Say something positive about: Deep Space Nine

mimey2 · July 2014

Same thing as the rest pretty much.

For me, this is my favorite of the 5 series. I like it because it isn't quite as 'perfect' a universe as most of the rest of the shows and movies kind of made things out to be. Which to me made it more interesting. It also dealt with some issues that hadn't really been dealt with in the past, or at least not very much (and sometimes not very well).

It also actually showed the Federation, and by extension, Starfleet, as not being the 'perfect' place we know it as. To paraphrase Michael Eddington's words, "Nobody leaves paradise."

Section 31 as well showed that despite the Federation's happy and friendship and hugs and other stuff routine, when something really dirty needed to be done, they would gladly turn a blind eye.

The Klingons and Romulans got a bit more fleshing out as well despite the somewhat limited time especially Romulans got in TNG. Klingons were continued from TNG as well, especially when Worf joined the show (though we had some before he joined), including one of the more well-beloved Klingon characters in the form of Martok.

We also learned in DS9 that apparently the only thing that mattered was 'the entire Alpha Quadrant' considering how often people loved to say it, doubly so for The Sisko.

The Dominion War also pushed all 3 major powers of the Federation, Romulans, and Klingons to nearly the breaking point.

(Fun times lie ahead, not just in this thread, but eventually I'll start making threads to have folks say something positive about the movies, even the bad ones! :eek: )

lebtron · July 2014

Its my favourite series too. Mainly because of Quark. Many people dont like the cartoonish ferengis, but they would perfectly fit onto 21st century earth.

Additional the episode "In the Pale Moonlight" is my absolute favourite. Thats how politics work.

snoggymack22 · July 2014

It was my least favorite of the series. But that's like, not a bad thing. I mean I loved pretty much all of the series, so this is only my least favorite by a notch or two.

It didn't catch on with me at first because of the preachiness of the Bajoran story way back in season 1 and 2.

Then the Gabriel Bell 2 parter hit and I was finally hooked. I loved that 2 parter. A lot.

Sisko was fun at first, but then when he shaved his head, I really became a big fan of the character.

Weird thing is, I liked him better as a Commander. And felt he became a little less unique when he got promoted to Captain.

I wasn't a fan of the Odo/Kira romance.

I was a fan of the Kira-Dukat animosity and the many wrinkles they added into that ongoing saga.

I thought what they did with the 1950s sci fi bit was amazing. And it had for me Sisko's "There are 4 lights" moment.

The House of Quark was an amazing episode.

Bashir and O'Brien's ongoing buddy scenes were always fun characterization moments.

The final season was compelling. The whole season long arc was fascinating. But overall the high points people have for the series weren't really my favorites. The battles and what not, just I don't know, didn't hit me as much as they hit others.

In the end though I think the overall theme of the Bajoran versus Cardassian dilemma is now anachronistic in a post 9/11 U.S.A. So one of the main themes of the show loses a lot of its power.

artan42 · July 2014

skollulfr wrote: »

"lets have minimal plot, religious pandering, and lots and lots of explosions":rolleyes:

*Wooooosh*!!

That was the sound of plots that lasted whole series going over your head.

*Wooooosh*!!

That was the sound of the deconstruction and subversion of religion presented in DS9 going over your head.

*BOOOOOM*!!

That was the sound of an explosion, cool eh? Or did you want a whole series of battles like TOS (with lots of shots of a shaking camera and a tiny image on a viewscreen) or like TNG (with two static ships facing each other and barely shooting).

yreodred · July 2014

At first i didn't like Sisko very much, mostly because he was so hostile towards picard (pilot episode).
Later i really began to like him, mostly because he was more down to earth than Picard.
I really liked Odo from the beginning just as Quark. Their private war was very entertaining most of the time.

O'Brien was one of my favs even at TNG, i really liked that he was developed much more.
But my favourite Character was Jadzia Dax, just wow.

Before season 3, DS9 was ok.
With the arrival of Worf, DS9 became awesome. (it leveld up from being the "B", becoming the"A" team for some time.)
Not just because Worf was a great character, but because it united both series and made Trek more interconnected.

