R&D Suggestion: New School - Starship Engineering

kodachikuno · November 2014

So I was considering the new upgrade systems and the R&D System and this idea hit me, and Im sure its been thought of before, but I'll toss it out and see if it'll be as popular as I think it will.

This school would be really minimal but I think the effects would be really worth the effort/grind/expense.

Levels 1-4 - would have some consumables that have an effect on small things like power transfer rates, temp hull points, shield recharge.
Level 5 - Allows you to(at a great expense in materials) upgrade a Tier 1 vessel to Tier 2
Levels 6-9 - would have improved versions of the earlier consumables, and new components required for the lv10 ability
Level 10 - Allows you to(at a great expense in materials) upgrade a Tier 2 vessel to Tier 3(including ones you upgraded from t1)
Levels 11-14 - would have advanced versions of the consumables, and new components required for the lv15 ability
Level 15 - Allows you to(at a great expense in materials) upgrade a Tier 3 vessel to Tier 4(including ones you upgraded from earlier tiers)
Levels 16-19 - Would allow construction of consumable combat pets like shuttles or the scorpion fighters you get from the vault mission, as well as the heavy TRIBBLE satellite turrets, and new components required for the lv20 ability
Level 20 - Allows you to take any existing Tier 5 vessel that cannot be upgraded to T5-U and upgrade it to T5-U capable(you would still have to buy the upgrade module to unlock it.)

This gives Cryptic a whole new grind, allows them to monetize vessels again that they have already gotten money on before(zen ships in the t1-3 range), monetize vessels they cant now, AND gives players something they already want. I think a lot of players would love to use a lower tier hull longer, esp if its a favorite like the Constitution or Constitution II.

The T5-U provided by this system would need to be kinda generic so as to not detract from other vessels. A few ideas I had are below.

Escorts : Lv1 Accuracy and Defense boost, lv2 critH and critD boost, lv3 weapon power boost, lv4 shield regen boost
Cruisers : Lv1 hull hp and regen boost, lv2 eng boff cooldown reduction, lv3 shield hp boost, lv4 cruiser powers get a little better
Science : Lv1 Sensor Analysis gets a boost. Lv2 shield hp and regen boost, lv3 subsystem target more effective, Lv4 sci boff cooldown reduction
Warbirds : Lv1 bonus stealth while cloaked, lv2 Accuracy and Defense boost, lv3 sing charge rate increase, lv4 small power level boost

these are just rough ideas of course and could be rearranged or redone completely but I felt I should include at least some ideas so the whole system looked more complete.

Unknown · November 2014

This content has been removed.

kodachikuno · November 2014

I kinda expected this idea would be more popular

mvp333 · November 2014

I like this idea, except that t1 and t2 ships should NOT be upgradeable to endgame, no matter how much grind goes into them. The Constitution-class and the like are really old, and CBS has actually stepped in and ruled out having them as endgame ships. Also, the ships that can't be upgraded to T5U are that way for a reason, AFAIK. T3 and T4, though, and the boosts/upgrades/consumables, I would like to see something like this for.

tcgrandpa · November 2014

please add this in!

kodachikuno · November 2014

mvp333 wrote: »

I like this idea, except that t1 and t2 ships should NOT be upgradeable to endgame, no matter how much grind goes into them. The Constitution-class and the like are really old, and CBS has actually stepped in and ruled out having them as endgame ships. Also, the ships that can't be upgraded to T5U are that way for a reason, AFAIK. T3 and T4, though, and the boosts/upgrades/consumables, I would like to see something like this for.

Thats why I capped all the t1-3 vessels at t4. I dont see any 'good' reason to limit existing t5 ships other than Cryptic wants money... this would let them monetize existing t5 ships. It would also provide these ships a generic, and weaker, upgrade tree than the existing t5-u and t6 ships. So there would still be a reason to shuck out cash for the better vessels. But if you REALLY REALLY want that other hull... there ya go.

kodachikuno · November 2014

no one else has any ideas to refine this concept?

xiaoping88 · November 2014

kodachikuno wrote: »

no one else has any ideas to refine this concept?

