from. I don't think I'd be alone in saying that it seems rather convenient for the rest of P1 to kick SD as a presenter once he has done what the playerbase has been asking for, to hold the devs to account.
Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head. - Euripides
I no longer do any Bug Hunting work for Cryptic. I may resume if a serious attempt to fix the game is made.
The new lockbox prizes are just that. Lockbox stuff. I have a thought about making queues better. What about Hero Weapons similar to what we got with Zefram Cochrane's shotgun, and a respec system to get them inline with a various weapon set. Worf's Bat'leth, Picard's phaser rifle, D'Vark's Omega Rifle, and so on.
I was enjoying the repartee between Geko and the new Host, (and the Hostess, for that matter), and sad with the choice made by Priority One on letting Kam go. But it is what it is.
I, originally, signed on to listen to the interview segment on Armadas. Dreading it.
Geko always sounded bored to me, “I have to do this because I am supposed to”, “I am going to say the least I can get away with”. By the end of the interview, he just sounded like an automaton, “just get this over with, fast”. Which is why I usually skip Geko interviews on Priority One, unless it is absolutely necessary.
Needless to say, I was quite enthralled by what was “brought to the table” this time. This was the first time I ever heard Geko sound totally engaged in talking, thoughtful about “his” game and the development and understanding of it. It was as if Geko needed someone to challenge him in order to shine. It was awesome.
Great interview.
I found my mind drifting away from DOFFing and tuning into the “radio”, more often than not. I went back and re-listen to this podcast AFTER I got done and signed out of the game. Just to make sure I did not miss something.
And I actually WANTED to.
And because of the interaction between Geko and the new hosts, I, also, came back the following week to listen to Part 2 of the interview. And Part 3 of the interview. And, I never thought I would say, “I was looking forward to listening to more”.
This is all too bad.
To: SarcasmDetector …. Thank you for a very enjoyable 3-4 hours of “radio”. (Oh, and, to Geko, too.)
Good luck to Priority One on finding a suitable replacement. Please don’t regress.
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Here is an interesting question: if P1 represents the community, and the community wants Kam on the show, will they bring him back? We could have a poll to see what people want, and whether they will listen.
Here is an interesting question: if P1 represents the community, and the community wants Kam on the show, will they bring him back? We could have a poll to see what people want, and whether they will listen.
You mean like a poll on this forum? This forum that appears to be mostly filled with hateful trolls and people bashing the devs at every turn they get? I think there is no way to get a more meaningless poll made than one on this forum.
Generally i would like a poll like that but that kind of poll would need a place to reach a lot more players than the ones that frequent this forum. In a way this forum tends to represent the worst of the community - so unless you want to know how what that specific part of the community thinks about what you are about to poll, well, i wouldn't waste my time on it.
Here is an interesting question: if P1 represents the community, and the community wants Kam on the show, will they bring him back? We could have a poll to see what people want, and whether they will listen.
You mean like a poll on this forum? This forum that appears to be mostly filled with hateful trolls and people bashing the devs at every turn they get? I think there is no way to get a more meaningless poll made than one on this forum.
Generally i would like a poll like that but that kind of poll would need a place to reach a lot more players than the ones that frequent this forum. In a way this forum tends to represent the worst of the community - so unless you want to know how what that specific part of the community thinks about what you are about to poll, well, i wouldn't waste my time on it.
How about on the actual P1 site? If they really want to represent the community and arent afraid to have the results available for everyone to see, lets do it.
Here is an interesting question: if P1 represents the community, and the community wants Kam on the show, will they bring him back? We could have a poll to see what people want, and whether they will listen.
I am not sure Kam's "radio personality” fits with Priority One. I think Priority One is going for a bit more “lighter” tone.
I can say this though: they need someone, like Kam, in that Kam could keep Geko focused on the topic.
Geko tends to drift off to “whatever” comes into his mind and carry the interview to different directions. And, in directions that is not often useful. It, also, tends to get Geko in trouble.
Geko is involved in the development of the game on soooo many different levels, and can see how things interact in different ways …. I believe Geko has a tendency to drive interviewers to linger into directions they were not meaning to go to. Maybe? Prolonging the whole “process” and diluting the information.
Having someone keep guests on track is is vital. I believe Kam did this quite well.
And Geko, as well as the podcast, came out better for it.
Kam may be a bit brusque and a bit "throaty" for what Priority One is looking for. This may work on a different show, though. And I hope Sarcasm Detector continues to stay connected with the community and wish him well on his next endeavor. But this whole thing with Priority One is already done.
And to say “THIS PERSON” is the right “FIT” for programming on a particular show….it is not really even a community issue.
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
And to say “THIS PERSON” is the right “FIT” for programming on a particular show….it is not really even a community issue.
If the community who listens to the show enjoys and wants someone on the show, how is that not a community issue? To ignore that feedback is to ignore the very community they say they represent. You cant have it both ways. You cant represent someone if you ignore the things they say that you may not like.
PS: I am not saying the majority of the community DOES want Kam on the show, but I am saying that P1 should care enough to try to find out. And they should do it in a way that everyone can see the results, for the sake of transparency.
Here is an interesting question: if P1 represents the community, and the community wants Kam on the show, will they bring him back? We could have a poll to see what people want, and whether they will listen.