I liked the character developement, they all became like a big family for a period of time.

Since this thread is about positive things about DS9, i'm not going to mention Kira, her annoying relationships with various boring bajoran guys, ending with Odo and her irritating drivel about the heroism of being a terrorist. :mad:
I'm also not going to mention the Defiant and all the nonsense of Starfleet building oversized spacefighters, just as the increasing deconstruction of roddenberrys positve future vision.

sander233 · July 2014

Let's see... where do I start with this?

Q and Sisko wrote:

"You hit me! Picard never hit me!"

"I'm not Picard!"

Kainon and Kira (after Kainon kills Marritza) wrote:

"He's a Cardassian. That's reason enough."

"No... It's not."

Garak wrote:

"I never tell the truth, because I don't believe there is such a thing."

Bashir and Garak wrote:

"Of all the stories you told me, which ones were true and which ones weren't?"

"My dear Doctor, they're all true."

"Even the lies?"

"Especially the lies."

Michael Eddington wrote:

"You know, in some ways you're even worse than the Borg. At least they tell you about their plans for assimilation. You're more insidious. You assimilate people and they don't even know it."

Nog and Leck wrote:

"This is the eighth run-through and you haven't even hit a single Jem'Hadar. And you shot Moogie!"

"I could see that we weren't going to rescue her, so I put her out of her misery"

Keevan (last words) wrote:

"I hate Ferengi..."

Benny Russell wrote:

"Call anybody you want, they can't do anything to me, not any more, and nor can any of you. I am a Human being, dammit! You can deny me all you want but you can't deny Ben Sisko - He exists! That future, that space station, all those people - they exist in here! In my mind! I created it! And everyone of you knew it, you read it. It's here. Do you hear what I'm telling you? You can pulp a story but you cannot destroy an idea, don't you understand, that's ancient knowledge, you cannot destroy an idea. That future - I created it, and it's real! Don't you understand? It is real. I created it. And it's real! It's REAL!"

Sisko wrote:

"But the most damning thing of all... I think I can live with it. And if I had to do it all over again, I would. Garak was right about one thing, a guilty conscience is a small price to pay for the safety of the Alpha Quadrant. So I will learn to live with it. Because I can live with it. I can live with it... Computer, erase that entire personal log."

Luther Sloan wrote:

"The Federation needs men like you, doctor. Men of conscience, men of principle... men who can sleep at night. You're also the reason Section 31 exists. Someone has to protect men like you from a universe that doesn't share your sense of right and wrong."

Dukat (multiple times) wrote:

"Nerys!"

Odo (multiple times) wrote:

"Hmph!"

stofsk · July 2014

I tuned in to watch DS9's premiere episode late one night when I was a kid. I had just gotten into TNG and TOS and heard that a new show was premiering. Saw the opening with Wolf 359. I thought 'holy ****' and was hooked.

DS9 is close to being a perfect spin off show. I like it more than I like TNG, and that's really surprising, because the TNG's cast are like a family and the DS9 cast didn't have the same chemistry. But DS9 really pushed the envelope of challenging the status quo. They didn't have a ship, so they couldn't run away from their problems like TOS and TNG did. (that said, there were a few snafus with regards to not following through on consequences, the most glaring examples would have been Sisko's actions in 'For The Uniform' and 'In The Pale Moonlight')

I like how sometimes there weren't easy fixes, neat resolutions by the 40 min mark like you could get with TOS and (especially) TNG. There was an episode in S2 about refugees from the Gamma Quadrant hoping to resettle on Bajor, and the bajorans were being real jerks to them. Well, that's life. My country throws refugees in island prisons when they're not disappearing them on the high seas.

While the show did question a lot of the assumptions that we had of the Federation after watching TOS and TNG, it did so in such a way that you could still like the Federation. They didn't go grimdark with it, or full-on dystopia like some scifi shows would do. Yes, the Federation isn't quite perfect or idyllic as we were lead to believe... but I'd still rather live there than here. I think it's to the writers' credit that they challenged the assumptions we had without subverting them or outright throwing them out. One of my favourite scenes in all the franchise occurs in a down moment between action scenes in 'Way of the Warrior', where Quark and Garak share a drink of root beer.

