test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Logic behind Temporal Ships being Tier 5?
wayofdera
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
Cryptic,
I have a couple temporal Ships, and every time I fly the newly created U-5 vessel, I can't stop but think, what went wrong in the future?
I mean, why is a ship that is from the future, still a tier 5 ship in STO (granted it can be upgraded for free to the U-5 status)? Even though the storyline behind the acquisition of temporal ships, is that they have been mostly stripped down, it still makes no sense that a stripped down temporal ship from 500 years in the future, is less advanced then current ships.
I agree that most ships at the tier 5 level, are iconic ships for all factions, and having a new tier of "modern ships" (As STO takes place 30 years after Nemesis) seems reasonable. The iconic ships are powerful, but most factions have probably built, or are building more powerful ships, as STO progresses past 2409. This makes sense. The previous iconic ships can be upgraded to a level U-5, making them almost as powerful, as the newly created ships from the Federation, Klingon, and Romulan factions.
However, the Temporal ship is from the future, so should it not have been upgraded right to the Tier 6 level? And if a tier 7 ever comes out 5 years from now, should it not be upgraded to that level again? It seems in comparison, to saying that a modern car, would be no more advanced than horse and cart from 500 years ago. Even if stripped down, the car is still more advanced in many ways.
Anyways, Cryptic, this issue of temporal ships being tier U-5, rather then 6, has irked me since the Delta Rising launch. So, I thought it best to voice my complaint on the forums, for others to agree, or disagree with, and hopefully be addressed one way, or another.
Thanks for the time,
I have a couple temporal Ships, and every time I fly the newly created U-5 vessel, I can't stop but think, what went wrong in the future?
I mean, why is a ship that is from the future, still a tier 5 ship in STO (granted it can be upgraded for free to the U-5 status)? Even though the storyline behind the acquisition of temporal ships, is that they have been mostly stripped down, it still makes no sense that a stripped down temporal ship from 500 years in the future, is less advanced then current ships.
I agree that most ships at the tier 5 level, are iconic ships for all factions, and having a new tier of "modern ships" (As STO takes place 30 years after Nemesis) seems reasonable. The iconic ships are powerful, but most factions have probably built, or are building more powerful ships, as STO progresses past 2409. This makes sense. The previous iconic ships can be upgraded to a level U-5, making them almost as powerful, as the newly created ships from the Federation, Klingon, and Romulan factions.
However, the Temporal ship is from the future, so should it not have been upgraded right to the Tier 6 level? And if a tier 7 ever comes out 5 years from now, should it not be upgraded to that level again? It seems in comparison, to saying that a modern car, would be no more advanced than horse and cart from 500 years ago. Even if stripped down, the car is still more advanced in many ways.
Anyways, Cryptic, this issue of temporal ships being tier U-5, rather then 6, has irked me since the Delta Rising launch. So, I thought it best to voice my complaint on the forums, for others to agree, or disagree with, and hopefully be addressed one way, or another.
Thanks for the time,
Post edited by wayofdera on
0
Comments
Free Tibet!
Edit: Actually, since the T5 label is so annoying, I thought of a great idea. How about Cryptic lets you upgrade to T20, but you consume an upgrade token for each tier. Not only that but it only changes the name and nothing else. No stats, no slots, nothing but the name. Problem solved. That's how you speak dollar.
This is why we can fly Dominion ships without a headpiece, why some older ships are up to par, and why some very advanced ships are less advanced.
The Ferengi owning 29th century technology explains why everything in this game is monetized.
Except the Tholians gutted all of the 29th century tech and left the chassis and the hull...leaving the Ferengi to put in basic 25th century technology...there was no T6 when they did this to the temporal vessels so why should they be T6?
This is awesome though. Reminds me of the raging tears of JHAS players demanding the Bugship have a 6th TAC Slot.
What would it really gain at T6? A final mastery trait. Big whoop. My timeships at T5U kick more tail than 90% of the people flying T6 Tronships anyway.
They're fine.
Helpful Tools: Dictionary.com - Logical fallacies - Random generator - Word generator - Color tool - Extra Credits - List of common English language errors - New T6 Big booty tutorial
They're also down one BO ability slot and the customizability of a specialist.
