Purple weapons are often worth selling though. They don't drop from the nvak/kerat systems as often. They do drop from STFs pretty regular though. They will sell from anywhere from 200k-20mil though depending on the mods. Make sure you learn what people are looking for on mods. Lots of players make a good income off of people posting [acc]x2 or 3 [dmg]x3 ect for the basic price of that weapon type. I know more then a few times i have caught [acc]x3 weapons on the exchange for 200-300k and turned them around for 12-15mil in a day.
The consoles yes they are worth far less then they used to be... still Tactical consoles still sell very well. As do RCS and Neutronium armors. Phaser consoles are about to get a small bump when undine drops. Not saying they will be worth millions like the old days... still worth posting MK XI and XII blue and up dmg consoles.
Also if you are really really broke and you have inventory space. Don't vendor the engines shields and deflectors... just head out when your inventory is pretty much full of them and vendor them. It adds up if you have 30-40 to vender at a time.
Yeah you can make lots just looking for misplaced Items - not as much as before fleet stuff - but still a fair bit. Very time consuming though - got to have time to burn spamming the exchange refresh button. Less PvP players also means less demand for Accx3 - people would be stupid to waste money on that for PvE in this game. Heck you can do some serious damage with white commons!!:eek:
Consoles never sold very well unless they were Energy based tacticals, Neutronium, or RCS Accelerators.
I used to make a killing - guessing what type of weapon was coming in the next lockbox - then buying up all the Tactical consoles I could store of that type.
I used to make a killing - guessing what type of weapon was coming in the next lockbox - then buying up all the Tactical consoles I could store of that type.
I'm still not seeing how putting anything from a lock box into the d-store helps cryptic. The d-store works as a dil sink at best. As it stands right now. all lock box items had to have real mony put into them as it requires zen. even if you buy from the zen from the dil exchange that zen some one had to buy. If you buy it on the exchange for millions and millions of ec it was still paid for by some one.
If it goes in the d-store, I could do dino-tagging for a couple of hours, have a few days to refine it and and get it from the dil store with no money in Cryptic's pocket.
This game is still very much pay2win whether it be with your own money or by giving your resources to some one else to buy it for you. The only cryptic makes money is keys and ships (to me it is not sustainable but that is another story). I can see cryptic enjoying inflated lock box item prices on the exchange because if it seems out of reach a player is going to either spend more time grinding away to get it or be more inclined to foolishly spend money on keys in hopes of getting what they want.
All those people who "control the market" are people who probably dumped money into the game to sell things on the exchange (pay2win is haves vs have nots in the end). Cryptic is not going to squish the economic flow that is in favor of their paying customers.
The only reason why these 30 mil exchange prices seem impossible is because all in game ec comes from vendors. you sell a key on the exchange, all that came from some one vendering deflectors.
Don't get all worked up about the EC marketplace. Become one with it, and nothing will be out of your grasp.
Alright. I have not dumped a dime into the game in the past 12 months. But I make decent ec from precisely the items he waxes are overpriced.
I look at the market. I see trends. I buy when it's cheap, and sell when it's high.
I don't use software to track things, I just do things smartly. Actually I do use an excel spreadsheet that lists things people MIGHT want with a new release.
My Inner Ferengi was having a field day.
For example: The Undine are coming.
Tholian VR doffs have been around forever. Most people DUMPED THEM CHEAPLY 'cause who seriously thought the Undine would reappear?
So I set aside a budget of easily earned EC. In this case 10 mil.
While people dumped the VR Doff Hirkene, I bought. And bought. Cheapest was a few hundred K. Most expensive was 3 Mil. On the first day of the Season 9 announcement, I sold 2 for 16 mil each covering my costs initial investment and the costs for storing many more.
I bought unopened VR Tholian doff boxes on the chance to get more. I was successful, including 2 borg related doffs.
The prices dropped to 4.5 mill. I bought them up using just my earnings.
Today they are back up to 12 million each and selling well. Current profit on the original 10 mill investment? In excess of 100 million with a potential of several hundred million more.
