QOL Improvement Request: Vendor Selling/R&D Ordering

lordhavelock · February 2015

TLDR: Cryptic, please remove the R&D Bank items from Vendor/Replicator Recycle menu, or otherwise add some sort of tabs, hide, or sort option.

I had originally posted asking that the R&D material be removed from the top of the Recycle menu and put at the bottom. I'm someone who sells vendor trash from the top-down. However, as this thread has progressed, there are others who sell their items bottom-up and are adamantly against my initial recommended change (and for them, I can see why they like it, but that doesn't work for my playstyle, see post 24 for details).

I think the best suggestions for what I currently feel would serve everyone and most improve the game, is in-hindsight, probably the most "simple": R&D material should be removed from Recycle entirely, or given it's own Recycle tab or "accordion" menu. Player solemkof makes this fine example:

solemkof wrote: »

reposting a sketch: http://i.imgur.com/BoZdYvF.jpg
top-sellers would only need one click to get R&D-mats out of the way, bottom-sellers would scroll down as usual

Please make it so!

Others have noted that some games offer the ability to lock items so they are hidden/can't be sold. Or the opposite, a Flag-Item-Function along with a Sell-All-Flagged-Items button. These would be great features to add to the game, too!

Anyway, thanks for reading/discussing. Please and thank yous to Cryptic. Live Long and Prosper!

xparr15 · February 2015

Start at the bottom and vendor upwards. All your things stay at the top of your inventory, you can just spam click sell, and you get to ignore all the mats at the top.

thatcursedwolf · February 2015

Do you poo-poo requests for things to have their own timers instead of relying on using rep timers as well?

lordhavelock · February 2015

xparr15 wrote: »

Start at the bottom and vendor upwards. All your things stay at the top of your inventory, you can just spam click sell, and you get to ignore all the mats at the top.

I still have to scroll down all the time I go to sell items at a shop, which is precisely what I'm trying to avoid doing.

Not to mention, the bottom of my inventory contains all sorts of items I *DON'T* want to sell, but carry with me all the time (pets, mostly, but also alternate gear, a stack of extra batteries/hypoes, that sort of stuff).

The way things are now, I have to scroll down below the R&D stuff, and find the "sweet spot" of vendor trash between R&D and desired/keep-able stuff. If R&D were at the bottom, then my vendor trash would be at the top of the menu and I'd just start selling straight away...

bobtheskull99 · February 2015

ugh, no, 100% against this...when I have vendor trash to sell its always at the bottom.... just sell from the bottom up until you hit something you don't want to sell

centaurianalpha · February 2015

There's no good reason to group the R & D stuff with any equipment at a vendor. Apart from the occasional bartender, the equipment vendors have no logical reason to be interested in materials. True, some vendors sell upgrades, but none that are really worth buying. TBH, I was initially surprised when I discovered that I could sell anything in my inventory to any vendor; apart from the out-world bartenders, I can't see why a kit vendor or armorer would buy ship equipment, and visa versa.

rattler2 · February 2015

I'd rather they DIDN'T show the Crafting Mats in the sell window, as they aren't even WORTH anything.

farmallm · February 2015

I like the idea of putting the R&D stuff in a different group. So you can easily click to which one to sell. Just like how you can click to see your inventory, R&D, and Assets.

bergins · February 2015

lordhavelock wrote: »

I still have to scroll down all the time I go to sell items at a shop, which is precisely what I'm trying to avoid doing.

Not to mention, the bottom of my inventory contains all sorts of items I *DON'T* want to sell, but carry with me all the time (pets, mostly, but also alternate gear, a stack of extra batteries/hypoes, that sort of stuff).

The way things are now, I have to scroll down below the R&D stuff, and find the "sweet spot" of vendor trash between R&D and desired/keep-able stuff. If R&D were at the bottom, then my vendor trash would be at the top of the menu and I'd just start selling straight away...

