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Wow, has the AI gotten smarter

hornet6hornet6 Member Posts: 101 Arc User
While playing through the Delta Rising content, I have noticed several things and was wondering, 'Is it just me?' It seems the AI has started to wise up a bit.

In space, many enemy ships often hit your ship with tractor beams then drop a load of rather nasty mines on you. If you don't have a movement buff on or available and don't break away from the tractor beam, those mines go off causing some nastier than usual damage. The enemy ships also seem to be prone to attempt running out of range when significantly damaged, many will regenerate some damage and be somewhat, albeit most often, and so far managably, repaired by the time you re-aquire them as targets.

On the ground, certain enemy soldiers almost immediately start trying to maneuver and outflank you.

This has happened too often to me (I always do storyline content solo) for me to believe it's random. Has anyone else experienced this? I haven't seen enemy NPC improvement like this since the Borg started running and tracking. It's quite enjoyable and welcome.
ANOTHER NERF !?!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Post edited by hornet6 on

Comments

  • catjarrettcatjarrett Member Posts: 285 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    I've seen a lot of reports that the DR AI has stepped up its game, and I agree, I think it's excellent and wish they'd travel further down that path than the more hp = higher difficulty road.
  • greyhame3greyhame3 Member Posts: 914 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    The space mechanic is similar to the Romulan D'deridex NPC ship. It would lock a tractor beam on you then launch a bunch of high yield plasma torpedoes at you.
  • futurepastnowfuturepastnow Member Posts: 3,660 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    It hasn't, really, it's just that newer enemies have been given slightly better and more complex abilities. Replay an old mission with Nausicaans or Gorn, they're just as dumb as ever.
  • artificial86artificial86 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Yup, they developed new A.I. for the Vaadwaur enemies. I'm loving the way the Vaadwaur spaceships behave now, although there is one minor complaint I have, specifically with the Vaadwaur Cruiser.

    The Vaadwaur Cruiser operates using the same A.I. as the smaller Vaadwaur frigates, it will either try to perform attack runs or it will park and just shell an area as long as you allow it to. When I get too close to it the A.I. forces it to run away and try to perform an attack run.

    Here's where the problem is, if I maintain my distance close enough to the cruiser, the A.I. will permanently try to run away, rather than turning around to attack. You can achieve this by keeping pace with the cruiser or slowing it. I've consistently been able to 100 to 0 Vaadwaur Cruisers by firing entirely into its rear arc using this tactic.

    It feels like I'm exploiting the A.I. when fighting the Vaadwaur Cruisers.

    The frigates don't really suffer from this issue since they're so fast, and the battleships seem to favour broadsiding rather than performing attack runs.
  • lordkhoraklordkhorak Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    It feels like I'm exploiting the A.I. when fighting the Vaadwaur Cruisers.

    Um....because you are? You described exactly how you're exploiting the AI.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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  • mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    The Vaaduvar (anyone can tell the right spelling? ;) ) seem to really have the most intersting AI to fight.

    But I think the extra hit points are also part of the equation here - they actually last long enough for their fancy trickwork to be visible.

    If I fight a Borg Cube in my Escort, it often goes down in 10 seconds or less. Even if it has a brilliant, interesting AI, it just can't survive long enough to show me.


    In a way, it's a good thing for the Cube. If you actually have to fight it for long, the shield neutralizer would probably wreck any fun out of it. But... It's just wrong. These are the frigging Borg! If they don't feel dangerous and tough, then you're doing it wrong.
    Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
  • catjarrettcatjarrett Member Posts: 285 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    lordkhorak wrote: »
    Um....because you are? You described exactly how you're exploiting the AI.

    You say exploit.

    Others say tactics.

    *shrug*
  • reginamala78reginamala78 Member Posts: 4,593 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Here's where the problem is, if I maintain my distance close enough to the cruiser, the A.I. will permanently try to run away, rather than turning around to attack. You can achieve this by keeping pace with the cruiser or slowing it. I've consistently been able to 100 to 0 Vaadwaur Cruisers by firing entirely into its rear arc using this tactic.