That isn't greed or market manipulation. It's too large for 1 player to completely dominate. Others are MOST DEFINITELY doing the same damn thing. But you can certainly build value in your portfolio by reading the blogs, listening to interviews and following the trends on Tribble.
The last 'great rush to buy' was Plasma tactical consoles for the LoR launch. Uncommon green consoles went as high as 250K. Everyone mocked plasma before that day came. I didn't. I invested.
Heck I know guys who do this with ships on a daily basis. Thier coin purse is, for a lack of a better description, 'quite large'. All of them earned this in-game.
The point I am trying to make is that you too can do this. Just watch my infomercial - 'Admiral Thrax's Guide to the Great Material Continuum' and if you're ready to join the hundreds of players who earn a serious living in the EC markets! [/sarcasm]
Just my Two Bits (or 25 cents worth for you young'ins)
I can see why you say that. it is possible to get everything with out paying a dime. Just time. But to get those items in the games some one had to put money into the game. That person then sold it for resources. The person who put money into the game has more resources then the one who did not. The person who buys keys and fsm will get enough ec to buy what ever they want faster then the person who is vender trash from missions.
All lock box items, keys, fsm, etc was bought by some one and they can afford all the doffs and gear they want if you gave them ec. If they baught your dil then you most likely ginded their starbase.
Pay2win isn't just about gear. it is also the ability to have the resources to get the latest stuff first and to find those trends and to capitalize on it.
Edit: Cryptic was just very good at confusing the whole issue.
With 5 toons you can refine 40k in Dilhitum a day. That's 300-350 Zen each day depending on the rate. So you can choose to save it up and buy Cstore ships. (1 week = 1 2500 point pack for free). Or you can convert that to around 7mil EC a day... combo that with 3-5million EC earned just grinding your 8k Dilhitum... and you are easily looking at 10 million EC daily. Or in other terms with in a week... you can have things like Leech consoles helms traits ect all done on ONE of your toons.
Dude,
How much time do you spend playing? Lol
I'm not trolling you, It's just that I know you're very active with the PVP community, that you know the mechanics of the game really, really, REALLY well, you're active in the forums, (I read your posts all the time), AND you grind dillithium and ec like a madman!
You should right an e book or something, I'd buy it !
I'm envious really, I'm lucky If some days I even have one hour a day to put in.
But it definitely sounds that when it comes to ec and dilithium, like with real money, being frugal is the way to go.
I honestly don't play as much as I used to. I admit there was a time I played way to much, and yes I earned most of my stuff then.
These days though I maintain a nice income with very little time spent doing it.
Here are a few tips to keep the time down.
When you have enough EC that you can start opening a few lockboxes now and then... open the ones that contain VIP mine claims. Don't open your lockboxs all on one toon. These things are toon bound instead of account. So you want to pick a toon you don't play often to open boxes on. When you get a claim... switch to another low played toon to open them on. Honestly I have a handful of toons that pretty much just stay at the mine. I log into them every few days and complete a couple tickets at a time, convert the D to Zen and log out of them. At this point I can log into 4 or 5 toons for 2-3 min each and then forget about them.
Granted that takes some EC in order to pick up keys... once the current bug promo ends I'm sure keys will drift back down to 1.7-2.0 mil each and then it becomes easier to do that.
The other option lots of people like is to do lots of doffing. I honestly never really bothered. I think if you get a half decent roster of doffs you can make some pretty easy D.
Lockboxes and false promises make more money than making things (semi-)easily available.
/thread
This is why most of the ideas in the OP are a non-starter for Cryptic.
I do agree with and lament the D-store's under-utilization however (and crafting for that matter). Long ago they wanted to consolidate the game currencies because there were way too many, then they slowly started adding new currencies back in over time and now some of the stores have been left by the wayside.
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
I bought 20 tuffli class when they were selling for 15 mil. Guess the price these days.
You can earn EC just by timely decisions....and patience without pointing a single finger to cryptic.
If you can find a cell ship which is costing for 40 mil then get it (assuming you have EC). Their prices will shoot up after a few months. You just need to wait.
Earning EC is like getting woman's kitty. If you are desperate then you won't get it. Keep your cool and it always comes to you
Grinding for MkIV epic gear?