In hindsight, I think what would have worked better for me would have been:
All DR ships? Are Tier 6.
New C-Store ships get Intel slots and an extra BO power.
Upgraded ships get a Captain BO station which has the extra BO power baked in there.
Cryptic and logic don't go together
Wait until the Fleet T6 Faction ships come. The Lockbox/Lobi/Event T6 Ships alread do not have that -1 console slot weakness.
I can speak dollar.
Offer a 1500 Zen T5/T5U/T5F/T5FU -> T6 conversion for only a select number of ships:
Temporal Ships
Adv. Obelisk Carrier
Voth Ships
Tholian Ships
Tal Shiar Adapted ships
All of those being fairly technologically advanced enough, and with a simple but situationally convenient Mastery.
Discounted 4 pack of Conversion to T6 Tokens for 5000 Zen.
Additionally, to answer the pleas for T6 Science ships, upgrade the Dyson ships to T6 (existing and future purchases) and just stuff a general T5 Sci-related Mastery trait common across all sub-variants. Players get their Science ships (even if they don't like it), and Cryptic doesn't have to do much more work. Upgrade the 3-ship bundle costs to 6000 Zen, and the individual ships to 3000 Zen. The mega Dyson bundle can remain as-is (a little bit of wallet mercy).
And just to not let the Feds continue to feel like they lost the Science race (blasphemy to those who insist they don't need more T6s; Cryptic must ensure more variety), do the same for the Vesta pack.
And just to be nice and make even more cash off future players, do the same as well for the Odyssey, Scimitar, and Bortesqu as well. Except the Odyssey will have the best Mastery trait of the 3 and the Scimitar will have the worst (because it's the best Flagship of the 3 in all other respects, and we can't let them outdo the Feds too much). And maybe limited Intel capability + a Mastery might help sell more Bortesqu off those filthy ungrateful KDF players who don't like the Flagship Cryptic worked so hard to design and code. More money, minimal work.
It will make money; esp. off those looking to buy keys for a chance at those lockbox ships as well as improving their Exchange value because they could be upgraded to T6 (for a premium), or those wanting a T6 Sci ship, or those wanting a semi-useful Bortesqu.
/End dollar speak
See? Classic maximum profit, minimal work. And incredibly easy (opposed to all the hard work in having to actually design, code, test, and release a new ship).
And it meets the general demands of the players, without actually caving in to the players. :cool:
Not necessarily. I expect that the Intel slots for certain C-Store ships will be adjusted to Generic Hybrid slots. So the Intel Commander slots on the Intel ships would stay the same, but its Intel Lt. slot would be changed to a generic hybrid slot where it can slot any specialized bridge officer that matches the Engineer, Tactical, or Science component.
After all, we are supposed to be getting a new specialization with the anniversary so it makes sense to only have certain new C-Store ships with restricted Specialization slots and the rest have Generic Hybrid slots.
So New C-Store ships get Specialization slots and an extra BO power would be more accurate.
The fleet versions are. The appropriate comparison would be T5U non-fleet to T6 C-Store since T6 fleet ships are planned for the next couple of months.
Ok here is how to speak in $, and what will/would have worked alot better....and its fairly similar to this idea above.
1) No T5-U.
Existing T5 and T5+ (the + denotes fleet, lockbox, event, newer 3 set vessels which are already +1 console etc) could be upgraded to T6/T6+ (either via an upgrade token or free upgrade in the case of lockbox ships only). T6 grants one extra boff ability slot (either Ens, Lt, or LtC), ship mastery (level 1-5 on all ships), +1 console, and a ship trait (at mastery 5). Ship upgrade tokens could have been +10-25% more expensive in Zen cost (as it's giving you more than the current T5-U - you are getting an extra BO slot AND the ship trait at mastery 5).
2) Specialisation Hybrid Boff slots.
When Delta Rising launched we got the Intel Specialisation and Intel Hybrid bridge officers with their new set of powers. DR also saw the release of a number of vessels that were either 'full intel' with a Lt AND Cmdr hybrid stations, or 'half intel' with just a Lt hybrid station.
