sure. the spectacle was fun to watch. but that didnt make jjspocks character any less of a angsty marty stu that i would half expect from a 14yo girl following a twilight marathon.
which kinda goes with the sparkle vamp reanimation blood from marker labs department of makeuswhole.
Honestly, it reminded me a lot of the fight between Kirk and Spock in Amok Time.
Contrast this with the George Lucas approach, and the Deep Space Nine approach.
Audience didn't like Jar Jar Binks? Lucas changes his plans and demotes him to extra for the next two films, whereas the original plan was to have him get dramatically killed off by Anakin in ROTS.
He should have left that part in. It would have given the audience something to cheer about...
Everywhere I look, people are screaming about how bad Cryptic is.
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
He should have left that part in. It would have given the audience something to cheer about...
But seriously folks, the idea was for Jar Jar to be a sympathetic, popular comic relief character, thus making his dramatic murder by Anakin shocking and tear-inducing. Which wasn't going to happen with everybody and his brother considering him a borderline-useless complete moron.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
I always like Neelix as well. I never had a problem with him on any level expect for his jealously for Tom when they were fighting over Kes. That's it.
For me personally, nothing after STNG really felt like Star Trek; the rest was more like Wannabe Trek.
And most of why they failed my personal test was in the characters. So I will weigh in on the side of Neelix-haters, but I don't single him out. Most of the rest sucked equally hard, in my personal opinion.
Seriously, whose idiot idea was that to stick WHOOPIE-freaking-Goldberg in a Star Trek show?
For me personally, nothing after STNG really felt like Star Trek; the rest was more like Wannabe Trek.
And most of why they failed my personal test was in the characters. So I will weigh in on the side of Neelix-haters, but I don't single him out. Most of the rest sucked equally hard, in my personal opinion.
Seriously, whose idiot idea was that to stick WHOOPIE-freaking-Goldberg in a Star Trek show?
Roddenberry's. :P
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
Wasn't there an episode where Neelix has an outburst at Tuvok, like "You're always so dismissive of me," or something similar? He goes on and on about how Tuvok was so horrible to him, but he never once looked inside and asked himself why. Neelix was free of meaningful introspection and never actually forced the VOY crew to see things differently. Data was bad, but at least he provided a different (and valid) perspective of a given situation. Neelix had an opportunity to be Dr. McCoy, in a way, and become the emotional backbone to poor victim single mother of a captain so desperately needed. Instead, he pissed it away on a love affair with Kes, the most boring 2-dimensional Trek regular ever. Chekov had more depth than the two of them combined (no offense to Pavel himself, of course).
Hell, even Tasha Yar, the most notoriously underdeveloped character in TNG, was more redeemable, relatable, and admirable than Neelix. She even died in the line of duty (and actually earned the respect of her Klingon underling prior to her death. And had...relations with Data). More than Neelix could say. He bailed when he found a new chick to bone and never even got to see Earth. He probably didn't even know if the crew made it home intact. The crew didn't respect him as much as they needed him. They were alone and desperate. Neelix took full advantage of them and gave nothing significant in return. He was a prick, through and through.
My Old Blog about things that could and should have been added when I wrote it. Not sure what I want to do with it now. I'll just keep it available now that most of it is outdated.
Actually, IIRC, it was Whoopi's idea. And she'd just won an Oscar, so Gene and the producers were like "sure, why not." She wanted to be a bartender, so they made the Ten Forward set to accommodate that. This whole forum owes its existence to her.
Really, though, she was just about the most interesting character on TNG, simultaneously the most "real" and also the most mysterious. One of the (many) reasons why I hate Generations so much is that it killed a lot of the mystery about her past. But she was a big part of why I liked TNG.
...Oh, baby, you know, I've really got to leave you / Oh, I can hear it callin 'me / I said don't you hear it callin' me the way it used to do?...
- Anne Bredon
Actually, IIRC, it was Whoopi's idea. And she'd just won an Oscar, so Gene and the producers were like "sure, why not." She wanted to be a bartender, so they made the Ten Forward set to accommodate that. This whole forum owes its existence to her.
Really, though, she was just about the most interesting character on TNG, simultaneously the most "real" and also the most mysterious. One of the (many) reasons why I hate Generations so much is that it killed a lot of the mystery about her past. But she was a big part of why I liked TNG.
Well said^^^
And good to see you around, Sander, I haven't seen you since early in finals week. Did you see the Janeway-bashing-free Voyager rewrite that starswordc and I cooked up? Takeshi said he showed it to the Mastersverse guys.
Yeah, I liked Guinan a lot; she was one of those characters who I can't write for fear of TRIBBLE them up. Plus, she was a good conscience for Picard when he wasn't sure what to do. I loved her and Picard's interactions in "I, Borg" especially.
and on top of that he had help from other crewmen to take out that section for a galley. its not like hes allowed to do it himself without all those regulations and such, so clearly the crew felt like it was needed as well.
So Neelix was giving orders to serving crew members, who then followed said orders?
Let's just think about that for a moment...
Maquis, fair enough, while some were former officers, others were just colonists/mercs/ect, so sure, they'd likely not think twice to such a situation, but commissioned, serving Starfleet officers, taking orders from an un-ranked civilian? Nononono, that's not acceptable at all, and probably actionable as failure to follow proper chain of command, or being 'improperly irrelieved' (as they would've been dong something official before Neelix roped them into helping him) so that's actually another sign of things not being quite right aboard the good ship Voyager...
well thats what you think. but clearly both kes and neelix were a big help and impressed her enough, unless i dont remember her smile after their asking her.
Kes was actually useful though... She had horticultural skills which were relatable to crop production, and because of her eidetic memory, she was able to be taught to be a nurse, thus filling a staffing vacancy. Sure, sometimes her powers caused more trouble than they were worth, but for the most part, she actually earned her keep on the ship. Neelix did not...