I am not sure Kam's "radio personality” fits with Priority One. I think Priority One is going for a bit more “lighter” tone.
I can say this though: they need someone, like Kam...
This pretty much hits the nail on the head.
Overall the show is run by people that represent pretty much casual players and that is perfectly fine - i think the majority of star trek online players fall into that category.
Now they got sarcasmdetector on the show as a host. He is no casual player at all - he knows the game mechanics in depth, knows how the dps crowd ticks, has a solid grasp on what tools are used by said players to measure dps and looks at numbers and results first and foremost.
When they put him on they had to choose. Either pull him more toward the casual crowd to make it fit the general theme or allow him to use that in depth knowledge to shift the show a little bit to appeal more to the hardcore players - players we see in the dps channels or in what's left of the pvp subgroup.
The lessons i take from this are:
1. P1 does benefit from someone that has a firm understanding of the game mechanics. Maybe add a segment like the foundry reviews that is focused on game aspects.
2. A more driven and focused interviewer can actually get more "real" information and ask more relevant questions. Heck, even the interviewed guest seemed to enjoy a more driven exchange more than just casual banter.
3. P1 is more than just the podcast itself and the information and links and videos posted by the p1 staff can be just as important as the show itself - at least for certain segments of the community.
I think the mistake that happened here was, that they got sarcasmdetector the wrong job. They got themselves an incredible asset but put it in the wrong spot. For a fulltime host they need someone that fits better with the casual crowd and the light banter. If you listen to older episodes you will notice quicky, that he seems like the odd man out. Its no failure on his part at all though.
There is a reason companies employ a spokesperson and usually don't let the engineers out of their cave to talk to the public - to put it it into a little more extreme words.
Here is an interesting question: if P1 represents the community, and the community wants Kam on the show, will they bring him back? We could have a poll to see what people want, and whether they will listen.
You mean like a poll on this forum? This forum that appears to be mostly filled with hateful trolls and people bashing the devs at every turn they get? I think there is no way to get a more meaningless poll made than one on this forum.
Generally i would like a poll like that but that kind of poll would need a place to reach a lot more players than the ones that frequent this forum. In a way this forum tends to represent the worst of the community - so unless you want to know how what that specific part of the community thinks about what you are about to poll, well, i wouldn't waste my time on it.
How about on the actual P1 site? If they really want to represent the community and arent afraid to have the results available for everyone to see, lets do it.
The problem is, you will always only reach a certain part of the community. To put that poll on the P1 site has the best chances for an almost representative poll. There will always be those that "just want to play the game" and "just want to listen to the show" and will never register or comment or vote. And without knowing how many of those there are, getting anything even remotely representative is impossible.
No matter how this pans out, i as a player, have certainly gained from it. I do enjoy the P1 banter but i also like the in depth stuff sarcasmdetector has put up and i will try to keep up with both.
Now they got sarcasmdetector on the show as a host. He is no casual player at all - he knows the game mechanics in depth, knows how the dps crowd ticks, has a solid grasp on what tools are used by said players to measure dps and looks at numbers and results first and foremost.
When they put him on they had to choose. Either pull him more toward the casual crowd to make it fit the general theme or allow him to use that in depth knowledge to shift the show a little bit to appeal more to the hardcore players - players we see in the dps channels or in what's left of the pvp subgroup.
I think you are creating a false scenario by making it sound like Kam would be dictating the direction of the show, when the reality is he was only 1 out of 3 hosts. Even if his perspective is more hardcore than the average player, the other 2 hosts were still there, so it's not P1 was suddenly going to be "the Kam show".
Full disclosure: I've been on P1 a number of times as a guest host and have enjoyed my interactions with the many folk who have produced it over the years, Kam included. I also have no idea of what has transpired, beyond what I've seen in this forum, and have no intent to delve into what happened as I see this as a private process between the involved parties.
I do feel motivated, however, to post a statement in full support of the P1 podcast model, which I've enjoyed since the days of Brandon and crew. Personally I am very much a casual gamer. I do spend a lot of time in this game and enjoy using the new systems to improve my gameplay, but despite being a scientist by trade, I have no interest personally in delving into the min-max thing, or even PVP. It's just not my thing.
I do enjoy STO for it's connection to a loved franchise, not for its design as an MMO (I will likely never play another after STO; just takes too much time!).
These aspects pretty much define the "community" of which I am a part. And for me, I have always enjoyed, and preferred the positive, minimally-adversarial format of the P1 podcast. I enjoy Al's frequent appearances, and appreciate the chance to understand more about the balance of concerns that drive decisions in how the game develops. I have many friends in the gaming industry and know a fair amount of how things work internally in a number of companies. Adding some understanding of how Cryptic/STO works is good.
Do I like everything that Cryptic does in the game? No. Do I understand why they do things I don't like? More often than not, I do, largely due to P1. For me, understanding why a system is in place, for game balance or business reasons, helps me work with it, even if I'd rather see something else in play.
I know a lot of posters hate listening to interviews that do not adopt an adversarial stance, to demand changes desired by the "community." Hell, there are some who probably wouldn't be satisfied unless every interview went like a Democrat being roasted on Fox News.
Personally I would never listen to a podcast like that. The world is filled with lots of angry screaming about people upset about this or that. I don't want that kind of think dragging down my mood and pissing me off in my entertainment and down time.
