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Forum Mods - what gives you the right?

jackal1701apwjackal1701apw Member Posts: 668 Arc User
EDIT: Self-moderated as against forum-rules - please close.
Post edited by jackal1701apw on
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Comments

  • mjarbarmjarbar Member Posts: 2,084 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    I can't post a link because my iPad keeps TRIBBLE up but there is a pretty comprehensive post on the STO Redit that gives ONE side of the story so that may be a good place to start.

    As for you post, the discussion of the Mods decisions in public is verboten so if you do want to raise a query I sudgest you PM them. In all liklyhood this thread will be locked if not removed.
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  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,395 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    These threads are like watching a train wreck. :) Or a Nandi wreck, as the case may be, as I just found a Nandi floating on the seas at Risa.

    Anyway, Inb4lock
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  • sunfranckssunfrancks Member Posts: 3,925 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    PWE owns the forum and gives the moderators the right to moderate it, I think.

    This.

    It was actually Trendy that closed the original topic made by one of the DPS channel mods.

    Basically, from what I have gathered from various sources, one subset of the admin team wanted the league reset due to some of the cheese that was used to exaggerate the numbers, being fixed by the devs.

    The other subset of the admin team didn't want that, so a slagging match started and mud was thrown everywhere.

    That is the general gist of it...
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  • imruinedimruined Member Posts: 1,457 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    PWE owns the forum and gives the moderators the right to moderate it, I think.

    Exactly what I was about to say... These are privately owned and operated forums - we are all guests here...

    I can't be bothered digging through the forums TOS right now, but I would also suspect that there's something written within stating Cryptic (through their moderators) have the right to close and delete any topic which they feel is inappropriate - a TOS we all agreed to when joining...
    The entitlement is strong in these forums...

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  • zobovorzobovor Member Posts: 198 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    PWE owns the forum and gives the moderators the right to moderate it, I think.

    True, but their mandate (I think) is about "fleet drama" .
    The DPS channels have about 7500 ppl in them, so that makes them a sub-community .

    And because of that, Askray would have done better if he gave an actual reason , as I don't recall the Foundry folk or the RPers or the PVPers getting this gag treatment .
    As is, it's just weird and uninformative .
  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,395 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    imruined wrote: »
    Exactly what I was about to say... These are privately owned and operated forums - we are all guests here...

    I can't be bothered digging through the forums TOS right now, but I would also suspect that there's something written within stating Cryptic (through their moderators) have the right to close and delete any topic which they feel is inappropriate - a TOS we all agreed to when joining...


    Not to mention there being something in the TOS about not being allowed to talk about decisions made by the moderation team. If the OP disagrees with something, let him/her take it to PM with the mod team.
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  • zobovorzobovor Member Posts: 198 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    *gets fresh hot popcorn out*... offers to share.

    I wonder how long it will be before this thread gets locked for complaining about another thread being modsmacked.

    :rolleyes:

    Well it was the third thread getting zapped .
    The first one was the pinned (now unpinned) DPS channels advert post .
    Second one got zapped with 2 posts in .
    And the last one was a perfectly reasonable toned one that got to page 9 before zap .

    Draw your own conclusios ... , as no reason is being provided .
  • imruinedimruined Member Posts: 1,457 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    zobovor wrote: »
    Draw your own conclusios ... , as no reason is being provided .

    It's pretty obvious Cryptic don't want it descending into a flame-war about who did what and who was to blame etc - we all know that's exactly what it would become, to think otherwise is being naive...
    The entitlement is strong in these forums...

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  • jackal1701apwjackal1701apw Member Posts: 668 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    meimeitoo wrote: »
    Not to mention there being something in the TOS about not being allowed to talk about decisions made by the moderation team.

    Please enlighten me as to where it says that...
    In the whole of Q's rules and policies post there is nothing about this:
    http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/announcement.php?f=128&a=151

    You are not allowed to discuss private correspondence from Mods (or anyone else for that matter) but I have read that post through a couple of times and can't see anything about not being ale to discuss such a decision.

    All I am saying is that it's fine when things get flamey Mods should be within their right to edit/delete posts, but closing whole threads on the discussion and leaving players who have no idea what is going on sat like this little icon :confused: is not right...
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  • jackal1701apwjackal1701apw Member Posts: 668 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Disputing an Infraction

    If you wish to dispute an infraction, you may file a 'forums and website' ticket on our support page located at: https://support.perfectworld.com/app/ask. A member of our Community Team, other than the individual who gave the infraction, will review your dispute and make a final call on the matter. Once a dispute has been reviewed and actioned, the issue will be considered closed and not subject to additional review.

    PWE has the final say on all aspects of this community. If you have a problem, you may make a complaint to PWE directly through our support site, and not publicly on the website. Creating threads or posts that question or reference administrative decisions or potential administrative decisions, such as post removals and thread closures, is not permitted.