Ain't Nobody Got Time for That
And now that the ground kit becomes modular based I can see lockbox drops of ultra rare modules that will cost one of your arms or legs on the exchange as well.
Hooray for more elitist creep. :rolleyes:
Tyr shall give me strength! For the glory of Tempus! I am the hands of Shar! Flames of Kossuth, protect me! Oghma, grant me knowledge! Lolth commands, and I obey!
The exchange is a Econ driven market...you do not like the prices then go get the Items the hard way (earn them) or the easy way (use REAL money and buy them) ie: lobi's or the C-store. Nobody is "controlling" the Exchange. Why should those of us that have worked hard at getting items to sell so we can earn some EC's (fake money) be penalized by those that just want to be handed everything the game has to offers in a Christmas Basket...pffffft
Soooo many whiners so few gamers...:mad:
just my 2 ec's worth
Betty
"Sips her PWE Koolaide and looks at alllll the goodies in the Z store"
Badname Betty (PvP...PvE...STF...Trophy Hunter...Latnium Collector...Federation)
Commander Morgana (PvP...PvE...STF...KDF)
1000 day vet and LTS
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] STO Join date: 7 Feb 2010
This is the kind of small-minded elitist TRIBBLE this post was trying to find a way to work around. So much for having faith in the STO community.
I was thinking today an alternative might be selling some trait-only packs and console-only packs as an alternative to keys.
As far as pricing goes, the items are worth much less than ship grand prizes and their Lobi counterparts. Balancing that fact against the fact they only award one of the lockbox items (consoles or traits, depending on which you buy) your odds of getting what you want would go much higher since you'd have an equal chance to get everything (i.e. there's a 1:20 chance of getting Helmsman or Wing Commander or whatever you want.) I'd price this at 50% of key packs and sell them exclusively in packs of 10 for 550 ZEN.
Preserves gambling economy, lowers the barrier to entry for those who know better than to go for the grand prizes, helps increase availability and fight ridiculous inflation.
Delta Rising is the best expansion ever and the players love it! No, seriously! ...Why are you laughing so hard?
I honestly don't play as much as I used to. I admit there was a time I played way to much, and yes I earned most of my stuff then.
These days though I maintain a nice income with very little time spent doing it.
Here are a few tips to keep the time down.
When you have enough EC that you can start opening a few lockboxes now and then... open the ones that contain VIP mine claims. Don't open your lockboxs all on one toon. These things are toon bound instead of account. So you want to pick a toon you don't play often to open boxes on. When you get a claim... switch to another low played toon to open them on. Honestly I have a handful of toons that pretty much just stay at the mine. I log into them every few days and complete a couple tickets at a time, convert the D to Zen and log out of them. At this point I can log into 4 or 5 toons for 2-3 min each and then forget about them.
Granted that takes some EC in order to pick up keys... once the current bug promo ends I'm sure keys will drift back down to 1.7-2.0 mil each and then it becomes easier to do that.
The other option lots of people like is to do lots of doffing. I honestly never really bothered. I think if you get a half decent roster of doffs you can make some pretty easy D.
You can do a half decent doff EC grind with 30 min of time. Once in a while, it nets 20 mil EC, but it does wear you down.
It's easy to TRIBBLE on ideas when you don't present any yourself and speak about ships that have already sailed.
It's clear now that traits and cross-faction consoles were a bad idea to put in lockboxes. It's clear now the Exchange prices and the EC market is spiraling out of control. It's a difficult problem to be sure, but it's worth making some suggestions.
Delta Rising is the best expansion ever and the players love it! No, seriously! ...Why are you laughing so hard?
I find it funny that in these conversations people seem to assume that people will/must login daily. I have trouble logging in enough times to complete a mission enough times in 3 weeks to complete the event. I prefer to login once or twice a week does it bother me if I miss something, no, and I have been accused of being lazy when it is an inhuman level of patience.
I remember reading somewhere that some MMO developers are considering hiring economists to "guide" the in game economy, problem is I do not remember where or if I was imagining it.
