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The borg and Dyson Sphere
asheistheraven
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The Voth, well okay I'll let it pass. I like having them as a new enemy, but I would rather think the bigger threat to the Sphere would have been the Borg, considering the Omega Particle. Though I'm hoping Cryptic didn't miss out on this opportunity as surely the Sphere would be swarmed with Borg sooner or later. Thus far the Borg feel like less of a threat later as they are an annoyance. The Dyson Sphere should be a perfect opportunity to make the Borg a greater threat, considering the zealous relationship with the Omega particle.
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I'm actually wondering how a huge structure the size of a Dyson sphere, which is basically inside the Borg's backyard, that is capturing the very element that the Borg revere, is somehow totally ignored by the Borg, and yet the Voth, who have really no connection to the Omega particle or the Dyson sphere are suddenly very interested in it.
I can still move.
I can still fight.
I will never give up!
Actually given that one Blog about the Romulan sensors going out to 30,000 light years (which is still stupid fyi), that puts the Dyson sphere not in the Borg's Back yard, but in their front yard. In short, its near the Galactic Core than in the depths of the Delta Quadrant.
Which technically would have it near the Borg Transwarp Hub. But we still don't know the status of the Borg, except we know they are still functioning (The Hive supposed to take place in the Borg Unicomplex in the Delta Quadrant, from what we were told).
So if the Borg was pushed back, then they wouldn't know about the Dyson Sphere.
Then there is the Iconian and Voth factors who likely are keeping the Borg at bay.
As for the Delta quadrant and Borg go.. the Borg do not control all of the quadrant, thats 1/4 of the Milky Way ffs. Anything outside of what they control is anyones guess including the Borg's.
Omega particle and Voth? Ok easy enough, an advanced species wants it for some advanced species stuff that is not the Borg. I am sure if Empress Sela found it she would want it too, Or the Dominion, or any other enemies. Wow like that is hard to grasp.
"I'm drunk, whats your excuse for being an idiot?" - Unknown drunk man. :eek:
I would buy the we don't know about what the Borg are doing right now, except that a) the sphere isn't new it's been there for millenia, so by now you'd figure they'd have found it and b) concidering that the Borg prime directive is, at all costs secure the Omega, they would more then likely stop EVERYTHING and go after this sphere.
The way that this would be revealed to the Borg is either through assimilation of some Starfleet, Romulan Republic, or KDF personnel or one of the Liberated Borg is not actually Liberated.
True true. But correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it said the Omega was turned on recently? So the Borg likely don't know about it.......yet.
And now that we now know that this Dyson Sphere is a home or a base of the Solinae, whom are one of the Iconian servitor races. I don't think the Iconians would be willing to let the Borg take over that technology, unless they are willing to scuttle the sphere in order to keep it out of the hands of the Voth, Federation, Romulans, Klingons, and the Borg.
That's why the Borg hasn't taken claim yet, because the Iconians keep them from away from it.
Depending on how the dyson sphere is constructed, from long range it would of been missed by the Borg, or if not they have no intended use for it. Remember the Borg can only adapt and learn about things through assimilation, what they do not assimilate they do not understand. they may have already sent cubes and spheres at it with no luck, and without knowing the details, the entry/exit portal scanners may not accept Borg ships as a rule anyway.
Romulan sensors probably go that far out, likely in some sort of research agreement with the federation and the use of the MIDAS array or they can scan the otherside of an active Iconian ship sized gateway and get readings back, you create a gateway to one location and a disturbance has to exist for a ship to appear, nothing saying the disturbance can't accept signals coming back from that side.
as for the borg, remember that they were in the area swarming the place, it is more then likely they knew about the sphere but it may not of been very high on their plans to assimilate to understand, at least before the unicomplex was destroyed along with the transwarp hub and trillions of drones by the ever reckless janeway.
Scans are deflected from the outside and the only way you know it is there is from the deflected scans and direct visual observation by close fly by. The Enterprise-D figured it out, so there is nothing stating others can not figure it out on their own, borg included.
Again unknown what the Borg may thing, want or desire from the sphere, they likely knew it was there after all do not forget the billions of drones that serve the collective including brilliant scientists who have knowledge of such a thing in their own cultures as theories. it wouldn't take them long to realize what it is. But the Borg do not adapt until they assimilated something that can help them understand more. so again they may know of it, perhaps even very interested in the sphere, but completely clueless as to how to open the portal doors to go inside?