    Well there we go.... learn something new everyday :)
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    ...#LLAP...
  • imruinedimruined Member Posts: 1,457 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Never mind... Was beaten to it...
    The entitlement is strong in these forums...

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  • zobovorzobovor Member Posts: 198 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Doesn't matter if they are a sub community. It doesn't give them the right to pollute the forums with flame wars or circumvent moderation by opening new threads to continue sniping at each other.

    And no the Mods don't have to explain their actions unless Cryptic/PWE requires them to do so, like when they send a PM to someone explaining why an infraction was given.

    It's nice if they do say something, but they don't owe us a public announcement justifying their decisions. Especially when people childishly spam new threads to get around a thread lock.

    I fully agree about all of that, with the exception that I see a difference between if said behavior came from a fleet and a sub-community .

    As an example , a few years ago when SOME Foundry folk were angry that the top listed Foundry missions were EC farms and they came to this main forum about that issue and lots of drama followed, the mods acted on threads that had "drama" , not against the topic in general, as it was considered a legitimate topic of a sub-community .

    In short, it was OK to talk about that, or the use of "clicky" missions (again Foundry drama) .
    When you deny a sub-community the participation of the "general forums" , I agree with the OP, that a thought out reason aught to be given .

    As is, it's like "we know it's a hot topic, but don't talk about it ... , because ..." what?
    These forums are not for your sub-community except when padded DPS videos are posted or when a well known numbers guy gets to host P1 ?

    Anyway ... pass the popcorn please .
  • bendalekbendalek Member Posts: 1,781 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    inb4lock ... Short answer ...

    One group of e-peen strokers spat the dummy at another group of e-peen strokers, and the e-peeen stroker channels exploded!

    Then one group of e-peen strokers came on these forums to whine, and another group of e-peen strokers joined in on the whining and disturbed the peace of those of us who are mature, and realise that this is JUST A GAME!

    So the PWE and by extension the mods had every right and justification in closing those threads, and probably this one too, in their forums.
    Oh, hoho hohhhhh, Oh,, hoho, hohhhhh
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  • supergirl1611supergirl1611 Member Posts: 809 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Bottom line is what was done was done, it was a very dishonoralbe and sneaky way to do it all for a power grab but its done.

    Morally right or wrong players will still use the new channels, why ? because they follow the path of least resistance and PvE queues will have high success rates so players can get their marks and dil without the hit and miss of the public queues, thats all the everyday joe player cares about that uses private channels.

    Hell if players had a true morale centre then some of the decisions taken by Cryptic would have nailed the coffin shut tight on this game many moons ago. But whilst there's still fun to be had we hang around dreaming of better times.

    I annoyed by what they did but i also understand that no amount of flaming or posting facts about the situation is going to change that. I doubt they lost any sleep over their actions anyone able to pull of that action wouldn't, and so nor will i.

    From a morale point of view i've chosen not to use the new channels.
  • bluethirdworldbluethirdworld Member Posts: 31 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    bendalek wrote: »

    One group of e-peen strokers spat the dummy at another group of e-peen strokers, and the e-peeen stroker channels exploded!

    Then one group of e-peen strokers came on these forums to whine, and another group of e-peen strokers joined in on the whining and disturbed the peace of those of us who are mature, and realise that this is JUST A GAME!

    So if there's a point of contention and disagreement then where can people discuss it?

    And if poeple discussing an issue disturbs your peace so much then just ignore it. This is the internet, not a direct line to your brain you cannot turn off.

    Some feel more strongly about issues you don't care about, so please explain why that's bad to discuss it? Would you appreciate people coming in on threads you are participating in and saying "it's just a game, stop disturbing my peace!"?

    Also, your crass characterization of the event shows you don't understand many if the issues, which seems inevitable as no one here can discuss it fit too long without getting threads closed. When over-moderation leads to ignorance that is a problem.
  • thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,108 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Also, your crass characterization of the event shows you don't understand many if the issues, which seems inevitable as no one here can discuss it fit too long without getting threads closed. When over-moderation leads to ignorance that is a problem.

    Since I am a DPS layman, and you seem to understand the situation, can you give me a simple explanation of what actually happened?

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    Join Date: Sep 2008

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  • bluethirdworldbluethirdworld Member Posts: 31 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    There's several active discussions on [redacted], as you should know ;-) Enough is going on there - no need to repeat here.
  • darkjeffdarkjeff Member Posts: 2,590 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Since I am a DPS layman, and you seem to understand the situation, can you give me a simple explanation of what actually happened?

    It's possible to have a team fly Recluse carriers to boost the DPS of the 5th captain. This isn't just stacking lots of Attack Pattern Beta, but also the Tholian Tetryon Grid console, which apparently affects players. By coordinating the timing so the 5th player fires off all their high cooldown burst abilities during the 5s boost from multiple Grid consoles, it's possible to get massive numbers for that 5th guy. Generally, the 5th guy gets over 100k while the others get 20k to 30k.