I love it. Of course you can imagine tons of cool stuff done this way.
But I don't see it happening.

hyefather · November 2014

kodachikuno wrote: »

I kinda expected this idea would be more popular

I like it but cryptic won't do it. Why? because they be damned if they would ever have to give credit to someone else for improving thier game. I believe they would go as far as going bankrupt on sto before they would ever give credit where credit is due, if it came from anyone other than themselves.

kodachikuno · November 2014

hyefather wrote: »

I like it but cryptic won't do it. Why? because they be damned if they would ever have to give credit to someone else for improving thier game. I believe they would go as far as going bankrupt on sto before they would ever give credit where credit is due, if it came from anyone other than themselves.

damn and I thought I was a pessimist

generator88 · December 2014

I hate to jump into the pessimism parade but while I like the idea, I don't think it would ever be implemented in the manner in which we want it.

The driving idea behind this would be to squeeze a little more life out of older ships, right? Just to put an example to it, let's say I had a Gladius-class Escort Refit (t2 ship), and I was hoping to ay least ride that ship up into t4. I have no faith that Cryptic wouldn't stretch the process out such that by the time I'd leveled up the needed R&D school and applied the necessary upgrades to my Gladius, that wasn't more than what I would have spent on a decent t5 ship, to say nothing of actually equipping said ship. During which time, I've been flying a ship that's constantly a tier or 2 behind the times.

Gah, I hate that I've gotten this cynical, but I am what they've made me. :-/

Generator

kodachikuno · December 2014

well thats the reason I made it so overly grindy and easy to monetize... so Cryptic would actually consider it :P I know there were several ships I would rather have just upgraded instead of choosing the next tier vessel. Sometimes because I hated the next tier options, other times just because I really liked the look and feel of what I was already flying.

dareau · February 2015

IIRC, there are T5, FT5, and FT5U versions of all:

Science T2 on up - Rhode Island, Olympus "bubble front", and obviously Intrepid designs.
Escort T2 on up - Saber or whatever that T2 is, Akira-types from T3, and obviously Defiant.
Cruiser T3 on up - Stargazer type, Excelsior, Ambassador, T4 Galaxy stockpiles.

And these ships are "monetized" with the costs of 200k FC for the T5 stock versions, 20K + 4 Fleet Modules (2k zen from somewhere) for FT5, and the extra $7 for the FT5U module.

Notice that all the T1s are "excluded" due to the "age" issue, and the T2 Cruisers (Connie Refit, Excalibur/Exeter/Vesper variants of the Connie) more over the "no Connies at endgame" concept - taken to the obvious extreme (it looks remotely like either NCC-1701 with no letters, it's not endgame material...)

As my sig indicates, I would love for the T1s and those last T2s to be "endgameified", and have stated the reasons it should be done multiple times - the least of which is that why are "certain fans" - specifically ToS, ENT-era hero, and most of TMP (the obvious exclusion of a certain Dev's favorite TMP ship) that can't enjoy their hero/favorite ship at endgame in what has morphed into the "ultimate sandbox version" of Star Trek...

If I keep typing, I'll delve into topics not appreciated by the Frequent Question Thread...

Here's hoping that the new EP takes the time to discuss these concerns with CBS and the rest of the Dev Team...

captaind3 · February 2015

I'm kind of a canonist, so I'm genuinely against the idea of tier 5 starships from 150 years ago on the raw principle.

Your idea has merit in other ways however. Instead of utilizing it for upgrading ships to higher tiers, I would utilize to customize existing starships with new abilities. Instead of just swapping out consoles, full on system upgrades. You don't put an EPS manifold into a console slot, you actually do a permanent overhaul on your ship's EPS conduit network permanently improving the ship's power transfer performance.

That said the older ships shouldn't be exempt from this. But for the Tier 1-4 ships, there should be a definitive ceiling to how much the ship's performance could be improved through this system. But I'm sure there would open up a tuner market for people to still do STFs in their hardened and tooled up Tier 1 and 2 ships.

I think a solution...and expensive solution would be to offer a "Quantum Leap" alternative setting. Have a gameplay space, where you would basically be operating as back in time, where the tier 2 starships would be top of the line. If the Undine attacked The Federation in 2375 what would the mission and response be like.

