The result being that the wealthy dump their EC buying out every material item on the Exchange, causing prices to soar, instead of hanging onto it. At that point the Exchange collapses as trillions of EC are dumped onto the market, all the goods vanish, and everyone turns to black market trading and barter instead as EC becomes toxic to even hold. Those that continue to transact in EC resort to sneaky means of tax avoidance, by breaking their EC into chunks and storing it on alts. Your idea becomes a miserable failure and the economy collapses.
There's a reason nobody uses perishable goods as currency.
perishable goods are always being sold, as well as hoarded.
Suffering a luxury tax, would only work to prevent over all hoarding of EC's, and will cause the so desired effect so many have been screaming about, a virtual sink to help eliminate vast quantities of EC's.
Goods would not suffer any taxation on simply holding onto them, only ray EC's would suffer the tax, and that is if they are over the 10mill mark.
Although someone will explain the process, I will never truly understand how that is possible.
I will give you a few examples.
Earn FM, buy vr engy doff box. Sold for a average of 3m per last month, this month the average is more like 5-6m per.
When Risa was up favors were selling for on average 8k per. Do a 2 min hunt every hour for 400k ec's. Do 11 mins of dancing for another 400k. They would sell as soon as you listed them and you could do that every hour. The hunt you could do on 4-5 toons every hour if all were at risa and you had good floaters. During the 1st few days favors were going for 50-30k each.
Make sure you get the high value doff missions. I have 3 vr catian fd doffs I keep to crit the catian fd doff recruitment mission. 24% to get a purple doff that sells for 600k every other day. I got the doffs I use for that mission on that mission btw. I also have a 24% chance to crit strike aginst fugitive support network. On a crit you can get 5 contra band and 2 r or vr prisoners that sell for 600k+ each. That mission seems like it is on a 26 hour cd so almost every day. I always log out at nr to get the romm or reman boff assignment. I have set doffs for those missions with a 49% chance for a purple. SInf or SOp purples get ~20m each.
perishable goods are always being sold, as well as hoarded.
Suffering a luxury tax, would only work to prevent over all hoarding of EC's, and will cause the so desired effect so many have been screaming about, a virtual sink to help eliminate vast quantities of EC's.
Goods would not suffer any taxation on simply holding onto them, only ray EC's would suffer the tax, and that is if they are over the 10mill mark.
i would prefer an optional sink. desirable, but optional.
Defiant
RnD and upgrade needs less RNG. Less lottery. Something has to change.
Still say it goes back to the Rep changes...that combination of Sponsorship Tokens and removing the Commodities. That was a major, but bearable sink. With it gone, the EC build up across all the players allowed for much higher pricing on items - there was simply that much surplus EC being generated. Wealth was built. The change to vendortrash separates the poor from the wealthy, where the poor can move up in wealth through real money transactions - and - join in with the crowd trading EC amongst themselves.
Just a few, and also Russia was deemed at one time, to be a socialist nation as well.
Just so you know... China prospers because of Economic exclusion zones that are exempt from Communist policies.
And... Russia was a Communist nation (USSR)... from about 1918 (an approximation, Lenin's take over was near the end of World War I and was facilitated by the Germans to get Russia out of the war) until 1989ish. It collapsed BECAUSE of it's economic policies. Famous Regan Speech... Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall? Ring any bells?
Russia's economy is in shambles, by the way. The ONLY thing that brings Russia any sort of income is oil. Russia has no viable exports, no sustainable industry. If Russia had no oil,they would be a third world country. They, arguably, already are.
i don't want to be rude... but... are you out of you [REDACTED] mind? why would i allow players, who i don't know, to have my hard earned EC? players who might be not worthy of it at all.
Just so you know... China prospers because of Economic exclusion zones that are exempt from Communist policies.
And... Russia was a Communist nation (USSR)... from about 1918 (an approximation, Lenin's take over was near the end of World War I and was facilitated by the Germans to get Russia out of the war) until 1989ish. It collapsed BECAUSE of it's economic policies. Famous Regan Speech... Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall? Ring any bells?
Russia's economy is in shambles, by the way. The ONLY thing that brings Russia any sort of income is oil. Russia has no viable exports, no sustainable industry. If Russia had no oil,they would be a third world country. They, arguably, already are.
Still makes China a communist country either way.