    The admin vote was to split these specialized "boost the 5th guy" runs into a separate chart, and not have these boosted runs count as qualifying runs.

    Apparently, a subset of the admin were unhappy with that, and during maintenance cleared out all the channels they had access to (over 7k players kicked), even ground channels they weren't trying to replace, and then sent new invites to their own channels.
  • jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 9,764 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Qualifying for what? Is there an in-game reward for getting high DPS? If not, I suppose that would be up to whoever's measuring epeens at the moment.

    As for the title of the thread - PWE owns the forums. PWE has appointed mods, and given them power to edit and/or close threads. This is private "property", over which they are entitled to exercise said power. That gives them the right.
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  • alexhurlbutalexhurlbut Member Posts: 292 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    meimeitoo wrote: »
    Or a Nandi wreck, as the case may be, as I just found a Nandi floating on the seas at Risa.

    Anyway, Inb4lock

    Not a "wreck" some of us take it to mean that Nandi is planet-landing capable like Voyager and Defiant. (and the last 2 Risian ships?)
  • westmetalswestmetals Member Posts: 8,390 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    zobovor wrote: »
    Well it was the third thread getting zapped .
    The first one was the pinned (now unpinned) DPS channels advert post .
    Second one got zapped with 2 posts in .
    And the last one was a perfectly reasonable toned one that got to page 9 before zap .

    Draw your own conclusios ... , as no reason is being provided .

    And being the OP... that two-post thread shouldn't have been as it wasn't directly about the drama, since I am not involved and have never been. And I am still experiencing the problem mentioned in that post, which I am now unlikely to ever get an answer for as the thread got locked down.
  • jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 9,764 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Not a "wreck" some of us take it to mean that Nandi is planet-landing capable like Voyager and Defiant. (and the last 2 Risian ships?)
    According to the old tech manual, the saucer section of the Constitution-class cruiser is capable of planetfall. It can't take off under its own power, but it can land...
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  • thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,108 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    darkjeff wrote: »
    Apparently, a subset of the admin were unhappy with that, and during maintenance cleared out all the channels they had access to (over 7k players kicked), even ground channels they weren't trying to replace, and then sent new invites to their own channels.

    Good lord :rolleyes:

    Thanks for the explanation though :)

    The-Grand-Nagus
    Join Date: Sep 2008

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  • alexhurlbutalexhurlbut Member Posts: 292 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    jonsills wrote: »
    According to the old tech manual, the saucer section of the Constitution-class cruiser is capable of planetfall. It can't take off under its own power, but it can land...
    And we see that in action with her descendant, the Enterprise-D in Generation heh. Best scene of the movie, Data and his most profound utterance.
  • thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,108 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    And if poeple discussing an issue disturbs your peace so much then just ignore it. This is the internet, not a direct line to your brain you cannot turn off.
    No, this is a privately owned and operated forum run by Cryptic/PWE.

    Cryptic/PWE decides the rules we have to follow if we want to be a part of this community.

    Cryptic/PWE decides which issues will be open for discussion and which will not.

    Cryptic/PWE decides which threads will remain open and which will be locked.

    ;)

    What he said has NOTHING to do with what you said. You are talking about rule breaking and forum moderation. HE is saying that if you don't LIKE a particular topic, then you can IGNORE it.

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    Join Date: Sep 2008

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  • angrytargangrytarg Member Posts: 10,838 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    jonsills wrote: »
    According to the old tech manual, the saucer section of the Constitution-class cruiser is capable of planetfall. It can't take off under its own power, but it can land...

    Fun fact: The Galaxy saucer was even intented to have landing gear and serve as a fully functional landing module (designer's interview in the Star Trek Starships magazine), essentially being a small city of it's own. But due to a deadline approaching, the landing gear couldn't be added to the model - in my headcanon it could always do this because it made sense (shuttle bay 1 looks like it could extend a landing bridge and be a huge transport for all kinds of equipment and personnel) - I'm glad that I was right with that assumption :D
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  • alexhurlbutalexhurlbut Member Posts: 292 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    Didn't Saint Roddenberry say he originally intended the whole ship (TOS Enterprise) to land but the doing the sets for the show was deemed too expensive so they went with transporters...
    Is that why we see the 'neo' Enterprise on planetside (construction) in the first movie, and "Rise, Kraken, RISE!" in "Into the Darkness?:D
  • bluethirdworldbluethirdworld Member Posts: 31 Arc User
    edited June 2015
    What he said has NOTHING to do with what you said. You are talking about rule breaking and forum moderation. HE is saying that if you don't LIKE a particular topic, then you can IGNORE it.

    Exactly, thanks for the help. Moderation shouldn't be about topics people don't like, but decorum and respect.
This discussion has been closed.