I remember reading somewhere that some MMO developers are considering hiring economists to "guide" the in game economy, problem is I do not remember where or if I was imagining it.
Many many games have people like this... some are very up front about it. The model Cryptic is using is borrowed from PWE and yes it is 100% designed by an economist.
Once again, we must fight the despicable temptation to make everything in the game easily available to everyone.
The only reason games like this are compelling is because they have things that are hard to get, that you have to work a lot to obtain or achieve.
The harder to get the stuff is, the more compelling. The easier, the less compelling.
That is not true in the least. Games are compelling because they are fun. What you're describing is merely a psychological trick that conditions players into thinking they're having fun by manipulating the connection between action and reward. If the game is not compelling absent of the colloquial rewards (e.g. loot), then the game is lacking the elements that make a truly fun game. Skill, balance, chance, exploration, story, autonomy, and creativity are all elements that can be integrated into a game to make it fun and compelling. Take that game that gives you a wormhole gun as an example. Throughout the whole game, you are presented with challenges to your skill, autonomy to explore, and a story to drive the game. There are no hard to get things in that game, they're all given to you as a matter of course as they become necessary. Yet, this game is incredibly fun and compelling. It even has meta humor that transcends the game itself.
To say that games are compelling because the acquisition of virtual items is difficult is a false equivalence. There is plenty of compelling fun to be had in an RPG without any kind of gated rewards.
Go here and show your support for a better Foundry!
Lockboxes and false promises make more money than making things (semi-)easily available. In short: don't hold your breath on MOST of this. There may be hope for Aegis and crafting, but I'm still having my doubts.
This, essentially.
But fun thing is that Cryptic doesnt even understand their own lockbox system.
The "lockbox" system is designed to CIRCLE the different lockboxes, not to constantly put every development effot into the lockboxes only.
They essentially design those + contents, and after the expiring time they are gone from this game forever... (outside from maybe a weekend where they drop again) Thats just a waste of dev resources. And as far as I know (might be wrong) no other game handles that in such a stupid manner.
The Idea behind that is, again circling. with lets say 20 different lockboxes available, each one is only available for a month, and after that it comes back for another month in about a year.
That puts the dump gambling addicted slug of a player into a rush to get and open as many of em as possible in that month and that sells.
Only new ones on such a slow frequency.... thats not how it works...
Please correct me if I'm wrong but aren't lock boxes a feature that was brought in by PWE? Cuz I don't recall them prior to PWE switching the game to F2P.
If my recollection is correct then it's not surprising that Cryptic doesn't understand a system they had to add to the game like forcing a round peg into a square hole.
Yes, it came with pwe. And it's still the worst thing that happened to the game.
But if it's there they should at least do it right, because in the current form it consumes to many development resources and produces for them to little outcome. It's just not economic.
And yeah... I'm not surprised either that they don't get it, there is a long list of pretty simple concepts that cryptic fails to understand...
Comments
Yeah you can make lots just looking for misplaced Items - not as much as before fleet stuff - but still a fair bit. Very time consuming though - got to have time to burn spamming the exchange refresh button. Less PvP players also means less demand for Accx3 - people would be stupid to waste money on that for PvE in this game. Heck you can do some serious damage with white commons!!:eek:
I used to make a killing - guessing what type of weapon was coming in the next lockbox - then buying up all the Tactical consoles I could store of that type.
Let me guess, Disruptor 80% of the time? :P
Was not that hard to predict. Whatever the leak was well in advance - just look at the NPC`s weapon type.
If it goes in the d-store, I could do dino-tagging for a couple of hours, have a few days to refine it and and get it from the dil store with no money in Cryptic's pocket.
This game is still very much pay2win whether it be with your own money or by giving your resources to some one else to buy it for you. The only cryptic makes money is keys and ships (to me it is not sustainable but that is another story). I can see cryptic enjoying inflated lock box item prices on the exchange because if it seems out of reach a player is going to either spend more time grinding away to get it or be more inclined to foolishly spend money on keys in hopes of getting what they want.
