So what is your list of items that are pay4advantage over others?

shadowwraith77 · September 2013

Well for starters it would include just about everything in the C-Store, paid membership and Fleet ships, but some of my favorites are.

http://sto.gamepedia.com/Marion_Frances_Dulmur

http://sto.gamepedia.com/Silent_Enemy_Set (particularly the Bio-neural Infusion Circuits)

http://sto.gamepedia.com/Console_-_Tachyokinetic_Converter

http://sto.gamepedia.com/Console_-_Rule_62_Multipurpose_Combat_Console#Console_-_Rule_62_Multipurpose_Combat_Console (not really the set but the Rule 62 console in general)

These are just a few simple examples of pay4advantage over others that have helped in creating power creep!!!

Please list yours!!!

topset · September 2013

Pretty much everything in the game these days.

Just take the entire contents of lockboxes, the lobi store, and the c-store and put them into a giant list.

But what else would you expect from an Asian MMO. They're all like that, horrendous money grabs. The only reason I play is because I love the Star Trek IP and have become good enough at this game to be able to get any lobi/zen/p4advantage item without giving PWE any money.

Although I'd hate to add up the amount of money I used to put into this game 1 year+ ago.

shadowwraith77 · September 2013

topset wrote: »

Pretty much everything in the game these days.

Just take the entire contents of lockboxes, the lobi store, and the c-store and put them into a giant list.

But what else would you expect from an Asian MMO. They're all like that, horrendous money grabs. The only reason I play is because I love the Star Trek IP and have become good enough at this game to be able to get any lobi/zen/p4advantage item without giving PWE any money.

Although I'd hate to add up the amount of money I used to put into this game 1 year+ ago.

LOL yeah I hear ya there topset!!!

burstorion · September 2013

Incoming 'its not p2w or p2advantage!' argument in 3, 2, 1....

-transports off thread-

dahminus · September 2013

0, everything in game can be acquired through in game means... paying real money is a short cut

lucho80 · September 2013

The Ferengi console I like. You add more flow caps to a drain boat and add some extra torpedo damage on top.

jdskjflkjdfklsjf · September 2013

Huh what ?

R.L. cash is for the lazy , impatient ppl.
Only thing i'v found that i can't get ingame is the Red Matter Capacitor.

omegashinzon · September 2013

shadowwraith77 wrote: »

Well for starters it would include just about everything in the C-Store, paid membership and Fleet ships, but some of my favorites are.

http://sto.gamepedia.com/Marion_Frances_Dulmur

http://sto.gamepedia.com/Silent_Enemy_Set (particularly the Bio-neural Infusion Circuits)

http://sto.gamepedia.com/Console_-_Tachyokinetic_Converter

http://sto.gamepedia.com/Console_-_Rule_62_Multipurpose_Combat_Console#Console_-_Rule_62_Multipurpose_Combat_Console (not really the set but the Rule 62 console in general)

These are just a few simple examples of pay4advantage over others that have helped in creating power creep!!!

Please list yours!!!

Next time you go into pvp and get wrecked in 2.5 seconds, just ask what they are using and there's your list. (assuming they are in good enough mood to answer the likes of you)

senatorvreenak · September 2013

dahminus wrote: »

0, everything in game can be acquired through in game means... paying real money is a short cut

Thats actually quite wrong.
If "everyone" went by that then it would be virtually impossible to get the lockbox stuff.
Some people MUST pay for the economy to work, for all these items to actually exist to be obtainable through in-game means.

baudl · September 2013

dahminus wrote: »

0, everything in game can be acquired through in game means... paying real money is a short cut

pretty much this, even if people disagree for whatever reason.
other MMOs require people to grind, with no shortcut...STO requires you to grind, but there is a shortcut...your real money.
many consider this unfair, i do not...it is infact what keeps the economy running in this game.

i played hours over hours WOW and still didn't manage to get THE top end gear (though very close)...in STO i never bought zen directly, i was a subscriber for nearly 400 days, and i have everything i want in the game with about half of the time i spend in WOW. And in WOW i payed over 700 euros in more or less 6 years in subscription fees. Via very cheap gametimecards STO cost me about 70-80 euros for those 400 days subscription and i'm here for 2 and a half years.

STO = best f2p model i know to date in MMOs...very casual friendly, and seems to bring PWE good money. WIN WIN

shadowwraith77 · September 2013

burstorion wrote: »

Incoming 'its not p2w or p2advantage!' argument in 3, 2, 1....

