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Space PvPers and Ground combat
majortiraomega
Member Posts: 2,214 Arc User
Season 8 is well under way, the reputation tokens now exist, which makes the reputation grind much easier. It just takes 6 days (7 with dyson) worth of projects to have a Ground character PvP ready. It's an extra 11 days (13 with dyson) if the player feels a desire to have a full Mk XII set instead of an Mk XI set.
The winter event is in full swing, which means marks to complete said reputation systems are very easy to obtain in large quantities. The Dilithium needed to obtain said sets is also much lower compared to space (16,500 for a full ground Mk XI set and 28,500 for a full ground Mk XII set).
Outside of the winter event, it's just a matter of running 18 Space STFs, 18 Crystaline Entity Elites, 20 Dyson Elites, and collecting 3x Epohhs from New Romulus to reach Tier V in all reputation systems. For a Space PvPer, they would probably be able to do all of those space missions in a few hours. (Minus Dyson, which would need to be a daily thing).
With all of that said, I'm curious to hear what keeps Space PvPers from trying Ground PvP. Is it a lack of interest, a lack of informational materials, or is it something else?
The winter event is in full swing, which means marks to complete said reputation systems are very easy to obtain in large quantities. The Dilithium needed to obtain said sets is also much lower compared to space (16,500 for a full ground Mk XI set and 28,500 for a full ground Mk XII set).
Outside of the winter event, it's just a matter of running 18 Space STFs, 18 Crystaline Entity Elites, 20 Dyson Elites, and collecting 3x Epohhs from New Romulus to reach Tier V in all reputation systems. For a Space PvPer, they would probably be able to do all of those space missions in a few hours. (Minus Dyson, which would need to be a daily thing).
With all of that said, I'm curious to hear what keeps Space PvPers from trying Ground PvP. Is it a lack of interest, a lack of informational materials, or is it something else?
--->Ground PvP Concerns Directory 4.0
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
Post edited by majortiraomega on
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Second, I like space more than ground, period. It's nice every now and again, to do a ground map, but generally not as fun for me, as the space battles.
butcher suspect, "What'd you hit me with?"
Temperance Brennan, "A building"
Is a mix of things i think. First of all the population is far lower than space pvp, and space pvp the population is already low.
The balance issues from the past scare people away, ground has always been more unbalanced and full of exploits than space (i don't know now, space is in a very bad shape right now).
Ground PvP fleets trend to be all the oposite of space pvp fleets, what do i mean with this? many of the space pvp fleets trend to avoid "cheese" in order to keep the fun going (there are exceptions i know, but in general that is the way of the community), but in ground is the opposite, pvp fleets try to use every TRIBBLE they can find to ruin the game experience, don't know why but in general ground players/fleets seems to have a bigger ego.
For me in particular, i don't like the mechanics of ground, i really hate the rpg mode, it feels dumb, i prefer a shooter mode were u have to "aim" for make a kill, but with rpg is just select and activate powers.
Also the need of make a diferent char is deal breaker for me, i don't know why cryptic insist with having a single skill tree for space and ground, i should be able of have a skill tree for each thing without one affecting the other, same for traits, instead of universal traits slots, we should have space and ground slots, so we could use the same character for both things.
Vin Naftero@playhard88 - FED Sciencie
K'tan@playhard88 - KDF Tactical
Argento@playhard88 - RRF Tactical (FED)
All of these are "in my opinion", and in no specific order:
1) Movement mechanics in space feel more fluid than ground.
2) There are a ton of "ground" focused MMOs/games, "space combat" is a bit less common and is more of what I want in a star trek game.
3) Ground PvP community seems even smaller than Space PvP community, and occasionally more toxic to each other (although this is probably just perception).
4) Ship "builds" are more involved, with more gear and more customization in BOFF powers vs. ground kits which are "locked".
5) I'd have to devote a full character specifically to ground due to skill points allotment, traits, etc.
6) Ground "exploits" and broken/OP items seem to even be in a worse state than space often is.
For the record I took a few ground bootcamp lessons, it didn't really get me motivated to do ground pvp after the fact though.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgHfsZ_eLGc
You know you are a master combatant when you can expose someone's nipples with a single swipe of a giant two handed spoon.
EDIT: I added some screenshots from my glory days.
A really good 2v2 (Tac+Sci on each side)
Space noobs beating ground pros
this. i dont play any other mmos because the entire concept of the 3rd person ground rpg stuff never did anything for me, but sto has space, thats what makes it special.
Now's the time to try it again. So many exploits have been fixed the enjoyment has gone up at least for me. Things like the black poo dampening field suck but unfortunately it's not going away.
Vanilla Ground PvP information
Back in the day when space and ground had separate skill trees ie. not one pool of points spread across both, ground pvp thrived.
People are just not willing to gimp their space builds trying to squeeze every ounce into space.
I would love it if Cryptic gave us +44k skill points and +8 Trait slots, making one set space only and one set ground only for a total of 16 traits and 400k total skill points. Of course I'd also have a few redundant characters at that point.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
This.
Personally, I like this version better - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3twVZ7jWsw
I find everything is 100x better with mortal kombat sound track :P
Elite Defense Stovokor
In general I tend to find there is a higher maturity level in space pvp, and I think if a few of these space fleets would bring that professional attitude to ground pvp they could shake things up really fast.
How many times I have died because I press keys only to find that they are not triggering fast enough...