'It's vile!'
'I know. It's so bubbly, and cloy, and happy.'
'...Just like the Federation.'
'But you know what's really frightening? If you drink enough of it... you begin to like it.'
'It's insidious!'
'Just like the Federation.'
'...Do you think they'll be able to save us?'
'I hope so.'

I love that outsiders perspective on the Federation that we rarely get to see. Most of the time it's guys like Picard or Kirk making speeches. I mean those speeches are good, but there's something a bit self-congratulatory about them. Picard especially could get a bit preachy. But to hear guys like Quark and Garak make observations on humans and the Federation gives the idea that the Federation is a swell place to live more weight.

starswordc · July 2014

Frankly it'd be harder for me to say something negative about DS9. Best overall plotting and episode quality (although usually its attempts at comedy episodes completely fell flat). It dared to admit that, no, the Federation is not perfect.

And I love Sisko to death, because instead of hemming and hawing about high-minded morals, he shuts up and does his damn job, often calling the hemmers-and-hawers out on their hypocrisy while he's at it.

The Maquis, Part II wrote:

Do you know what the problem is? The problem is Earth! On Earth, there is no poverty, no crime, no war. You look out the window of Starfleet Headquarters and you see paradise. Well, it's easy to be a saint in paradise, but the Maquis do not live in paradise. Out there in the Demilitarized Zone, all the problems haven't been solved yet. Out there, there are no saints just people. Angry, scared, determined people who are going to do whatever it takes to survive, whether it meets with Federation approval or not!

And I like his down-to-earth nature, too. There was always something aristocratic about Picard that just ... bugged me.

rekurzion · July 2014

Garak

"Perhaps the moral of the story is to never tell the same lie twice"

The Hawk (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Man_Called_Hawk). I've always liked Avery Brooks even if he turned all Stevie Wonder on drugs crazy (reference from Star Trek Captains). I also dug that he would remote host his college lectures while on set wearing his costume.

The story telling was superb and cerebral. I mean, was he just a crazy black man in a paded cell writing stories or was he a Star Trek Commander chosen as the savior of an entire people.

It also holds a little special place knowing that if Gene were alive it would have never been created. Gene was against dramatic and explicit religious overtones in his creation and DS9 jumped over the deep end full fledge. I don't think Gene would have approved the main story arc but it proves that religion can work in Star Trek very well. And to represent a culture that could be both highly spiritual while embracing science was quite refreshing.

Lastly, the relationship between Sisko and his son was perhaps the best example of a healthy African-American father/son relationship on TV since the Cosby show. That was a big statement and one I appreciated.

Oh...and Dax.

Both of them.

I'd fire my graviton pulse into their subspace fracture anytime if you catch my meaning.

marcusdkane · July 2014

Also my favourite series, and so many favourite elements to list, so I'll go with my top five:

Sexual holosuites (that's how they were labeled on the construction floor plan)
Ezri Dax
Sky-blue tumble-not mugs
The clock Sisko built while under the alien influence
USS Defiant

Give me those five things IRL, and I'd be a happy camper :cool:

steamwright · July 2014

Garak. Just plain Garak. I see y'all have beat around the bush with his quotes, but I'm just cutting to the heart of the matter. Oh, and by extention, his debate relationship with Bashir.

yreodred wrote: »

At first i didn't like Sisko very much, mostly because he was so hostile towards picard (pilot episode).
Later i really began to like him, mostly because he was more down to earth than Picard.

From the first I liked Sisko very much, because he was hostile to Picard. This let me immediately know he had feet of clay, like the rest of us, and was more down to earth than Picard. He was uncomfortable with his religious icon status, but largely accepted it with grace. (It was the late-series revelation that he was part Prophet that I didn't like. It felt against the grain) He was a father, not from a distance, but very up close and personal. He loved to laugh and tease (possibly even more than Kirk) and enjoyed the absurd, so long as it didn't threaten those he protected. He enjoyed going where no one had gone before, just like the others, but still managed to find endless wonder in that already well known to the Federation and even to him. I refer to the Bajorans and especially to Dax. He could make the decisions that would cower other captains, and learn to live with them. The answer to the question of which captain I'd like to serve under is always Sisko.