Why should Neelix have to suffer Janeway's wrath when no one else ever did? Heck, she kept a serial killer around to help out!
You know, maybe I should modify my earlier guess - maybe everyone aboard Voyager actually had suffered cognitive impairment during their transit...
Noo, she had Suder relieved of all duties and confined to his quarters for the duration of the voyage (at least, that was her plan) He was only able to 'help out' when the Kazon took the ship, and the Doctor needed his help to repel them... He certainly wasn't kept around to help out with the intent of his help ever being sought, and the only reason he was kept on board, was because he would have had to be brought to Starfleet custody to answer for his crimes...
For me personally, nothing after STNG really felt like Star Trek; the rest was more like Wannabe Trek.
And most of why they failed my personal test was in the characters. So I will weigh in on the side of Neelix-haters, but I don't single him out. Most of the rest sucked equally hard, in my personal opinion.
Seriously, whose idiot idea was that to stick WHOOPIE-freaking-Goldberg in a Star Trek show?
With all the reasons to hate Neelix already mentioned, I can think of only one now...
He's a better cook than I am...
Think about that for a moment...
*sings* "I like Gammera! He's so neat!!! He is full of turtle meat!!!"
"Hah! You are doomed! You're only armed with that pathetic excuse for a musical instrument!!!" *the Savage Beast moments before Lonnehart the Bard used music to soothe him... then beat him to death with his Fat Lute*
I considered a thread merge, but there aren't really enough new posts in this thread to warrant it. If you would like to discuss the topic, please use the other thread.
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My character Tsin'xing
He should have left that part in. It would have given the audience something to cheer about...
What's my position?
That people should know what they're screaming about!
(paraphrased from "The Newsroom)
But seriously folks, the idea was for Jar Jar to be a sympathetic, popular comic relief character, thus making his dramatic murder by Anakin shocking and tear-inducing. Which wasn't going to happen with everybody and his brother considering him a borderline-useless complete moron.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
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And most of why they failed my personal test was in the characters. So I will weigh in on the side of Neelix-haters, but I don't single him out. Most of the rest sucked equally hard, in my personal opinion.
Seriously, whose idiot idea was that to stick WHOOPIE-freaking-Goldberg in a Star Trek show?
Roddenberry's. :P
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
Hell, even Tasha Yar, the most notoriously underdeveloped character in TNG, was more redeemable, relatable, and admirable than Neelix. She even died in the line of duty (and actually earned the respect of her Klingon underling prior to her death. And had...relations with Data). More than Neelix could say. He bailed when he found a new chick to bone and never even got to see Earth. He probably didn't even know if the crew made it home intact. The crew didn't respect him as much as they needed him. They were alone and desperate. Neelix took full advantage of them and gave nothing significant in return. He was a prick, through and through.
Actually, IIRC, it was Whoopi's idea. And she'd just won an Oscar, so Gene and the producers were like "sure, why not." She wanted to be a bartender, so they made the Ten Forward set to accommodate that. This whole forum owes its existence to her.
Really, though, she was just about the most interesting character on TNG, simultaneously the most "real" and also the most mysterious. One of the (many) reasons why I hate Generations so much is that it killed a lot of the mystery about her past. But she was a big part of why I liked TNG.
...Oh, baby, you know, I've really got to leave you / Oh, I can hear it callin 'me / I said don't you hear it callin' me the way it used to do?...
- Anne Bredon
Well said^^^
And good to see you around, Sander, I haven't seen you since early in finals week. Did you see the Janeway-bashing-free Voyager rewrite that starswordc and I cooked up? Takeshi said he showed it to the Mastersverse guys.
Yeah, I liked Guinan a lot; she was one of those characters who I can't write for fear of TRIBBLE them up. Plus, she was a good conscience for Picard when he wasn't sure what to do. I loved her and Picard's interactions in "I, Borg" especially.
Let's just think about that for a moment...
Maquis, fair enough, while some were former officers, others were just colonists/mercs/ect, so sure, they'd likely not think twice to such a situation, but commissioned, serving Starfleet officers, taking orders from an un-ranked civilian? Nononono, that's not acceptable at all, and probably actionable as failure to follow proper chain of command, or being 'improperly irrelieved' (as they would've been dong something official before Neelix roped them into helping him) so that's actually another sign of things not being quite right aboard the good ship Voyager...
Kes was actually useful though... She had horticultural skills which were relatable to crop production, and because of her eidetic memory, she was able to be taught to be a nurse, thus filling a staffing vacancy. Sure, sometimes her powers caused more trouble than they were worth, but for the most part, she actually earned her keep on the ship. Neelix did not...
Noo, she had Suder relieved of all duties and confined to his quarters for the duration of the voyage (at least, that was her plan) He was only able to 'help out' when the Kazon took the ship, and the Doctor needed his help to repel them... He certainly wasn't kept around to help out with the intent of his help ever being sought, and the only reason he was kept on board, was because he would have had to be brought to Starfleet custody to answer for his crimes...
and I DONT LIKE SPAM!!! euw :P
Are you dissing Guinan?
Idk about you but guinan is a dead ringer for whoopi goldberg now if guinan had dreadlocks id think they were twins lololololol
He's a better cook than I am...
Think about that for a moment...
"Hah! You are doomed! You're only armed with that pathetic excuse for a musical instrument!!!" *the Savage Beast moments before Lonnehart the Bard used music to soothe him... then beat him to death with his Fat Lute*
There is another, current thread on the same topic here: http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1332371
I considered a thread merge, but there aren't really enough new posts in this thread to warrant it. If you would like to discuss the topic, please use the other thread.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek