Apparently, PUG's don't like to finish matches

magniacapra · April 2014

I think on average 25% of my matches finish with 5 on both sides.

What is this ****?

snoge00f · April 2014

It's the premades fault!

orondis · April 2014

Haven't had one match like that yet.

lucho80 · April 2014

Yup, in about 25% of matches my teammates leave. The worst part? In one of those matches, one of my teammates was part of my fleet. We didn't go in together(pure accident), didn't even know who it was, but man it sucks being left hanging like that.

realmini · April 2014

lucho80 wrote: »

Yup, in about 25% of matches my teammates leave. The worst part? In one of those matches, one of my teammates was part of my fleet. We didn't go in together(pure accident), didn't even know who it was, but man it sucks being left hanging like that.

i had a few matches where the enemy left, rare when my own team leaves. (altho it happens)
sometimes people get bugged/ miss pop/ etc. one thing i notice, i havent seen anyone join AFTEr a guy quit. that used to happen all the time. but thats just becus pvp is happening more, so the next guy in line has somewhere to go. Many many times i have called in opvp when the feds team was down a man or two, some guys would join any game and voila in right away.
meh. my unsolicited 2 cents

but yeah my team rarely leaves, and the days of facing a premade to make them leave are over

scurry5 · April 2014

I don't know.....in every match I've played so far, there has been at least one leaver. Timezone, maybe?

lordcutterslade · April 2014

Leaver Penalty needed - nuff said
So many players are just leaving pvp matches and get away with it.

wolverine595959 · April 2014

I think the some PuGs thought the new queues were going to be a magic bullet to their suckage and when they realize its not they leave.

discloned · April 2014

I am not so sure the problem is with PUG's. I have also seen premade teams leave when they are cut to shreds. It just happens not that often because premade teams tend to win more, of course, but it does happen there as well.

I think its a societal issue. I have seen this in many games and think this is related to some deeper issue. We are just witnessing symptoms here.

As i started to play games, way back in the 80s we usually had arcade conversions. Thats from coin operated machines. So what was the deal? Three lives and maybe an extra life after 100.000 points or something (obviously you wouldn't throw money into your home system).

So my generation was used to... well... loose if you screwed up. Game over, man.

The following generation... not so much. They grew up on games where you still would die but could restore from a saved state you could pick in most cases without any restrictions at all. And cheats... god mode, etc.

Not that our games back then had no cheats, it was just utterly pointless of playing the game with indestructibility turned on, because quite frankly, a lot of games did not end and just kept going faster and throwing more enemies at you, there you go.

I ran into a video documentation about a few guys trying to play through gauntlet with cheats (retro style) and watched not without glee when they'd notice. But i digress...

So the concept of death became over time more and more meaningless and games got easier and easier. The epitome of this is probably Diablo 3 which asks you in all seriousness if you want to restart at the point you just died (with some degradation to armor, but still...). To be fair it has a hardcore mode where you character gets DELETED when you TRIBBLE up, which saved the game for me.

Now you have people who all this time played happily in this soft cushioned environment and all is good and well until... they hit multiplayer. And there, like in any other game that is a game by definition, which means you can also TRIBBLE up, they TRIBBLE up. Big time. And they are not used to it. They lack the emotional experience to deal with the lack of success.

And there is the problem. Not being able to cope with loosing a game.

I think this will change in the future, because it has gotten so bad that, hands down, its ridiculous. I also hope for a more Counter-Strike like PvP environment in STO, where people go in a match and and whoever dies is OUT for the round (no deleting chars in a MMORPG, of course). And to anybody who argues this may be unpopular i say: is Counterstrike an unpopular game? If your answer is no, why do you think it is not? Maybe because of GAME MECHANICS?

And not necessarily ADVANCED game mechanics but game mechanics that are PRESENT. These days you got to be grateful for everything ^^

wast33 · April 2014

wolverine595959 wrote: »

I think the some PuGs thought the new queues were going to be a magic bullet to their suckage and when they realize its not they leave.

lol... makes one think they may forgot about the core of pvp: pvp'ers... they're AVRYWHEAAA

...
btw: i suck

... buff waste, nerf everything else!

seriously: i assume >read sig< could have a good positive effect on the q's without too much afford. but yeah... gonna be done in the pvp-season

dova25 · April 2014

Well it may be the disconnect problem that I think some people have it (there are at least 2 posts in forum about that)
I have it from 8.5 and there were cases when I was disconnected twice or more during a match / stf.