All those people who "control the market" are people who probably dumped money into the game to sell things on the exchange (pay2win is haves vs have nots in the end). Cryptic is not going to squish the economic flow that is in favor of their paying customers.
The only reason why these 30 mil exchange prices seem impossible is because all in game ec comes from vendors. you sell a key on the exchange, all that came from some one vendering deflectors.
Couldn't agree more.
Also, I've paid a fair bit over the years and still very rarely win.
Don't get all worked up about the EC marketplace. Become one with it, and nothing will be out of your grasp.
Alright. I have not dumped a dime into the game in the past 12 months. But I make decent ec from precisely the items he waxes are overpriced.
I look at the market. I see trends. I buy when it's cheap, and sell when it's high.
I don't use software to track things, I just do things smartly. Actually I do use an excel spreadsheet that lists things people MIGHT want with a new release.
My Inner Ferengi was having a field day.
For example: The Undine are coming.
That isn't greed or market manipulation. It's too large for 1 player to completely dominate. Others are MOST DEFINITELY doing the same damn thing. But you can certainly build value in your portfolio by reading the blogs, listening to interviews and following the trends on Tribble.
The last 'great rush to buy' was Plasma tactical consoles for the LoR launch. Uncommon green consoles went as high as 250K. Everyone mocked plasma before that day came. I didn't. I invested.
Heck I know guys who do this with ships on a daily basis. Thier coin purse is, for a lack of a better description, 'quite large'. All of them earned this in-game.
The point I am trying to make is that you too can do this. Just watch my infomercial - 'Admiral Thrax's Guide to the Great Material Continuum' and if you're ready to join the hundreds of players who earn a serious living in the EC markets! [/sarcasm]
Just my Two Bits (or 25 cents worth for you young'ins)
Admiral Thrax
I can see why you say that. it is possible to get everything with out paying a dime. Just time. But to get those items in the games some one had to put money into the game. That person then sold it for resources. The person who put money into the game has more resources then the one who did not. The person who buys keys and fsm will get enough ec to buy what ever they want faster then the person who is vender trash from missions.
All lock box items, keys, fsm, etc was bought by some one and they can afford all the doffs and gear they want if you gave them ec. If they baught your dil then you most likely ginded their starbase.
Pay2win isn't just about gear. it is also the ability to have the resources to get the latest stuff first and to find those trends and to capitalize on it.
Edit: Cryptic was just very good at confusing the whole issue.
Dude,
How much time do you spend playing? Lol
I'm not trolling you, It's just that I know you're very active with the PVP community, that you know the mechanics of the game really, really, REALLY well, you're active in the forums, (I read your posts all the time), AND you grind dillithium and ec like a madman!
You should right an e book or something, I'd buy it !
I'm envious really, I'm lucky If some days I even have one hour a day to put in.
But it definitely sounds that when it comes to ec and dilithium, like with real money, being frugal is the way to go.
These days though I maintain a nice income with very little time spent doing it.
Here are a few tips to keep the time down.
When you have enough EC that you can start opening a few lockboxes now and then... open the ones that contain VIP mine claims. Don't open your lockboxs all on one toon. These things are toon bound instead of account. So you want to pick a toon you don't play often to open boxes on. When you get a claim... switch to another low played toon to open them on. Honestly I have a handful of toons that pretty much just stay at the mine. I log into them every few days and complete a couple tickets at a time, convert the D to Zen and log out of them. At this point I can log into 4 or 5 toons for 2-3 min each and then forget about them.
Granted that takes some EC in order to pick up keys... once the current bug promo ends I'm sure keys will drift back down to 1.7-2.0 mil each and then it becomes easier to do that.
The other option lots of people like is to do lots of doffing. I honestly never really bothered. I think if you get a half decent roster of doffs you can make some pretty easy D.
/thread
This is why most of the ideas in the OP are a non-starter for Cryptic.
I do agree with and lament the D-store's under-utilization however (and crafting for that matter). Long ago they wanted to consolidate the game currencies because there were way too many, then they slowly started adding new currencies back in over time and now some of the stores have been left by the wayside.
Joined January 2009
You can earn EC just by timely decisions....and patience without pointing a single finger to cryptic.