P1 has always been a wonderful haven to keep up with a game I play for fun, and to find out in a positive and enjoyable way what goes on behind the scenes. I hope it never changes, and as long as it is fun, playful, respectful, and fair, I will be happy to jump on from time to time to talk science with the hosts, regardless of who takes up the reins.
I know these folk put a lot of personal time and effort into what they do every week, and I hate to see them come under fire due to alleged offenses in not serving "the community" by running a wonderful podcast they way they want to.
There is no "THE Community" of this game. There are many. P1 does an excellent job of serving one community of which I am a part. If you prefer a different voice, then I'm sure there are other options out there as well, or take a stab at making one yourself.
There is no "THE Community" of this game. There are many. P1 does an excellent job of serving one community of which I am a part. If you prefer a different voice, then I'm sure there are other options out there as well, or take a stab at making one yourself.
If that is the new official stance they want to take, thats fine, but that is not what we have been told. For years they have said they are representing THE community, THE players. So if they want to change that to "the specific part of the community whose feedback we want to listen to and who agree with what we say", thats fine! But just be honest and say THAT. Dont use vague or general language that gives an impression that isnt the case.
Also, if they want to say that "the community" they represent is just their listeners, thats also fine. But that begs the question, what about the people who LISTEN to the show, but didnt want Kam kicked off. How exactly is P1 representing those people who ARE listeners?
If that is the new official stance they want to take, thats fine, but that is not what we have been told. For years they have said they are representing THE community, THE players. So if they want to change that to "the specific part of the community whose feedback we want to listen to and who agree with what we say", thats fine! But just be honest and say THAT. Dont use vague or general language that gives an impression that isnt the case.
I speak entirely for myself in my post, and not for the P1 team. My statements are my take on things, not theirs.
But how can you not understand that the community of this game is varied far beyond any single viewpoint? When have the devs ever implemented a change that wasn't both loved and hated at the same time on the forums. When has it ever happened that something that "the community" begged for finally showed up in a patch, immediately followed by "the community" screaming over how terrible it was to do that?
Players have to understand that there's virtually no opinion about any aspect of this game that isn't uncontested. And there is literally no way to make a decision that makes everyone happy.
I just take exception to those who attack people who do a project like P1 out of love for Trek and of STO because the podcast isn't being done the way they PERSONALLY want it, while hiding behind the banner of speaking for "THE community" which, as anyone who actually reads the forums knows, is anything BUT a single monolithic set of opinions.
The best any podcast can do it try to offer something of broad interest for a mixed player base. And they devote many hours of personal time, volunteering to put this together. They deserve better than constant attacks over personal soapbox issues.
I think that the bottom line comes down to this:
P1 let SarcasmDetector go. People who followed Sarcasm over to P1 were shocked and upset when they found out. Other people/entities were surprised to see how much of a following Sarcasm has. P1 as an entity, can choose to not have anyone operate under their brand for whatever reason they have, whether it's justifiable or not. What they do to explain it to their fans is up to them.
Sarcasm has collected his toys, and moved on to focus on other endeavours. For those who enjoy his work, please continue to support him.
But how can you not understand that the community of this game is varied far beyond any single viewpoint?
I do understand that, and that only supports the point I was making. Anyone who claims they represent "the community" or "the players" is wrong. No one does, and no podcast does. That being the case, no one should make comments even suggesting they do. And if those kinds of comments *are* made(whether recently or in the past), they should be called out as wrong.
P1 as an entity, can choose to not have anyone operate under their brand for whatever reason they have, whether it's justifiable or not. What they do to explain it to their fans is up to them.
For sure. They have the right to ignore feedback from their listeners and refuse to respond. And other people have the right to give their thoughts on that. We all have the right to say whatever we want, in line with the forum rules.
Another idea to get people to play queues more is to give the queues a massive XP boost - like 3.5x to 5x for Normals, & 7x to 10x for Advanced & Elite. The current XP payouts are pitiful. Kill XP in queues is, last I checked, lower than in solo play and you actually get less XP for completion of a queue than you do for most of the patrol missions.
I'll believe it when I see it. There are rumors (and I hope they never materialize) that he is planning on gating R&D mat'ls and the big marks behind the "optionals". I don't trust one word from his mouth other than he hates Klingons
P1 as an entity, can choose to not have anyone operate under their brand for whatever reason they have, whether it's justifiable or not. What they do to explain it to their fans is up to them.
For sure. They have the right to ignore feedback from their listeners and refuse to respond. And other people have the right to give their thoughts on that. We all have the right to say whatever we want, in line with the forum rules.
No argument there. I did invoke the RoA's in another forum, btw.
P1 as an entity, can choose to not have anyone operate under their brand for whatever reason they have, whether it's justifiable or not. What they do to explain it to their fans is up to them.
For sure. They have the right to ignore feedback from their listeners and refuse to respond. And other people have the right to give their thoughts on that. We all have the right to say whatever we want, in line with the forum rules.
No argument there. I did invoke the RoA's in another forum, btw.
