wait, what? there's a dialogue check for equipped traits? i didn't know that was possible - wonder if that was a recent addition
I just tested. It's apparently NOT there for the trait but it is for at least one telepathic species. (Lethean, maybe?)
Anyway, the gist is: Something she's saying is a flat out lie but which one can't be determined due to telepathic blocks.
However, given that Cryptic has never been subtle on this stuff and that two years ago, Daniel Stahl was running around saying, "Are you sure they're the Iconians and not someone who wants you to think they're the Iconians?", I'm leaning towards that being the lie.
Hm. Maybe that ties into the Hur'q/Fek'Ihiri connection as well.
If the Hur'q's MO is to hide behind myths and legends, maybe they're posing as Iconians the way they posed as Fek'Ihiri?
I still personally lean towards the idea of it really being Iconians and the Iconians being the Old Ones in both "Catspaw" (TOS) and "What are little girls made of?" (TOS).
Memory Alpha assumes the Old Ones in each were different groups. But both episodes were written by the same writer.
The Old Ones in "What Are Little Girls Made Of?" were said to create an android race that was too perfect many thousands of years ago. They began deactivating their androids but their androids, wise to their creators' plans, rose up in rebellion and claimed to have killed the Old Ones.
In "Catspaw", the Old Ones are said to be a group that has retreated from the Milky Way Galaxy. They sent a servant race, the Ornithoids, posing as witches to scout the progress made in the galaxy since they had left.
The same writer, Robert Bloch, wrote both stories (and was a friend of H.P. Lovecraft, whose stories seem echoed in STO's take on the Iconians).
The biggest disappointment for me was that this end cap to the Delta Rising story arc did not, unlike the Worf and Tuvok episodes, end with a "holy TRIBBLE!" cliffhanger nor did it give even the remotest hint on what happens next. At the very least, it should have set things up for the next arc.
One of the unfortunate side effects of "redoing" Sela is that the new version now appears in the Romulan mission "Turning Point" (where you pick your faction).
I was running a new Romulan toon through the story arcs, and when Sela walked into the conference to confront D'tan, I just went "Whoah!"
Apparently whatever happened to Sela was so bad it permeated down through the time line. :eek:
One of the unfortunate side effects of "redoing" Sela is that the new version now appears in the Romulan mission "Turning Point" (where you pick your faction).
I was running a new Romulan toon through the story arcs, and when Sela walked into the conference to confront D'tan, I just went "Whoah!"
Apparently whatever happened to Sela was so bad it permeated down through the time line. :eek:
It permeated down through the timeline and into her mother! :P
(Seriously, try replaying Temporal Ambassador, you'll see what I'm talking about.)
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
The biggest disappointment for me was that this end cap to the Delta Rising story arc did not, unlike the Worf and Tuvok episodes, end with a "holy TRIBBLE!" cliffhanger nor did it give even the remotest hint on what happens next. At the very least, it should have set things up for the next arc.
There was one at the end of the Last Stand, the Kobali ground arc.
I'm guessing SPOILER.
You mean you don't get a "[punch her in the face]" option if you're part of the Romulan Republic?
That would be one of several appropriate actions I feel one could take, depending on their opinion of Sela.
I mean heck, as Federation I can murder a defenseless Ferengi merchant, destroy an allied Benthan ship, promise to take an incarcerated prisoners proposal to help the federation with genetic engineering, help the Tal Shiar who are in the middle of experimenting on Republic personnel with borg implants, but no matter if you like Sela or hate her, the conversation amounts to Sela spouting some useless information you already know and sending her off to prison.
For the long wait, I can't help but feel the conclusion to the Sela arc here is a bit lackluster.
That I agree with. And as I first played the mission on KDF and FED chars, I was looking forward to how the dialogue options would be different for a Romulan char.
I was disappointed in that I was protecting Sela from Tiaru Jarok, same as on FED and KDF.
Given all those actions you mention here (except for the Tal Shiar helping, that's forced upon characters under brainwashing), I was expecting Romulan characters to be more... ruthless and agressive toward the one believed responsible for so many woes.
The interesting thing is that if you have the telepathy trait, you find out that one of her statements is definitely a lie but not which one.
I can confirm there is slightly different dialogue for Vulcans in the end QnA with Sela as well. Nothing revolutionary, though.