No thanks. The items I'm keeping in inventory auto-sort to the top of inventory, so anything I pick up (vendor trash) is at the bottom of my inventory. If I currently click on the Recycle tab, the order of things is:
1. R&D Mats, etc
2. Main Inventory: Stuff to Keep
3. Main Inventory: Stuff I've Picked Up
All I need to do is scroll to the bottom of the Recycle tab's list and click away happily. If they put R&D at the end, as you suggest, the order would be:
1. Main Inventory: Stuff to Keep
2. Main Inventory: Stuff I've Picked Up
3. R&D Mats, etc
Ordered this way, I'd need to fiddle around the list, looking for the Vendor Trash between my Stuff to Keep and R&D. Not an improvement at all.

jrichard1979 · February 2015

I keep all my R&D stuff in my bank. But it wouldn't hurt to have them not show at all like somebody else said. Since they sell for 0. You can craft with items from your bank, granted my bank is slap full, but it works for me.

solemkof · February 2015

reposting a sketch: http://i.imgur.com/BoZdYvF.jpg
top-sellers would only need one click to get R&D-mats out of the way, bottom-sellers would scroll down as usual

millimidget · February 2015

lordhavelock wrote: »

It's quite inconvenient, not to mention increases the potential to accidentally delete (sell) components or other things not intended.

Which is exactly why it's WAI.

zeuslegion1 · February 2015

Another Quality of Life Improvement: Remove unnecessary confirmation pop-ups.

Yes, I get it. You want to make sure I wanted to do X before letting me do X. Still, there are quite a few unnecessary additional confirmations to the confirmation.

Like at the ESD Ship Vendor:

ME: "Hmm. I'd like to take a look at some starships, please."

LT. LAUREL: "I'm here to help you choose a vessel. What would like to know?"

ME: "Just show me your selection."

LT. LAUREL: "Would you like to get a new starship, have me tell you about the different ship types, or end our conversation?"

ME: "Hmm. Thought I was pretty clear on that. I'd like to take a look at some ships."

LT. LAUREL: "Which one were you interested in?"

ME: "Is this a gag? Did Q put you up to this? I DON'T KNOW WHAT SHIP I WANT. SHOW. ME. YOUR. SELECTION."

LT. LAUREL: "Would you like to browse our selection?"

ME: "For the love of Spock's green-blooded pointy ears, YES, woman. YES. I would LOVE to see your selection of SHIPS. YES."

...

Another useful change would be to put the Customize Starship button ABOVE the Customize Shuttle button in the Ship Tailor responses. Seriously. How often do I ever need to customize the shuttle I NEVER GET TO USE?

"Comparatively little" is the correct answer. You go to the bonus round.

...

Also, while cleaning these things up, how about adding some personality to these characters? The Tailor on ESD is Cardassian for cryin' out loud. A CARDASSIAN TAILOR. There's NO WAY Elim Garak would say to any customer "Hello. You can alter your uniform and look here." as his sales pitch.

How about instead of that, his pitch is more like this:

GHEMIK TELUR: "Well hello there! Tired of that old uniform? I can get you into something new in a jiffy! Or maybe you need some off-duty clothes, something stylish for a night on the town? You wouldn't want to look unfashionable on Risa, now would you?"

"Please, view our selection of finely tailored outfits and let me know if I can be of any further assistance."

[View Selection]
[Exit]

If you're worried new players won't understand the difference between costume slots, move all that 4th-wall-shattering text at the top of the tailor screen i.e. "In addition to Duty Uniforms, your character has a costume slot for Off-Duty Outfits. Off-Duty Outfits offer a variety of new looks for when you're not on the bridge and include many items not allowed in the Starfleet Uniform Code. Some items of clothing and colors may only be used in an Off-Duty Outfit slot."

BAM. Noob has been schooled + NPC interaction has been streamlined AND made briefly interesting.

alex284 · February 2015

centaurianalpha wrote: »

There's no good reason to group the R & D stuff with any equipment at a vendor. Apart from the occasional bartender, the equipment vendors have no logical reason to be interested in materials. True, some vendors sell upgrades, but none that are really worth buying. TBH, I was initially surprised when I discovered that I could sell anything in my inventory to any vendor; apart from the out-world bartenders, I can't see why a kit vendor or armorer would buy ship equipment, and visa versa.

This. You get, what, 0 selling crafting mats to vendors, but could get 100's of thousands selling them on the exchange?

Just take out crafting mats from the sell window. It only lends itself to accidents.

bernatk · February 2015

True. Also why not right click / "flag as junk". When at vendor, "sell junk". Like in that other PWE game (Torchlight).

decronia · February 2015

Anyone remember how the replicator used to be? The commodities were at the end and you had to scroll down to get to them. After a while they changed this and put them at the top. I see no difference here. AS has been said I don't see why the mats show at all as they have 0ec value. The crafter items do so I can see why they are visible.

fovrel · February 2015

Just as some other posters here I made a habit of putting vendor trash at the bottom of my inventory, did that before the new R&D system, so I can sell from bottom to top. Yeah, I have to scroll down each time I want to sell stuff.