To me, the only way a Constitution should be endgame is if the timeline is the late 23rd century.

kodachikuno · February 2015

captaind3 wrote: »

I'm kind of a canonist, so I'm genuinely against the idea of tier 5 starships from 150 years ago on the raw principle.

To me, the only way a Constitution should be endgame is if the timeline is the late 23rd century.

Yeah well if I had my druthers the whole game would be set in the movie era and TRIBBLE on TNG+ :P But really I stopped trying to apply canon anything to STO the moment they turned the RSE into snidley whiplash and this terrible 1.5 dimensional sidekicks. When they tossed a t-rex with laz0rz in because 'it was cool' that was when I stopped taking STO remotely serious as a Trek game and began treating it as the Trek-ish flavored PWE half-assed p.o.s. its devolving into. If this game even tried to be or feel like Star Trek I'd agree with you 100% but it doesn't

edit:
p.s. thanks for rezing this topic!

at least more people will get a chance to look it over and toss in their 2 bits

centaurianalpha · February 2015

The idea is a good one, but its implementation would undoubtedly cost a purple fortune in dil, ship upgrades & fleet modules. Of course, it would never be used if the total price of the finished product were too much higher than the Zen or Lobi stores, but it's a feature that a good F2P game should have.

beefydegree · February 2015

kodachikuno wrote: »

Yeah well if I had my druthers the whole game would be set in the movie era and TRIBBLE on TNG+ :P But really I stopped trying to apply canon anything to STO the moment they turned the RSE into snidley whiplash and this terrible 1.5 dimensional sidekicks. When they tossed a t-rex with laz0rz in because 'it was cool' that was when I stopped taking STO remotely serious as a Trek game and began treating it as the Trek-ish flavored PWE half-assed p.o.s. its devolving into. If this game even tried to be or feel like Star Trek I'd agree with you 100% but it doesn't

edit:
p.s. thanks for rezing this topic! at least more people will get a chance to look it over and toss in their 2 bits

Have to say, I do agree with you on that. I can't wait, in some way, that someone else, buys this company out, and get this StarTrek, on Track, the way it should have been.. :cool: I still like the game. But changes are really needed..:rolleyes:

captaind3 · March 2015

kodachikuno wrote: »

Yeah well if I had my druthers the whole game would be set in the movie era and TRIBBLE on TNG+ :P But really I stopped trying to apply canon anything to STO the moment they turned the RSE into snidley whiplash and this terrible 1.5 dimensional sidekicks. When they tossed a t-rex with laz0rz in because 'it was cool' that was when I stopped taking STO remotely serious as a Trek game and began treating it as the Trek-ish flavored PWE half-assed p.o.s. its devolving into. If this game even tried to be or feel like Star Trek I'd agree with you 100% but it doesn't

edit:
p.s. thanks for rezing this topic! at least more people will get a chance to look it over and toss in their 2 bits

I never understood why people hated the idea of the Voth utilizing a weaponized Jurassic Park against us. I'm surprised there wasn't a Jurassic Park book about that. They'd have access to the genetic data, experience working with them, and the tech for the mind control (after 65 million years of R&D). The psychological impact of a Tyrannosaur charging would be worth cleaning up the dung and fertilizer on a city ship.

Then again I may not have been fazed because I loved Dino Riders as a kid.

allyoftheforce · October 2018

Scaling ships would be a nice take for the future of the game. But I don't see it becoming a big thing unless they up the price of the ships themselves. Either in Dil cost or Zen. Which wouldn't surprise me. People have been wanting something like this for a long time. Holding on to your favorite ship for as long as you can. It's something that was sort of in the show. Upgrades, retrofits, refits, modular replacements and so on.

I remember Suricatta making a suggestion, long ago, about putting computer cores in game. Certain things would determine the amount and type of ship gear you could have while making a lower level tier ship equal to one that starts at a higher level. Though it would have limits. You can only upgrade so far to a certain tier. I.E., you can't put a phaser lance on a Miranda.

R&D Suggestion: New School - Starship Engineering

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