And USSR does say socialist republic, even though they were run by a communist dictator.
There is still no sink of any worth, only the faucet is slightly smaller. The ec already here, stays here. The inflation continues, just at a slightly slower rate. What this screws are new players who don't already have billions saved with nowhere for them to spend it.
This affects those who run the Loot-o-Matic foundry missions to make easy money with little effort.
And in my opinion... you reap what you sow.
Create abusive foundry missions for the sole purpose of artificially generating large amounts of vendor trash, and then act surprised Cryptic has a problem with too much EC in the economy as a result of said vendor trash.
..snip..
Cannot agree more.
I would also point out that Cryptic added a new EC generation tool at the same time they nerfed the pricing. R&D materials and components are suddenly valuable, and theres a fairly large percentage of players who will not max even 1 school over the course of a year in part-time playing.
I certainly admit to killing time doing an occasional farming run. With the changes R&D sales have more than covered any perceived loss.
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
I would also point out that Cryptic added a new EC generation tool at the same time they nerfed the pricing. R&D materials and components are suddenly valuable, and theres a fairly large percentage of players who will not max even 1 school over the course of a year in part-time playing.
I certainly admit to killing time doing an occasional farming run. With the changes R&D sales have more than covered any perceived loss.
Oh please. Don't tell me you've already forgotten about the Ferengi Gold Lock Box Exchange fiasco.
I don't see anyone blaming the Foundry authors for creating the Loot-o-Matic missions.
I do see plenty of contempt for Cryptic for nerfing the vendor trash payouts for loot gathered in said Foundry missions, however.
Thing is, the vendor trash nerf didn't just affect those Foundry missions...it affected all vendor trash. If Cryptic had just limited the amount of EC one could earn from running Foundry missions, then that would have addressed the issue - no? Instead, they nerfed vendor trash for everybody while leaving those Foundry missions there...so what's going to happen? More folks are likely to end up running them because loot's been killed everywhere else.
So yeah, it's a case of pointing the finger at Cryptic for that. They should have nerfed Foundry EC...
...but in the end, still - they removed the EC sink that came with the Rep System; so the issue would have eventually happened on down the road anyway. Removing the EC sink from the Rep System is another thing where the finger can be pointed at Cryptic.
There's all sorts of fingers to be pointed at Cryptic over this matter.
Given zones as undine space battlezone, vendortrash ec farming is not any more sole territory of foundry. Thus the global nerf (if one wants to go that route at all) was the right choice.
*Tin foil hat on*
Cryptic wanted to nerf the ability of new players to purchase lock box and other gear from exchange to force them into monetization paths (dilithium / rep grinds / crafting-dilithium-grind). They know the veterans have enough to survive on and some have hundreds or billions of EC. Introducing sinks was too hard for such an "limited" team so just nerf the noobs and TRIBBLE (sorry) and make them buy stuff or keys.
*Tin foil hat off*
Thing is, the vendor trash nerf didn't just affect those Foundry missions...it affected all vendor trash. If Cryptic had just limited the amount of EC one could earn from running Foundry missions, then that would have addressed the issue - no? Instead, they nerfed vendor trash for everybody while leaving those Foundry missions there...so what's going to happen? More folks are likely to end up running them because loot's been killed everywhere else.
So yeah, it's a case of pointing the finger at Cryptic for that. They should have nerfed Foundry EC...
...but in the end, still - they removed the EC sink that came with the Rep System; so the issue would have eventually happened on down the road anyway. Removing the EC sink from the Rep System is another thing where the finger can be pointed at Cryptic.
There's all sorts of fingers to be pointed at Cryptic over this matter.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
I think if this had anything to do with a desire to nerf the shoot-fish-in-a-barrel foundry missions, then they could have done something really, really simple.
If you do not know, there is a fx in the space foundry maps that lets authors create a box in space where ships lose their shields. This affects both players and npcs inside of the box.
What the lootz missions do is put the player on the shielded part and put the enemies in the shieldless part.
They could easily stop this from happening by making that fx a map-wide effect, like other map-wide effects. Authors could still have players enter the "box" by using triggers tied to a reach marker.
It would instantly kill the utility of all those missions. And we wouldn't really lose any functionality, unless it's part of a story to shoot a defenseless ship. Even that could be faked with a very weak mob skinned as a battleship.