This system works for me fine, but an improvement is not wrong here. I don't mind if things get changed as long it is overall an improvement. Here are some more ideas

Let us flag items for selling or not selling, at the vendor sellable items are only shown or non-sellable is greyed out.

Let me sell/recycle everything. I am looking at lockboxes and tribbles. In Neverwinter Online I can sell the lockboxes at a vendor. As I remember you get some gold for it. This is not needed here, however I want an easy and convenient way to trash them.

I spent a lot of time fiddling with my inventory. No matter how much inventory slots I have, I always fill them up, so I end with 6 to 10 free slots. Its the paradox, I don't need this item now, but perhaps I need it later. Let's keep it. It is the reason I do not buy extra bank and inventory slots. I only seem to fill them up, so what is the point.

I have recently hit level 60 with one of my characters. A milestone, then I do a mission and pick up some loot. What is it? A small hypo .... Ahhhhhh, I am such a happy guy now. This is sometimes better than sex. No.

I would love to have a gimmick, would certainly be intersted to buy it in the Zen store, that would transform all low level loot directly into EC, even if it is 50% or 60% of the value.

lordhavelock · February 2015

Clearly people play differently. Some people like to sell top down, others prefer to scroll down and sell top up. While the latter seems inefficient to me (having to scroll down all the time... >shudder< ugh), if it works for them, then I wouldn't want to change the game in a way that interrupts their playstyle...

solemkof wrote: »

reposting a sketch: http://i.imgur.com/BoZdYvF.jpg
top-sellers would only need one click to get R&D-mats out of the way, bottom-sellers would scroll down as usual

A couple wise players posted the idea of removing or segmenting R&D from the Recycle screen entirely, and this seems a great idea.

My favorite suggestion belongs to solemkof in the quote above.

I also like the idea of having some method of "flagging" junk to mass-sell. This would be great, too.

killer1986chris · February 2015

Honestly I just hold enter and select to delete all the vendor trash, lets me stay in space and is quick even with some loss in value it's made up for by fewer loading screens.

tk79 · February 2015

lordhavelock wrote: »

Not to mention, the bottom of my inventory contains all sorts of items I *DON'T* want to sell, but carry with me all the time (pets, mostly, but also alternate gear, a stack of extra batteries/hypoes, that sort of stuff).

The problem with that is that when you use the Sort feature, important items get places on top. Like Elite drops from STFs, all drops from events, Lobi, etc. This tells me that "important items get placed on top" and thus it involves R&D mats in regards of selling preference.

I agree with how things currently work, and therefore I disagree with this suggestion. I always scroll all the way down when selling -- it's where all the junk usually is, and it seems that the game understands it the same way, by the way it sorts things.

Full disclosure: I use the Sort button all the time.

bumperthumper · February 2015

I would rather the R&D items simply be left out of the option. We can easily discard them for the same amount of EC they sell for.

thatcursedwolf · February 2015

R+D items also have their own (massive) storage. They no longer clutter up normal inventory.

he11blade · February 2015

lordhavelock wrote: »

I'd like to make the request for a Quality of Life Improvement, that on the Vendor Selling screen our R&D material is ordered at the bottom of the list of things to sell. I'm not saying to remove it at all (it is sometimes useful to get rid of overstock, or otherwise get a few EC for some of the components/items that have an EC value), but just let me get to the items in my Inventory-proper, first.

Agreed. Further, I'd like to have a filter button to either show or hide the items in the R&D tab. I never vendor those and it would make it less likely I'd accidentally sell something.

One more thing. In another MMO I played, you could make items as locked, meaning they wouldn't show up for sale at a vendor unless you unlocked them in your inventory. That made vendoring quick and painless. You could quickly sell everything in the vendor window because the items you wanted to keep were locked.

BTW, this was submitted as a quality of life improvement. Some people have criticized asking for this, saying it's a minor issue. Quality of life suggestions generally ARE smaller issues that would just make in game hassles a bit smaller. These are things that get in the way of the fun, not major, game breaking flaws. So, while it's certainly fine to disagree with a suggestion, please be supportive of people asking for changes to small annoyances like this (see my signature link).

lordhavelock · February 2015

killer1986chris wrote: »

Honestly I just hold enter and select to delete all the vendor trash, lets me stay in space and is quick even with some loss in value it's made up for by fewer loading screens.

