"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
Wow, we really are doooooooommmmed. Valoreah and I actually agreed on something.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Given that it's still being written by Kurtzman and Orci, it would still suck whoever directed it... I think Justin Lin's a better director than JJ Abrams, but that's kinda like saying I'd rather get AIDS than Ebola... The one thing I would say in his defence, is that he can work with an existing franchise as is, rather than reinventing it to his vision (lets be honest, Brian and Dom are essentially still the same characters they were in the first movie, they've just grown more as Human beings) so any flaws the movie has, will still be down to the TRIBBLE poor writing and production (as if Jar Jar would ever criticise something his homies write) Best move would be for the studio to fire the lot of them, and get new writers and producers. They could keep Lin (who I think could do a good job with a good script) or haul Frakes out (who, let's be honest, if it wasn't for him getting behind the camera on TNG, would have meant a lot of upcoming actor/directors never getting a shot) However, the fact that the execs went with Lin, shows they either don't have confidence in Frakes' directing abilities, or, they don't want him rectifying the JJVerse bulls**t and getting things back on track as per PrimeVerse...
I still don't like Lin, mostly because he committed the unforgivable sin of making a movie that had fast cars, the Rock, and Vin Diesel into hours upon hours of boredom.
If I were in charge of Paramount, I would've brought in Frakes, fired Orci and Kurtzman, asked Sir Patrick Stewart if he would please pretty please be willing to play the villain and get Chiwetel Ejiofor to play the hero. It'd be set in the Prime verse, TRIBBLE that JJ nonsense, and it would have Chiwetel Ejiofor as captain of the Enterprise, trying to stop Sir Patrick Stewart from doing something bad. And it would be epic and awesome and contain massive amounts of Britishness and eyebrow acting.
And George Takei would show up as a time-travelling Captain Sulu who is the key to everything because Sir Patrick Stewart's character wants to kill Sulu and alter the timeline into the JJverse because crazy quantum thingummies. It would be epic and tense and would make a f*ck ton of money on the actors' talents alone.
I still don't like Lin, mostly because he committed the unforgivable sin of making a movie that had fast cars, the Rock, and Vin Diesel into hours upon hours of boredom.
If I were in charge of Paramount, I would've brought in Frakes, fired Orci and Kurtzman, asked Sir Patrick Stewart if he would please pretty please be willing to play the villain and get Chiwetel Ejiofor to play the hero. It'd be set in the Prime verse, TRIBBLE that JJ nonsense, and it would have Chiwetel Ejiofor as captain of the Enterprise, trying to stop Sir Patrick Stewart from doing something bad. And it would be epic and awesome and contain massive amounts of Britishness and eyebrow acting.
And George Takei would show up as a time-travelling Captain Sulu who is the key to everything because Sir Patrick Stewart's character wants to kill Sulu and alter the timeline into the JJverse because crazy quantum thingummies. It would be epic and tense and would make a f*ck ton of money on the actors' talents alone.
That sounds as boring as Fast6...
I'd as soon let the franchise sit as it is than even do another movie... I wouldn't contemplate introducing a new captain/crew without a TV series, as with no prior emotional investment, that might just as well be any generic sci-fi movie, not specifically Star Trek.
If I had to do a Trek movie, I'd either do a final movie in the JJVerse with the existing cast, or something involving the TNG/DS9/VOY casts in an ensemble piece set prior to STO. To be honest, I'd as soon there not be another Trek movie at all, I just don't think the franchise needs it...
Well, considering how ridiculous it really got with the last flick, it can't get any worse.
Warmaker just jinxed it, we are royally boned. At this point i will be excited if the tv (sure aint paying for it, outside my cable bill) does not actually, literally spew out TRIBBLE while broadcasting this movie.
New home of the Romulan Republic.
I have an idea for what Season 11 should be; Season 11: The Big Bug Fix.
I have not been able to read my bug tickets in over a year, not even the tickets about not being able to see my tickets.
I find the drama of your signature proof of your immaturity, this means you, DR whiners.
I'd as soon let the franchise sit as it is than even do another movie... I wouldn't contemplate introducing a new captain/crew without a TV series, as with no prior emotional investment, that might just as well be any generic sci-fi movie, not specifically Star Trek.