-transports off thread-

There was no mention of p2w, because you can win with free stuff that isn't paid for, this is simply a thread on what you can pay for to get an advantage over someone who hasn't or won't.
About the only p2w on this game is you pay for a key, you open a lockbox, and you win something that's about it!!!

neoakiraii · September 2013

shadowwraith77 wrote: »

There was no mention of p2w, because you can win with free stuff that isn't paid for, this is simply a thread on what you can pay for to get an advantage over someone who hasn't or won't.

You just defined P2W and said it's not ???

shadowwraith77 · September 2013

neoakiraii wrote: »

You just defined P2W and said it's not ???

How is that p2w when someone with completely free (not paid for) stuff can win over other's who have paid for an advantage? Or win in every aspect of the game with free unpaid for stuff?

lianthelia · September 2013

senatorvreenak wrote: »

Thats actually quite wrong.
If "everyone" went by that then it would be virtually impossible to get the lockbox stuff.
Some people MUST pay for the economy to work, for all these items to actually exist to be obtainable through in-game means.

So? Just because some people choose to spend money on lockboxes and stuff doesn't mean it isn't possible to buy things completely in game.

You could get anything you want from a lockbox/c-store/exchange without having to spend one cent. The only things you cant obtain is vet stuff but that doesn't really affect gameplay.

neoakiraii · September 2013

shadowwraith77 wrote: »

How is that p2w when someone with completely free (not paid for) stuff can win over other's who have paid for an advantage? Or win in every aspect of the game with free unpaid for stuff?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Pay+to+win+definition

wildchild8 · September 2013

Have to agreed with guys re everythigns IS available for free. stuff is easily grindable over time if you want it... even lobi stuff... albeit at a much longer time to earn it but doable.

as for the advantages... I remember flying old skool builds in the PVP q's recently in training for a tourny(no c cstore consoles or ships, no doffs, no stfs sets/rep gear and so forth) and was still able to face roll the weaker players and some of the more experienced players alike.

you dont need all the fancay gear to do well once you know what you're at. the gear just helps thats along. and if you've ground the fancay gear. in my mind you're all more then entitled to use it, you earned it... dont have the gear and feel a little unpowered because of it verus guys with... then go grind it just like they did....

point of my post... dont make gear a patsy so your own problems or lack of basic build knowledge... theres plenty of info on the forums... and no reason you cant have the same setups as the guys pounding you if you really want... if they're still pounding you... look into what they're doing better and improve... its how we all got there!

shadowwraith77 · September 2013

neoakiraii wrote: »

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Pay+to+win+definition

Sorry I don't buy those weak definitions!!!

This game could be more closely compared to a drag race between two perfectly exact cars handed to you for free. Both have an equal chance of winning with you behind the wheel of either, but also have the same odds of losing as well. Now if different drivers are used meaning you and someone else those odds can and may change, but it's still free and both drivers have a chance of winning or losing. Now let's pay4advantage over the other by adding some headers, engine upgrades, lightened weight, better tires etc... so now one car has paid for an advantage over the other. If the car that has all the upgrades still loses than it hasn't accomplished much in the way of p2w because it isn't winning, all it has is a paid4advantage (or in some terms p4an increased chance 2 win) over the other!!!

topset · September 2013

baudl wrote: »

pretty much this, even if people disagree for whatever reason.
other MMOs require people to grind, with no shortcut...STO requires you to grind, but there is a shortcut...your real money.

I don't really agree with this. The only real "grind" in the game is the fleet and reputation systems, which can't be shortcut with real money.

shadowwraith77 · September 2013

topset wrote: »

I don't really agree with this. The only real "grind" in the game is the fleet and reputation systems, which can't be shortcut with real money.

Time wise due to timers yes, time to fill projects not so much as you can make EC's and dilithium thru use of real money so in a sense yes real money can play a factor in rep and fleet advancement!!! But otherwise yes you are pretty much correct.

thecosmic1 · September 2013

topset wrote: »

I don't really agree with this. The only real "grind" in the game is the fleet and reputation systems, which can't be shortcut with real money.

But you can short-cut all the requirements for those things with real money. I would imagine that most Fleetbases currently at T5 were paid for, in part, with purchased Zen traded for Dilithium - and many have sold purchased Keys and whatnot to raise EC, etc. And even now we see people willing to sell their Fleet Marks for ECs.

Money gets you around the grind in many ways.

shadowwraith77 · September 2013

thecosmic1 wrote: »

But you can short-cut all the requirements for those things with real money. I would imagine that most Fleetbases currently at T5 were paid for, in part, with purchased Zen traded for Dilithium - and many have sold purchased Keys and whatnot to raise EC, etc. And even now we see people willing to sell their Fleet Marks for ECs.

Money gets you around the grind in many ways.

