I happen to like EPtS because you do get knocked out of Cloak, you never regen Shields other than hitting abilities (and EPtS is as close to spam as you can get), plus it's only the Ensign Eng slot (which would probably be ET for me otherwise)... AND, I'm cheap :P. My Engineer is a Romulan Embassy BOFF with Superior Subterfuge, and he gets stuck on all sorts of ships... not just my B'rel. So I need the EPtS for other builds. EPtS & Aux to SIF is just generally useful.
Speaking of EPTS, quick question. Does EPTS heal shields while cloaked or, at least, keep the resistance buff going so when you are decloaked, the shields already have bonus resistances?
F'ing darn loadout issues. I got 2nd place in Crystalline Catastrophe (Elite), but the loadouts slotted my Transphasic Mines Aft instead of a second Breen Cluster.
I could probably manage more DPS if I ran APO3 instead of 2 Grav Wells, but 2nd place is pretty good for a transphasic/GW control bird.
I'd be messing around with my new Fleet Hoh'sus if it weren't for the loadout issues destroying all my build experiments.
F'ing darn loadout issues. I got 2nd place in Crystalline Catastrophe (Elite), but the loadouts slotted my Transphasic Mines Aft instead of a second Breen Cluster.
I could probably manage more DPS if I ran APO3 instead of 2 Grav Wells, but 2nd place is pretty good for a transphasic/GW control bird.
I'd be messing around with my new Fleet Hoh'sus if it weren't for the loadout issues destroying all my build experiments.
Are you talking about BOP ability trays constantly clearing out? If so, that was happening to me all the time with my B'Rel retrofit last night. Even the DOFFs were resetting to whatever it was before I made changes to the Active ones. Every time I loaded into space. I sent a bug report but it was frustrating and it ended my play on a BOP.
You will place better with dual Grav wells than you will with APO3. I know because I ran APO3 for a long time, with a b'rel decked out with the best gear dilithium and fleet marks can buy.
The rankings heavily weigh sci skills into account. Every time you use Grav well you receive a "bonus" towards your final ranking.
You will place better with dual Grav wells than you will with APO3. I know because I ran APO3 for a long time, with a b'rel decked out with the best gear dilithium and fleet marks can buy.
The rankings heavily weigh sci skills into account. Every time you use Grav well you receive a "bonus" towards your final ranking.
Yeah, for CE/CEE, Science-centric players have an equal chance at coming out on top despite the appearance of well played Scimitars and such. Many times I've placed #1 with high Science and absolutely minimal TAC ability ships such as Intrepids and Veranus.
And Grav Well just makes it easy for AOE weapons. Tricobalts, Dyson / Omega / Rom-Hyper / etc. torps on HYT or TS, CSV. It lines everything up so well there and keeps the shards from getting too out of hand.
Speaking of EPTS, quick question. Does EPTS heal shields while cloaked or, at least, keep the resistance buff going so when you are decloaked, the shields already have bonus resistances?
Thanks.
No, using any shield heal while cloaked will not heal your shields.
Because they are in a permanent offline state while you are cloaked, you MUST decloak to heal shields.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
Well, the one time I did CCE with my Fleet Hoh'sus (before it came down with a bad case of Loadout FUBAR), I ran Commander Tac & Lt.Com Sci (only the one Grav Well), and I took 3rd place in that. I guess the Hoh'sus is sort of like my Romulan's Ar'kif, though, so it wasn't that foreign to fly it.
Anyway, my B'rel's Loadout problems are fixed now, I think, due to being able to reclaim C-store ships (which I can't do with my Fleet Hoh'sus).
I'm going to stick to my Transphasic build until I know the Loadouts are all fixed. Transphasics are just so reliable right now. They'd have to buff Photons a ton more for me to specialize in them, even if I still run Gravimetrics for spreads & HY bombs.
I'm liking the Jump Console from the Ch'tang, mostly, but figuring out what direction I'm supposed to be looking at is going to take a bit.
