Which roughly means that she being three is the equivalent of a thirty year old human. Kes was a fully matured member of her species and suggesting people that liked her (which in the end means they like the looks of th actress portraying her) are prone to pedophilia is just a bit too much, don't you think?
Sasami of tenhi muyo is over 1000 years old but looks and acts like a 6 year old.
Lots of people are into her and think its perfectly ok due to her age. I disagree based on her behavior.
On the other end of the scale we have dance in the vampire bund. Nina is a vampire over 600 years old. She is shown completly naked in a number of scenes some of which with sexual implications despite having the body of a six year old. This is nowhere near as problematic as it is made quite clear that despite her body she has the mind of an adult.
True ocampans mature quickly but her own people admitted she was still just a child. A fact that was reinforced by her naive behavior up until she changed her hairstyle
It dosent matter that she looks like an adult the fact of the matter is she was about 3 years old at the start of voyager and her race consider her a child. In cases like this. the physical body is irrelevant. The only important factor is mental maturity
Why do people hate Wes? Quark? Malcolm? Seems every trek show had one hate. I for one like Wes and I really thought Quark grew on the show.
Malcolm was disliked a lot because he was a walking stereotype of British. Though to be fair he was as SFDebris pointed out the most competent member of the NX01s bridge crew by far, having ideas that seem crazy or paranoid to Archer like being prepared and scanning ahead of bumbling down to an unexplored planet.
His character or lack of though was classic Berman and Braga, only a select few of the bridge officers got any sort of fleshing out, on Voyager it was Janeway, Paris, The Doctor and later Seven for the most part. Ent was almost always centered around Archer, Tucker or T'pol.
As for Neelix, well he was supposed to be the breakout character but was so poorly written that a lot of people just ended up hating him, the breakout character then turned out to be the Doctor. Its a shame really because Ethan Philips is a really good actor and the VOY writers squandered that.
I didn't have a problem with the character. And was happy to see him in the game. But everyone gets on your nerves at times. To me at times the show was just horrible, or a character did something that was just wrong. That is how shows goes at times.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
I have almost no problem with Neelix. I hate B'elanna. The episode where she goes nuts about her baby looking a bit Klingon? She basically has an utter mental breakdown and mindrapes the Doctor, which all turns out totally fine in the end because it's totally ok to reach into the Doctor's brain and alter it, and who wouldn't want a chief engineer who had a psychotic break? Paris got demoted for the crime of "not being an evil a-hole". Going mad and assaulting crewmen is apparently fine.
Have you ever seen a pregnant Klingon?
Neither have I. Maybe that kind of thing is to be expected. Granted, under normal circumstances they would've put her on maternity leave but Voyager needs all hands on deck.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Sasami of tenhi muyo is over 1000 years old but looks and acts like a 6 year old.
Lots of people are into her and think its perfectly ok due to her age. I disagree based on her behavior.
On the other end of the scale we have dance in the vampire bund. Nina is a vampire over 600 years old. She is shown completly naked in a number of scenes some of which with sexual implications despite having the body of a six year old. This is nowhere near as problematic as it is made quite clear that despite her body she has the mind of an adult.
True ocampans mature quickly but her own people admitted she was still just a child. A fact that was reinforced by her naive behavior up until she changed her hairstyle
It dosent matter that she looks like an adult the fact of the matter is she was about 3 years old at the start of voyager and her race consider her a child. In cases like this. the physical body is irrelevant. The only important factor is mental maturity
What? Kes was portrayed by an adult woman playing an adult Okampa. Naive and unexperienced, but adult. And as you pointed out, she "developed" a bit later on (as far as her deus-ex machina kind of character was allowed to develop). The examples you provided are animated which is something completely different. I personally think that in animation, canon age is entirely irrelevant. If something has a six year old child's body it is the depiction of a six year old child and portraying that in an erotic/sexual context is plain wrong as this is portrayed onto that body. Having an adult actress playing a somewhat juvenile or naive but developed alien (reaching a third of her lifespan should count as developed enough to be mature) is something entirely different.
Now, is Neelix to be considered a pedophile in-canon? Again, I say no. Kes was entirely developed and reached sexual maturity as established at some point in the series. Now he still was an TRIBBLE as he obviously played Kes and profited from her naivety and lack of experience. He essentially tried to keep her dumb to have a "girlfriend" he was "superior" to, which in the end hopefully turned out to be the other way around.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
First: I hate Neelix for calling Kes his girlfriend and for doing a very bad job trying to kick Toms asss trying to keep Kes. And he doesent know ***** about anything, trust me, the crew would have gotten along well without him.