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class. Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider. Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
well, i readed blog about message in which one of survivors saying that SHE (ques who ) is thier leader in surviving of abduction...that imeadiatly opened questin in my mind - are thier captors TOTAL IDIOTS ?
first rule of keeping prisoners is to kill all posible leaders of uprising and assign worst of prisoners as keeprs of others. Why they forgot this simple rule ?
The worst part of this, for me, was her appearance; the Elachi must have an ugly stick they were using for interrogation purposes, because the only thing she's missing now is a Bruce Campbell-style butt-chin.
That I agree with. And as I first played the mission on KDF and FED chars, I was looking forward to how the dialogue options would be different for a Romulan char.
I was disappointed in that I was protecting Sela from Tiaru Jarok, same as on FED and KDF.
Given all those actions you mention here (except for the Tal Shiar helping, that's forced upon characters under brainwashing), I was expecting Romulan characters to be more... ruthless and agressive toward the one believed responsible for so many woes.
I can confirm there is slightly different dialogue for Vulcans in the end QnA with Sela as well. Nothing revolutionary, though.
You end up turning Sela over to Tiaru by default anyways at the end, so there didn't really seem to be much of a point to the conversation with Sela.
I kinda expected that we'd at least have the option to turn her over to our ally or something instead.
On another note, does sela have a new haircut in addition to her new face? The bangs look a bit longer than the other Romulan/Vulcan hairdos.
Needs less forehead/cranium, more chin width, less chin length.
Denise Crosby's attractiveness was never fully maximized with Sela.
I think Tasha should probably just be reverted.
Sela needs to be tweaked a bit but isn't far off aside from needing a shorter, wider chin and a lot less forehead.
The Image Overlay Utility is a handy tool. You can overlay a partially transparent photo overtop STO in windowed mode.
Sela shouldn't look like Denise crosby looks now. Sela should seem younger and... how to say this politely?... thinner. She claims having been a prisoner these past months after all.
The only way I can understand her face changing is that the Mushroom heads (as the Elachi are called) started 'mushroomising' Sela's head already. Leading to that swelling look. Of course that stops making sense when you realise Sela's look has been changed across the board, in all previous missions.
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class. Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider. Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Sela shouldn't look like Denise crosby looks now. Sela should seem younger and... how to say this politely?... thinner. She claims having been a prisoner these past months after all.
The only way I can understand her face changing is that the Mushroom heads (as the Elachi are called) started 'mushroomising' Sela's head already. Leading to that swelling look. Of course that stops making sense when you realise Sela's look has been changed across the board, in all previous missions.
The comparison pic I supplied was from Crosby's appearance as Sela on TNG nearly 25 years ago.
Yeah I don't thinks Sela is horrible, and when I compare how she looked before to how she looked in the show.... her LoR version looks more like her as an 18 year old than as an adult. Sure, she's part Romulan and ages slower than a human, but she was born in 2345, thus making her 65 years old in STO. superior alien physiology or not she shouldn't look like a teenager.
The comparison pic I supplied was from Crosby's appearance as Sela on TNG nearly 25 years ago.
Interesting, it closely resembled an Imdb pic of crosby from some recent movie or something that someone posted on the forums.
Than perhaps I should rephrase my wishes: Sela in game shouldn't look like a dummy (which is the current case), even if then she more or less resembles Denise Crosby. (Yes, I know I'm grasping at straws, but the Sela in game is just somehow terrible.)
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class. Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider. Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Interesting, it closely resembled an Imdb pic of crosby from some recent movie or something that someone posted on the forums.
Than perhaps I should rephrase my wishes: Sela in game shouldn't look like a dummy (which is the current case), even if then she more or less resembles Denise Crosby. (Yes, I know I'm grasping at straws, but the Sela in game is just somehow terrible.)
I think she was making a face in the picture I shared.
One trick about likenesses in STO is that you're going to have to pick a facial expression to reference as your default. People are almost never NOT expressing, whether it's lifted brows or flaring nostrils.
At a glance, I'd say they used a couple of pics including her Memory Alpha page as reference (which has the new haircut).
One thing to keep in mind with actor likenesses is that they invariably clash with the classic artistic direction for STO, which has been a bit flat and cartoony.
Even beautiful real people have irregular features and assymetrical faces. I think it's interesting that people expect this ruggedness of the male faces.