One of the problems I had with the P1 Crapcast , was the total lack of real decent. All of what was done to the player base was just fine it seemed, no matter how pissed and extremely angry the players were @DR or the events after DR everthing was just great You can not claim to be a community Crapcast without expressing what the community is talking about . Yet P1 Crapcast had devs on and the sun was shining even as Xp points were taken from players for grinding. Nerf here nerf there ... P1 Crapcast could have asked what are you thinking ... But they decided it was easier to kiss TRIBBLE and look at the pretty sun shine.
One of the problems I had with the P1 Crapcast , was the total lack of real decent. All of what was done to the player base was just fine it seemed, no matter how pissed and extremely angry the players were @DR or the events after DR everthing was just great You can not claim to be a community Crapcast without expressing what the community is talking about . Yet P1 Crapcast had devs on and the sun was shining even as Xp points were taken from players for grinding. Nerf here nerf there ... P1 Crapcast could have asked what are you thinking ... But they decided it was easier to kiss TRIBBLE and look at the pretty sun shine.
I don't agree with all the "crapcast" comments, though I think your general point(regarding P1's tone) has been a common one over the years. Regarding the greater subject of representing the "community" or "players", there are really only 2 ways of getting ANY impression about what the "community" or "players" think or feel:
1) public forums
2) behind the scenes data
With rare exceptions of infographics, we simply do not have access to the behind the scenes numbers. That being the case, we have nothing to go on except Cryptic's word that "XX is the best expansion ever". The only thing we DO have access to and can actually see for ourselves is public forums, and the *most* people happen to be here on the official forums, not on a private fleet or podcast forum. And yes, the official forums are only a small minority of the total playerbase, and therefore do not accurately represent the total playerbase. But the fact remains, they are still the main source of player feedback that we actually have access to.
The "problem" is, some people ignore feedback they don't want to see, or doesn't fit into their talking points. Even if the official forums happen to be in an uproar about a given issue, some people will simply dismiss them and say, "oh, they don't represent the people in game", or "the people I talk to in my private little forum or fleet chat or skype channel don't think that". However, the true irony/hypocrisy of that statement is, the people who you talk to in your private little forum or fleet chat or skype channel are an even *smaller* group than post here on the official forums, meaning they are even *less* representative than the official forums.
Having said all that, the simple fact is that the folks at P1 have every right to make whatever kind of show they want, and they have every right to ignore feedback they disagree with.
I think you guys are being a little harsh, just my opinion everyone is of course entitled to one. I think Elijah is just looking out for the best interest of Priority One Podcast. I hate to see anyone go as well, but I don't have the full details of the situation and therefore can't really make too many comments on it all.
However, I do know that Cryptic/Perfect World Entertainment does NOT have to accept any invite to any Podcast it doesn't want, and can in fact at any moment say during an interview, "we're done here". So obviously there's a fine line that a free game reporting Podcast can cross before the developers feel that it is in their best interest not to do interviews.
As a community we want the developers to talk out, to tell us what's coming and their plans. We obviously want a Podcast that reports the truth and challenges the developers to make the game better and listen to the their paying gaming community; because let's be honest, keeping the lights on and paying the mortgage is what it's all about to them in the end...and we all have to understand and accept that.
Just my two cents, I could be wrong, just wanted to comment on this thread as well. I hope they work it all out, I'll keep listening and I hope Al and the rest of them continue to do interviews as well.
Fleet Admiral Thomas Winston James a.k.a. The Grayfox Fleet Leader of:
Liberty Task Force/Liberty Honor Guard
Pride of the Federation/Pride of the Empire
Liberty Guardians U.S.S. Liberty, NX-42813-L, T-6 Legendary Odyssey Class
Grand Nagus, I get what you are saying. Frankly, this podcast is very much Cryptic's mouthpiece. Is it that wrong? of course not, but I don't agree with their moniker of being The Community representative. I have made some comments before on how its seems that a host was very disconnected from the community and his rants only showed that they were true. I am sorry to say, but I am going to be moving on from listenership of the his podcast. This is their proverbial strike three for me, first one was the podcast vs forum show, second one was the rants, and now this one.
Kam, does at first, does seem to have the elitist attitude at first, but when you listen its not really elitist it is more of him knowing the game way more than his fellow hosts. Not that there is anything wrong with it. Jayce knows his lore, Cookie has that outsider's view, and Kenna has that new player view. Kam's interview wasn't a roast nor was it a grilling of Geko, Kam was just more assertive in his questions and Geko was giving good answers. This was the first interview that I enjoyed with Geko on it.
Nobody wants a grilling of the Devs just like they don't a complete groveling over the Dev either. Lately, its more towards latter.
Kam's interview wasn't a roast nor was it a grilling of Geko, Kam was just more assertive in his questions and Geko was giving good answers. This was the first interview that I enjoyed with Geko on it.
I have read many similar comments, which is why it is such a shame he was kicked off. I also can't help but wonder what Geko's impression was. Did *he* feel like he was getting grilled? If so, did that have anything to do with anything else?
Which "you guys", exactly? And which comments, specifically? I definitely think one person was a bit harsh, and I quoted that post in my reply to it, but other than that I have read mostly reasonable comments, and hope mine have been pretty reasonably worded as well. But since you made such a general statement, I just want to know who all you are talking about.
Which "you guys", exactly? And which comments, specifically? I definitely think one person was a bit harsh, and I quoted that post in my reply to it, but other than that I have read mostly reasonable comments, and hope mine have been pretty reasonably worded as well. But since you made such a general statement, I just want to know who all you are talking about.