The suggestion works like this. You could purchase a Hybrid station token (c.500 Zen) that would change one Lt slot on ANY T6 ship to a hybrid station (fixed for every ship). This way you could take an older lockbox/lobi ship which would be freely upgraded to T6, and then spend Zen to grant that ship the ability to run Intel or [REDACTED] future specialisation slots. Alternatively you could take a T5 ship (like a scimitar) and would have to use both a T6 upgrade token AND a Lt hybrid token to enable that ship to have access to specialist powers.
C-store ships released from DR and in the future are already T6 (no upgrade token needed however fleet token needed to become T6+) and are already have the hybrid slots (no specialisation hybrid token needed). There are a selection of 'full' ships that have Cmdr AND Lt hybrids and others are 'half' ships that only have the lower rank hybrid stations. Future spec types would also have their own C-Store ships as I am sure we will see come the Anniversary event. However, this system allows for older ships to be on par with the newer ships and is a monetised system that will have players paying Zen to bring their old ships up to spec and have access to the new powers. Only Full Intel ships get the Cmdr Hybrid but all other ships can get up to Lt (and occasionally there will be special ships like the sheshar that actually have LtC hybrid but these are exceptions).
3. Ship Traits.
The suggestion means that lots of new ship traits are needed (for all existing T5/5+ ships that can be taken up to T6) but actually traits can be grouped together (e.g. all Jem Hadar ships could have the same trait, all Voth ships could have the same trait, all T5/5+ fed escorts could have the same trait etc.) so it isn't really that many. Also some could be passives (easier to code). However, a VERY important aspect would be that T5-mastery traits are ACCOUNT based unlocks. You could monetise this as follows: Once a mastery is unlocked on one character they are able to manufacture an item from the dil-store like this 'Detailed Ship Schematic: Phantom Intel Escort' (c.20,000 dilithium). This item is account bound on pickup and can be transferred to other characters on that account via the account bank (just like Rep sponsorship tokens). Once used on another character this item unlocks the relevant ship trait for that character (in this example it is Reprocicity). This suggestion will INCREASE ship sales as people purchase ships to obtain trait combinations for toons of different factions and gets rid of the faction lock-out issues that the ship trait system has introduced. It is also an additional sink.
Please listen to this. Players are fed up with the constant replace your stuff for the new things rather than upgrade your current things. Ships are your toon in space. This is your avatar and people based their entire character around them so are rightfully pi55ed when they are made sub-standard.
Here is an analogy - if you released a skin for your ground toon that made the player look like a giant frog but gave you +100% HP, +100% Damage, +100% crit chance, what do you think the player reaction to that would be? People would be mad, as they don't want to look like a frog, but you made it that the only way to be viable would be to purchase and use that skin.
We are your CUSTOMERS. We are your PLAYERS. This is how we PLAY. This is how you get us to PAY.
...#LLAP...
Logic is irrelevant. They want you to spend money on T6 ships.
http://sto.gamepedia.com/Scryer_Intel_Science_Vessel
And I have one of these:
http://sto.gamepedia.com/Wells_Temporal_Science_Vessel
It's the Wells that I fly the most. All the shiny new Intel skills aren't enough to make the other ship any good. Even the promise of a starship trait hasn't been enough to keep me flying it.
Don't be in such a rush for Cryptic to change a great ship. The Wells is a thing of beauty.
Free Tibet!
Isn't that what we're comparing? The Mobius doesn't have a fleet version.
So, here is your modern car stripped down. You have technology from 500 years ago to refit it into working order.
So, how superior is that car?
Or they are the future equivalent of a police car - The police generally do not drive military vehicles on their rounds.
There are so many things in game that should be way more powerful than they are, or less according to Star Trek canon... but this is a MMO, and things have to be "balanced". You'd swear a Defera was running the show
Which begs the question why don't we have queue missions to raid the Tholians and Lobi Consortium for their temporally displaced contraband. That has to be a violation of several temporal treaties.
Me on the other hand I hate time travel. Keep DTI away from me.