When my fleet finally gets a tier 5 shipyard, season 9 has totally gimped progress because everyone is converting dilithium right now, I was thinking of giving the jump console a try in that extra engineering console slot. I'm not sure it's gonna be worth it on a mine centric transphasic build, though, due to the long cooldowns of mines and the cluster-mine torps.
Anyone using it on a mine heavy build? Is it good?
When my fleet finally gets a tier 5 shipyard, season 9 has totally gimped progress because everyone is converting dilithium right now, I was thinking of giving the jump console a try in that extra engineering console slot. I'm not sure it's gonna be worth it on a mine centric transphasic build, though, due to the long cooldowns of mines and the cluster-mine torps.
Anyone using it on a mine heavy build? Is it good?
Jump Console for a BOP isn't ideal, IMO, because they can turn and move so well. Getting onto the tail of a ship isn't a big deal, esp. in PVE.
I've done a Mine build before on a BOP. Experimented with Tricobalts, Quantums, Transphasic, Nukara Mines. Relying on Mines alone isn't enough, due to the very long cooldowns. However, if you're devoting alot of TAC BOFF space, it works out very well in conjunction with Torpedoes.
Transphasic Torp & Mine Combo works very well, esp. if sporting the Breen Set 2 piece bonus. Remember, specific damage projectile type is ideal as it boosts both the Torp & Mines for that kind. So, for instance, Photon Consoles will boost both the Torp & Mine of that kind. Breen 2 piece bonus reinforces Transphasic Projectile damage, so both Torps and Mines (Breen Cluster is considered a Mine) will benefit. Transphasic weapons have low damage values, but if you have more of it coming, it can help... using Torps, Mines, Breen Cluster, all that can bleed through shields.
It may be useful to try out defense & resist reduction abilities in conjunction with whatever you do. Stuff like Omega Space Set's 3 piece bonus will help in reducing Kinetic Resists, and landing APB / APO will help also (APB would be more ideal for PVE due to availability, but APO will make it hit alot harder). SCI Captain's Sensor Scan will help, as well as TAC APA.
Lastly, if using Mines and a High Aux Build, Nukara Web Mines with DPB3 is wonderful with a B'Rel.
ok I'm being seen by NPCs while cloaked. is there something i should be speccing into other than starship stealth? 6 ranks there? stealth console?
It is probably not you at all. NPCs 'cheat' a bit in that they can see you under cloak irregardless of your stealth level. They will not fire at you usually, but they can always see you as long as you hold aggro.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
It's been a long time since I flew a Torp/Mine Boat B'Rel. With S9, there's some interesting things esp. since I tried stuffing in my KDF ENG in the B'Rel Retrofit. Yes, an Engineer. Why? High Subsystem Power.
Please note, this was a very hastily put together build for tonight and playing with the Flanking Bonus.
Centerpiece Weapon: Using TAC BUFFs (I favor APO), Dispersal Pattern Beta 3 Nukara Web Mines. For effectiveness, you need to have high Aux Power.
B'Rel Retrofit: Nukara Web Bomber with a KDF Engineer
Space Traits:
Auxiliary Power Configuration - Offense:
Auxiliary Power Configuration - Defense:
Tactical Advantage
Omega Kinetic Shearing
Critical DOFF: Technician for extra Aux Power while Cloaked.
Power Distribution: Typically fly cloaked with Max Aux Power. Next priority in Power will be Engines, then Shields, then Weapons.
Notes: Firstly, the main purpose of the build is Nukara Web Mine Bombing. The B'Rel & T'Varo are perfect mounts for this. The build also has moderate energy weapons if I ever should decide to go "Pew Pew" with cannons, but again, priority are the Nukara Mines. I could go with more emphasis on projectiles, which changes things considerably on first glance.
