Although, I will note that it has been my observation that the players that stomp ISE in four minutes don't seem interested in HOSE..... hmmmmm.
Several reasons exist for reduced interest in HOSE
1. HOSE is kinda buggy. Even though you're supposed to be safe when hiding by the Queen, you still be instakilled by lances anyway if someone else is outside.
2. The pay isn't actually any better.
3. People don't like to venture outside their box of familiarity.
4. People who STILL do STFs despite having no reason to do so are basically just ship testing and want a consistent environment rather than doing something new.
One or more of these reasons typically combine to massively dampen interest. If HOSE gave proto tech drops, I guarantee it would immediately gain popularity. But given that you're going to farm for Marks using the path of least resistance, it's all ISE, all the time.
I wouldn't mind seeing the return of the "combined" STFs (as I never played them before) - does all sorts of things:
Makes the sector useful again, as I would make the combined STFs only accessable via the planets as it was in the old days.
Increases socialization in said sector - a beef many people seem to have.
Makes varied builds necessary - too many people specialized into space only and would be a liability on ground unless they respecced.
Payout for said mission would be (IMO) combined payout of running the space and ground of appropriate level, with random chance for old [Borg] gear / Med Kit / weapon... As far as getting the old Borg gear, bring back Roxy and the EDC / Salvages (whichever one was used to buy them)...
Detecting big-time "anti-old-school" bias here. NX? Lobi. TOS/TMP Connie? Super-promotion-box. (aka the two hardest ways to get ships) Excelsior & all 3 TNG "big hero" ships? C-Store. Please Equalize...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
I would like to see the old stf's return. The stf's that are up now are way to quick and easy for a lot of players that have been around for a long time.
The old ones would not replace the new ones but would be able to be run like they used to by picking up the mission and going to the planet with your team.
I am wondering if anyone else is feeling the same.
Aaaaah the GOOD Times, the good old days - Too bad the whiners finalized its demised.
(I played this **** 200x, and I have yet to receive my last piece of my set- uuugh... the memories of those awful complainers)
I do agree, bring them back in their original state but separate from the now soo called Kiddie land Elite mode and their insta-fix. Sure the old school took 3hrs to complete, but with a decent team, it was satisfying, I rather have them back as an optional gameplay.
To make it interesting they could add the mk XII armour pieces as rare drops from the full lenght ones, as an alternative way of getting them without the lengthy grind, as well as a little extra cosmetic or title to indicate full lenght STF completion.
You must be joking......... That was the best mission in the game...
Nah, the best mission in the game ever was the Cardassian Fleet Action, DS9 Under Siege.
It had everything a team would want out of a mission. Killer ground mission with tension and drama. Saving DS9 from invasion. And a space battle, Foxes and Hounds, connected to it.
Simply the best mission in the game.
Anyways, I'm not a fan of them bringing back the old STFs. They were buggy, glitchy and terrible examples of end-game design. For anyone who's ever actually raided in an MMO (be it breaking Plane of Fear, or doing 40 man AQ), the STFs were just an embarrassment to gaming.
Also, if they do bring this morass back, there's absolutely no way they'll link them to the rewards of the current rep grind. That's backwards thinking and disregards the purpose of the rep grind. Whatever rewards they grant will be less appealing than what the grind will reward you with. The incentive will still be to do the grind. Because that's the model for the game's current functionality.
I do agree, bring them back in their original state but separate from the now soo called Kiddie land Elite mode and their insta-fix. Sure the old school took 3hrs to complete, but with a decent team, it was satisfying, I rather have them back as an optional gameplay.
Pretty much this .
Gecko said that the next content that is getting a look over after the initial Fed missions is the Borg content .
Unfortunetly he only talked about the "Borg story line" -- so I have no idea if that includes the STF's or not .
It's so hard to get Cryptic to get interested in working on past stuff -- which then get's to be put on a time table -- wich then gets a budget , that it's hard to think that now that they finally are working on Borgs stuff , the one that they get repeatedly asked to update get's ... I dunno , hopefully not ignored .
My other fear is that they are afraid to touch the STF's without Gozer .
Nah, the best mission in the game ever was the Cardassian Fleet Action, DS9 Under Siege.