I think maybe I'll explain this on a napkin for Geko at Vegas.
I think if this had anything to do with a desire to nerf the shoot-fish-in-a-barrel foundry missions, then they could have done something really, really simple.
If you do not know, there is a fx in the space foundry maps that lets authors create a box in space where ships lose their shields. This affects both players and npcs inside of the box.
What the lootz missions do is put the player on the shielded part and put the enemies in the shieldless part.
They could easily stop this from happening by making that fx a map-wide effect, like other map-wide effects. Authors could still have players enter the "box" by using triggers tied to a reach marker.
It would instantly kill the utility of all those missions. And we wouldn't really lose any functionality, unless it's part of a story to shoot a defenseless ship. Even that could be faked with a very weak mob skinned as a battleship.
I think maybe I'll explain this on a napkin for Geko at Vegas.
That's something that's always annoyed me with Cryptic. They typically knee-jerk with a problem and go for the quick fix than actually dealing with thought-out fixes. But this one is killing the economy and making it very difficult for newbs to buy gear off the exchange. Or small fleets to pay for their daily consumables.
Given zones as undine space battlezone, vendortrash ec farming is not any more sole territory of foundry. Thus the global nerf (if one wants to go that route at all) was the right choice.
Or the old-school choice, DSEs... Those give you literally endless enemies to kill. Well, you have to exit and find a new one periodically, but you can literally keep at it all day long...
I think if this had anything to do with a desire to nerf the shoot-fish-in-a-barrel foundry missions, then they could have done something really, really simple.
If you do not know, there is a fx in the space foundry maps that lets authors create a box in space where ships lose their shields. This affects both players and npcs inside of the box.
What the lootz missions do is put the player on the shielded part and put the enemies in the shieldless part.
They could easily stop this from happening by making that fx a map-wide effect, like other map-wide effects. Authors could still have players enter the "box" by using triggers tied to a reach marker.
It would instantly kill the utility of all those missions. And we wouldn't really lose any functionality, unless it's part of a story to shoot a defenseless ship. Even that could be faked with a very weak mob skinned as a battleship.
I think maybe I'll explain this on a napkin for Geko at Vegas.
I haven't played foundry missions in a while but....didn't they 'fix' that a long time ago by putting a limit on the amount of loot drops,per day for foundry content?
To me it seems something else is going on here,but with Cryptic you never know what till it's too late.
The PWE/Cryptic sweatshop...not where the game is made,but where the game is played!
Take back your home,end the grind!
Volunteer moderators policing the forums is like a mall cop trying to solve a murder.
I think if this had anything to do with a desire to nerf the shoot-fish-in-a-barrel foundry missions, then they could have done something really, really simple.
If you do not know, there is a fx in the space foundry maps that lets authors create a box in space where ships lose their shields. This affects both players and npcs inside of the box.
What the lootz missions do is put the player on the shielded part and put the enemies in the shieldless part.
They could easily stop this from happening by making that fx a map-wide effect, like other map-wide effects. Authors could still have players enter the "box" by using triggers tied to a reach marker.
It would instantly kill the utility of all those missions. And we wouldn't really lose any functionality, unless it's part of a story to shoot a defenseless ship. Even that could be faked with a very weak mob skinned as a battleship.
I think maybe I'll explain this on a napkin for Geko at Vegas.
I disagree. I don't think the foundry was the prime motivator behind this. You can get loot more efficiently from the undine space battlezone than you could from any foundry mission.
The problem they are trying to address I think is the rampant inflation occurring on the exchange. There is too much currency (EC) in the EC economy. By putting curbs on the rate of EC gain, they put a brake on the rate of the inflation. What they also need to do is add some serious EC sinks to the game, and encourage people with vast amounts of EC to liquidate them somehow. That will bring down prices on the exchange.
People seem to think that this is a nerf. It isn't. The ability to easily gain EC with no practical way to destroy it (remove it from the game) is the real nerf since it actually reduces the value of each individual unit of the currency (EC). That flood of EC is what is driving the high prices on the exchange. This change is an incomplete buff to the currency, there needs to be a sink to remove what is already in circulation to complete it.
I think if this had anything to do with a desire to nerf the shoot-fish-in-a-barrel foundry missions, then they could have done something really, really simple.