Hmmm... I'm not aware of this technique. I think you're referring to discarding an item (which I've always done by right-clicking and selecting discard/accept)... I'll have to try this method.

he11blade wrote: »

Agreed. Further, I'd like to have a filter button to either show or hide the items in the R&D tab. I never vendor those and it would make it less likely I'd accidentally sell something.

One more thing. In another MMO I played, you could make items as locked, meaning they wouldn't show up for sale at a vendor unless you unlocked them in your inventory. That made vendoring quick and painless. You could quickly sell everything in the vendor window because the items you wanted to keep were locked...

Thanks for the support He11blade. I also like the idea of a filter, lock, or otherwise a method for tagging items to not be sold.

he11blade wrote: »

...BTW, this was submitted as a quality of life improvement. Some people have criticized asking for this, saying it's a minor issue. Quality of life suggestions generally ARE smaller issues that would just make in game hassles a bit smaller. These are things that get in the way of the fun, not major, game breaking flaws. So, while it's certainly fine to disagree with a suggestion, please be supportive of people asking for changes to small annoyances like this (see my signature link).

It's sad that there's so much negativity in these forums, that even small suggestions such as mine get such negative trolling. As you say, I'm not screaming about a major bug, I'm asking for a QOL improvement. I don't have a problem with different opinions, and now that others have shown me theirs, I'm happy to change my request thanks to others' suggestions.

I'm just trying to improve the game. It's sad people "poo poo" on open discussion anymore. :rolleyes:

thatcursedwolf wrote: »

R+D items also have their own (massive) storage. They no longer clutter up normal inventory.

True, but they do clutter up the vendor recycle screen, which is what I'm asking (originally) that they be moved to the bottom of the list, or (since people sort/sell in a different order than I), that the R&D items are removed from the recycle screen entirely.

tk79 wrote: »

The problem with that is that when you use the Sort feature, important items get places on top... Full disclosure: I use the Sort button all the time.

I use the Sort button in my banks. Love it! But then my banks only contain items that I know I want to keep. It's a pre-sorted selection of goods, if you will. However, my Inventory contains items I want to keep (like the Elite currency, pets, etc.) along with vendor garbage. If I sort that, the trash ends up inter-mixed with the treasures, as it were. Which makes recycling even more tedious, as I have to pay extra attention to how I sell stuff.

Maybe I'm "Doing It Wrong", and I'm happy to listen if you want to elaborate on how you prevent that from happening.

Allow me to describe how I roll:

I have purchased many extra slots, so that at what I consider a reasonably-sized Inventory window, about half my slots require a scroll-down to see. That's great for me, as I can "hide away" items that I want to keep, but never (or rarely) need to actually interact with.
Perfect example are Pets. I have a zillion pets. Hey, they're dumb, but I like 'em. And unlike Cryptic's Champions game (which puts unlocked pets as a click-option on a UI menu), Star Trek Online requires that I always carry a token in my Inventory to represent the pet. Fine. I'll accept the burden of paying for extra slots to keep them. I'm ok with that.
There's other gear down there, too. Like my EVA suit, alternate weapons, extra batteries/hypos, etc.
Between ground and space pets, I have so many that if I kept them "Sorted" they'd be at the top of my Inventory, and that's all I'd see when every time I open my Inventory. Which is quite impractical, I hope you'll agree.
I want to open my Inventory and see what drops I've picked-up right away. 99% of them are trash. But a few might be Exchangeable, or otherwise keepers. I pick through those, dragging the valuables down, and the TRIBBLE for easy sale at the top.
For >4yrs of play, whenever I'd visit a vendor to sell off TRIBBLE, it was at the top of my Inventory, and I'd click on Recycle, and start selling away. No scrolling or searching. With the addition of R&D, I now have to scroll to mid-way down to find a sweet spot of trash in between the R&D goods and the pets/extras I want to keep.
Goal of this thread, really, is to get rid of R&D off the top. Originally I said put it at the bottom, but since that impacts others in a way I didn't consider, I'm happy if it's just removed, added to another tab/accordion, and/or other methods of selection/tagging into include/exclude/lock items are added.

I hope that helps explain things.

lordhavelock · February 2015

Ok, I completely re-wrote the original post/request. I hope it is now more acceptable to all (most? lol) parties?

:cool:

If a mod happens to see this and has the ability to change the thread title, please do so, and make it read:

QOL Improvement Request: Remove R&D Bank Items from Recycle Menu.

Thanks.

thatcursedwolf · February 2015

lordhavelock wrote: »

True, but they do clutter up the vendor recycle screen, which is what I'm asking (originally) that they be moved to the bottom of the list, or (since people sort/sell in a different order than I), that the R&D items are removed from the recycle screen entirely.