Secondly: When he tried to commit suicide I thought Ethan Phillips was going but since stupid garbage Ensign Wildman told her daughter that there were monsters under her bed and wanted NEELIX to make her daughter feel better. And of course: Wildman is married to a reptile, but thank heaven Naomi gets her looks from her mothers side.
Thirdly: Neelix is always embarrassing Janeway and the other crewmen. And he is always cutting into private conversations and always saying: As your ships morale officer, I believe you need my help or something like that.
There are many other reasons why I hate Neelix, but I'm not going into it.
Captain Joseph Riker, U.S.S. Odyssey==General V'Mar, U.S.S. Blackwater-A==Admiral Laura Holmes, U.S.S. Forward Unto Dawn Grand Master Thotok, son of Koloth, I.K.S. Sompek==Dahar Master Shanara, I.K.S. Balth'Quv Admiral R'Tath V'Tirex, R.R.W. Dhael Glohha'enh==Commander Ta'eth Korval, R.R.W Hachae ch'Rhian==Admiral Vranuk, R.R.W Delevhas
It's not the worst I've ever seen. The 80s had a lot of weird movies... some were weird in a good way others.... not so much. I think tha tif I had to pick one for the WTF award I'd go with Slipstream. Apparently part of why it was so bad is that they decided during filming to skip certain parts of the script entirely in order to get a lower rating.... which left gaps in the plot.
Ethan Phillips - Neelix is a great actor, that's why people can hate him, or love him so much.
I would bet more people are annoyed by him, which is another testament to his acting prowess.
Personally I take the Vulcan approch to his persona displayed on voyager, its neither here nor there for me, but his talent is appreciated.
Neither have I. Maybe that kind of thing is to be expected. Granted, under normal circumstances they would've put her on maternity leave but Voyager needs all hands on deck.
Even given that she's part-Klingon, her actions are inexcusable.
Still, given Klingons, and what's generally expected of Klingon women...I mean, they're kind of supposed to bee tougher and nastier than the men...it's possible that pregnant Klingons are shown all the deference possible and given copious targs to vent their rage on.
Now, is Neelix to be considered a pedophile in-canon? Again, I say no. Kes was entirely developed and reached sexual maturity as established at some point in the series. Now he still was an TRIBBLE as he obviously played Kes and profited from her naivety and lack of experience. He essentially tried to keep her dumb to have a "girlfriend" he was "superior" to, which in the end hopefully turned out to be the other way around.
And that is my point. The fact Neelix was able to take advantage of her that easily proves that she wasnt mature enough to handle a relationship plus you are completely disregarding the fact that her own people referred to her as a child.
My original statement was only made in jest at her physical age and I wasn't trying to imply Neelix was into underage women. I was merely stating that Kes is way to immature to consider in a romantic sense
However I like B'lanna, Tuvok, Chakotay, Janeway(sort of), Seven(I like her for how she dresses), Harry Kim, and Paris. I like voyager but not as much as DS9 or original series, the latter is good but physics is bullcrap to them. I LOVE ds9, Sisko is my favorite captain though I liked DaxA until she wanted to be Klingon then I called DaxB a improvement. ENT is okay if you get past the bad acting and Trip and T'Pols hormones and the episodes that are just taken off from other shows. And next generation is boring and I don't like the charecters.
Captain Joseph Riker, U.S.S. Odyssey==General V'Mar, U.S.S. Blackwater-A==Admiral Laura Holmes, U.S.S. Forward Unto Dawn Grand Master Thotok, son of Koloth, I.K.S. Sompek==Dahar Master Shanara, I.K.S. Balth'Quv Admiral R'Tath V'Tirex, R.R.W. Dhael Glohha'enh==Commander Ta'eth Korval, R.R.W Hachae ch'Rhian==Admiral Vranuk, R.R.W Delevhas
And that is my point. The fact Neelix was able to take advantage of her that easily proves that she wasnt mature enough to handle a relationship plus you are completely disregarding the fact that her own people referred to her as a child
A young woman would without a doubt called a child in a lot of societies, regardless of her biological development. I am pretty sure a young adult, but umarried woman in the victorian era was recognized as a "child" due to her "purity". The same could apply to the scene you are referring to, although this is of course only speculation. But I see it this way, although I must admit I don't spend much time thinking about it
Now, being played by Neelix in that way is of course due to her inexperience and Neelix is, like I said, a jerk. But Kes was also raised in isolation and Neelix is a space faring "cowboy", showing her glittering techno stuff and taking her to the stars. It's a bad clich
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I've not watched much of the shows, and not just Voyager, in general. But I've seen Neelix in a few and he is the sort of character that can just rub you the wrong way if you are not in the mood.