It had everything a team would want out of a mission. Killer ground mission with tension and drama. Saving DS9 from invasion. And a space battle, Foxes and Hounds, connected to it.
Simply the best mission in the game.
Anyways, I'm not a fan of them bringing back the old STFs. They were buggy, glitchy and terrible examples of end-game design. For anyone who's ever actually raided in an MMO (be it breaking Plane of Fear, or doing 40 man AQ), the STFs were just an embarrassment to gaming.
Also, if they do bring this morass back, there's absolutely no way they'll link them to the rewards of the current rep grind. That's backwards thinking and disregards the purpose of the rep grind. Whatever rewards they grant will be less appealing than what the grind will reward you with. The incentive will still be to do the grind. Because that's the model for the game's current functionality.
I never did the ds9 under siege. I wanted to do it when my chars was finished leveling, but then it wasn't available for rear admrals...
But I really wonder why cryptic seems to be more busy taking content out if the game instead of adding some...
Ds9 under siege
Old stfs
Terradome
Space assault pvp
That mission we gathered computer core fragments for
That story mission with the ferengie chase
Mirror event
That's only the ones I talked/!wrote with people about just today....
Cryptic already forced a split in points between space and ground and those points are enough to make a viable ground char. That point is moot.
What i do not like about the newest rep, the voth, is that the space set and ground set do not come in mkX-XII increments anymore.
meaning to complete the SETS build to work well AGAINST the voth, you have to complete the fckn voth rep.
At which point the sets aren't needed.
The Voth Armor, even though it looks like it should be environmentally sealed, does not actually work as an eviro suit. That means you cannot do Tholian Rep grind with it.
It also does not give you the nifty instant remodulation of the Omega/Maco/Honor Guard sets. So the Voth rep has a serious lack of utility.
Both borg and tholian sets are available early in the rep, making the rest of the grind easier.
The voth rep, while less clicky on one part (no more commodities YEAH!) immediately introduced an HOURLY rep mission. Turning it from a clicky fest into a "adjust clock" fest.
The item sets also only complete at Max rep.
I would like to see the old stf's return. The stf's that are up now are way to quick and easy for a lot of players that have been around for a long time.
The old ones would not replace the new ones but would be able to be run like they used to by picking up the mission and going to the planet with your team.
I am wondering if anyone else is feeling the same.
simpily no. while it was nice to succeed after an extremly long drawn out stf it was also extremely frustrating when people would drop out sadly that would happen far too often.
also the old way of doing the borg stfs wasn't even done very well. they actually did a great job separating them.
what people should be asking for is NEW stfs. while you can learn from the past and the present to make something better for the future. I can't see how repackaging stfs again or adding 'rollback' stfs being of any benefit to the game.
if you want a long stf ask for a daily wrapper mission to complete all 8 borg stfs ground and space for a nice reward.
simpily no. while it was nice to succeed after an extremly long drawn out stf it was also extremely frustrating when people would drop out sadly that would happen far too often.
also the old way of doing the borg stfs wasn't even done very well. they actually did a great job separating them.
what people should be asking for is NEW stfs. while you can learn from the past and the present to make something better for the future. I can't see how repackaging stfs again or adding 'rollback' stfs being of any benefit to the game.
if you want a long stf ask for a daily wrapper mission to complete all 8 borg stfs ground and space for a nice reward.
Bring them back as an addition to what is there. If some don't want to play them, then don't. I have finished them in the past with as few as three people. Would be nice to place them back on the map with the borg/undine revamp.
Gold Sub since March 2010
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
simpily no. while it was nice to succeed after an extremly long drawn out stf it was also extremely frustrating when people would drop out sadly that would happen far too often.
also the old way of doing the borg stfs wasn't even done very well. they actually did a great job separating them.
what people should be asking for is NEW stfs. while you can learn from the past and the present to make something better for the future. I can't see how repackaging stfs again or adding 'rollback' stfs being of any benefit to the game.
if you want a long stf ask for a daily wrapper mission to complete all 8 borg stfs ground and space for a nice reward.
What some people do not seem to get is that some of us liked exactly that kind of long dragging gameplay.