Nothing is known as to how the Iconians feel about the Borg, there was only a tiny mention on one of their consoles in that subspace layer place about Earth and the Humans, but that is far from knowing the intent. For all we know the Iconians built the Borg and have included a hidden shut down code the Borg still do not know of for all we know. so really until there is something to back up that claim, can not say either way how the Iconians will deal with the Borg.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Given Federation sensors are the best and they go out a few parsecs, them saying the Romulan Republic having new sensors of 30,000 light years is.......well pulling numbers our their keesers. But at least it gives us a general location of the Dyson Sphere.
And signals don't work like that, remember with the Bajoran Wormhole, they had to set up a relay on the other end. The same principle would apply to the gateways as well.
We can't absolutely say for sure if the Borg mapped it and ignored it, same goes with the Iconians.
And if they did, obviously they wasn't interested since it gave no sign of technology to be worthy of assimilation.
Lets go what we know, the Iconians know how to manipulate the Borg.
But right now, we have nothing linking Iconians to the Borg history or their technology, so we shouldn't go assuming such things.
Assimilation is not required for adaptation or learning. The Borg are capable of developing new solutions and technologies to overcome obstacles or solve problems at a pace that can blow one's mind. They don't need to assimilate something to understand it or implement a new technology. Assimilated information is just part of the Collective's information base.
And adaptation? If assimilation was required, then a Borg Cube or Drone would not be able to adapt to a newly encountered foe's weapons, or overcome their defenses, in a matter of seconds.
I fully agree. That's what made the Borg so damn scary in TNG.
Unfortunately, Voyager decided to be stupid and throw out a line that the Borg don't understand what they can't assimilate, hence why they were unable to fight Species 8472. As much as I love Scorpion, that part of it does irk me.
A Romulan Strike Team, Missing Farmers and an ancient base on a Klingon Border world. But what connects them? Find out in my First Foundary mission: 'The Jeroan Farmer Escapade'
The Iconians are probably manipulating the Voth.
To the OP: perhaps the Borg are re-grouping after the Alpha Quadrant species have destroyed their Hive.
A Romulan Strike Team, Missing Farmers and an ancient base on a Klingon Border world. But what connects them? Find out in my First Foundary mission: 'The Jeroan Farmer Escapade'
You're an order of magnitude off here. It's 135km long, or 135 thousand meters long. Not 135 thousand km.
Bigger? Not by a long shot. Just check the scale in the last dev blog, the Voth mother ship makes Borg cubes look like specks. And they aren't just bigger in size, the Voth have technology that is far superior to the collective.
While I do agree that this should certainly generate a lot of interest from the collective and that there should be some Borg encounters, they wouldn't be the main threat. In fact, the Voth might be weakened enough by them throwing every cube they have at them that the combined Federation, Klingon, and Romulan forces will actually stand a chance, which would make more sense, so hopefully that will be mentioned at least.
9 Episodes = 30+ episodes...?
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
It's pronounced "S.T.O." "Stow" sounds idiotic! lol
However, cryptic has killed the borg as an enemy so leave them be.
I think we can infer but not confirm the following:
(1) The Iconians use Omega to lure and disable or destroy Borg while already being powerful enough to destroy or disable them without doing so.
(2) The Borgs requirement to have to study them the old fashioned way implies that no Iconian has ever been assimilated.
TRIBBLE Hydra! Hail Janeway!
haha yeah wasn't wearing my glasses here and i just saw the 135.0 and to me it looked like 135,000 km was thinking about it and didn't sound right, thanks for the tip hehe. But thats still a significant size difference and the borg being in the same quadrant would of faced the voth before.. and from what it seems they either didn't face them or did and got their cubes sent back in little packages piece by piece... :P
The only tactical value of the ship is in the forces it can deploy, which include several dreadnoughts, a number of battleships, dozens if not hundreds of cruisers and frigates, likely many millions of Voth with their attendant mechanized and warbeast units. While it is likely able to extend force over an entire sector, it contributes very little to that force.
In short, this ship is a liability. Too many eggs in one basket. It's highly vulnerable to asymmetric warfare, attacks on the fortress can have a much larger impact than direct military confrontation with the forces it deploys, and at much lower casualty risk: Consider not only the ships we destroy during the event, but the ones we seal inside their launch bays and leave for dead during the reactor explosion. Those are all ships that, if the Voth ran things like Starfleet, would be spread throughout the combat zone and not centralized in a location where many of them can be ambushed and many more destroyed without even entering combat.