I just glanced at Seven of Nine and her facial proportions are dead on.
You know what I think? I think what's mostly off about the female likenesses in STO is hair and makeup.
Seven should have red tint to her hair. Her eyebrows are darkened. Her skin is less shiny (due to makeup). The big difference is eye makeup. Mascara and fake eyelashes. The proportions for Seven's face are perfect.
Depending on your baseline for Sela (or Tasha), this is probably also true barring some cranial adjustments. Nose mouth and eyes are perfect proportion and her chin is about the right shape. She should have unraised, totally human eyebrows. Smokey eyeliner, dull foundation, salmon colored lipstick.
I think what you're seeing in the game is almost exactly what these actresses would have looked like when they were on the shows, only without cosmetic makeup. (Whereas the men likely had some very subtle foundation makeup and highlights designed for film, the women had cosmetic makeup.)
I think she was making a face in the picture I shared.
One trick about likenesses in STO is that you're going to have to pick a facial expression to reference as your default. People are almost never NOT expressing, whether it's lifted brows or flaring nostrils.
At a glance, I'd say they used a couple of pics including her Memory Alpha page as reference (which has the new haircut).
One thing to keep in mind with actor likenesses is that they invariably clash with the classic artistic direction for STO, which has been a bit flat and cartoony.
Even beautiful real people have irregular features and assymetrical faces. I think it's interesting that people expect this ruggedness of the male faces.
I just glanced at Seven of Nine and her facial proportions are dead on.
You know what I think? I think what's mostly off about the female likenesses in STO is hair and makeup.
Seven should have red tint to her hair. Her eyebrows are darkened. Her skin is less shiny (due to makeup). The big difference is eye makeup. Mascara and fake eyelashes. The proportions for Seven's face are perfect.
Depending on your baseline for Sela (or Tasha), this is probably also true barring some cranial adjustments. Nose mouth and eyes are perfect proportion and her chin is about the right shape. She should have unraised, totally human eyebrows. Smokey eyeliner, dull foundation, salmon colored lipstick.
I think what you're seeing in the game is almost exactly what these actresses would have looked like when they were on the shows, only without cosmetic makeup. (Whereas the men likely had some very subtle foundation makeup and highlights designed for film, the women had cosmetic makeup.)
What you say may very well be the problem for me. It's true I see enormous differences on my female chars and Boffs depending on the 'makeup pattern' I use.
Speaking of Seven, I noticed in game she gets more like Jeri Ryan/show Seven the closer you get. The large head you see in a dialogue window matches her far better then the face you typically see on the character running around or some of the promotional pics on the site.
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class. Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider. Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Comments
My character Tsin'xing
I just tested. It's apparently NOT there for the trait but it is for at least one telepathic species. (Lethean, maybe?)
Anyway, the gist is: Something she's saying is a flat out lie but which one can't be determined due to telepathic blocks.
However, given that Cryptic has never been subtle on this stuff and that two years ago, Daniel Stahl was running around saying, "Are you sure they're the Iconians and not someone who wants you to think they're the Iconians?", I'm leaning towards that being the lie.
Hm. Maybe that ties into the Hur'q/Fek'Ihiri connection as well.
If the Hur'q's MO is to hide behind myths and legends, maybe they're posing as Iconians the way they posed as Fek'Ihiri?
I still personally lean towards the idea of it really being Iconians and the Iconians being the Old Ones in both "Catspaw" (TOS) and "What are little girls made of?" (TOS).
Memory Alpha assumes the Old Ones in each were different groups. But both episodes were written by the same writer.
The Old Ones in "What Are Little Girls Made Of?" were said to create an android race that was too perfect many thousands of years ago. They began deactivating their androids but their androids, wise to their creators' plans, rose up in rebellion and claimed to have killed the Old Ones.
In "Catspaw", the Old Ones are said to be a group that has retreated from the Milky Way Galaxy. They sent a servant race, the Ornithoids, posing as witches to scout the progress made in the galaxy since they had left.
The same writer, Robert Bloch, wrote both stories (and was a friend of H.P. Lovecraft, whose stories seem echoed in STO's take on the Iconians).
I was running a new Romulan toon through the story arcs, and when Sela walked into the conference to confront D'tan, I just went "Whoah!"