People bailing out is annoying, no question. But that's where fleets are for. You can make appointments to be sure the team has enough time ect, other wise leavers come with that kind of content. That can not be avoided but it's no reason not to make that kind of content in the first place.
Because they should take some time, they should be hard, even sometimes frustrating (as long as it is not unfairly frustrating).
Just makes the sweetness of finally figuring them out and beating em sweeter.
That's not the case with the dumbed down fast foot content we have now.
This is,I admit, fun it's own way, but it's not a replacement.
I have no problem bringing back the old STF. In a game this limited in content it seems stupid to not be utilizing whatever content is sitting in storage somewhere. The people who want to play them should be allowed to - just like virtually anything on Replay in the game.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
What some people do not seem to get is that some of us liked exactly that kind of long dragging gameplay.
People bailing out is annoying, no question. But that's where fleets are for. You can make appointments to be sure the team has enough time ect, other wise leavers come with that kind of content. That can not be avoided but it's no reason not to make that kind of content in the first place.
Because they should take some time, they should be hard, even sometimes frustrating (as long as it is not unfairly frustrating).
Just makes the sweetness of finally figuring them out and beating em sweeter.
That's not the case with the dumbed down fast foot content we have now.
This is,I admit, fun it's own way, but it's not a replacement.
I understand your point even tho I don't agree. since you can just play all 8 through now. group or pug. there is no need for the dev team to spend any time on this.
plus they are also easier because gozer I believe worked with the community to 'clean' them up a lot. I was certainly happy that the ground 'trash' mobs got fixed. leading cause of quitters in cure ground.
I understand your point even tho I don't agree. since you can just play all 8 through now. group or pug. there is no need for the dev team to spend any time on this.
plus they are also easier because gozer I believe worked with the community to 'clean' them up a lot. I was certainly happy that the ground 'trash' mobs got fixed. leading cause of quitters in cure ground.
The point is that the story has been completely butchered in those two part junk they replaced them with. We get it, you're not interested, but what is your objection to it being there for people that want to experience/re-experince what was once a nice story with a little challenge to it if it gives them no advantage against you?
I understand your point even tho I don't agree. since you can just play all 8 through now. group or pug. there is no need for the dev team to spend any time on this.
plus they are also easier because gozer I believe worked with the community to 'clean' them up a lot. I was certainly happy that the ground 'trash' mobs got fixed. leading cause of quitters in cure ground.
I don't have that time regulary but on a weekend now at then I can make the time.
Nobody would/should FORCE people into it (which is why Im opposed to unique rewards), but they should be there and reward appropriately.
The point is that the story has been completely butchered in those two part junk they replaced them with. We get it, you're not interested, but what is your objection to it being there for people that want to experience/re-experince what was once a nice story with a little challenge to it if it gives them no advantage against you?
The old STF's had a good story to them, they really did, but they were also very long drawn. I still shudder to this day to think about 2-5 hours STF's. And not to mention all the trash mobs, that was just tedious. Got really boring having to waste so many Borg.
The new ones might be easier, but they are still not what I would call faceroll easy, unless you are in a pre made team.
And I say good riddance of the trash mobs of old, those were just unwanted cannon fodder.
To reintroduce the old STF's now would, as Spock would say, be illogical. Can you imagine how pugs would work? And before anyone say the obvious about joining a fleet or using one the existing ESTF cannels; well news flash, not everyone wants to be in a fleet, they like being lone wolfs, and some do not care to join cannels just to play an STF.
No, it would be bad ROI for Cryptic to re-introduce the old STF's, as I can't imagine that many actually playing them due to the length of them. Sure some would, but how many would you need before you would get a positive ROI?
As another said above, ask not for the old to be re-introduced, but rather new STF's, wich would get much better ROI...
The old STF's had a good story to them, they really did, but they were also very long drawn. I still shudder to this day to think about 2-5 hours STF's. And not to mention all the trash mobs, that was just tedious. Got really boring having to waste so many Borg.
The new ones might be easier, but they are still not what I would call faceroll easy, unless you are in a pre made team.
And I say good riddance of the trash mobs of old, those were just unwanted cannon fodder.