    All of them have this behavior. They all have a counter to try and prevent you from doing so (assault ship speed, cruiser mines, artillery ship placate), but if you counter their counters you can just hang out in the rear arc and chew them to pieces. Fast ships with CRF (bops especially of all things, due to flanking) simply demolish the Vaadwaur.

    Personally I'm amused by this, because when was the last time when spikey bops were king?
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  • artificial86artificial86 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    My point was that, while all the Vaadwaur ships (except the battleship) perform similar maneuvers, its too easy to keep up with the Cruisers and chew through their rear, even on Elite. Hence why I hope Cryptic figures out a way to have the A.I. just turn around and fight if you've stayed at their 6 for too long.

    Alternatively, they could revert one of the 2 Vaadwaur cruisers types to the old A.I.. This way, the 2 different cruisers will look like they're working together, with one staying close to attract your attention while the other shells you from the side.
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  • artificial86artificial86 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    The additional HP/Res is pretty much essential at this point. Otherwise you'd simply chew through them no matter what maneuvers they did.

    Case in point, a lot of glass-cannons are complaining about being 1-shotted by the Crystaline Entity on CC Advanced now, and assumed that the Entity's attacks were buffed. Except it wasn't.

    What was actually happening was the Crystalline Entity was getting enough time to build its damage buff charges. It always had this ability, but people were bursting down the Entity before they ever saw the damage buff come into effect.

    I'd say keep the increased HP/res. It ensures the mobs stay alive long enough to pull off their moves. Story missions on Elite are actually fun now.
  • tigerariestigeraries Member Posts: 3,492 Arc User
    edited October 2014

    I'm exploiting the A.I.

    You cheater!
  • bobtheskull99bobtheskull99 Member Posts: 706 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    on ground I noticed this just after the pre-patch but I wasn't sure if it was my imagination or not

    doing deferi "emancipation" breen would often duck behind objects and avoid being shot at more often
  • coolheadalcoolheadal Member Posts: 1,253 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Enemy races and the AI that controls them are much tougher and the way they're programmed to deal huge damages on your ship. So you have to out think that AI. Rebuild your ship weapons, consoles, shields and even upgrade the T5 if you can. There are Mastery now which max out at level 4. I've reached that still I need 3 layers of shield protection. If you have any of the Rep sets for space most of them offer 4 layers of shield protection then you could make it 5 layers using certain consoles. But in all the AI is smart though!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Time will only tell!
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  • artificial86artificial86 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    valoreah wrote: »
    That's not a smarter AI, that's just the lazy man's way of programming a new ability for the NPCs.

    Which is totally fine. Programming mobs that have emergent A.I. is insanely difficult for any game. In an MMO its essentially impossible.

    All they need to do is give the A.I. enough attack patterns and triggered responses to keep things fun. The new A.I. introduced in DR for the Vaadwaur was most definitely a step in the right direction.
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  • talonxvtalonxv Member Posts: 4,257 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    Only thing I find funny, is watching the borg cubes shake on all 3 axis. That is priceless.
    afMSv4g.jpg
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  • artificial86artificial86 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    valoreah wrote: »
    The problem with this is that it's too easy to figure out. Once you fight the Vaadwaur, you understand exactly how to defeat them within about 2 minutes. In that time frame, you've seen every trick they're going to use ever.

    More intelligent A.I. is the way to go. Hell, even teaching NPCs basic dogfighting technique would make encounters more fun.

    Its pretty obvious you have no idea how hard it is to code mob A.I.. Let's just leave it at that.
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  • artificial86artificial86 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    valoreah wrote: »
    I never claimed to know anything about programming mob A.I., nor do I really need to in order to have an opinion on what I would find engaging.

    Saying "it's hard" is a lazy, defeatist attitude IMO.

    There is a difference between tackling a challenge and attempting the impossible. Doing emergent A.I. in an MMO falls in the latter, and expecting developers to even attempt such things only sets you up for disappointment.
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  • artificial86artificial86 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    The did do something else. They developed new A.I. for the Vaadwaur. It could use a few tweaks but overall its awesome.

    End of discussion. Any more out of you will simply be considered to be an excuse to rage.
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  • artificial86artificial86 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited October 2014
    I'm entitled to consider your posts to be nothing more than toxic rage. Its quite simple really.
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