Nog. I see Nog as greatly understated by fans. Here you have a kid who doesn't know how to fit in with other species due to both Ferengi prejudices and a weak father. Over the series, he sees a surrogate father-type in Sisko, and gravitates toward Sisko's teachings. He takes the best of Ferengi concepts and abilities, uses them to leverage a place in Starfleet, and begins a new course with his life. When faced with the shattering loss of a natural limb, he doesn't pop back to action like so many in other series, but goes through the long mental trauma that real soldiers suffer. In the end, he matures from worthless punk to valuable Starfleet officer, and through circumstance, advisor to the Grand Nagus. He's the best of both worlds.

dalolorn · July 2014

Garak and Bashir, Bashir and O'Brien, Odo and Quark... the list goes on. So many funny combinations.

And it went back to what's probably my favorite TOS episode, too!

marcusdkane · July 2014

steamwright wrote: »

Garak. Just plain Garak. I see y'all have beat around the bush with his quotes, but I'm just cutting to the heart of the matter. Oh, and by extention, his debate relationship with Bashir.

From the first I liked Sisko very much, because he was hostile to Picard. This let me immediately know he had feet of clay, like the rest of us, and was more down to earth than Picard. He was uncomfortable with his religious icon status, but largely accepted it with grace. (It was the late-series revelation that he was part Prophet that I didn't like. It felt against the grain) He was a father, not from a distance, but very up close and personal. He loved to laugh and tease (possibly even more than Kirk) and enjoyed the absurd, so long as it didn't threaten those he protected. He enjoyed going where no one had gone before, just like the others, but still managed to find endless wonder in that already well known to the Federation and even to him. I refer to the Bajorans and especially to Dax. He could make the decisions that would cower other captains, and learn to live with them. The answer to the question of which captain I'd like to serve under is always Sisko.

Nog. I see Nog as greatly understated by fans. Here you have a kid who doesn't know how to fit in with other species due to both Ferengi prejudices and a weak father. Over the series, he sees a surrogate father-type in Sisko, and gravitates toward Sisko's teachings. He takes the best of Ferengi concepts and abilities, uses them to leverage a place in Starfleet, and begins a new course with his life. When faced with the shattering loss of a natural limb, he doesn't pop back to action like so many in other series, but goes through the long mental trauma that real soldiers suffer. In the end, he matures from worthless punk to valuable Starfleet officer, and through circumstance, advisor to the Grand Nagus. He's the best of both worlds.

PLUS ONE!

I think Nog showed more growth and development, than any other character in Trek canon... As you said, he went from being an illiterate punk doing petty smash and grabs, to correcting the spelling and grammar of his tutor, to being an efficient, competent Starfleet officer. I think one of the things I enjoyed most about The Visitor, was the glimpses it showed of Nog as he went through the ranks, how he could still make fun of himself with his friends, and how when it came down to business (commanding a starship) he was 100% how a Starfleet Captain should be :cool:

worffan101 · July 2014

What ISN'T there to like?

But by far my favorite is Odo, even slightly more than Worf. :eek:

And I ship OdoxKira with the fire of a million Hobus supernovae. Because they're ridiculously cute when they're together.

starswordc · July 2014

And another thing: Gul Dukat and Weyoun, the two best damn villains the franchise has ever had.

hawku001x · July 2014

i am...... Tosk

gulberat · July 2014

Of all the Star Trek series, I consider DS9 the most true. In many ways this is also why despite its flaws I overall like the STO plotline. DS9 is where the Federation learned that talk does not always solve problems--and frankly, if you do not present a strong enough front, all your talk will mean nothing and your enemies will run roughshod over you (just look at the results of kowtowing to the Cardassians and handing Fed worlds over to them--really, why would the Cardassians take such a "power" seriously?).

