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Forums > Home› Star Trek Online General Discussion

Why Respecs need to be free

jadizbanejadizbane Member Posts: 59 Arc User
edited September 2014 in Star Trek Online General Discussion
With ship loadouts and all the various space sets it has become apparent that Respecing is frequently required. In alot of cases one Skill Build will not be viable between some of the space and ground sets so should respecing be free and also similar to ship loadouts and switching between skills in favour of a different set say like the undine or dyson set. If you frequent the Dyson sphere for instance you have to fight both Voth and Undine and equipping the appriopriate set is more effective against these foes. So can we have interchangable respcing for different situations?

I would like to think my opinion and request is not unreasonable or impossible.

Just throwing it out there.

regards to the Star Trek community

Jadiz
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Comments

  • banatinebanatine Member Posts: 250 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    I don't see why this is neccessary. If you want to hyper-specialise your skills, you have to accept the drop in versatility.

    it's very easy to skill yourself towards generalisation if you want to regularly switch ships. Every single one of my characters uses the same skill setup, and i have almost half the bars filled on the antire screen.

    Just remmber that those last 3 red bars are basically never worth the skill points, and the 3 greens ALWAYS are unless you know for a fact you will never use their associated powers (looking at you, sci skills, and driver coil)
    Real Temporal Operative: Purchased the Special Temporal Agent pack before it was even officially announced!
  • thegcbaconthegcbacon Member Posts: 434 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    You must be a very poor builder or have severe ADHD to have to frequently respec.
  • jaguarskxjaguarskx Member Posts: 5,945 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    Meh...

    Give a 2nd option to purchase respect token with real money only. Set the price on that option to $2.50 USD and it's equivalent in other countries.

    Based on a Dil : Zen exchange rate of 170, you can either grind for about 11 days for the 500 Zen to purchase the respec token, or simply pay $2.50 fee for instant gratification.
  • qziqzaqziqza Member Posts: 1,044 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    They may provide us with some really tasty starters and the occasional free glass of house white, but they are after all a business. They will always entice us with these nice freebies, but the expectation is for us to want the full 3 course meal, get properly lashed, and be happy to pay the bill at the end of the night :D Oh, and dont forget to tip your Cryptic Devs.
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  • cryptiecopcryptiecop Member Posts: 239 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    jadizbane wrote: »
    With ship loadouts and all the various space sets it has become apparent that Respecing is frequently required. In alot of cases one Skill Build will not be viable between some of the space and ground sets so should respecing be free and also similar to ship loadouts and switching between skills in favour of a different set say like the undine or dyson set. If you frequent the Dyson sphere for instance you have to fight both Voth and Undine and equipping the appriopriate set is more effective against these foes. So can we have interchangable respcing for different situations?

    I would like to think my opinion and request is not unreasonable or impossible.

    Just throwing it out there.

    regards to the Star Trek community

    Jadiz

    Jadiz from FEDX on Ahazi server in SWG?
    cmbanner2015.jpg
  • psychoplattpsychoplatt Member Posts: 285 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    jadizbane wrote: »
    With ship loadouts and all the various space sets it has become apparent that Respecing is frequently required.
    Jadiz

    No. They will not sell any lifetime Subs after that and the game will die. The 9 respec Tokens per char are a great Argument to get lifetime - if u Play over 20 chars like me ;)
    nice u wasted so much time in your sig - i do not see it anyway :)
  • cryptiecopcryptiecop Member Posts: 239 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    psychoplatt wrote: »
    No. They will not sell any lifetime Subs after that and the game will die. The 9 respec Tokens per char are a great Argument to get lifetime - if u Play over 20 chars like me ;)