The one you quoted for sure but just the general comments that Priority One is the "mouthpiece" of Cryptic. I just don't feel that way. Sure their take on the game might be more positive than most, they're big fans for one and of course they want to appease the Devs which in turn brings them back which in turn gives them listeners which in turn brings donations.
Fleet Admiral Thomas Winston James a.k.a. The Grayfox Fleet Leader of:
Liberty Task Force/Liberty Honor Guard
Pride of the Federation/Pride of the Empire
Liberty Guardians U.S.S. Liberty, NX-42813-L, T-6 Legendary Odyssey Class
I do get that a segment of the community is unhappy that the interviews with the Devs, Rivera in particular, is not adversarial enough to confront them directly and aggressively with the negative opinions represented by a segment of the forum posters.
I am part of a different segment of the community that would NOT prefer that kind of podcast. P1 does an excellent job of covering what's happening in game, and giving an insiders perspective on why things unfold the way they do. That's a valuable function, I enjoy it, and as such am contributing to this thread to voice the other community desire to P1, which is to maintain their current format and editorial style. It has served them, and us, for many years now.
I did enjoy Kam on the show; he was not representing my primary interests in the game, but did give an insight into the DPSer mentality. I don't share it, but I do understand it a bit better. I personally disagree strongly with some of the changes he was lobbying for in that particular interview. I don't know what transpired behind the scenes, but I did feel he was beginning to dance on the edge of proper interview etiquette (though I also don't personally think he crossed it in anything I heard on the podcast). Despite disagreeing with some of his key points, I AM sorry to see him go, but not knowing why things played out that way I don't think it's fair or appropriate for anyone to "demand" his return through a poll or ad-hoc collection of requests in this thread.
I just feel it's important to speak up when I hear a number of posters pile on and say P1 is flawed and needs to change its format because it isn't doing what they would want a podcast to do. Because it IS doing what many others of us think it should, which includes a standing policy of respectful civility when dealing with interviews.
Forums are filled with people passionate about things that they are unhappy with. Passion is a great motivator to post. But for every angry voice there is at least another content voice that doesn't say anything because they are NOT worked up and quietly approve of how things are. One can't always take the angry tenor of most online forums to indicate those opinions represent everyone.
I've been posting in this thread to at least balance out the opinions to include those of the segment of the community that supports their style as-is, and is grateful for the time, effort, and passion they bring to this endeavor.
while I do like kam (most of the time) he didnt really fit in with P1.
Also it doesnt actually matter what we think as P1 is not our project its theirs so you can stop listening or just accept it but crying about it wont help.
Comments
I haven't taken P1 seriously in nearly most the time it has been going, and while I don't always agree with SD on stuff this is one of those occasions where I have to say that he's done a much better job on his stint of the show than the rest of the presenters ever did put together.
Most other MMO's (or games with large communities in general) have their ways of holding the developers to account, and there are some particularly well known examples of what can happen when communities get their voices heard. Truth is P1 keeps making claim that they represent the community, but they never have done except in a lip-service kind of manner that merely results in the real issues being brushed under the rug.
What SD has done is represent the community properly, something the other presenters would do well to learn from. I don't think I'd be alone in saying that it seems rather convenient for the rest of P1 to kick SD as a presenter once he has done what the playerbase has been asking for, to hold the devs to account.
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I, originally, signed on to listen to the interview segment on Armadas. Dreading it.
Geko always sounded bored to me, “I have to do this because I am supposed to”, “I am going to say the least I can get away with”. By the end of the interview, he just sounded like an automaton, “just get this over with, fast”. Which is why I usually skip Geko interviews on Priority One, unless it is absolutely necessary.
Needless to say, I was quite enthralled by what was “brought to the table” this time. This was the first time I ever heard Geko sound totally engaged in talking, thoughtful about “his” game and the development and understanding of it. It was as if Geko needed someone to challenge him in order to shine. It was awesome.
Great interview.
I found my mind drifting away from DOFFing and tuning into the “radio”, more often than not. I went back and re-listen to this podcast AFTER I got done and signed out of the game. Just to make sure I did not miss something.
And I actually WANTED to.
And because of the interaction between Geko and the new hosts, I, also, came back the following week to listen to Part 2 of the interview. And Part 3 of the interview. And, I never thought I would say, “I was looking forward to listening to more”.
This is all too bad.
To: SarcasmDetector …. Thank you for a very enjoyable 3-4 hours of “radio”. (Oh, and, to Geko, too.)
Good luck to Priority One on finding a suitable replacement. Please don’t regress.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
You mean like a poll on this forum? This forum that appears to be mostly filled with hateful trolls and people bashing the devs at every turn they get? I think there is no way to get a more meaningless poll made than one on this forum.
Generally i would like a poll like that but that kind of poll would need a place to reach a lot more players than the ones that frequent this forum. In a way this forum tends to represent the worst of the community - so unless you want to know how what that specific part of the community thinks about what you are about to poll, well, i wouldn't waste my time on it.
How about on the actual P1 site? If they really want to represent the community and arent afraid to have the results available for everyone to see, lets do it.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I am not sure Kam's "radio personality” fits with Priority One. I think Priority One is going for a bit more “lighter” tone.