If you do not know, there is a fx in the space foundry maps that lets authors create a box in space where ships lose their shields. This affects both players and npcs inside of the box.
What the lootz missions do is put the player on the shielded part and put the enemies in the shieldless part.
They could easily stop this from happening by making that fx a map-wide effect, like other map-wide effects. Authors could still have players enter the "box" by using triggers tied to a reach marker.
It would instantly kill the utility of all those missions. And we wouldn't really lose any functionality, unless it's part of a story to shoot a defenseless ship. Even that could be faked with a very weak mob skinned as a battleship.
I think maybe I'll explain this on a napkin for Geko at Vegas.
The best loot farming missions for me weren't those. They were the ones that were actually rated with stars and were essentially Kill X waves of various enemy groupings. They hit the loot cap just as easily, didn't have that stupid shield no shield thing going on and took just as much time. But because they were rated, they also gave out the Dil reward.
I have to admit, I thought the deliberate nerf for vendor trash was a tad high. Maybe reduce it a little if you want.
It is however one way people earn EC to get some of the new shinies. By severely cutting this, it only serves to increase the power gap between those who have all the good stuff, and now those, who cannot afford it.
If you've come to the forums to complain about the AFK system, it's known to be bugged at the moment.
I have to admit, I thought the deliberate nerf for vendor trash was a tad high. Maybe reduce it a little if you want.
It is however one way people earn EC to get some of the new shinies. By severely cutting this, it only serves to increase the power gap between those who have all the good stuff, and now those, who cannot afford it.
cryptic hoping you will use real money to get that good stuff but in reality are they are doing is driving people to the breaking point
Comments
perishable goods are always being sold, as well as hoarded.
Suffering a luxury tax, would only work to prevent over all hoarding of EC's, and will cause the so desired effect so many have been screaming about, a virtual sink to help eliminate vast quantities of EC's.
Goods would not suffer any taxation on simply holding onto them, only ray EC's would suffer the tax, and that is if they are over the 10mill mark.
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
I will give you a few examples.
Earn FM, buy vr engy doff box. Sold for a average of 3m per last month, this month the average is more like 5-6m per.
When Risa was up favors were selling for on average 8k per. Do a 2 min hunt every hour for 400k ec's. Do 11 mins of dancing for another 400k. They would sell as soon as you listed them and you could do that every hour. The hunt you could do on 4-5 toons every hour if all were at risa and you had good floaters. During the 1st few days favors were going for 50-30k each.
Make sure you get the high value doff missions. I have 3 vr catian fd doffs I keep to crit the catian fd doff recruitment mission. 24% to get a purple doff that sells for 600k every other day. I got the doffs I use for that mission on that mission btw. I also have a 24% chance to crit strike aginst fugitive support network. On a crit you can get 5 contra band and 2 r or vr prisoners that sell for 600k+ each. That mission seems like it is on a 26 hour cd so almost every day. I always log out at nr to get the romm or reman boff assignment. I have set doffs for those missions with a 49% chance for a purple. SInf or SOp purples get ~20m each.
Just a few examples.
It's still rare by comparison to those, though...and...you've still got the folks that "need" it for the frigate pets on their J-Dreads.
i would prefer an optional sink. desirable, but optional.
RnD and upgrade needs less RNG. Less lottery. Something has to change.
I've never had that work. Running two "Rom" toons, just never had that work.
Just so you know... China prospers because of Economic exclusion zones that are exempt from Communist policies.
And... Russia was a Communist nation (USSR)... from about 1918 (an approximation, Lenin's take over was near the end of World War I and was facilitated by the Germans to get Russia out of the war) until 1989ish. It collapsed BECAUSE of it's economic policies. Famous Regan Speech... Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall? Ring any bells?
Russia's economy is in shambles, by the way. The ONLY thing that brings Russia any sort of income is oil. Russia has no viable exports, no sustainable industry. If Russia had no oil,they would be a third world country. They, arguably, already are.
I think you've missed my point.
... and my sarcasm.
Still makes China a communist country either way.
And USSR does say socialist republic, even though they were run by a communist dictator.
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
system Lord Baal is dead
Well put.. agreed
Cannot agree more.
I would also point out that Cryptic added a new EC generation tool at the same time they nerfed the pricing. R&D materials and components are suddenly valuable, and theres a fairly large percentage of players who will not max even 1 school over the course of a year in part-time playing.