    They use to charge for trait and reputation respecs too, but eventually dropped that some time ago...skill respecs need to fall in line with that as well imo...
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  • strykewolf67strykewolf67 Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    Would have been handy to have one on the first couple of characters I ran up, months ago. After that I've just planned ahead on them, a bit.
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  • hyefatherhyefather Member Posts: 1,286 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    I don't think it should be free. I do think it should be lowered to maybe 200 zen. I know I would experiment more with builds if it didn't cost so much. I mean thats a Fleet module just to change skill points. Thats just too much.
  • dankindicadankindica Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    These people that say a specialized spec is not needed CLEARLY do NOT PvP because a general jack of all trades spec simply DOES NOT fly in PvP. I agree with OP and always thought since I started this game that it's absolutely ridiculous to make a player pay to re-spec and this is the ONLY game I have experienced this hard core greed. Not only is re-specing NEEDED for different ships and builds, BUT most people will TRIBBLE up their 1st couple builds at a cost of 5 USD per TRIBBLE up. Took me 2 to get mine right and it is VERY specialized. I don't want to pay again I'd rather spend money on cool game content not a damn re-spec. So If I want to change it up I'll need to start a new toon. However what will most likely happen is I'll stop playing and move to a game that is less greedy. One that allows me to actually PLAY a game and have fun, rather than making it as task oriented as possible requiring more dedication to advance than a average paying JOB. OH and don't mess up cause it will cost you. Already as it is the game is wearing thin on me despite loving the game play. I understand money has to be made but this game is THEE MOST time gated, greedy F2P I have seen. I think free re-specs is asking for VERY LITTLE!
  • jackal1701apwjackal1701apw Member Posts: 669 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    To be honest I don't think it should be totally free.. but it does need to be more flexible.

    I would suggest something akin to loadouts on a ship.

    Every Character gets one skill set. However, you can purchase another skill set for 200-400 Zen. This is a one time character unlock. After purchasing and opening - said character would have a second skill set that they can save skill choices into.

    Selecting one skill set over another doesnt cost andything and can be swapped like traits can.
    Want to CHANGE your saved skill sets? That still costs a respec token (but perhaps a respec allows u to change ALL your skill sets rather than just one.)
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  • johnthomas00johnthomas00 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    I've been playing since the game went F2P, though I have spent several hundred dollars in the z-store (now c-store). I have used all of 1 respec, which I bought, becuase I maxed out driver coils on my first character and later decided I no longer wanted the points spent there. I by no means think driver coils is a waste though like some people do, it was it's place but I maxed it all the way and I just later decided that I wanted those points elsewhere.

    None of my other now 7 (I have 8 characters total) have even been respeced and I don't think they should be free as you can easily build both focused and general characters and not need to respec to enjoy the game.
  • dankindicadankindica Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    That's the thing though. Not everyone can make a game their full time job. Me personally I have one toon. The time gate in this game seriously deters me from rolling another toon. It's just too much time for not enough enjoyment. Re-specs should be available for in game currency maybe a couple million EC sounds very appropriate. Adversely if the want to continue charging 500 zen for a re-spec then OFFER zen in 5 USD amounts, as of now minimum you can buy is 10 USD. That's twice whats needed to re-spec which i personally paid TWICE. At two separate purchases of 10 USD, that's a freaking ship right there. I was made to spend 20 USD because I didn't understand the game well enough. Making a profit off of inexperienced players (cause its new and inexperienced players who often are in need of re-specs) is a deplorable practice.
  • jaguarskxjaguarskx Member Posts: 5,945 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    sopwithsnipe wrote: »

    3. They do sell respecs on the C-store for real money. Cryptic/PWE charges $5 bucks for instant gratification.

    Any item in the C-Store can be purchased with Zen obtained by purchasing said Zen or exchanging dilithium for Zen so basically it can cost $0 to $5 USD of real money depending on your desire to grind dilithium. Or a combination of the two; purchased Zen and exchanged Zen.

    The $2.50 USD I proposed is a straight credit card charge for the respec token. Basically it gives you the option to simply pay $2.50 for and instant token, or grind dilithium in exchange for 500 Zen (equivalent of $5 USD) to get the token without having to spend real money.
  • dankindicadankindica Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    Another appropriate measure would be to just have it cost a certain amount of dil in game. This way at least the price is set. The player knows what they have to save and does not have to watch a dil exchange and plan their purchase around varying markets. Or be forced to avoid purchases during new content drops like lock boxes that drive the price up and up and up.
  • johnthomas00johnthomas00 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    dankindica wrote: »
    That's the thing though. Not everyone can make a game their full time job. Me personally I have one toon. The time gate in this game seriously deters me from rolling another toon. It's just too much time for not enough enjoyment. Re-specs should be available for in game currency maybe a couple million EC sounds very appropriate. Adversely if the want to continue charging 500 zen for a re-spec then OFFER zen in 5 USD amounts, as of now minimum you can buy is 10 USD. That's twice whats needed to re-spec which i personally paid TWICE. At two separate purchases of 10 USD, that's a freaking ship right there. I was made to spend 20 USD because I didn't understand the game well enough. Making a profit off of inexperienced players (cause its new and inexperienced players who often are in need of re-specs) is a deplorable practice.