If I had to do a Trek movie, I'd either do a final movie in the JJVerse with the existing cast, or something involving the TNG/DS9/VOY casts in an ensemble piece set prior to STO. To be honest, I'd as soon there not be another Trek movie at all, I just don't think the franchise needs it...
Clearly, my friend, you have never seen Serenity. Or 12 Years a Slave.
Chiwetel Ejiofor versus Sir Patrick Stewart would be epic.
And...I guess that you've got a point there, maybe have three or four seasons of Captain Chiwetel Ejiofor and then make a movie?
Because frankly, I want to see that man and his incredibly soulful eyes take on Sir Patrick Stewart and his impeccable class.
could still be pushed back while the script is ripped up and a new one is in the pipeline. but with justin lin now in, he will probably want to get things done his way, including big spoilers on the nacelles, big exhaust ports coming from the engineering section and the saucer has holes in it to look like a steering wheel .
but seriously, lets see whats is what with the new director first.
Not to mention spinners a new shiny black paint job with fire accents
a blower system hanging from the warp core
a new pro style transmition with a skull shift TRIBBLE right by the captains chair
oh and large rear tires for those scenes when the enterprise needs to do a burnout
Clearly, my friend, you have never seen Serenity. Or 12 Years a Slave.
Chiwetel Ejiofor versus Sir Patrick Stewart would be epic.
And...I guess that you've got a point there, maybe have three or four seasons of Captain Chiwetel Ejiofor and then make a movie?
Because frankly, I want to see that man and his incredibly soulful eyes take on Sir Patrick Stewart and his impeccable class.
Actually, that's precisely why I know it would be boring as sin... (haven't seen 12 Years a Slave Though...) Ejiofor is an incredible dramatic actor, but he isn't suited to anything aproaching an action/adventure/fast-pased role (that's not meant as an insult, by the way, just a case of appropriate casting) and I felt he was one of the weakest aspects of Serenity (which I felt didn't ring true to the Firefly series...)
And you might want to see him take on Sir Patrick, but that doesn't necessarily mean others would, or that it would be franchise-appropriate In a generic sci-fi or any other genre, such as courtroom drama, then yes, it would make for a well-cast, interesting film, just not Star Trek, IMHO. To be honest, I'd just as soon not see a new Trek film at all, and simply let the franchise rest :cool:
I still don't like Lin, mostly because he committed the unforgivable sin of making a movie that had fast cars, the Rock, and Vin Diesel into hours upon hours of boredom.
If I were in charge of Paramount, I would've brought in Frakes, fired Orci and Kurtzman, asked Sir Patrick Stewart if he would please pretty please be willing to play the villain and get Chiwetel Ejiofor to play the hero. It'd be set in the Prime verse, TRIBBLE that JJ nonsense, and it would have Chiwetel Ejiofor as captain of the Enterprise, trying to stop Sir Patrick Stewart from doing something bad. And it would be epic and awesome and contain massive amounts of Britishness and eyebrow acting.
And George Takei would show up as a time-travelling Captain Sulu who is the key to everything because Sir Patrick Stewart's character wants to kill Sulu and alter the timeline into the JJverse because crazy quantum thingummies. It would be epic and tense and would make a f*ck ton of money on the actors' talents alone.
Actually, that's precisely why I know it would be boring as sin... (haven't seen 12 Years a Slave Though...) Ejiofor is an incredible dramatic actor, but he isn't suited to anything aproaching an action/adventure/fast-pased role (that's not meant as an insult, by the way, just a case of appropriate casting) and I felt he was one of the weakest aspects of Serenity (which I felt didn't ring true to the Firefly series...)
And you might want to see him take on Sir Patrick, but that doesn't necessarily mean others would, or that it would be franchise-appropriate In a generic sci-fi or any other genre, such as courtroom drama, then yes, it would make for a well-cast, interesting film, just not Star Trek, IMHO. To be honest, I'd just as soon not see a new Trek film at all, and simply let the franchise rest :cool:
Three things:
1. I DON'T want the next Trek movie to be action. I want something more like the Chain of Command 2-parter, with some action but mostly tense drama.