I can say this though: they need someone, like Kam, in that Kam could keep Geko focused on the topic.
Geko tends to drift off to “whatever” comes into his mind and carry the interview to different directions. And, in directions that is not often useful. It, also, tends to get Geko in trouble.
Geko is involved in the development of the game on soooo many different levels, and can see how things interact in different ways …. I believe Geko has a tendency to drive interviewers to linger into directions they were not meaning to go to. Maybe? Prolonging the whole “process” and diluting the information.
Having someone keep guests on track is is vital. I believe Kam did this quite well.
And Geko, as well as the podcast, came out better for it.
Kam may be a bit brusque and a bit "throaty" for what Priority One is looking for. This may work on a different show, though. And I hope Sarcasm Detector continues to stay connected with the community and wish him well on his next endeavor. But this whole thing with Priority One is already done.
And to say “THIS PERSON” is the right “FIT” for programming on a particular show….it is not really even a community issue.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
If the community who listens to the show enjoys and wants someone on the show, how is that not a community issue? To ignore that feedback is to ignore the very community they say they represent. You cant have it both ways. You cant represent someone if you ignore the things they say that you may not like.
PS: I am not saying the majority of the community DOES want Kam on the show, but I am saying that P1 should care enough to try to find out. And they should do it in a way that everyone can see the results, for the sake of transparency.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
This pretty much hits the nail on the head.
Overall the show is run by people that represent pretty much casual players and that is perfectly fine - i think the majority of star trek online players fall into that category.
Now they got sarcasmdetector on the show as a host. He is no casual player at all - he knows the game mechanics in depth, knows how the dps crowd ticks, has a solid grasp on what tools are used by said players to measure dps and looks at numbers and results first and foremost.
When they put him on they had to choose. Either pull him more toward the casual crowd to make it fit the general theme or allow him to use that in depth knowledge to shift the show a little bit to appeal more to the hardcore players - players we see in the dps channels or in what's left of the pvp subgroup.
The lessons i take from this are:
1. P1 does benefit from someone that has a firm understanding of the game mechanics. Maybe add a segment like the foundry reviews that is focused on game aspects.
2. A more driven and focused interviewer can actually get more "real" information and ask more relevant questions. Heck, even the interviewed guest seemed to enjoy a more driven exchange more than just casual banter.
3. P1 is more than just the podcast itself and the information and links and videos posted by the p1 staff can be just as important as the show itself - at least for certain segments of the community.
I think the mistake that happened here was, that they got sarcasmdetector the wrong job. They got themselves an incredible asset but put it in the wrong spot. For a fulltime host they need someone that fits better with the casual crowd and the light banter. If you listen to older episodes you will notice quicky, that he seems like the odd man out. Its no failure on his part at all though.
There is a reason companies employ a spokesperson and usually don't let the engineers out of their cave to talk to the public - to put it it into a little more extreme words.
Which brings us to what "the community" wants...
The problem is, you will always only reach a certain part of the community. To put that poll on the P1 site has the best chances for an almost representative poll. There will always be those that "just want to play the game" and "just want to listen to the show" and will never register or comment or vote. And without knowing how many of those there are, getting anything even remotely representative is impossible.
No matter how this pans out, i as a player, have certainly gained from it. I do enjoy the P1 banter but i also like the in depth stuff sarcasmdetector has put up and i will try to keep up with both.
I think you are creating a false scenario by making it sound like Kam would be dictating the direction of the show, when the reality is he was only 1 out of 3 hosts. Even if his perspective is more hardcore than the average player, the other 2 hosts were still there, so it's not P1 was suddenly going to be "the Kam show".
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I do feel motivated, however, to post a statement in full support of the P1 podcast model, which I've enjoyed since the days of Brandon and crew. Personally I am very much a casual gamer. I do spend a lot of time in this game and enjoy using the new systems to improve my gameplay, but despite being a scientist by trade, I have no interest personally in delving into the min-max thing, or even PVP. It's just not my thing.
I do enjoy STO for it's connection to a loved franchise, not for its design as an MMO (I will likely never play another after STO; just takes too much time!).
These aspects pretty much define the "community" of which I am a part. And for me, I have always enjoyed, and preferred the positive, minimally-adversarial format of the P1 podcast. I enjoy Al's frequent appearances, and appreciate the chance to understand more about the balance of concerns that drive decisions in how the game develops. I have many friends in the gaming industry and know a fair amount of how things work internally in a number of companies. Adding some understanding of how Cryptic/STO works is good.
Do I like everything that Cryptic does in the game? No. Do I understand why they do things I don't like? More often than not, I do, largely due to P1. For me, understanding why a system is in place, for game balance or business reasons, helps me work with it, even if I'd rather see something else in play.
I know a lot of posters hate listening to interviews that do not adopt an adversarial stance, to demand changes desired by the "community." Hell, there are some who probably wouldn't be satisfied unless every interview went like a Democrat being roasted on Fox News.
Personally I would never listen to a podcast like that. The world is filled with lots of angry screaming about people upset about this or that. I don't want that kind of think dragging down my mood and pissing me off in my entertainment and down time.