    Although ESD is often full of trolls, good players are there too. If you have questions about skills you can always ask, many others do, and this can lead to not having to buy respecs.
  • dankindicadankindica Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    Well I'm past re-spec on this toon he's set. But see what if I want to change ships. Maybe I want to fly a pure dps escort for pvp and then have a nice tank for pve. Those are way different from one another. My options.... pay to change, accept mediocrity in my toon or endure the grueling horrible time gate grind to rep and gear another toon. All options that will lead me to put the game down when this toon becomes a bore.
  • dankindicadankindica Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    A majority of the people new to this game don't last 6 months. That is a problem. A problem veteran players directly pay for when cryptic isn't bringing in enough cash and they continue to further gouge their veterans. It's just bad business. Unfortunately they make bank and get away with it and couldn't care less as long as the gravy train is still rolling.
  • johnthomas00johnthomas00 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    dankindica wrote: »
    Well I'm past re-spec on this toon he's set. But see what if I want to change ships. Maybe I want to fly a pure dps escort for pvp and then have a nice tank for pve. Those are way different from one another. My options.... pay to change, accept mediocrity in my toon or endure the grueling horrible time gate grind to rep and gear another toon. All options that will lead me to put the game down when this toon becomes a bore.

    Many of us have alts that we use to spec in roles for just that very reason... or as mentioned you can just buy various ships to your hearts content and make a general build giving your character some of everything but not focising in any one thing so he can run any of those ships as you like.

    I will however note that my main is a tac and I have run dps escorts, tankish cruisers, and sci ships with him all on a dps build, the only one that I had to watch my BOFFs on was the sci ship.

    In truth the problem I have when jumping ships (and I do it often on my main as I own many ships and get bored with my "main" ship sometimes and change for a day or two) is the BOFF skill setup NOT my captain's skills. I eventually went and bought more boff slots so I could spec boffs a certain way to avoid retraining them every week or so.
  • rygelx16rygelx16 Member Posts: 161 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    I agree Re-specs are waaaay to expensive. While they don't have to be free, they are far too high. They should cost either dil or EC if anything. Charging this much just hurts build creativity theory-crafting. Cryptic games are the ones I have ever seen discourage such activities so much.
  • annemarie30annemarie30 Member Posts: 2,698 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    my toons are specced fairly neutral. most powers are at 6. maybe that kills my DPS but at least i have a balanced captain
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  • jadizbanejadizbane Member Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    cryptiecop wrote: »
    Jadiz from FEDX on Ahazi server in SWG?

    yes its me
  • jadizbanejadizbane Member Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    jackal1701apw wrote: »
    To be honest I don't think it should be totally free.. but it does need to be more flexible.

    I would suggest something akin to loadouts on a ship.

    Every Character gets one skill set. However, you can purchase another skill set for 200-400 Zen. This is a one time character unlock. After purchasing and opening - said character would have a second skill set that they can save skill choices into.

    Selecting one skill set over another doesnt cost andything and can be swapped like traits can.
    Want to CHANGE your saved skill sets? That still costs a respec token (but perhaps a respec allows u to change ALL your skill sets rather than just one.)

    now thats a better idea then what i originally said
  • thegcbaconthegcbacon Member Posts: 434 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    dankindica wrote: »
    That's the thing though. Not everyone can make a game their full time job. Me personally I have one toon. The time gate in this game seriously deters me from rolling another toon. It's just too much time for not enough enjoyment. Re-specs should be available for in game currency maybe a couple million EC sounds very appropriate. Adversely if the want to continue charging 500 zen for a re-spec then OFFER zen in 5 USD amounts, as of now minimum you can buy is 10 USD. That's twice whats needed to re-spec which i personally paid TWICE. At two separate purchases of 10 USD, that's a freaking ship right there. I was made to spend 20 USD because I didn't understand the game well enough. Making a profit off of inexperienced players (cause its new and inexperienced players who often are in need of re-specs) is a deplorable practice.