Regarding the JHAS Set use, I opted for it due to several reasons:
- Brings a very hefty, Energy Weapons Power bonus since it's my lowest assigned subsystem power priority. Cloaked, Weapons Power sits at 73. Not high, but definitely enough to be useful but not great. If I need that, I can shift power to it, pop a Weapons battery, or use the Warp Core's "Weapons Capacitor" ability. I could replace the shield with an Elite Fleet Resilient Shields-ResB, but the character did not have one on hand.
General Tactic: First, figure out where you need to be to attack and gain "Flanking" bonus. While cloaked, fly past target and drop an Aceton Assimilator nearby. This gets the NPCs' attention. Next pass is the Attack Run... fly in fast, pop APO / TAC BUFFs, DPB3, TS1, then Grav Well 1. When close to the target, fire Nukara Web Mines in close range, turn around (do not fly past), continue speeding away, then fire TS1 with the Tricobalt Torp.
Probably going to change it some more. Maybe more single target emphasis. But it's late and I'm tired at the moment.
While most of what you are posting here is quite correct and would be effective, your build really does not leverage the Brel biggest advantage, Enhanced Battlecloak very well. Your would be just as well to use a Norgh, Hos'sus, or any other Battlecloak equipped ship. The whole point of EBC is to never de cloak, firing all weapons from cloak to maintain the 15% bonus damage. This can ONLY be done with torpedoes, mines or projectiles. You cannot fire energy weapons from cloak. Thus the purpose of this thread... How to get the most from the Brel.
Player and forumite formerly known as FEELTHETHUNDER
ok I'm being seen by NPCs while cloaked. is there something i should be speccing into other than starship stealth? 6 ranks there? stealth console?
Your auxilliary level can also have an affect on being detected. The previous poster mentions the truth about aggro. Once an NPC is aggrod, it doesn't really "forget". Aggro is a numerical score. The higher that score from taking damage the more likely you get the NPCs undivided attention.
The stealth/cloak factor is the second part of it. Cloak gives a number. That stealth number is applied against the NPCs detection score. If the stealth score is more than the detection score the NPC does not detect you and you can't be targeted. Running high auxilliary power acts as a bonus to your stealth score. Conversely, the detecting enemy gets a boost to its detection score from running high auxiliary, as I understand it. There were a number of threads on stealth mechanics which I am paraphrasing. If I have it incorrect please feel free to correct me.
Player and forumite formerly known as FEELTHETHUNDER
While most of what you are posting here is quite correct and would be effective, your build really does not leverage the Brel biggest advantage, Enhanced Battlecloak very well. Your would be just as well to use a Norgh, Hos'sus, or any other Battlecloak equipped ship. The whole point of EBC is to never de cloak, firing all weapons from cloak to maintain the 15% bonus damage. This can ONLY be done with torpedoes, mines or projectiles. You cannot fire energy weapons from cloak. Thus the purpose of this thread... How to get the most from the Brel.
The CRF is there as an option for whenever I decide to go Pew-Pew with cannons, as a proper, canon BOP should. The Torp and Mine skills still use the EBC. That's what I do, but at times in an instance, I want to go guns blazing.
Also, you will get a stronger decloak damage buff if I drop my ordnance the traditional way. By default on my BOP's setup, the decloak dmg bonus is 45%. Now, AFAIK, you don't get this same bonus firing while staying in cloaks. There are no icons, no buffs mentioning anywhere I get the same 45% dmg bonus.
Even IF you wanted to play traditional energy weapons and such with a B'Rel, you still can still cloak, and more importantly, heal yourself while cloaked and get back in the action ASAP. This is PVP usefulness and a luxury of EBC you don't get outside the B'Rel and T'Varo.
Also, I want to fly the iconic B'Rel. Not the Norgh. Not the Hegh'ta. And definitely not the atrocious looking Hoh'Sus. I want to fly THE Klingon Bird of Prey.
The CRF is there as an option for whenever I decide to go Pew-Pew with cannons, as a proper, canon BOP should. The Torp and Mine skills still use the EBC. That's what I do, but at times in an instance, I want to go guns blazing.