To reintroduce the old STF's now would, as Spock would say, be illogical. Can you imagine how pugs would work? And before anyone say the obvious about joining a fleet or using one the existing ESTF cannels; well news flash, not everyone wants to be in a fleet, they like being lone wolfs, and some do not care to join cannels just to play an STF.
No, it would be bad ROI for Cryptic to re-introduce the old STF's, as I can't imagine that many actually playing them due to the length of them. Sure some would, but how many would you need before you would get a positive ROI?
As another said above, ask not for the old to be re-introduced, but rather new STF's, wich would get much better ROI...
Newsflash to you:
This is a social game.
If you always want to be the "lone wolf", go play Bridge Commander.
Right now outside of pvp there is no reason to socialize. You do not join fleets to socialize any more, just to get fleet stuff. Every PVE content can be done with randoms.
What some people want is content THAT IS NOT DOABLE BY "LONE WOLFS" in an MMO.
Newsflash to you:
This is a social game.
If you always want to be the "lone wolf", go play Bridge Commander.
Right now outside of pvp there is no reason to socialize. You do not join fleets to socialize any more, just to get fleet stuff. Every PVE content can be done with randoms.
What some people want is content THAT IS NOT DOABLE BY "LONE WOLFS" in an MMO.
FYI, I am in a fleet.
I was merely stating that there are some that prefer not to join fleets for whatever reason, and that is their choice, who are we to tell them what to do?
Also, your comment about "go play Bridge Commander" is down putting. Just because some players prefer to be lone wolfs, does not mean they should quit playing STO or any other MMO for that matter.
But I will not start an arguement here. What I said in my first post in this thread is till a valid point, we just have different views on things, wich is not uncommon on MMO forums
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
The point is that the story has been completely butchered in those two part junk they replaced them with. We get it, you're not interested, but what is your objection to it being there for people that want to experience/re-experince what was once a nice story with a little challenge to it if it gives them no advantage against you?
well the entire story in sto all over the place. that needs work without a doubt.
what I have against it, would be the fact it's just a waste of dev time. effectively your asking for the current borg stfs to be repackaged back to how they was so people can have a longer mission of the current '2 parts' as an option. guys seriously play space then ground back to back it's not hard lol. I know you miss the old style but it's long gone.
also how in the blue hell can this benefit the game? it can't. when the dev time could be much better spent working on some new stfs. but you'd rather play the same stfs over and over? to me that is just ridiculous. I'd much rather see some NEW content that could be similar in the old stf style of a team working thru the story of a hard mission in space or ground.
but only thing worth doing is making the borg in general throughout the game harder.
personally I don't like the current story voth etc. but the breach is a pretty good fairly new stf and it's not over in 5 mins. for me that is progression in terms of making a stf that isn't over before the kettle boils.
but what is your objection to it being there for people that want to experience/re-experince what was once a nice story with a little challenge to it if it gives them no advantage against you?
Two-fold:
1- The underlying tone that this topic usually ends up putting forth (and it can be found in this thread) is that the old STFs took more skill to complete. This is not the case. They were just time consuming and buggy. As an experienced MMO raider in games like Everquest, I could tell the difference between buggy, poorly designed timesink, and actual end-game raiding content. It was like the difference between NTOV in Scars of Velious and Vex Thal in Planes of Power. And even the slog that was Vex Thal was so much more elegantly designed than anything Gozer ever created for this game.
2- The other suggestion that keeps cropping up is to have easier or even alternate to obtain rewards that circumvent the grind that currently exist. Or unique rewards only obtainable through that avenue and not the current grind. All of which are bad ideas because they then work against the design of the grind.
And being completely honest, it's the primary reason why the STFs if they do come back won't satisfy many of the posters here. Because they won't have unique or alternative reward paths. They'll be done as a fun event or a concession to player requests. But the game pretty much is locked into the reward path of the grind. PWE won't be getting away from that. At all.
So the objection of your playstyle preference is just perception. It's fine by me if you want to step back into that buggy mess.
It's not fine by me that you think it took skill to complete, because time is not a skill. And I really don't think you're considering PWE if you feel a retro STF will let you get rewards better than the current grind gives from the same content in its cut-up state.
I was merely stating that there are some that prefer not to join fleets for whatever reason, and that is their choice, who are we to tell them what to do?