2. I have to say that I was completely in awe of Ejiofor in Serenity, and I feel that his performance was the strongest, most powerful part of the movie. It may not have had the same Space Cowboys feel as Firefly did, but that's kind of what happens when you stick the show's second season into a 90-minute movie and call it good.
3. I think it'd be awesome. Two brilliant thespians just giving their all at each other...think Gandalf VS. Saruman from LOTR 1, or Professor X facing off with Magneto. Tense drama, very much in the spirit of my favorite TNG two-parters, reclaiming Trek for people who want to THINK during a Trek movie...
I mean, there is a time and a place for dumb action (Pacific Rim is my favorite guilty pleasure), but Star Trek is not it. STO is borderline, but JJTrek crosses and recrosses the line and has the arrogance to pretend to be making some big dramatic point when the plot's full of more holes than a Dutch dam made of Swiss cheese that was used for target practice by a bunch of Imperial stormtroopers with machine guns.
We've seen Sir Patrick try to do the action/chase stuff in the last two TNG movies, too. He's a great dramatic actor, possibly the finest of his generation - but running and gunning ain't exactly Shakespeare, you know?
You cast the actor that fits the role, not the one you really like to see. I can't think of anyone better than Vin Diesel to play Riddick, but I wouldn't cast him as the lead in As Good As It Gets or Annie Hall. Sir Patrick makes for an excellent Capt. Picard (as long as the scriptwriters remember that Jean-Luc isn't an action hero), and I loved his work in Jeffrey, but he'd be totally out of place as John McClane in Die Hard or as a member of the Ghostbusters.
And honestly, the plotline you describe not only fits the actors poorly, but also is totally unnecessary. Every TV episode and movie in the Prime timeline hamstrings the writers a little more; a reboot was an excellent idea, poorly executed due to poor writing. The two saving graces that I saw were that it was acknowledged in dialog that this timeline existed alongside the other, with the point of diversion being when Nero intruded, and that the writers were big enough fanboys to remember the rumored relationship between Uhura and Spock before the beginning of the series.
What I want to see is a better-written movie (or reboot TV show), which will have to wait until after this one unless someone at the studio decides to scrap what they have and start over. (I have little faith in Orci and Kurtzman; more accurately, I have a great deal of faith that they can't write Trek to save their lives.)
Eh, my ideas can be pretty stupid, I'll grant you that.
I DO want to see a better-written movie, though. Into Darkness was one big inescapable plot singularity, and it made it worse by pretending to be smart.
Seriously, if you're going to make a dumb action movie, at least have the decency to make it openly stupid. And then have giant robots punch giant monsters IN THE FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE like Pacific Rim did.
1. I DON'T want the next Trek movie to be action. I want something more like the Chain of Command 2-parter, with some action but mostly tense drama.
2. I have to say that I was completely in awe of Ejiofor in Serenity, and I feel that his performance was the strongest, most powerful part of the movie. It may not have had the same Space Cowboys feel as Firefly did, but that's kind of what happens when you stick the show's second season into a 90-minute movie and call it good.
3. I think it'd be awesome. Two brilliant thespians just giving their all at each other...think Gandalf VS. Saruman from LOTR 1, or Professor X facing off with Magneto. Tense drama, very much in the spirit of my favorite TNG two-parters, reclaiming Trek for people who want to THINK during a Trek movie...
I mean, there is a time and a place for dumb action (Pacific Rim is my favorite guilty pleasure), but Star Trek is not it. STO is borderline, but JJTrek crosses and recrosses the line and has the arrogance to pretend to be making some big dramatic point when the plot's full of more holes than a Dutch dam made of Swiss cheese that was used for target practice by a bunch of Imperial stormtroopers with machine guns.