Also, you will get a stronger decloak damage buff if I drop my ordnance the traditional way. By default on my BOP's setup, the decloak dmg bonus is 45%. Now, AFAIK, you don't get this same bonus firing while staying in cloaks. There are no icons, no buffs mentioning anywhere I get the same 45% dmg bonus.
Even IF you wanted to play traditional energy weapons and such with a B'Rel, you still can still cloak, and more importantly, heal yourself while cloaked and get back in the action ASAP. This is PVP usefulness and a luxury of EBC you don't get outside the B'Rel and T'Varo.
Also, I want to fly the iconic B'Rel. Not the Norgh. Not the Hegh'ta. And definitely not the atrocious looking Hoh'Sus. I want to fly THE Klingon Bird of Prey.
Ya I can certainly understand your reasons and that is fine, it's your choice. I use a Fleet Norgh for my energy weapons torp alpha strike when I want to pew. I use the Fleet Brel on a different character that is spec'd for torps only. Doesn't have any points in energy weapons at all. The two are completely different play styles. The point still remains...the EBC is best leveraged for projectiles. Energy weapons load outs simply do not need EBC and do fine with BC. My point is to let others like the OP understand those two important facts so they know the importance of what EBC does for Brel torp boats, which is what this thread is about and what the OP asked.
Player and forumite formerly known as FEELTHETHUNDER
Comments
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
Thanks.
Unfortunately you are quite correct.
I could probably manage more DPS if I ran APO3 instead of 2 Grav Wells, but 2nd place is pretty good for a transphasic/GW control bird.
I'd be messing around with my new Fleet Hoh'sus if it weren't for the loadout issues destroying all my build experiments.
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
Are you talking about BOP ability trays constantly clearing out? If so, that was happening to me all the time with my B'Rel retrofit last night. Even the DOFFs were resetting to whatever it was before I made changes to the Active ones. Every time I loaded into space. I sent a bug report but it was frustrating and it ended my play on a BOP.
The rankings heavily weigh sci skills into account. Every time you use Grav well you receive a "bonus" towards your final ranking.
Yeah, for CE/CEE, Science-centric players have an equal chance at coming out on top despite the appearance of well played Scimitars and such. Many times I've placed #1 with high Science and absolutely minimal TAC ability ships such as Intrepids and Veranus.
And Grav Well just makes it easy for AOE weapons. Tricobalts, Dyson / Omega / Rom-Hyper / etc. torps on HYT or TS, CSV. It lines everything up so well there and keeps the shards from getting too out of hand.
No, using any shield heal while cloaked will not heal your shields.
Because they are in a permanent offline state while you are cloaked, you MUST decloak to heal shields.
Anyway, my B'rel's Loadout problems are fixed now, I think, due to being able to reclaim C-store ships (which I can't do with my Fleet Hoh'sus).
I'm going to stick to my Transphasic build until I know the Loadouts are all fixed. Transphasics are just so reliable right now. They'd have to buff Photons a ton more for me to specialize in them, even if I still run Gravimetrics for spreads & HY bombs.
I'm liking the Jump Console from the Ch'tang, mostly, but figuring out what direction I'm supposed to be looking at is going to take a bit.
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
Anyone using it on a mine heavy build? Is it good?
Jump Console for a BOP isn't ideal, IMO, because they can turn and move so well. Getting onto the tail of a ship isn't a big deal, esp. in PVE.
I've done a Mine build before on a BOP. Experimented with Tricobalts, Quantums, Transphasic, Nukara Mines. Relying on Mines alone isn't enough, due to the very long cooldowns. However, if you're devoting alot of TAC BOFF space, it works out very well in conjunction with Torpedoes.