P1 has always been a wonderful haven to keep up with a game I play for fun, and to find out in a positive and enjoyable way what goes on behind the scenes. I hope it never changes, and as long as it is fun, playful, respectful, and fair, I will be happy to jump on from time to time to talk science with the hosts, regardless of who takes up the reins.
I know these folk put a lot of personal time and effort into what they do every week, and I hate to see them come under fire due to alleged offenses in not serving "the community" by running a wonderful podcast they way they want to.
There is no "THE Community" of this game. There are many. P1 does an excellent job of serving one community of which I am a part. If you prefer a different voice, then I'm sure there are other options out there as well, or take a stab at making one yourself.
Rock on, P1, and keep doing what you do so well!
If that is the new official stance they want to take, thats fine, but that is not what we have been told. For years they have said they are representing THE community, THE players. So if they want to change that to "the specific part of the community whose feedback we want to listen to and who agree with what we say", thats fine! But just be honest and say THAT. Dont use vague or general language that gives an impression that isnt the case.
Also, if they want to say that "the community" they represent is just their listeners, thats also fine. But that begs the question, what about the people who LISTEN to the show, but didnt want Kam kicked off. How exactly is P1 representing those people who ARE listeners?
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I speak entirely for myself in my post, and not for the P1 team. My statements are my take on things, not theirs.
But how can you not understand that the community of this game is varied far beyond any single viewpoint? When have the devs ever implemented a change that wasn't both loved and hated at the same time on the forums. When has it ever happened that something that "the community" begged for finally showed up in a patch, immediately followed by "the community" screaming over how terrible it was to do that?
Players have to understand that there's virtually no opinion about any aspect of this game that isn't uncontested. And there is literally no way to make a decision that makes everyone happy.
I just take exception to those who attack people who do a project like P1 out of love for Trek and of STO because the podcast isn't being done the way they PERSONALLY want it, while hiding behind the banner of speaking for "THE community" which, as anyone who actually reads the forums knows, is anything BUT a single monolithic set of opinions.
The best any podcast can do it try to offer something of broad interest for a mixed player base. And they devote many hours of personal time, volunteering to put this together. They deserve better than constant attacks over personal soapbox issues.
P1 let SarcasmDetector go. People who followed Sarcasm over to P1 were shocked and upset when they found out. Other people/entities were surprised to see how much of a following Sarcasm has. P1 as an entity, can choose to not have anyone operate under their brand for whatever reason they have, whether it's justifiable or not. What they do to explain it to their fans is up to them.
Sarcasm has collected his toys, and moved on to focus on other endeavours. For those who enjoy his work, please continue to support him.
Fleet Defiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support | Fleet Manticore Kinetic Strike Ship | Tactical Command Kinetic Siege Refit | Fleet Defiant Quantum Phase Escort | Fleet Valiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support
Turning the Galaxy-X into a Torpedo Dreadnought & torpedo tutorial, with written torpedo guide.
"A good weapon and a great strategy will win you many battles." - Marshall
I knew using Kinetics would be playing the game on hard mode, but what I didn't realize was how bad the deck is stacked against Kinetics.
I do understand that, and that only supports the point I was making. Anyone who claims they represent "the community" or "the players" is wrong. No one does, and no podcast does. That being the case, no one should make comments even suggesting they do. And if those kinds of comments *are* made(whether recently or in the past), they should be called out as wrong.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
For sure. They have the right to ignore feedback from their listeners and refuse to respond. And other people have the right to give their thoughts on that. We all have the right to say whatever we want, in line with the forum rules.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I'll believe it when I see it. There are rumors (and I hope they never materialize) that he is planning on gating R&D mat'ls and the big marks behind the "optionals". I don't trust one word from his mouth other than he hates Klingons
Gateway to hell indeed
No argument there. I did invoke the RoA's in another forum, btw.
Fleet Defiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support | Fleet Manticore Kinetic Strike Ship | Tactical Command Kinetic Siege Refit | Fleet Defiant Quantum Phase Escort | Fleet Valiant Kinetic Heavy Fire Support
Turning the Galaxy-X into a Torpedo Dreadnought & torpedo tutorial, with written torpedo guide.
"A good weapon and a great strategy will win you many battles." - Marshall
I knew using Kinetics would be playing the game on hard mode, but what I didn't realize was how bad the deck is stacked against Kinetics.
I saw that =P
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I don't agree with all the "crapcast" comments, though I think your general point(regarding P1's tone) has been a common one over the years. Regarding the greater subject of representing the "community" or "players", there are really only 2 ways of getting ANY impression about what the "community" or "players" think or feel:
1) public forums
2) behind the scenes data
With rare exceptions of infographics, we simply do not have access to the behind the scenes numbers. That being the case, we have nothing to go on except Cryptic's word that "XX is the best expansion ever". The only thing we DO have access to and can actually see for ourselves is public forums, and the *most* people happen to be here on the official forums, not on a private fleet or podcast forum. And yes, the official forums are only a small minority of the total playerbase, and therefore do not accurately represent the total playerbase. But the fact remains, they are still the main source of player feedback that we actually have access to.
The "problem" is, some people ignore feedback they don't want to see, or doesn't fit into their talking points. Even if the official forums happen to be in an uproar about a given issue, some people will simply dismiss them and say, "oh, they don't represent the people in game", or "the people I talk to in my private little forum or fleet chat or skype channel don't think that". However, the true irony/hypocrisy of that statement is, the people who you talk to in your private little forum or fleet chat or skype channel are an even *smaller* group than post here on the official forums, meaning they are even *less* representative than the official forums.