I wouldn't say he was bad, he's just that irritating little kid with snot dangling out of his nose constantly asking questions.
But if I strictly go within his representation in STO, I actually like him. It sucks I need to fetch and carry for him during that mission but that's a failure in the writing/design, not so much him.
And when the time comes he is ready and willing to kick some TRIBBLE, and I can respect that. Of course it needs to be said that STO Neelix could well be different from 'actual' TV show Neelix.
A young woman would without a doubt called a child in a lot of societies, regardless of her biological development. I am pretty sure a young adult, but umarried woman in the victorian era was recognized as a "child" due to her "purity". The same could apply to the scene you are referring to, although this is of course only speculation. But I see it this way, although I must admit I don't spend much time thinking about it
Now, being played by Neelix in that way is of course due to her inexperience and Neelix is, like I said, a jerk. But Kes was also raised in isolation and Neelix is a space faring "cowboy", showing her glittering techno stuff and taking her to the stars. It's a bad clich
All good points. I still cant help but think of her as a kid though. It just seemed that she was portrayed with a childlike wonder. Its why I feel she was able to see the Dr as a person rather than a program being run by the computer like everyone else did.
She definitely had a more open mind, or preserved a "childlike wonder", although in the doctor's case you could also argue that the concept of a holographic program looking like a person would be completely alien to her, considering her origin. But why should "childlike wonder" be an indication for pedophilia? I'm sorry if you weren't the one making the comparission in the first place It's just that this was what I was arguing against. At least to me, Kes was biologically and sexually adult, which rules out any form of pedophilia. You could argue that Neelix had an inferiority complex and tried to play her, he absolutely did at least during the course of season one.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
answer: they don't, not really, he's just one of the chars on the show, some of them have good moments, some not so good, some great, that's just the way it goes.
they haters are simply aping/emulating/copying what they think is a popular point of view to hop on some imaginary bandwagon-of-cool in their own heads
somewhat the analog of finding someone to gang up on and pick on in gradeschool so you can deflect attacks away from yourself
nothing approaches the fail of jar jar. we all have things we don't like from time to time and it's fun to say "oh man, jar jar all over again" but it's just not the case. jar jar was so painful and universally disliked it was unreal. I remember the scenes with him in the theaters, it was so quiet you could hear peoples hearts beating. It was horrible, how that happened I'll never know. I mean really, don't they screentest things?
EDIT: but I agree, the original relationship nelix had was a headscratcher, vaguely creepy. the writers did good for both characters to tidy that up.
The highlighted part says it all. Neelix developed over the other six and a half seasons, you know. And I'm pretty sure that he became a pretty decent cook. :P
Nope. His kitchen remained a Health Department nightmare the entire time, and nobody ever spoke favorably of his cooking except him. Mostly they only ate it to humor him and get him to put a sock in his overbearing incompetent mouth for five minutes. Two crew members who got locked in an alien prison and were starving only tried his food out of desperation.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Oh awesome. You like his opinionated guides as well?
Yep.
Heck, first thing I though when I saw that 'Captain' Harry Kim was stuck on the Kobali battleground here in STO was 'Poor, dumb Harry'.
Even in STO he gets stuck with all the worst spots. Neelix, Seven, Tuvok, and the Doctor are all off flying around actually partaking in the story while Harry is stuck on an empty ground zone I barely see people in.
On a side note, I don't mind Neelix as the WW chef. I'd take the 'devil you know' as it were compared to that obnoxious chef from last year.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
Well, for the sake of conversation, this is my take on Neelix:
Wasn't there an episode where Neelix has an outburst at Tuvok, like "You're always so dismissive of me," or something similar? He goes on and on about how Tuvok was so horrible to him, but he never once looked inside and asked himself why. Neelix was free of meaningful introspection and never actually forced the VOY crew to see things differently. Data was bad, but at least he provided a different (and valid) perspective of a given situation. Neelix had an opportunity to be Dr. McCoy, in a way, and become the emotional backbone to poor victim single mother of a captain so desperately needed. Instead, he pissed it away on a love affair with Kes, the most boring 2-dimensional Trek regular ever. Chekov had more depth than the two of them combined (no offense to Pavel himself, of course).