Also, your comment about "go play Bridge Commander" is down putting. Just because some players prefer to be lone wolfs, does not mean they should quit playing STO or any other MMO for that matter.
But I will not start an arguement here. What I said in my first post in this thread is till a valid point, we just have different views on things, wich is not uncommon on MMO forums
Its not that I don't enjoy doing stuff alone now and then, but you generally don't team up you can't expect to be able to solve every part on the games content.
And even less its argument to not include group content in the first place. And with ground content I mean content that needs the group to work together and not random teaming.
People keep saying over and over that reintroducing the old stf's is a waste of dev time. this is not the case. the old missions are there and still in tact. i actually have one of the old mission accepted on a toon and went into the sytem. the content is there the missions just need to be turned on. not much work involved in that. further more i think people are afraid that all the most expert players will not q for the easy stf's and will be left with trashy pugs in the q's.
People keep saying over and over that reintroducing the old stf's is a waste of dev time. this is not the case. the old missions are there and still in tact. i actually have one of the old mission accepted on a toon and went into the sytem. the content is there the missions just need to be turned on. not much work involved in that. further more i think people are afraid that all the most expert players will not q for the easy stf's and will be left with trashy pugs in the q's.
I deleted mine last week, it's been sitting there since they turned them off but your point remains, it wouldn't waste time and if anyone gets bored and wants to see how things use to be (minus the reward) then they have that to try out. I feel it should be an option, no special reward, marks yes but no more than you can get from 2 hours of stf play now. That way it's not a way to cut back the "grind" like some people fear. Just the original story the way it was supposed to play. I don't really think it'd be much of a challenge now days with all the new gear being so much stronger than what we had back then. I just miss the "oh wait... I saved myself from the Borg by beating up on them before they got to vaga? Cool!" Effect they had.
Edit: well two out of three would require no time, forgot they redid the start of the fed side that killed my favorite story, so that one would need rewriting.
Comments
1. HOSE is kinda buggy. Even though you're supposed to be safe when hiding by the Queen, you still be instakilled by lances anyway if someone else is outside.
2. The pay isn't actually any better.
3. People don't like to venture outside their box of familiarity.
4. People who STILL do STFs despite having no reason to do so are basically just ship testing and want a consistent environment rather than doing something new.
One or more of these reasons typically combine to massively dampen interest. If HOSE gave proto tech drops, I guarantee it would immediately gain popularity. But given that you're going to farm for Marks using the path of least resistance, it's all ISE, all the time.
Makes the sector useful again, as I would make the combined STFs only accessable via the planets as it was in the old days.
Increases socialization in said sector - a beef many people seem to have.
Makes varied builds necessary - too many people specialized into space only and would be a liability on ground unless they respecced.
Payout for said mission would be (IMO) combined payout of running the space and ground of appropriate level, with random chance for old [Borg] gear / Med Kit / weapon... As far as getting the old Borg gear, bring back Roxy and the EDC / Salvages (whichever one was used to buy them)...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
Aaaaah the GOOD Times, the good old days - Too bad the whiners finalized its demised.
(I played this **** 200x, and I have yet to receive my last piece of my set- uuugh... the memories of those awful complainers)
I do agree, bring them back in their original state but separate from the now soo called Kiddie land Elite mode and their insta-fix. Sure the old school took 3hrs to complete, but with a decent team, it was satisfying, I rather have them back as an optional gameplay.
Nah, the best mission in the game ever was the Cardassian Fleet Action, DS9 Under Siege.
It had everything a team would want out of a mission. Killer ground mission with tension and drama. Saving DS9 from invasion. And a space battle, Foxes and Hounds, connected to it.
Simply the best mission in the game.
Anyways, I'm not a fan of them bringing back the old STFs. They were buggy, glitchy and terrible examples of end-game design. For anyone who's ever actually raided in an MMO (be it breaking Plane of Fear, or doing 40 man AQ), the STFs were just an embarrassment to gaming.
Also, if they do bring this morass back, there's absolutely no way they'll link them to the rewards of the current rep grind. That's backwards thinking and disregards the purpose of the rep grind. Whatever rewards they grant will be less appealing than what the grind will reward you with. The incentive will still be to do the grind. Because that's the model for the game's current functionality.