Apparently whatever happened to Sela was so bad it permeated down through the time line. :eek:
It permeated down through the timeline and into her mother! :P
(Seriously, try replaying Temporal Ambassador, you'll see what I'm talking about.)
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
There was one at the end of the Last Stand, the Kobali ground arc.
I'm guessing SPOILER.
I was disappointed in that I was protecting Sela from Tiaru Jarok, same as on FED and KDF.
Given all those actions you mention here (except for the Tal Shiar helping, that's forced upon characters under brainwashing), I was expecting Romulan characters to be more... ruthless and agressive toward the one believed responsible for so many woes.
I can confirm there is slightly different dialogue for Vulcans in the end QnA with Sela as well. Nothing revolutionary, though.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
first rule of keeping prisoners is to kill all posible leaders of uprising and assign worst of prisoners as keeprs of others. Why they forgot this simple rule ?
I think she's already growing it, too.
I kinda expected that we'd at least have the option to turn her over to our ally or something instead.
On another note, does sela have a new haircut in addition to her new face? The bangs look a bit longer than the other Romulan/Vulcan hairdos.
GG Cryptic.
dnirg eht nioj
Needs less forehead/cranium, more chin width, less chin length.
Denise Crosby's attractiveness was never fully maximized with Sela.
I think Tasha should probably just be reverted.
Sela needs to be tweaked a bit but isn't far off aside from needing a shorter, wider chin and a lot less forehead.
The Image Overlay Utility is a handy tool. You can overlay a partially transparent photo overtop STO in windowed mode.
Sela shouldn't look like Denise crosby looks now. Sela should seem younger and... how to say this politely?... thinner. She claims having been a prisoner these past months after all.
The only way I can understand her face changing is that the Mushroom heads (as the Elachi are called) started 'mushroomising' Sela's head already. Leading to that swelling look. Of course that stops making sense when you realise Sela's look has been changed across the board, in all previous missions.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
The comparison pic I supplied was from Crosby's appearance as Sela on TNG nearly 25 years ago.
My character Tsin'xing
Interesting, it closely resembled an Imdb pic of crosby from some recent movie or something that someone posted on the forums.
Than perhaps I should rephrase my wishes: Sela in game shouldn't look like a dummy (which is the current case), even if then she more or less resembles Denise Crosby. (Yes, I know I'm grasping at straws, but the Sela in game is just somehow terrible.)
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
I think she was making a face in the picture I shared.
One trick about likenesses in STO is that you're going to have to pick a facial expression to reference as your default. People are almost never NOT expressing, whether it's lifted brows or flaring nostrils.
At a glance, I'd say they used a couple of pics including her Memory Alpha page as reference (which has the new haircut).
One thing to keep in mind with actor likenesses is that they invariably clash with the classic artistic direction for STO, which has been a bit flat and cartoony.
Even beautiful real people have irregular features and assymetrical faces. I think it's interesting that people expect this ruggedness of the male faces.
I just glanced at Seven of Nine and her facial proportions are dead on.
You know what I think? I think what's mostly off about the female likenesses in STO is hair and makeup.
Seven should have red tint to her hair. Her eyebrows are darkened. Her skin is less shiny (due to makeup). The big difference is eye makeup. Mascara and fake eyelashes. The proportions for Seven's face are perfect.
Depending on your baseline for Sela (or Tasha), this is probably also true barring some cranial adjustments. Nose mouth and eyes are perfect proportion and her chin is about the right shape. She should have unraised, totally human eyebrows. Smokey eyeliner, dull foundation, salmon colored lipstick.
I think what you're seeing in the game is almost exactly what these actresses would have looked like when they were on the shows, only without cosmetic makeup. (Whereas the men likely had some very subtle foundation makeup and highlights designed for film, the women had cosmetic makeup.)
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
Again, Sela (and Tasha) are STILL Denise Crosby circa 1991.
Those aren't aged to 2014. That's 1991 Denise Crosby without cosmetic makeup.
What you say may very well be the problem for me. It's true I see enormous differences on my female chars and Boffs depending on the 'makeup pattern' I use.
Speaking of Seven, I noticed in game she gets more like Jeri Ryan/show Seven the closer you get. The large head you see in a dialogue window matches her far better then the face you typically see on the character running around or some of the promotional pics on the site.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!