Hell, even Tasha Yar, the most notoriously underdeveloped character in TNG, was more redeemable, relatable, and admirable than Neelix. She even died in the line of duty (and actually earned the respect of her Klingon underling prior to her death. And had...relations with Data). More than Neelix could say. He bailed when he found a new chick to bone and never even got to see Earth. He probably didn't even know if the crew made it home intact. The crew didn't respect him as much as they needed him. They were alone and desperate. Neelix took full advantage of them and gave nothing significant in return. He was a prick, through and through.
In context of STO....well, he's still the same douchebag Neelix. He hasn't evolved or developed in any noticeable way since his time on VOY. So yeah, still a prick.
My Old Blog about things that could and should have been added when I wrote it. Not sure what I want to do with it now. I'll just keep it available now that most of it is outdated.
Well, for the sake of conversation, this is my take on Neelix:
In context of STO....well, he's still the same douchebag Neelix. He hasn't evolved or developed in any noticeable way since his time on VOY. So yeah, still a prick.
I find him to be marginally less annoying in STO. Here, at least, we can see how he is better than the rest of the Talaxian species.
Neelix, at least, TRIES to be useful, even though he is 100% incompetent at every damn thing that he does.
The other Talaxians? Not only are they sociopathic incompetents, they're lazy. They have Admiral Awesomename, hero of the galaxy, person who's PWNed everything from Borg to Elachi to Iconians. running around picking up spices for them from random people.
Never mind the fact that any half-wit who thinks themselves a chef knows damn well that you keep your spices well-stocked and in an easily-accessible central location at all times, think about just how valuable Admiral Awesomename's on-duty time is, in terms of universes and star systems saved per minute on-duty, and see that on average, that fat, lazy Talaxian excuse for a cook thinks that getting the spices that HE SHOULD BE KEEPING TRACK OF ALREADY is more important than approximately .4 of a solar system.
At least Neelix does SOMEthing, even if he's utterly incompetent.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
That's not the talaxians fault, that's solely due to Cryptic's poor writing. The whole story line has examples of characters doing the scutwork that is normally done by the lowest ranking crewmen.
And if you notice whenever your character is hosting diplomats or visiting Admirals you aren't given the option of having them wash the dingleberry stains out of the crews soiled underwear before the big conference.
These types of missions are the devs way of insultingly reminding us of what they think of us.
I always think that if they send us collecting scrap metal. And the cold, hard truth is that they need to pad it out as much as possible, getting everyone spending as much time as possible in those mission, fueling the metrics...
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
During its run, I disliked Neelix. The character just grated on my nerves. By the half way point of the second season, the whole show grated on my nerves.
Despite all of that, there were actually a few moments in the game where I did like Neelix... for the first time.
I think a lot of the Neelix hate is because the character is representative of Voyager: bad writing on top of a not too original idea. Heh. during the 1 1/2 season I could stomach the show, I reached a point where I hoped the ship and crew would never make it home. I still wish they hadn't made it home.
I always think that if they send us collecting scrap metal. And the cold, hard truth is that they need to pad it out as much as possible, getting everyone spending as much time as possible in those mission, fueling the metrics...
Well, that sort of thing happened in the TV show too, granted the crew often assisted, but the hero was always there.
That's why we have Boffs, Doffs, and away teams. You tell them what to do and they do it.
If you can headcanon it this way kudos to you The DOFFing system feels, to me, so far decoupled from the actual gameplay that I don't recognise it as a part of the ship. It's a completely unrelated trading cards minigame and I never could convince me that these DOFF cards represent anyone on my imaginary starship
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I finally went and watched Starcrash.... wow... interesting choice for a movie name... it's apparently named after the method by which the (good) Emperor defeats the bad guy at the end.
And yes, it's a giant steaming pile of half-cooked ham. awkward, but adorable.... Oh and it has the Hoff.
Comments
Sasami of tenhi muyo is over 1000 years old but looks and acts like a 6 year old.
Lots of people are into her and think its perfectly ok due to her age. I disagree based on her behavior.
On the other end of the scale we have dance in the vampire bund. Nina is a vampire over 600 years old. She is shown completly naked in a number of scenes some of which with sexual implications despite having the body of a six year old. This is nowhere near as problematic as it is made quite clear that despite her body she has the mind of an adult.