Pretty much this .
Gecko said that the next content that is getting a look over after the initial Fed missions is the Borg content .
Unfortunetly he only talked about the "Borg story line" -- so I have no idea if that includes the STF's or not .
It's so hard to get Cryptic to get interested in working on past stuff -- which then get's to be put on a time table -- wich then gets a budget , that it's hard to think that now that they finally are working on Borgs stuff , the one that they get repeatedly asked to update get's ... I dunno , hopefully not ignored .
My other fear is that they are afraid to touch the STF's without Gozer .
I never did the ds9 under siege. I wanted to do it when my chars was finished leveling, but then it wasn't available for rear admrals...
But I really wonder why cryptic seems to be more busy taking content out if the game instead of adding some...
Ds9 under siege
Old stfs
Terradome
Space assault pvp
That mission we gathered computer core fragments for
That story mission with the ferengie chase
Mirror event
That's only the ones I talked/!wrote with people about just today....
Cryptic already forced a split in points between space and ground and those points are enough to make a viable ground char. That point is moot.
What i do not like about the newest rep, the voth, is that the space set and ground set do not come in mkX-XII increments anymore.
meaning to complete the SETS build to work well AGAINST the voth, you have to complete the fckn voth rep.
At which point the sets aren't needed.
The Voth Armor, even though it looks like it should be environmentally sealed, does not actually work as an eviro suit. That means you cannot do Tholian Rep grind with it.
It also does not give you the nifty instant remodulation of the Omega/Maco/Honor Guard sets. So the Voth rep has a serious lack of utility.
Both borg and tholian sets are available early in the rep, making the rest of the grind easier.
The voth rep, while less clicky on one part (no more commodities YEAH!) immediately introduced an HOURLY rep mission. Turning it from a clicky fest into a "adjust clock" fest.
The item sets also only complete at Max rep.
What. The. Hell.
Kinda missing the point with that, cryptic.
simpily no. while it was nice to succeed after an extremly long drawn out stf it was also extremely frustrating when people would drop out sadly that would happen far too often.
also the old way of doing the borg stfs wasn't even done very well. they actually did a great job separating them.
what people should be asking for is NEW stfs. while you can learn from the past and the present to make something better for the future. I can't see how repackaging stfs again or adding 'rollback' stfs being of any benefit to the game.
if you want a long stf ask for a daily wrapper mission to complete all 8 borg stfs ground and space for a nice reward.
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
What some people do not seem to get is that some of us liked exactly that kind of long dragging gameplay.
People bailing out is annoying, no question. But that's where fleets are for. You can make appointments to be sure the team has enough time ect, other wise leavers come with that kind of content. That can not be avoided but it's no reason not to make that kind of content in the first place.
Because they should take some time, they should be hard, even sometimes frustrating (as long as it is not unfairly frustrating).
Just makes the sweetness of finally figuring them out and beating em sweeter.
That's not the case with the dumbed down fast foot content we have now.
This is,I admit, fun it's own way, but it's not a replacement.
I understand your point even tho I don't agree. since you can just play all 8 through now. group or pug. there is no need for the dev team to spend any time on this.
plus they are also easier because gozer I believe worked with the community to 'clean' them up a lot. I was certainly happy that the ground 'trash' mobs got fixed. leading cause of quitters in cure ground.
The point is that the story has been completely butchered in those two part junk they replaced them with. We get it, you're not interested, but what is your objection to it being there for people that want to experience/re-experince what was once a nice story with a little challenge to it if it gives them no advantage against you?
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Nobody would/should FORCE people into it (which is why Im opposed to unique rewards), but they should be there and reward appropriately.
That, too.
The new ones might be easier, but they are still not what I would call faceroll easy, unless you are in a pre made team.
And I say good riddance of the trash mobs of old, those were just unwanted cannon fodder.
To reintroduce the old STF's now would, as Spock would say, be illogical. Can you imagine how pugs would work? And before anyone say the obvious about joining a fleet or using one the existing ESTF cannels; well news flash, not everyone wants to be in a fleet, they like being lone wolfs, and some do not care to join cannels just to play an STF.