Transphasic Torp & Mine Combo works very well, esp. if sporting the Breen Set 2 piece bonus. Remember, specific damage projectile type is ideal as it boosts both the Torp & Mines for that kind. So, for instance, Photon Consoles will boost both the Torp & Mine of that kind. Breen 2 piece bonus reinforces Transphasic Projectile damage, so both Torps and Mines (Breen Cluster is considered a Mine) will benefit. Transphasic weapons have low damage values, but if you have more of it coming, it can help... using Torps, Mines, Breen Cluster, all that can bleed through shields.
It may be useful to try out defense & resist reduction abilities in conjunction with whatever you do. Stuff like Omega Space Set's 3 piece bonus will help in reducing Kinetic Resists, and landing APB / APO will help also (APB would be more ideal for PVE due to availability, but APO will make it hit alot harder). SCI Captain's Sensor Scan will help, as well as TAC APA.
Lastly, if using Mines and a High Aux Build, Nukara Web Mines with DPB3 is wonderful with a B'Rel.
It is probably not you at all. NPCs 'cheat' a bit in that they can see you under cloak irregardless of your stealth level. They will not fire at you usually, but they can always see you as long as you hold aggro.
While most of what you are posting here is quite correct and would be effective, your build really does not leverage the Brel biggest advantage, Enhanced Battlecloak very well. Your would be just as well to use a Norgh, Hos'sus, or any other Battlecloak equipped ship. The whole point of EBC is to never de cloak, firing all weapons from cloak to maintain the 15% bonus damage. This can ONLY be done with torpedoes, mines or projectiles. You cannot fire energy weapons from cloak. Thus the purpose of this thread... How to get the most from the Brel.
Player and forumite formerly known as FEELTHETHUNDER
Expatriot Might Characters in EXILE
Your auxilliary level can also have an affect on being detected. The previous poster mentions the truth about aggro. Once an NPC is aggrod, it doesn't really "forget". Aggro is a numerical score. The higher that score from taking damage the more likely you get the NPCs undivided attention.
The stealth/cloak factor is the second part of it. Cloak gives a number. That stealth number is applied against the NPCs detection score. If the stealth score is more than the detection score the NPC does not detect you and you can't be targeted. Running high auxilliary power acts as a bonus to your stealth score. Conversely, the detecting enemy gets a boost to its detection score from running high auxiliary, as I understand it. There were a number of threads on stealth mechanics which I am paraphrasing. If I have it incorrect please feel free to correct me.
Player and forumite formerly known as FEELTHETHUNDER
Expatriot Might Characters in EXILE
The CRF is there as an option for whenever I decide to go Pew-Pew with cannons, as a proper, canon BOP should. The Torp and Mine skills still use the EBC. That's what I do, but at times in an instance, I want to go guns blazing.
Also, you will get a stronger decloak damage buff if I drop my ordnance the traditional way. By default on my BOP's setup, the decloak dmg bonus is 45%. Now, AFAIK, you don't get this same bonus firing while staying in cloaks. There are no icons, no buffs mentioning anywhere I get the same 45% dmg bonus.
Even IF you wanted to play traditional energy weapons and such with a B'Rel, you still can still cloak, and more importantly, heal yourself while cloaked and get back in the action ASAP. This is PVP usefulness and a luxury of EBC you don't get outside the B'Rel and T'Varo.
Also, I want to fly the iconic B'Rel. Not the Norgh. Not the Hegh'ta. And definitely not the atrocious looking Hoh'Sus. I want to fly THE Klingon Bird of Prey.
Ya I can certainly understand your reasons and that is fine, it's your choice. I use a Fleet Norgh for my energy weapons torp alpha strike when I want to pew. I use the Fleet Brel on a different character that is spec'd for torps only. Doesn't have any points in energy weapons at all. The two are completely different play styles. The point still remains...the EBC is best leveraged for projectiles. Energy weapons load outs simply do not need EBC and do fine with BC. My point is to let others like the OP understand those two important facts so they know the importance of what EBC does for Brel torp boats, which is what this thread is about and what the OP asked.
Player and forumite formerly known as FEELTHETHUNDER
Expatriot Might Characters in EXILE