To clarify, I meant that since they weren't in main inventory any more they shouldn't show up with main inventory items in the vendor screen.

lordhavelock · February 2015

thatcursedwolf wrote: »

To clarify, I meant that since they weren't in main inventory any more they shouldn't show up with main inventory items in the vendor screen.

Ah. Understood, and agree.

jellico1 · February 2015

R&D should be separate in the sell list

bergins · February 2015

lordhavelock wrote: »

Hmmm... I'm not aware of this technique. I think you're referring to discardinAllow me to describe how I roll:
I have purchased many extra slots, so that at what I consider a reasonably-sized Inventory window, about half my slots require a scroll-down to see. That's great for me, as I can "hide away" items that I want to keep, but never (or rarely) need to actually interact with.

Perfect example are Pets. I have a zillion pets. Hey, they're dumb, but I like 'em. And unlike Cryptic's Champions game (which puts unlocked pets as a click-option on a UI menu), Star Trek Online requires that I always carry a token in my Inventory to represent the pet. Fine. I'll accept the burden of paying for extra slots to keep them. I'm ok with that.

There's other gear down there, too. Like my EVA suit, alternate weapons, extra batteries/hypos, etc.

Between ground and space pets, I have so many that if I kept them "Sorted" they'd be at the top of my Inventory, and that's all I'd see when every time I open my Inventory. Which is quite impractical, I hope you'll agree.

I want to open my Inventory and see what drops I've picked-up right away. 99% of them are trash. But a few might be Exchangeable, or otherwise keepers. I pick through those, dragging the valuables down, and the TRIBBLE for easy sale at the top.

For >4yrs of play, whenever I'd visit a vendor to sell off TRIBBLE, it was at the top of my Inventory, and I'd click on Recycle, and start selling away. No scrolling or searching. With the addition of R&D, I now have to scroll to mid-way down to find a sweet spot of trash in between the R&D goods and the pets/extras I want to keep.

Goal of this thread, really, is to get rid of R&D off the top. Originally I said put it at the bottom, but since that impacts others in a way I didn't consider, I'm happy if it's just removed, added to another tab/accordion, and/or other methods of selection/tagging into include/exclude/lock items are added.

I hope that helps explain things.

I suspect that if I used your method, I would agree with your original request. It seems to me, though, that a suggestion might improve your QOL: Stop manually sorting to the bottom. I hear you when you say you think it is impracticle to have to scroll past the things you want to keep, but is that more impracticle than simply scrolling to the bottom and then hitting Sort when you've cleaned out the trash? I suspect you are spending more time sorting by hand the "Keepers" than you are saving by not having to scroll down.

lordhavelock · February 2015

jellico1 wrote: »

R&D should be separate in the sell list

Yes!

bergins wrote: »

I suspect that if I used your method, I would agree with your original request...

Thanks. I'm passed that now. Heh. Just want the R&D material out of Recycle entirely (or otherwise moved to a separate tab/filterable).

bergins wrote: »

...It seems to me, though, that a suggestion might improve your QOL: Stop manually sorting to the bottom. I hear you when you say you think it is impracticle to have to scroll past the things you want to keep, but is that more impracticle than simply scrolling to the bottom and then hitting Sort when you've cleaned out the trash? I suspect you are spending more time sorting by hand the "Keepers" than you are saving by not having to scroll down.

Yes. To me the idea of consistently scrolling down is VERY inefficient and impractical. The fact I have to do it now only on the Recycle Window is the reason for this thread. Why would I want to do it every time I opened Inventory? >shudder< That makes no sense... :rolleyes:

Look, I only hand-pick-out Keeper Drops, once in a while. Maybe once a play session or two. When I said I drag them down, I don't mean I scroll to the bottom of my inventory and put them by my Pets/AltGear, I'm just dragging the couple of Keeper Drops to the bottom of the existing screen-size, usually over a piece of trash which gets them to flip-flop cells with each other. Unless I actually have a full inventory (very rare), I don't have to scroll down to move them at all.

However, I open Inventory to glance at what I've got/found, pretty regularly through my play. It would suck if every time I wanted to check out that last drop, I had to first scroll down through all my Pets/AltGear.

Again though... How I sort/use my Inventory is no longer really relevant. Let's just get R&D Material out of the Main-Inventory Recycle window. Agreed?

QOL Improvement Request: Vendor Selling/R&D Ordering

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