If you can find a cell ship which is costing for 40 mil then get it (assuming you have EC). Their prices will shoot up after a few months. You just need to wait.
Earning EC is like getting woman's kitty. If you are desperate then you won't get it. Keep your cool and it always comes to you
Ain't Nobody Got Time for That
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Hooray for more elitist creep. :rolleyes:
For the glory of Tempus!
I am the hands of Shar!
Flames of Kossuth, protect me!
Oghma, grant me knowledge!
Lolth commands, and I obey!
Soooo many whiners so few gamers...:mad:
just my 2 ec's worth
Betty
Badname Betty (PvP...PvE...STF...Trophy Hunter...Latnium Collector...Federation)
Commander Morgana (PvP...PvE...STF...KDF)
1000 day vet and LTS
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] STO Join date: 7 Feb 2010
I was thinking today an alternative might be selling some trait-only packs and console-only packs as an alternative to keys.
As far as pricing goes, the items are worth much less than ship grand prizes and their Lobi counterparts. Balancing that fact against the fact they only award one of the lockbox items (consoles or traits, depending on which you buy) your odds of getting what you want would go much higher since you'd have an equal chance to get everything (i.e. there's a 1:20 chance of getting Helmsman or Wing Commander or whatever you want.) I'd price this at 50% of key packs and sell them exclusively in packs of 10 for 550 ZEN.
Preserves gambling economy, lowers the barrier to entry for those who know better than to go for the grand prizes, helps increase availability and fight ridiculous inflation.
You can do a half decent doff EC grind with 30 min of time. Once in a while, it nets 20 mil EC, but it does wear you down.
It's clear now that traits and cross-faction consoles were a bad idea to put in lockboxes. It's clear now the Exchange prices and the EC market is spiraling out of control. It's a difficult problem to be sure, but it's worth making some suggestions.
I remember reading somewhere that some MMO developers are considering hiring economists to "guide" the in game economy, problem is I do not remember where or if I was imagining it.
Many many games have people like this... some are very up front about it. The model Cryptic is using is borrowed from PWE and yes it is 100% designed by an economist.
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/john-smith-on-the-guild-wars-2-virtual-economy/
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/john-smith/56/487/8b4
That is not true in the least. Games are compelling because they are fun. What you're describing is merely a psychological trick that conditions players into thinking they're having fun by manipulating the connection between action and reward. If the game is not compelling absent of the colloquial rewards (e.g. loot), then the game is lacking the elements that make a truly fun game. Skill, balance, chance, exploration, story, autonomy, and creativity are all elements that can be integrated into a game to make it fun and compelling. Take that game that gives you a wormhole gun as an example. Throughout the whole game, you are presented with challenges to your skill, autonomy to explore, and a story to drive the game. There are no hard to get things in that game, they're all given to you as a matter of course as they become necessary. Yet, this game is incredibly fun and compelling. It even has meta humor that transcends the game itself.
To say that games are compelling because the acquisition of virtual items is difficult is a false equivalence. There is plenty of compelling fun to be had in an RPG without any kind of gated rewards.
This, essentially.
But fun thing is that Cryptic doesnt even understand their own lockbox system.
The "lockbox" system is designed to CIRCLE the different lockboxes, not to constantly put every development effot into the lockboxes only.
They essentially design those + contents, and after the expiring time they are gone from this game forever... (outside from maybe a weekend where they drop again) Thats just a waste of dev resources. And as far as I know (might be wrong) no other game handles that in such a stupid manner.
The Idea behind that is, again circling. with lets say 20 different lockboxes available, each one is only available for a month, and after that it comes back for another month in about a year.
That puts the dump gambling addicted slug of a player into a rush to get and open as many of em as possible in that month and that sells.
Only new ones on such a slow frequency.... thats not how it works...
Yes, it came with pwe. And it's still the worst thing that happened to the game.
But if it's there they should at least do it right, because in the current form it consumes to many development resources and produces for them to little outcome. It's just not economic.
And yeah... I'm not surprised either that they don't get it, there is a long list of pretty simple concepts that cryptic fails to understand...