    You obviously haven't played many F2P games. There's games w.o respec mechanics, so you ahve to reroll. Also, try using the DILX for a single respec. Maybe you'd have been smarter and gotten more info when you 1st respecced your character. It says a lot about you needing 4 respecs.
  • whiterookwhiterook Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    dankindica wrote: »
    Well I'm past re-spec on this toon he's set. But see what if I want to change ships. Maybe I want to fly a pure dps escort for pvp and then have a nice tank for pve. Those are way different from one another. My options.... pay to change, accept mediocrity in my toon or endure the grueling horrible time gate grind to rep and gear another toon. All options that will lead me to put the game down when this toon becomes a bore.

    To the OP, I mean no disrespect to you or those that feel the need to specialize like they are joining to be a member of a S.E.A.L. team.

    In "every" MMO that I have every played in - you guys are never happy with how the game respec's are done. And before you start getting all defensive on me, I do understand what you are talking about - I just reached a point a very long time ago where I can not get excited about creating an uber toon. I am in the game to have fun, not save the world by being the best of the best of the best! But that's just me..... :)
  • jadizbanejadizbane Member Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    whiterook wrote: »
    To the OP, I mean no disrespect to you or those that feel the need to specialize like they are joining to be a member of a S.E.A.L. team.

    In "every" MMO that I have every played in - you guys are never happy with how the game respec's are done. And before you start getting all defensive on me, I do understand what you are talking about - I just reached a point a very long time ago where I can not get excited about creating an uber toon. I am in the game to have fun, not save the world by being the best of the best of the best! But that's just me..... :)

    I'm not annoyed with anyone's responses in this post. I was curious to see if anyone feels as i. It's not so much as creating an uber toon. It's having the perfect set of skills for the right situation.

    I wouldnt mind paying for a skill loadout though.

    Some people have been only mildly critical but feedback from the community is what it's all about. If we all thought the same way life would be boring. Differing opinions is not a bad thing. From everyone's responses here if has helped me to no longer stress over it and to go for a more generalised set up. The last 3 points in a skill box while nice is not essential.
  • baudlbaudl Member Posts: 4,060 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    yeah, can't understand why it isn't free anyway since it ACTIVELY discourages you to use multiple ships that may require very different speccs.

    actually i would get rid of the skilltree entirely, but buff the numbers on specific science consoles to compensate.
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  • lianthelialianthelia Member Posts: 7,897 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    banatine wrote: »
    I don't see why this is neccessary. If you want to hyper-specialise your skills, you have to accept the drop in versatility.

    it's very easy to skill yourself towards generalisation if you want to regularly switch ships. Every single one of my characters uses the same skill setup, and i have almost half the bars filled on the antire screen.

    Just remmber that those last 3 red bars are basically never worth the skill points, and the 3 greens ALWAYS are unless you know for a fact you will never use their associated powers (looking at you, sci skills, and driver coil)

    ^ this...

    If you skip purchasing those red bars you can have way...WAY more flexibility and points to spend...you lose a little and you gain a lot.

    There are very few things you can't get if you go with just 6...
    Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
  • drmoxdrmox Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    R.E.S.P.E.C.S. find out what it means to me!

    R.E.S.P.E.C.S. it needs to be free!

    Oh (sock it to me, sock it to me, sock it to me)

    A little Respec! (just a little bit)

    I get tired (just a little bit)

    Keep on tryin' (just a little bit)

    You're runnin' out of fools (just a little bit)

    (Re, re, re, re,) 'spec! ...

    the campaign song for this! :P
    image
  • macfellymacfelly Member Posts: 107 Arc User
    edited September 2014
    Its funny this comes up every so often. There's always a handful of people jumping in yelling, "NO you pay for your respec and like it." and how it doesn't matter anyway. So if it doesn't matter how I respec why am I forced to use 500 zen to do it?

    Respecs need to be free, or at least cheaper like a buck or so.
    Apparently not loyal enough :|
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