LOL beat you to the punch line!!!

stardestroyer001 · September 2013

thecosmic1 wrote: »

But you can short-cut all the requirements for those things with real money. I would imagine that most Fleetbases currently at T5 were paid for, in part, with purchased Zen traded for Dilithium - and many have sold purchased Keys and whatnot to raise EC, etc. And even now we see people willing to sell their Fleet Marks for ECs.

Money gets you around the grind in many ways.

The requirements aren't the hard part; the 20 hour timer is. That can't be circumvented with money. It's also a reason why people are beginning to want a lump sum method of completing all 5 tiers in one massive grind pile.

ursusmorologus · September 2013

topset wrote: »

I don't really agree with this. The only real "grind" in the game is the fleet and reputation systems, which can't be shortcut with real money.

The only "grind" to them is generating credits/dilithium, and you can definitely shortcut those grinds with real money. The rest of those systems are just time-wait, that's downtime not grinding.

thecosmic1 · September 2013

stardestroyer001 wrote: »

The requirements aren't the hard part; the 20 hour timer is. That can't be circumvented with money. It's also a reason why people are beginning to want a lump sum method of completing all 5 tiers in one massive grind pile.

If you're here and have the resources the timer means nothing: 1 day, 2 days, it doesn't matter The timer just determines how quickly it gets done, not how much it costs to do. If you don't have the resources you never get to the timer at all.

stardestroyer001 · September 2013

thecosmic1 wrote: »

If you're here and have the resources the timer means nothing: 1 day, 2 days, it doesn't matter The timer just determines how quickly it gets done, not how much it costs to do. If you don't have the resources you never get to the timer at all.

Again, the resources aren't an issue with me, since I can either grind in advance, grind now, or pay money to purchase the commodities/transfer into Dil. It's the non-negotiable timer which prevents me from completing the tiers in a reasonable amount of time. Non-negotiable, meaning I can't offer any ingame or paid resources to speed things up.

topset · September 2013

ursusmorologus wrote: »

The only "grind" to them is generating credits/dilithium, and you can definitely shortcut those grinds with real money. The rest of those systems are just time-wait, that's downtime not grinding.

Nah, the "grind" in starbases is donating doffs, sitting there mashing your mouse key to buy, open, and donate duty officers.

The EC, and the dilithium, if you have a lot of people who actively contribute that's just stuff you get by playing the content you enjoy.

shadowwraith77 · September 2013

topset wrote: »

Nah, the "grind" in starbases is donating doffs, sitting there mashing your mouse key to buy, open, and donate duty officers.

The EC, and the dilithium, if you have a lot of people who actively contribute that's just stuff you get by playing the content you enjoy.

Rom toons are the best for common doff collection, but EC's and someone else's grind can eliminate your grind time to a minimum for doffs.

thecosmic1 · September 2013

stardestroyer001 wrote: »

Again, the resources aren't an issue with me, since I can either grind in advance, grind now, or pay money to purchase the commodities/transfer into Dil. It's the non-negotiable timer which prevents me from completing the tiers in a reasonable amount of time. Non-negotiable, meaning I can't offer any ingame or paid resources to speed things up.

If you can buy Dilithum, ECs, Fleet Marks, etc then you don't need to spend the time grinding them. You can do what you want and let your money do the work for you. You can start a project and let the timer run while you go and do other things rather then start grinding for the next timer.

So if I can buy my Fleet Marks and Dilithium I can skip grinding them and go and grind my Rom Marks instead. Thus I'm saving time. The timer is irrelevant.

milandare · September 2013

Time-gated content is why I have not tried PvP, perhaps that is entirely my loss, but it feels like if I did catch up things would have moved on already. There's no real science behind my analysis, if I had time for that I'd do the time-gated content. So for me it's not a case of p2w, simply dp2l.

bannon3 · September 2013

thecosmic1 wrote: »

If you can buy Dilithum, ECs, Fleet Marks, etc then you don't need to spend the time grinding them. You can do what you want and let your money do the work for you. You can start a project and let the timer run while you go and do other things rather then start grinding for the next timer.

So if I can buy my Fleet Marks and Dilithium I can skip grinding them and go and grind my Rom Marks instead. Thus I'm saving time. The timer is irrelevant.

I agree with this, or at least have dil packages in the cstore, like 500 dil for X amount, 1.000 for X and so on. Having the mining claims help but if you cant get them and dont do all the grinding accumulating dil takes forever so I dont bother really.

havokreign · September 2013

bannon3 wrote: »

I agree with this, or at least have dil packages in the cstore, like 500 dil for X amount, 1.000 for X and so on. Having the mining claims help but if you cant get them and dont do all the grinding accumulating dil takes forever so I dont bother really.

It's called contraband.

So what is your list of items that are pay4advantage over others?

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