No, it would be bad ROI for Cryptic to re-introduce the old STF's, as I can't imagine that many actually playing them due to the length of them. Sure some would, but how many would you need before you would get a positive ROI?
As another said above, ask not for the old to be re-introduced, but rather new STF's, wich would get much better ROI...
Newsflash to you:
This is a social game.
If you always want to be the "lone wolf", go play Bridge Commander.
Right now outside of pvp there is no reason to socialize. You do not join fleets to socialize any more, just to get fleet stuff. Every PVE content can be done with randoms.
What some people want is content THAT IS NOT DOABLE BY "LONE WOLFS" in an MMO.
FYI, I am in a fleet.
I was merely stating that there are some that prefer not to join fleets for whatever reason, and that is their choice, who are we to tell them what to do?
Also, your comment about "go play Bridge Commander" is down putting. Just because some players prefer to be lone wolfs, does not mean they should quit playing STO or any other MMO for that matter.
But I will not start an arguement here. What I said in my first post in this thread is till a valid point, we just have different views on things, wich is not uncommon on MMO forums
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
well the entire story in sto all over the place. that needs work without a doubt.
what I have against it, would be the fact it's just a waste of dev time. effectively your asking for the current borg stfs to be repackaged back to how they was so people can have a longer mission of the current '2 parts' as an option. guys seriously play space then ground back to back it's not hard lol. I know you miss the old style but it's long gone.
also how in the blue hell can this benefit the game? it can't. when the dev time could be much better spent working on some new stfs. but you'd rather play the same stfs over and over? to me that is just ridiculous. I'd much rather see some NEW content that could be similar in the old stf style of a team working thru the story of a hard mission in space or ground.
but only thing worth doing is making the borg in general throughout the game harder.
personally I don't like the current story voth etc. but the breach is a pretty good fairly new stf and it's not over in 5 mins. for me that is progression in terms of making a stf that isn't over before the kettle boils.
Two-fold:
1- The underlying tone that this topic usually ends up putting forth (and it can be found in this thread) is that the old STFs took more skill to complete. This is not the case. They were just time consuming and buggy. As an experienced MMO raider in games like Everquest, I could tell the difference between buggy, poorly designed timesink, and actual end-game raiding content. It was like the difference between NTOV in Scars of Velious and Vex Thal in Planes of Power. And even the slog that was Vex Thal was so much more elegantly designed than anything Gozer ever created for this game.
2- The other suggestion that keeps cropping up is to have easier or even alternate to obtain rewards that circumvent the grind that currently exist. Or unique rewards only obtainable through that avenue and not the current grind. All of which are bad ideas because they then work against the design of the grind.
And being completely honest, it's the primary reason why the STFs if they do come back won't satisfy many of the posters here. Because they won't have unique or alternative reward paths. They'll be done as a fun event or a concession to player requests. But the game pretty much is locked into the reward path of the grind. PWE won't be getting away from that. At all.
So the objection of your playstyle preference is just perception. It's fine by me if you want to step back into that buggy mess.
It's not fine by me that you think it took skill to complete, because time is not a skill. And I really don't think you're considering PWE if you feel a retro STF will let you get rewards better than the current grind gives from the same content in its cut-up state.
Its not that I don't enjoy doing stuff alone now and then, but you generally don't team up you can't expect to be able to solve every part on the games content.
And even less its argument to not include group content in the first place. And with ground content I mean content that needs the group to work together and not random teaming.
They've done that already. Not sure there's much point into doing that over and over again.
I think you're wrong there.
I deleted mine last week, it's been sitting there since they turned them off but your point remains, it wouldn't waste time and if anyone gets bored and wants to see how things use to be (minus the reward) then they have that to try out. I feel it should be an option, no special reward, marks yes but no more than you can get from 2 hours of stf play now. That way it's not a way to cut back the "grind" like some people fear. Just the original story the way it was supposed to play. I don't really think it'd be much of a challenge now days with all the new gear being so much stronger than what we had back then. I just miss the "oh wait... I saved myself from the Borg by beating up on them before they got to vaga? Cool!" Effect they had.
Edit: well two out of three would require no time, forgot they redid the start of the fed side that killed my favorite story, so that one would need rewriting.