True ocampans mature quickly but her own people admitted she was still just a child. A fact that was reinforced by her naive behavior up until she changed her hairstyle
It dosent matter that she looks like an adult the fact of the matter is she was about 3 years old at the start of voyager and her race consider her a child. In cases like this. the physical body is irrelevant. The only important factor is mental maturity
Malcolm was disliked a lot because he was a walking stereotype of British. Though to be fair he was as SFDebris pointed out the most competent member of the NX01s bridge crew by far, having ideas that seem crazy or paranoid to Archer like being prepared and scanning ahead of bumbling down to an unexplored planet.
His character or lack of though was classic Berman and Braga, only a select few of the bridge officers got any sort of fleshing out, on Voyager it was Janeway, Paris, The Doctor and later Seven for the most part. Ent was almost always centered around Archer, Tucker or T'pol.
As for Neelix, well he was supposed to be the breakout character but was so poorly written that a lot of people just ended up hating him, the breakout character then turned out to be the Doctor. Its a shame really because Ethan Philips is a really good actor and the VOY writers squandered that.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
Have you ever seen a pregnant Klingon?
Neither have I. Maybe that kind of thing is to be expected. Granted, under normal circumstances they would've put her on maternity leave but Voyager needs all hands on deck.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
What? Kes was portrayed by an adult woman playing an adult Okampa. Naive and unexperienced, but adult. And as you pointed out, she "developed" a bit later on (as far as her deus-ex machina kind of character was allowed to develop). The examples you provided are animated which is something completely different. I personally think that in animation, canon age is entirely irrelevant. If something has a six year old child's body it is the depiction of a six year old child and portraying that in an erotic/sexual context is plain wrong as this is portrayed onto that body. Having an adult actress playing a somewhat juvenile or naive but developed alien (reaching a third of her lifespan should count as developed enough to be mature) is something entirely different.
Now, is Neelix to be considered a pedophile in-canon? Again, I say no. Kes was entirely developed and reached sexual maturity as established at some point in the series. Now he still was an TRIBBLE as he obviously played Kes and profited from her naivety and lack of experience. He essentially tried to keep her dumb to have a "girlfriend" he was "superior" to, which in the end hopefully turned out to be the other way around.
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Secondly: When he tried to commit suicide I thought Ethan Phillips was going but since stupid garbage Ensign Wildman told her daughter that there were monsters under her bed and wanted NEELIX to make her daughter feel better. And of course: Wildman is married to a reptile, but thank heaven Naomi gets her looks from her mothers side.
Thirdly: Neelix is always embarrassing Janeway and the other crewmen. And he is always cutting into private conversations and always saying: As your ships morale officer, I believe you need my help or something like that.
There are many other reasons why I hate Neelix, but I'm not going into it.
Grand Master Thotok, son of Koloth, I.K.S. Sompek==Dahar Master Shanara, I.K.S. Balth'Quv
Admiral R'Tath V'Tirex, R.R.W. Dhael Glohha'enh==Commander Ta'eth Korval, R.R.W Hachae ch'Rhian==Admiral Vranuk, R.R.W Delevhas
Go back to '79 and some Starcrash, eh? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzfuNSpP0RA
It's on Netflix, woot - woot - the oddball stuff I've been watching instead of playing STO, though I think it's on YouTube as well.
I could have totally seen Neelix as a character in that movie.
I would bet more people are annoyed by him, which is another testament to his acting prowess.
Personally I take the Vulcan approch to his persona displayed on voyager, its neither here nor there for me, but his talent is appreciated.
Even given that she's part-Klingon, her actions are inexcusable.
Still, given Klingons, and what's generally expected of Klingon women...I mean, they're kind of supposed to bee tougher and nastier than the men...it's possible that pregnant Klingons are shown all the deference possible and given copious targs to vent their rage on.
And that is my point. The fact Neelix was able to take advantage of her that easily proves that she wasnt mature enough to handle a relationship plus you are completely disregarding the fact that her own people referred to her as a child.
My original statement was only made in jest at her physical age and I wasn't trying to imply Neelix was into underage women. I was merely stating that Kes is way to immature to consider in a romantic sense
Grand Master Thotok, son of Koloth, I.K.S. Sompek==Dahar Master Shanara, I.K.S. Balth'Quv
Admiral R'Tath V'Tirex, R.R.W. Dhael Glohha'enh==Commander Ta'eth Korval, R.R.W Hachae ch'Rhian==Admiral Vranuk, R.R.W Delevhas
A young woman would without a doubt called a child in a lot of societies, regardless of her biological development. I am pretty sure a young adult, but umarried woman in the victorian era was recognized as a "child" due to her "purity". The same could apply to the scene you are referring to, although this is of course only speculation. But I see it this way, although I must admit I don't spend much time thinking about it
Now, being played by Neelix in that way is of course due to her inexperience and Neelix is, like I said, a jerk. But Kes was also raised in isolation and Neelix is a space faring "cowboy", showing her glittering techno stuff and taking her to the stars. It's a bad clich
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I wouldn't say he was bad, he's just that irritating little kid with snot dangling out of his nose constantly asking questions.