Why do the borg not go where dinosaurs walk? Because perhaps thats a battle the collective would like to avoid for now.
That aside: we only learn of the omega because w get a sensor reading in from a gate inside.
The Sphere itself could very well be containing any Omega signatures so the borg might not even realize. The Idea of a dyson shell after all IS the total enclosure and capture of all outgoing emissions from the star, that should include the omega signature.
And i would like to again remind people:
The BORG ARE NOT INVINCIBLE!
The Gamma quadrant is Held by the Dominion, a monolithic Empire that is Totally geared for War and can SPAM ships and troops.
We KNOW Shapeshifters can take even exotic forms, FIRE for example. How would the Borg fight that? They have not yet successfully because i have never seen Jem hadar borg or Assimilated shapeshifters.... So Yeah, thats a wasp nest best left at peace, even if you are the Collective.
In the Delta quadrant we have already seen SEVERAL Very highly advanced species trolling around. The Borg are SURROUNDED by people that HATE them with gusto.
Yes their resources are exapansive and yes they have lots of ships, but they also have lots of ground to cover. Those transwarp hubs are needed because the collective constantly needs to shift around its forces to counter their foes. And powerful foes they are because i do not see the BORG stream rolling the universe....
That brings me back to the Voth: They left earth millions of years ago.
Millions. From har har flintlocks to FCK YEAH SPACESHIPS! it was ~600 years for humanity. And by now we do pose a distant threat to the collective. They cant just harvest us anymore because the whole adaption schtick has danced its last dance, they would need to send the bug guns in numbers now.
The Voth have been around a wee bit longer. Millions of years.
The Bigger question here is really how the hell are those guys not stomping the universe by now... well because they are led by religious hacks.... A bit of an isolationist agenda too....
oh btw: The krenim build a ship that was invulnerable and able to literally push your TRIBBLE out of time. No borg there and the guy presumably did this for a few hundred ears already....
Why no borg? Because why attract the attention of that guy with his invulnerable ship.... that could just flat out murder you from time....
Heck, at the end we get a slightly benevolent krenim empire.... BUT IT WAS STILL AT WAR WITH ITS NEIGHBORS!!!!!!! WHICH could apparently keep em at bay! So chew on that.
The Borg are a mighty moloch, but its surrounded by the freaking Bizarro Justice league of space empires....
They simply can' be everywhere and TRIBBLE of everyone at once.
The Voth would disable our ships, take us prisoner, and that would be the end of that. KDF and a few melee focused Starfleet or Republic crews might make a bit of an impact once their ships are boarded after all systems and even handheld energy weapons are disabled, but the Voth as they were in the show are simply too powerful for Starfleet, the Klingons, or the Romulans to face and even have a hope of winning against.
So, yes, hevach, the Voth in game are easy pickings... because if they weren't dumbed down, they would kill everything that got in their way like they were stomping through a field of helpless kittens with some big ol' spiked boots on.
You mean those guys with the big cubes we use as casual target practice in kerrat?
Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
A Dinobot
"The Borg - party-poopers of the galaxy" ~ The Doctor
There is nothing in Voyager to suggest the Voth are this advanced. Voyager's only observations on their technology were:
1. Phased cloaking (a technology the Federation, Klingons, and Romulans possess but do not use)
2. Transwarp drive (a technology the Federation did not have at the time, but does now - and mastered in decades what held the Voth back for millennia)
3. Electronic warfare systems including remote override and power drain (systems which the Federation has encountered in many other races, some of them more effective, and has developed countermeasures for all)
4. Transporters capable of beaming an entire ship a short distance
5. Sensors capable of discerning individual life forms over several light years (Starfleet has managed in the shows under special circumstances)
Nothing on their offensive or defensive capabilities.
We also know from the Temporal Cold War that within 200 years, the Federation will field a class of ship far larger and superior to the Voth city ship Voyager encountered (Enterprise-J).
Everything in the shows only establishes the Voth being perhaps 1-200 years advanced over Voyager, and Voyager is at the other end of the late 24th century tech explosion that continues breakneck in STO. Held back by doctrine, they have not changed - they took millions of years to get that far ahead, while Starfleet needed only a few hundred. They are by a more reasonable assessment perhaps 50-100 years advanced over Starfleet at worst, little better than the Tholians were in Kirk's time, and we were able to stand up to the Tholians then and since - and the Tholians are not held back as the Voth are, but have continued to advance.