I've actually just had a thought... (dangerous, I know ) But, as a conclusion to the JJVerse arc, maybe have Ejiofor as a younger version of General Chang... Would capture the gravitas of the character, but without the OTT rantings of the original actor (I want to say Christopher Plummer...) which I felt turned a brilliantly dangerous character into an embarassing caracature. Mostly, I feel Sir Patrick is too enshrouded in his role of Picard to ever play any other character in the Trek Verse (which is a shame) (that goes for all the other actors too) so I wouldn't even consider them for anything but the most background of roles (such as Ethan Philips as the doorman in First Contact)
I've actually just had a thought... (dangerous, I know ) But, as a conclusion to the JJVerse arc, maybe have Ejiofor as a younger version of General Chang... Would capture the gravitas of the character, but without the OTT rantings of the original actor (I want to say Christopher Plummer...) which I felt turned a brilliantly dangerous character into an embarassing caracature. Mostly, I feel Sir Patrick is too enshrouded in his role of Picard to ever play any other character in the Trek Verse (which is a shame) (that goes for all the other actors too) so I wouldn't even consider them for anything but the most background of roles (such as Ethan Philips as the doorman in First Contact)
That's a really awesome idea, but how about this...
Sir Patrick Stewart as JJverse Q? That would be pretty damn awesome.
But I do see your point...even though I actually liked Chang a LOT in ST 6.
That's a really awesome idea, but how about this...
Sir Patrick Stewart as JJverse Q? That would be pretty damn awesome.
But I do see your point...even though I actually liked Chang a LOT in ST 6.
As before, I wouldn't use any of them in any capacity beyond a background cameo. It just wouldn't work, viewers would always be thinking 'previous role', so there'd always be that cognitive disconnection if they were used 'in franchise'... As jonsills said, it's about casting the right actor for the part, not who you want to see
As before, I wouldn't use any of them in any capacity beyond a background cameo. It just wouldn't work, viewers would always be thinking 'previous role', so there'd always be that cognitive disconnection if they were used 'in franchise'... As jonsills said, it's about casting the right actor for the part, not who you want to see
Mmh, point...but this is Sir Patrick Stewart we're talking about.
Mmh, point...but this is Sir Patrick Stewart we're talking about.
I think that he could pull it off.
Yes, he could 'play the part', but no one watching would think anything other than 'Picard', it would be like getting Pierce Brosnan to play Blofeld opposite Daniel Craig as Bond... So no, he couldn't, because Human memory wouldn't accept it
Yes, he could 'play the part', but no one watching would think anything other than 'Picard', it would be like getting Pierce Brosnan to play Blofeld opposite Daniel Craig as Bond... So no, he couldn't, because Human memory wouldn't accept it
Comments
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
You must not be familiar with the internet.
Wow, we really are doooooooommmmed. Valoreah and I actually agreed on something.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
If I were in charge of Paramount, I would've brought in Frakes, fired Orci and Kurtzman, asked Sir Patrick Stewart if he would please pretty please be willing to play the villain and get Chiwetel Ejiofor to play the hero. It'd be set in the Prime verse, TRIBBLE that JJ nonsense, and it would have Chiwetel Ejiofor as captain of the Enterprise, trying to stop Sir Patrick Stewart from doing something bad. And it would be epic and awesome and contain massive amounts of Britishness and eyebrow acting.
And George Takei would show up as a time-travelling Captain Sulu who is the key to everything because Sir Patrick Stewart's character wants to kill Sulu and alter the timeline into the JJverse because crazy quantum thingummies. It would be epic and tense and would make a f*ck ton of money on the actors' talents alone.
That sounds as boring as Fast6...
I'd as soon let the franchise sit as it is than even do another movie... I wouldn't contemplate introducing a new captain/crew without a TV series, as with no prior emotional investment, that might just as well be any generic sci-fi movie, not specifically Star Trek.
If I had to do a Trek movie, I'd either do a final movie in the JJVerse with the existing cast, or something involving the TNG/DS9/VOY casts in an ensemble piece set prior to STO. To be honest, I'd as soon there not be another Trek movie at all, I just don't think the franchise needs it...
I have an idea for what Season 11 should be; Season 11: The Big Bug Fix.
I have not been able to read my bug tickets in over a year, not even the tickets about not being able to see my tickets.
I find the drama of your signature proof of your immaturity, this means you, DR whiners.
Clearly, my friend, you have never seen Serenity. Or 12 Years a Slave.
Chiwetel Ejiofor versus Sir Patrick Stewart would be epic.
And...I guess that you've got a point there, maybe have three or four seasons of Captain Chiwetel Ejiofor and then make a movie?
Because frankly, I want to see that man and his incredibly soulful eyes take on Sir Patrick Stewart and his impeccable class.