But if I strictly go within his representation in STO, I actually like him. It sucks I need to fetch and carry for him during that mission but that's a failure in the writing/design, not so much him.
And when the time comes he is ready and willing to kick some TRIBBLE, and I can respect that. Of course it needs to be said that STO Neelix could well be different from 'actual' TV show Neelix.
She definitely had a more open mind, or preserved a "childlike wonder", although in the doctor's case you could also argue that the concept of a holographic program looking like a person would be completely alien to her, considering her origin. But why should "childlike wonder" be an indication for pedophilia? I'm sorry if you weren't the one making the comparission in the first place
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they haters are simply aping/emulating/copying what they think is a popular point of view to hop on some imaginary bandwagon-of-cool in their own heads
somewhat the analog of finding someone to gang up on and pick on in gradeschool so you can deflect attacks away from yourself
nothing approaches the fail of jar jar. we all have things we don't like from time to time and it's fun to say "oh man, jar jar all over again" but it's just not the case. jar jar was so painful and universally disliked it was unreal. I remember the scenes with him in the theaters, it was so quiet you could hear peoples hearts beating. It was horrible, how that happened I'll never know. I mean really, don't they screentest things?
EDIT: but I agree, the original relationship nelix had was a headscratcher, vaguely creepy. the writers did good for both characters to tidy that up.
He has a capacity to kick some serious *** when needed (just wish that side came out more in DR side by side with his usual self)
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
Yep.
Heck, first thing I though when I saw that 'Captain' Harry Kim was stuck on the Kobali battleground here in STO was 'Poor, dumb Harry'.
Even in STO he gets stuck with all the worst spots. Neelix, Seven, Tuvok, and the Doctor are all off flying around actually partaking in the story while Harry is stuck on an empty ground zone I barely see people in.
On a side note, I don't mind Neelix as the WW chef. I'd take the 'devil you know' as it were compared to that obnoxious chef from last year.
*this post presented by the degree of Janeway*
Well, for the sake of conversation, this is my take on Neelix:
In context of STO....well, he's still the same douchebag Neelix. He hasn't evolved or developed in any noticeable way since his time on VOY. So yeah, still a prick.
I find him to be marginally less annoying in STO. Here, at least, we can see how he is better than the rest of the Talaxian species.
Neelix, at least, TRIES to be useful, even though he is 100% incompetent at every damn thing that he does.
The other Talaxians? Not only are they sociopathic incompetents, they're lazy. They have Admiral Awesomename, hero of the galaxy, person who's PWNed everything from Borg to Elachi to Iconians. running around picking up spices for them from random people.
Never mind the fact that any half-wit who thinks themselves a chef knows damn well that you keep your spices well-stocked and in an easily-accessible central location at all times, think about just how valuable Admiral Awesomename's on-duty time is, in terms of universes and star systems saved per minute on-duty, and see that on average, that fat, lazy Talaxian excuse for a cook thinks that getting the spices that HE SHOULD BE KEEPING TRACK OF ALREADY is more important than approximately .4 of a solar system.
At least Neelix does SOMEthing, even if he's utterly incompetent.
It was necroed in Ten Forward, actually.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
I always think that if they send us collecting scrap metal. And the cold, hard truth is that they need to pad it out as much as possible, getting everyone spending as much time as possible in those mission, fueling the metrics...
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Despite all of that, there were actually a few moments in the game where I did like Neelix... for the first time.
I think a lot of the Neelix hate is because the character is representative of Voyager: bad writing on top of a not too original idea. Heh. during the 1 1/2 season I could stomach the show, I reached a point where I hoped the ship and crew would never make it home. I still wish they hadn't made it home.
My character Tsin'xing
If you can headcanon it this way kudos to you
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As if the Winter Event npcs talking every few seconds wasn't annoying enough
They had to bring in Neelix to do the same?
Is it any wonder people were disliking the gazeo this year
And yes, it's a giant steaming pile of half-cooked ham. awkward, but adorable.... Oh and it has the Hoff.
My character Tsin'xing