Having said all that, the simple fact is that the folks at P1 have every right to make whatever kind of show they want, and they have every right to ignore feedback they disagree with.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
However, I do know that Cryptic/Perfect World Entertainment does NOT have to accept any invite to any Podcast it doesn't want, and can in fact at any moment say during an interview, "we're done here". So obviously there's a fine line that a free game reporting Podcast can cross before the developers feel that it is in their best interest not to do interviews.
As a community we want the developers to talk out, to tell us what's coming and their plans. We obviously want a Podcast that reports the truth and challenges the developers to make the game better and listen to the their paying gaming community; because let's be honest, keeping the lights on and paying the mortgage is what it's all about to them in the end...and we all have to understand and accept that.
Just my two cents, I could be wrong, just wanted to comment on this thread as well. I hope they work it all out, I'll keep listening and I hope Al and the rest of them continue to do interviews as well.
Fleet Leader of:
Liberty Task Force/Liberty Honor Guard
Pride of the Federation/Pride of the Empire
Liberty Guardians
U.S.S. Liberty, NX-42813-L, T-6 Legendary Odyssey Class
Game Handle: Grayfox@GrayfoxJames
Website: https://www.libertytaskforce.com
Armada (STOFA Member Fleet): https://www.libertytaskforce.com/stofa
Discord: https://discord.gg/bGp9N7z
Twitter: STOFA@LTFGrayfox
Email: CSDynamix@Hotmail.com
Kam, does at first, does seem to have the elitist attitude at first, but when you listen its not really elitist it is more of him knowing the game way more than his fellow hosts. Not that there is anything wrong with it. Jayce knows his lore, Cookie has that outsider's view, and Kenna has that new player view. Kam's interview wasn't a roast nor was it a grilling of Geko, Kam was just more assertive in his questions and Geko was giving good answers. This was the first interview that I enjoyed with Geko on it.
Nobody wants a grilling of the Devs just like they don't a complete groveling over the Dev either. Lately, its more towards latter.
I have read many similar comments, which is why it is such a shame he was kicked off. I also can't help but wonder what Geko's impression was. Did *he* feel like he was getting grilled? If so, did that have anything to do with anything else?
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Which "you guys", exactly? And which comments, specifically? I definitely think one person was a bit harsh, and I quoted that post in my reply to it, but other than that I have read mostly reasonable comments, and hope mine have been pretty reasonably worded as well. But since you made such a general statement, I just want to know who all you are talking about.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
The one you quoted for sure but just the general comments that Priority One is the "mouthpiece" of Cryptic. I just don't feel that way. Sure their take on the game might be more positive than most, they're big fans for one and of course they want to appease the Devs which in turn brings them back which in turn gives them listeners which in turn brings donations.
Fleet Leader of:
Liberty Task Force/Liberty Honor Guard
Pride of the Federation/Pride of the Empire
Liberty Guardians
U.S.S. Liberty, NX-42813-L, T-6 Legendary Odyssey Class
Game Handle: Grayfox@GrayfoxJames
Website: https://www.libertytaskforce.com
Armada (STOFA Member Fleet): https://www.libertytaskforce.com/stofa
Discord: https://discord.gg/bGp9N7z
Twitter: STOFA@LTFGrayfox
Email: CSDynamix@Hotmail.com
I am part of a different segment of the community that would NOT prefer that kind of podcast. P1 does an excellent job of covering what's happening in game, and giving an insiders perspective on why things unfold the way they do. That's a valuable function, I enjoy it, and as such am contributing to this thread to voice the other community desire to P1, which is to maintain their current format and editorial style. It has served them, and us, for many years now.
I did enjoy Kam on the show; he was not representing my primary interests in the game, but did give an insight into the DPSer mentality. I don't share it, but I do understand it a bit better. I personally disagree strongly with some of the changes he was lobbying for in that particular interview. I don't know what transpired behind the scenes, but I did feel he was beginning to dance on the edge of proper interview etiquette (though I also don't personally think he crossed it in anything I heard on the podcast). Despite disagreeing with some of his key points, I AM sorry to see him go, but not knowing why things played out that way I don't think it's fair or appropriate for anyone to "demand" his return through a poll or ad-hoc collection of requests in this thread.
I just feel it's important to speak up when I hear a number of posters pile on and say P1 is flawed and needs to change its format because it isn't doing what they would want a podcast to do. Because it IS doing what many others of us think it should, which includes a standing policy of respectful civility when dealing with interviews.
Forums are filled with people passionate about things that they are unhappy with. Passion is a great motivator to post. But for every angry voice there is at least another content voice that doesn't say anything because they are NOT worked up and quietly approve of how things are. One can't always take the angry tenor of most online forums to indicate those opinions represent everyone.
I've been posting in this thread to at least balance out the opinions to include those of the segment of the community that supports their style as-is, and is grateful for the time, effort, and passion they bring to this endeavor.
Also it doesnt actually matter what we think as P1 is not our project its theirs so you can stop listening or just accept it but crying about it wont help.
Kam just wasnt fitting well and thats that.