I do think some modernization would be in order were DS9 remade today: for one, Sisko would have to *answer* for what he did chasing after Eddington, specifically the WMD use. And I do agree with the other poster that said the Bajoran terrorist thing would have to be addressed...the romanticizong of that would have to go away. There are a few things I could think of to address it in a (somewhat) minimally invasive manner. First, I would have run with the plotline that was actually considered by the writers, of making Kira unable to be certain if she was the real Kira Nerys or if she was indeed Iliana Ghemor. That would have had to give her pause.

And one other thing I would have done regardless: I would have allowed Silaran Prin to break Kira in "The Darkness and the Light." Was Prin sick and wrong for what he was doing? You bet. But when Kira told him she didn't even regret civilian casualties, she was as wrong. It is one thing to go after a military target--even to go after a military target, have an accident that harms a civilian, and regret the accident even if it may well have been unavoidable and the target had to be hit no matter what. It is another to decide the civilians deserve what they get basically for being born Cardassian and not even shed a tear. So I would have allowed Prin to break her, to force that admission out of her that she was indeed over the line. It would have been a damned dark episode, but it would have knocked the last of the self-righteousness right out of her quite efficiently.

The funny thing is, overall I did like Kira. But that would have to be fixed, in order to modernize the show.

stofsk · July 2014

starswordc wrote: »

And another thing: Gul Dukat and Weyoun, the two best damn villains the franchise has ever had.

Weyoun is awesome because he's so non-threatening. He laughs, he smiles, he jokes, he charms - but he can order a Jem'hadar battleship to glass a planet full of people. Or unleash a bio-engineered plague. Or something else nasty.

Dukat though I think they fumbled. The writers worked so hard to make him nuanced in the first five and a half seasons that they kinda felt like the made him too nuanced, so they dialed it up to 11 on the villain meter as a reaction. It kinda feels incongruous.

But best villain has to be Khan

ryan218 · July 2014

In the Pale Moonlight.

'Nuff said! :P

cmdrscarlet · July 2014

Maybe it's already been said: LOTS of space battles!!

And Gul Dukat ... loved to hate that guy. Well acted IMO.

EDIT: And Ezri ... good gracious.

markhawkman · July 2014

I love Vorta.

artan42 · July 2014

I think the DS9 terrorism issues had a different spin over the pond that would be comparable to the situation now. The series aired when the Troubles in Ireland were still a present and real threat.

grandnaguszek1 · July 2014

The best things about the series for me were:

1. Jem'Hadar (Ikat'ika was my favorite)

2. Quark because I just love the Ferengi episodes that allowed us to see more Ferengi culture.

3. MORN!!!!

4. Garak

5. Worf

6. Last but not least........Dax!

voporak · July 2014

ryan218 wrote: »

In the Pale Moonlight.

'Nuff said! :P

I was literally going to say the exact same thing!

Garak
Sisko
Garak
The Defiant
Garak
The Dominion
Garak
Did I mention Sisko?
Garak
Straying away from Gene Roddenberry's "Everything is happy!" future
Andrew Robinson
Morn
Garak
Quark
Garak
The rest of everybody
Garak

And Dukat.

takeshi6 · July 2014

Sisko. The Ultimate Badass.

He has proved it many times, but when did he first prove it?

When He Punched Q In The Face!!!!

pwlaughingtrendy · July 2014

One of my favorite lines by my favorite Ferengi:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5J_qn93Nkc

It brought up a lot of issues that are darker and sometimes unfeatured in the present day Star Trek.

bones1970 · July 2014

steamwright wrote: »

Garak. Just plain Garak. I see y'all have beat around the bush with his quotes, but I'm just cutting to the heart of the matter. Oh, and by extention, his debate relationship with Bashir.

And section 31.
DS9 best star trek serie.

gooddaytodie39 · July 2014

I loved Kira Nerys. The episode Progress brought tears to my eyes. Quark made me laugh. Worf and his love for Jadzia made me want to be brave and a better man.

Say something positive about: Deep Space Nine

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