If I am fast enough in logging back I can rejoin automatically but if something stops me a couple of seconds (like the popup for checking the files for example) it is possible that I can't rejoin the match.More the system sees my char as in match because I can't join any new queue no matter what kind of .(I have to log out and log in to be able to join a match)

rakija879 · April 2014

It's the philosophy that if you are in the losing team leave the game possible all to irritate the other team so that they cant finish the game :P. Now really if that team is a premade that's finishing matches 15 -0 thats the only option for the pug team to hurt them, where it counts!:::D
So if you play in a premade team and you are a pug mass murderer you deserve that :cool:

discloned · April 2014

Oh and btw, it creates memorable victories, too. When its down to two players, the entire rest of the teams watching it its sooo much more rewarding to win.

For example, some 10 years back when Mechwarrior 4 was still being played it was down to my 70 ton heavy Archer (a missile boat) vs a 90 ton Mauler (assault class). He managed to engage me short distance by lurking around a corner.

Not an optimal situation for a missile boat built for engaging mechs from a far distance, facing a heavier mech wielding a pair of LB-X autocannons. Basically i was already dead. There was no way out of this.

So i turned on him, in anticipation of the barrage that would surely tear me to shreds.

It took awfully long... missile systems started to lock on. And then i realized i had him. He was going to skew my missile lock by firing just before lock-on, or... at least that was the plan...

I didn't wait for the lock-on and just launched missiles point blank. At this distance it was impossible for the missiles not to hit him.

There was one other thing my opponent hadn't expected. An Archer is a heavy mech, but still its weapons capacity is somewhat limited, usually relying on bundles of long range missiles.

But...

...as i had decided to omit sidearms completely, removing all additional laser weapons from the arm i also had seen no need for taking armor on those sections, which in turn allowed me to exchange the usual twin LRM20 racks with dual advanced tactical missile racks (area effect missiles).

A second later the mauler was no more. THAT was memorable. You should have heard the screams of the opposing team. Or to quote an old movie: "Conan, what is best in life?"

wast33 · April 2014

discloned wrote: »

Oh and btw, it creates memorable victories, too. When its down to two players, the entire rest of the teams watching it its sooo much more rewarding to win.

^indeed! some time ago i had a run on my rom with slinat where all of our team left due to we were facing a very cheesy, at least, pugmade (may pre, whatever)...

we were both on roms (me torps, he vape), so we had the chance to choose when to fight and when to run. hard and long match which we won in the end. has been one of those epic ones

. nothing beats rom cheese i guess

...

discloned · April 2014

Well, two days ago there was this one guy in Kerrat. And we decided bot tho go to ramming speed at the same time. We died both, of course ^^

darramouss1 · April 2014

I've left quite a few PvP matches over the past few days. Almost all of them were due to the game crashing and shutting itself down. The remaining once or twice was due to the game locking itself and my computer up.

I really think that a) it's too early to see whether leavers are a pattern, and b) the game's stability needs to be fixed before you can even consider counting stats.

darramouss1 · April 2014

edalgo wrote: »

Bad connection and disconnects are 1 thing but visually watching someone run away and hit the Warp button is another all together

True, but also consider that the game may force people to. I had to warp out of a PvE as the graphics started to wig out on me, with things turning in to insanely bright white squares. It provided me with the triple threat joy of being blinded, getting a headache and making the mission unplayable.

Sure, some people are just quitting, but I still believe that some people are having issues with the game. If that's the case is it more fair for them to leave (leaving the remaining people short) or staying and being useless (leaving your team theoretically short but providing an easy kill for the opponents)?

My point is that until the kinks are ironed out it's not really the right time to start charting trends.

lexxie1983 · April 2014

edalgo wrote: »

Bad connection and disconnects are 1 thing but visually watching someone run away and hit the Warp button is another all together

i Agree had it a couple of times warp leavers middle in a pvp. that just sucks whit some PVP games. or in a dyson undine space battlezone for that matter! but it is not the time to talk about trends yet.

Because I also latley had issues lost connection. last time it was so bad was playing an elite PVP (lost the name) was a voth one with a big TRIBBLE mother ship. but hell connection timed out or lost every 10 seconds of a minute. thats not fun all together. is saw in chat in a split second before connection lost for the TRIBBLE time someone saying he is lost or left. thats ruins someones rep with other players. besides that it ruins your fun TRIBBLE well

they need to fix that.

NOTE: sinds season nine no problems but it can pop up at any given time in a pvp!

crypticarmsman · April 2014

snoge00f wrote: »

It's the premades fault!

Yeah, all two of them

lucho80 · April 2014

discloned wrote: »

Oh and btw, it creates memorable victories, too. When its down to two players, the entire rest of the teams watching it its sooo much more rewarding to win.

I could pull that kind of trick in the SF Hospital map of America's Army. Snipe all the people on the far side of the map, and troll people coming into my spot by dropping off and killing them from behind or killing them in the stairwell (I could hear them coming up every single time). Not in this game though.

ghyudt · April 2014

discloned wrote: »

I am not so sure the problem is with PUG's. I have also seen premade teams leave when they are cut to shreds. It just happens not that often because premade teams tend to win more, of course, but it does happen there as well.