Not to mention spinners a new shiny black paint job with fire accents
a blower system hanging from the warp core
a new pro style transmition with a skull shift TRIBBLE right by the captains chair
oh and large rear tires for those scenes when the enterprise needs to do a burnout
And you might want to see him take on Sir Patrick, but that doesn't necessarily mean others would, or that it would be franchise-appropriate
My character Tsin'xing
Three things:
1. I DON'T want the next Trek movie to be action. I want something more like the Chain of Command 2-parter, with some action but mostly tense drama.
2. I have to say that I was completely in awe of Ejiofor in Serenity, and I feel that his performance was the strongest, most powerful part of the movie. It may not have had the same Space Cowboys feel as Firefly did, but that's kind of what happens when you stick the show's second season into a 90-minute movie and call it good.
3. I think it'd be awesome. Two brilliant thespians just giving their all at each other...think Gandalf VS. Saruman from LOTR 1, or Professor X facing off with Magneto. Tense drama, very much in the spirit of my favorite TNG two-parters, reclaiming Trek for people who want to THINK during a Trek movie...
I mean, there is a time and a place for dumb action (Pacific Rim is my favorite guilty pleasure), but Star Trek is not it. STO is borderline, but JJTrek crosses and recrosses the line and has the arrogance to pretend to be making some big dramatic point when the plot's full of more holes than a Dutch dam made of Swiss cheese that was used for target practice by a bunch of Imperial stormtroopers with machine guns.
You cast the actor that fits the role, not the one you really like to see. I can't think of anyone better than Vin Diesel to play Riddick, but I wouldn't cast him as the lead in As Good As It Gets or Annie Hall. Sir Patrick makes for an excellent Capt. Picard (as long as the scriptwriters remember that Jean-Luc isn't an action hero), and I loved his work in Jeffrey, but he'd be totally out of place as John McClane in Die Hard or as a member of the Ghostbusters.
And honestly, the plotline you describe not only fits the actors poorly, but also is totally unnecessary. Every TV episode and movie in the Prime timeline hamstrings the writers a little more; a reboot was an excellent idea, poorly executed due to poor writing. The two saving graces that I saw were that it was acknowledged in dialog that this timeline existed alongside the other, with the point of diversion being when Nero intruded, and that the writers were big enough fanboys to remember the rumored relationship between Uhura and Spock before the beginning of the series.
What I want to see is a better-written movie (or reboot TV show), which will have to wait until after this one unless someone at the studio decides to scrap what they have and start over. (I have little faith in Orci and Kurtzman; more accurately, I have a great deal of faith that they can't write Trek to save their lives.)
I DO want to see a better-written movie, though. Into Darkness was one big inescapable plot singularity, and it made it worse by pretending to be smart.
Seriously, if you're going to make a dumb action movie, at least have the decency to make it openly stupid. And then have giant robots punch giant monsters IN THE FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE like Pacific Rim did.
What so we can have another 2 hour tv episode passed off as a movie.
neither did most of the planet considering it floped.
I've actually just had a thought... (dangerous, I know
That's a really awesome idea, but how about this...
Sir Patrick Stewart as JJverse Q? That would be pretty damn awesome.
But I do see your point...even though I actually liked Chang a LOT in ST 6.
As before, I wouldn't use any of them in any capacity beyond a background cameo. It just wouldn't work, viewers would always be thinking 'previous role', so there'd always be that cognitive disconnection if they were used 'in franchise'... As jonsills said, it's about casting the right actor for the part, not who you want to see
Mmh, point...but this is Sir Patrick Stewart we're talking about.
I think that he could pull it off.
Yes, he could 'play the part', but no one watching would think anything other than 'Picard', it would be like getting Pierce Brosnan to play Blofeld opposite Daniel Craig as Bond... So no, he couldn't, because Human memory wouldn't accept it
Ehhhhhh...
This is probably just me, but I could buy it.
*engages Suspension of Disbelief* :P
I have a pretty strong one.
So when something breaks that...yeah. It takes something REALLY wild. Or REALLY bad.
For me, it's a sliding scale. Sometimes I can let stuff slide, other times, the smallest thing might break it for me, it just depends :P