LOL particularly when I have a dino stomping on my head!!
Same thing can be said about space buffs, how many times i have to hit faw and tt and then faw again to get it to go off, that's why in space you prepare for it, why not do the same on ground, aka, your low on health, but instead of hitting hypo i see most people hit fire.......then hit hypo and not have hypo do anything cuz the fire animation is still in progress and they die and then say, ground sucks
Space pvp also has the problem of misfiring abilities, especially if you have about 10 of them in a spacebar bind lol. Just like in space if you try to fire off multiple abilities at once, it can confuse the game and potentially none will fire. Same applies to ground.
Ground pvp just brings the issue to the fore more so because the pace is faster, and many situations come up that require very hasty response.
Thinking of ground pvp more so as turn based could help. Example, you see the opponent who has you targeted use their "turn" to hulk up on tac buffs, then you use your "turn" to prep a couple of defensive abilities. Or the tac could already have tac buffs up and is heading your way. In a way he is using his "turn" to move towards you, which gives you time take your "turn".
There are always situations that come up where you are just like wth! was that, and you died. But thankfully the majority are decently preventable.
Maybe everything will just "click" thinking this way.
Then, with help of two self-confessed heroes of Ground PvP started bullying players into fighting them in PVE channels i decided Ground can go die. There are some true asshats in Space, but i just don't want the association with the kind of people Ground seems to foster.
Maybe it's just me thinking this, but i think you've made the bed, you've made threads openly flaunting how your 5 mans can trolls the queues for consecutive days.
Doesn't sound like fun to me, so i'll stick to the PvE ground that i've grown to enjoy.
@Aquitaine985
Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
Oooooooh. That's what the expose mechanic is about. It makes total sense now! Though to be in line with canon, when Kirk's tunic was ripped it wasn't a debuff. He got like +1,000,000 to all combat stats and Superior Sex Icon as a trait.
I guess that's one way to look at it. Usually I have zone off in matches to avoid that nonsense although the need for that has lessened substantially. Dunno, I don't think playing to intentionally exacerbate people who are easily frustrated is a good reason to play any game. I play to have fun with friends and hopefully have a challenging match. Purposely trying to set people off just isn't part of that equation. Just seems like a strange motivation to me but to each their own.
Ground is in a good spot right now, with the remaining bugs being relatively minor. Even if they don't change the biochemist doff it doesn't seem game breaking OP even if the stacking is clearly glitched.
It's the same as space or anything else. It takes practice and effort to get better and anyone coming in new would have to accept that there would be a large experience gap between them and veterans.
Vanilla Ground PvP information
Last season added some real trash to ground tho. (dark clouds with dampening field, chasing orbital strikes are annoying too, but they are not op)
[Combat (Self)] You lose 6549 (7572) Cold from the torment of the underworld.
In-game handle @Janetza
Space is much worse. I can't count the number of times I've queued for a Space arena, only to find that I'm up against 2x Aux2Bat Scimitar, 1x Recluse Healer, and 2x Wells. At least with ground there is still a chance for victory against a true full premade. The odds of getting PvP regular teamates on the ground is also significantly higher than in space due to the smaller community. The majority of the players that don't run in premades are used to fighting with each other due to the size of the community, significantly increasing the possibility of beating a premade.
Cryo Immobilizer Module, the Biochemist duty officer, the Dampening Field trait (visual effects needs to be toned down), and the DoT Security Officer all need fixes before I'd be truly happy with the state of Ground PvP.
Although I think there's something wrong with Chroniton Mine Barrier IV, I think they are dealing more damage than they should. Yesterday I was getting hit with mines dealing ~750 damage per mine before resistances, that's enough to oneshot a player 3 times over per field....and engineers may deploy one field every 22 seconds. There's also the matter of having those mines flank on every attack, which should not be happening.
There are ways to easily counter the cloak attack. I made a rather lengthy post about it a month ago. If you are interested in learning how to counter cloaking strikes, please read this: http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=13236831&postcount=2
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
Ground PvP was striked by premades so many times. Those fleets that did it were FES, Hammer, KIG, -FS-, 1. Fleet Command Germany. One fleet which I stated didn't start so earlier, but on example, FS, FES, and possibly Hammer/KIG. (Though I'm not sure for these both)
Because of our own interests and enemy treaties we've destroyed Ground PvP ourselfes. It's everyone's fault. Mine, my fleetmates', FS', FES', Hammer's. We've let our self-interest interfere and not care about the players who were stomped by those premades.
Am I whining? No. There are many kids who were raging about premades stomping them. I don't speak on their behalf, but that's what I think. I as one do not rage when I get defeated by a premade, on the countrary, it's challenging and fun, but there are many other players who think opposite.
Also as said before, there are many trolls/douchebags in Ground PvP.
Why Space PvPers don't the Ground PvP? I think it's because they have tried Ground PvP way way before I even set my foot on it, and they did not like it because of the following reasons:
1. They were raging that they were constantly getting stomped by premades.
2. They just were not interested.
3. They didn't liked it and couldn't find any way to develop at it (to become better), so they quit it and liked Space PvP more.
This is my opinion, and if I get a response I'd prefer not some flame post about how much I'm wrong. I'm probably wrong and open for any criticizm, but I really think the fault lies in us. Yes, of course because of some bugs Ground PvP seems kinda unstable, but I really think the fault lies in us players.
''The most disgusting ship you can ever see in the universe. Yes. Truly.''
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