I think its a societal issue. I have seen this in many games and think this is related to some deeper issue. We are just witnessing symptoms here.

As i started to play games, way back in the 80s we usually had arcade conversions. Thats from coin operated machines. So what was the deal? Three lives and maybe an extra life after 100.000 points or something (obviously you wouldn't throw money into your home system).

So my generation was used to... well... loose if you screwed up. Game over, man.

The following generation... not so much. They grew up on games where you still would die but could restore from a saved state you could pick in most cases without any restrictions at all. And cheats... god mode, etc.

Not that our games back then had no cheats, it was just utterly pointless of playing the game with indestructibility turned on, because quite frankly, a lot of games did not end and just kept going faster and throwing more enemies at you, there you go.

I ran into a video documentation about a few guys trying to play through gauntlet with cheats (retro style) and watched not without glee when they'd notice. But i digress...

So the concept of death became over time more and more meaningless and games got easier and easier. The epitome of this is probably Diablo 3 which asks you in all seriousness if you want to restart at the point you just died (with some degradation to armor, but still...). To be fair it has a hardcore mode where you character gets DELETED when you TRIBBLE up, which saved the game for me.

Now you have people who all this time played happily in this soft cushioned environment and all is good and well until... they hit multiplayer. And there, like in any other game that is a game by definition, which means you can also TRIBBLE up, they TRIBBLE up. Big time. And they are not used to it. They lack the emotional experience to deal with the lack of success.

And there is the problem. Not being able to cope with loosing a game.

I think this will change in the future, because it has gotten so bad that, hands down, its ridiculous. I also hope for a more Counter-Strike like PvP environment in STO, where people go in a match and and whoever dies is OUT for the round (no deleting chars in a MMORPG, of course). And to anybody who argues this may be unpopular i say: is Counterstrike an unpopular game? If your answer is no, why do you think it is not? Maybe because of GAME MECHANICS?

And not necessarily ADVANCED game mechanics but game mechanics that are PRESENT. These days you got to be grateful for everything ^^

Way to overanalyze siggy. The problem isn't being unable to take a loss, nor is it with premades or pugs. The problem is the system that's currently in place to determine who fights who. Pugs are usually just casual players who want to get a little more challenge out of the game and test themselves by going against other players. Premades are made up of players who play together all the time and are set up to work together. Pug vs pug and premade vs premade would be fine. Both are fair and both have a possibility of either team winning. Premade vs pug, forget fair. The match is over before it starts. And you can always tell which one you're up against from the first attack. What's the point in staying if its already a foregone conclusion that you will lose, and without being able to put up much of a fight? You wanna know how to fix this problem? Pugs and premades need to stop being put against each other.

uraziel0815 · April 2014

Penality for pug leaving isnt an option, as long as queue gets you in a random Teamsetting.
When i hit with my Sci a Team of 4 other Sci/Engis i tend to warp even before i see the first enemy.
Why? Usually my team cant make Kills and these matches tend to take hours and still are 0-0.
Thats not fun.

rakija879 · April 2014

edalgo wrote: »

Sometimes premades aren't premades at all. Just friends from the same fleet, fleetmade. Sometimes its just randoms people pick up from OPvP.

Top premades are very hard to beat even with your own sometimes.

Other times you're pugging it, have a few good players on your team, and the 5 man group staring you down is just a fleetmade. Those cases its possible to still win. But when people warp early there goes that possibility right out the window.

The only time its good is when the pug is dead weight anyway.

I was in a match a while ago where 2 pugs on my team warped bc the other team had 3 Vapers and a good healer. So it was me in my Avenger and 2 Engie Healers left. WellI cou ldn't stop them from Vaping me even with 2 healers bc its just too fast... So I cloak and proceed to decloak on the Romulans with my Alpha when they'd try to Vape the healers. We end up winning the match 15-8 3 vs 4.

That was memorable!!

But extremely rare

So you are saying this or that premade TRIBBLE is not the same they just smell alike :P
And being so the premade being set up with a total random pugs in public pvp queue can produce a great pvp match

What are the chances for that match not to be 15 - 0 again?

brandonfl · April 2014

You know what? I used to be totally against warping. I always felt you should see it through, get your participation credit and maybe some dil. However, this game's PvP has become so bad, full of bugs and exploits that I've had to reconsider my position on this. My gametime is very limited these days and if I see something like a FAW or TIF premade, I'll just warp. I play to have fun and if I'm not having fun, I'm not going to waste the little time I have available to enjoy playing games. Frankly, at this point it's hard to blame players. Cryptic has just completely dropped the ball on PvP and emphasized it with introducing broken queues that were reported as broken on Tribble.

Apparently, PUG's don't like to finish matches

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