I certainly admit to killing time doing an occasional farming run. With the changes R&D sales have more than covered any perceived loss.
Joined January 2009
Oh please. Don't tell me you've already forgotten about the Ferengi Gold Lock Box Exchange fiasco.
Thing is, the vendor trash nerf didn't just affect those Foundry missions...it affected all vendor trash. If Cryptic had just limited the amount of EC one could earn from running Foundry missions, then that would have addressed the issue - no? Instead, they nerfed vendor trash for everybody while leaving those Foundry missions there...so what's going to happen? More folks are likely to end up running them because loot's been killed everywhere else.
So yeah, it's a case of pointing the finger at Cryptic for that. They should have nerfed Foundry EC...
...but in the end, still - they removed the EC sink that came with the Rep System; so the issue would have eventually happened on down the road anyway. Removing the EC sink from the Rep System is another thing where the finger can be pointed at Cryptic.
There's all sorts of fingers to be pointed at Cryptic over this matter.
Cryptic wanted to nerf the ability of new players to purchase lock box and other gear from exchange to force them into monetization paths (dilithium / rep grinds / crafting-dilithium-grind). They know the veterans have enough to survive on and some have hundreds or billions of EC. Introducing sinks was too hard for such an "limited" team so just nerf the noobs and TRIBBLE (sorry) and make them buy stuff or keys.
*Tin foil hat off*
- Judge Aaron Satie
Yeah, that thought has definitely been floating around there. I go and watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-0TEJMJOhk :each time it creeps up.
If you do not know, there is a fx in the space foundry maps that lets authors create a box in space where ships lose their shields. This affects both players and npcs inside of the box.
What the lootz missions do is put the player on the shielded part and put the enemies in the shieldless part.
They could easily stop this from happening by making that fx a map-wide effect, like other map-wide effects. Authors could still have players enter the "box" by using triggers tied to a reach marker.
It would instantly kill the utility of all those missions. And we wouldn't really lose any functionality, unless it's part of a story to shoot a defenseless ship. Even that could be faked with a very weak mob skinned as a battleship.
I think maybe I'll explain this on a napkin for Geko at Vegas.
That's something that's always annoyed me with Cryptic. They typically knee-jerk with a problem and go for the quick fix than actually dealing with thought-out fixes. But this one is killing the economy and making it very difficult for newbs to buy gear off the exchange. Or small fleets to pay for their daily consumables.
My character Tsin'xing
I haven't played foundry missions in a while but....didn't they 'fix' that a long time ago by putting a limit on the amount of loot drops,per day for foundry content?
To me it seems something else is going on here,but with Cryptic you never know what till it's too late.
Take back your home,end the grind!
Volunteer moderators policing the forums is like a mall cop trying to solve a murder.
Let us know if he calls you a whiner directly to your face.
I disagree. I don't think the foundry was the prime motivator behind this. You can get loot more efficiently from the undine space battlezone than you could from any foundry mission.
The problem they are trying to address I think is the rampant inflation occurring on the exchange. There is too much currency (EC) in the EC economy. By putting curbs on the rate of EC gain, they put a brake on the rate of the inflation. What they also need to do is add some serious EC sinks to the game, and encourage people with vast amounts of EC to liquidate them somehow. That will bring down prices on the exchange.
People seem to think that this is a nerf. It isn't. The ability to easily gain EC with no practical way to destroy it (remove it from the game) is the real nerf since it actually reduces the value of each individual unit of the currency (EC). That flood of EC is what is driving the high prices on the exchange. This change is an incomplete buff to the currency, there needs to be a sink to remove what is already in circulation to complete it.
That's my view though.
The best loot farming missions for me weren't those. They were the ones that were actually rated with stars and were essentially Kill X waves of various enemy groupings. They hit the loot cap just as easily, didn't have that stupid shield no shield thing going on and took just as much time. But because they were rated, they also gave out the Dil reward.
It is however one way people earn EC to get some of the new shinies. By severely cutting this, it only serves to increase the power gap between those who have all the good stuff, and now those, who cannot afford it.
cryptic hoping you will use real money to get that good stuff but in reality are they are doing is driving people to the breaking point
system Lord Baal is dead