Of course under that same light, wouldn't you then want a BRF and a BSV to go with it? Because let's face it, BFAW is... well... yeah... XD.
I mean you see lots of instances of BRF in the shows, and you see things similar to BSV in the show as well, so if you were to take out the limitation on SST to beams, I would want to see ALL tac powers universalized.
But I would maintain that if you were going to do that, keep the damage types separate as abilities go. But I think I see where you're going with this. And I semi-approve, but at the same time... your initial arguments kind of lost me tbh...
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
it's very simple... I want the "beam" taken out of all tac powers and want it to extend to all energy weapons. That is it. Not so hard, right? Or is my tac officer too stupid to be able to communicate with my helmsman to line up the nose of the ship on the target's engines and "disable engine subsystem" with cannons?
You'd have 8 abilities that lock each other out for 15s. The BTS abilities lock you out of BO/FAW just like BO/FAW lock each other out. Just like CSV/CRF lock each other out.
It would cause problems for folks that currently mix in a DBB with their Cannons - since they are distinct now, there are things you can do with them that you couldn't do if they were all linked.
Still though, I still think the BTS abilities should be a single ability - Beam Target Subsystems, where the player is able to select which subsystem the ability should target - rather than having to carry multiple copies of the ability. By rolling the four abilities into one, it would create space for the addition of other Tac abilities that could alleviate that feeling of the build being cookie cutter...
You'd have 8 abilities that lock each other out for 15s. The BTS abilities lock you out of BO/FAW just like BO/FAW lock each other out. Just like CSV/CRF lock each other out.
It would cause problems for folks that currently mix in a DBB with their Cannons - since they are distinct now, there are things you can do with them that you couldn't do if they were all linked.
Still though, I still think the BTS abilities should be a single ability - Beam Target Subsystems, where the player is able to select which subsystem the ability should target - rather than having to carry multiple copies of the ability. By rolling the four abilities into one, it would create space for the addition of other Tac abilities that could alleviate that feeling of the build being cookie cutter...
Yeah, this is good.. allow the player to select the subsystem they wish to target. By consolidating the abilities, that would also open up on the tac player to new abilities being added. The way they are setup now is cumbersome.
Example:
Worf: Captain, I just returned from the starbase where I was trained in targetting auxiliary subsystems.
Picard: Excellent, Mister Worf.
*Romulan ship suddenly attacks the Enterprise and they are caught off guard, but able to survive. They cannot survive another attack so Picard orders..."
Picard: Mister Worf, we cannot survive another attack. Target their weapon systems and fire at my command.
Worf: I am sorry, Captain, but while I may have been trained in targeting weapon subsystems previously, I have forgotten how to do so. I can target aux subsystems for you or we can pause the fight while I return to the starbase and learn how to target weapon systems again.
Picard: Mister Worf, you are relieved of duty.
....... so idiotic. and the fact that cannons cannot attack a subsystem is equally ludicrous.
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In naval warfare the "escort" is simply a smaller ship that's cheaper to produce and acts as a screen for the more valuable larger ships. But since we don't have a definition for "cheaper to produce" in a MMORPG environment the escort had to be made equal to the larger battleships.
the fact that cannons cannot attack a subsystem is equally ludicrous.
Targeting subsystems was a special attack done by Tuvok, where he "modulated" the frequency of a phaser to penetrate shields and target a particular subsystem. That it became a general attack at all, in the sense that it has (including being built in to Sci Vessels) - is somewhat silly. Still, you couldn't do the same with a cannon (a pulse) that you could do with a beam (non-pulse).
Course, one could simply point to Phaser procs with pulse weapons. I'd say a second wrong thing shouldn't be used as a justification to do a third wrong thing...
Both targeting subsystems and the Phaser proc should be pulled. And on that topic, Viral Matrix should be pulled...bunch of script kiddies running around the universe attacking ship computers running Win95 or something, eh? Meh...
Targeting subsystems was a special attack done by Tuvok, where he "modulated" the frequency of a phaser to penetrate shields and target a particular subsystem. That it became a general attack at all, in the sense that it has (including being built in to Sci Vessels) - is somewhat silly. Still, you couldn't do the same with a cannon (a pulse) that you could do with a beam (non-pulse).
Course, one could simply point to Phaser procs with pulse weapons. I'd say a second wrong thing shouldn't be used as a justification to do a third wrong thing...
Both targeting subsystems and the Phaser proc should be pulled. And on that topic, Viral Matrix should be pulled...bunch of script kiddies running around the universe attacking ship computers running Win95 or something, eh? Meh...
Targeting various subsystems has been done with all manner of weapons including torpedoes. It's not a matter of magic modulation technobable, it's "hey, see that port there? that's a torpedo port, please disable their ability to fire those ouchie torpedoes by blowing that to hell."
I agree with the dialogue story above that it is ridiculous that our builds are so specialized and limited in general, if you want to target more than one subsystem, you're gonna carry multiple copies, if you want to divert emergency power, a system on your ship, to shields AND also be able to put it to engines or weapons, you're gonna need multiple copies. Many abilities would work better and be more trek-like if they were baked into the ship, since many of them are hardware functions, not really boff skills, however, I don't think the devs want to do that, as the game would lose the typical mmo trinity vibe they were aiming for. I'm not saying I wouldn't love for them to drop that and rework things, but I really doubt they will... at least not in the near future.
But yes, having "attack patterns" and being able to choose which one you want to use without having to eat up a whole bunch of boff skill slots would be nice. Being able to say "target shields" and all damage your ship does for the next 15 or so seconds goes to knocking down shield power/ 1% chance for each energy pulse to disable/5% chance for torpedoes to disable... something along those lines, would be very nice. All ships have a reserve of emergency power, being able to put that to shields or engines or weapons or aux (even though aux doesn't really make sense as that's: "reserve power to the backup power!" lol...) would be very nice... and yes, I would love it, push for it, please, make it happen. But... just being realistic, I myself, and plenty of other people have posted threads that have gone on for days arguing how the game should be more like that... and yet, here we are, same ol, same ol.
Targeting various subsystems has been done with all manner of weapons including torpedoes. It's not a matter of magic modulation technobable, it's "hey, see that port there? that's a torpedo port, please disable their ability to fire those ouchie torpedoes by blowing that to hell."
I agree with the dialogue story above that it is ridiculous that our builds are so specialized and limited in general, if you want to target more than one subsystem, you're gonna carry multiple copies, if you want to divert emergency power, a system on your ship, to shields AND also be able to put it to engines or weapons, you're gonna need multiple copies. Many abilities would work better and be more trek-like if they were baked into the ship, since many of them are hardware functions, not really boff skills, however, I don't think the devs want to do that, as the game would lose the typical mmo trinity vibe they were aiming for. I'm not saying I wouldn't love for them to drop that and rework things, but I really doubt they will... at least not in the near future.
But yes, having "attack patterns" and being able to choose which one you want to use without having to eat up a whole bunch of boff skill slots would be nice. Being able to say "target shields" and all damage your ship does for the next 15 or so seconds goes to knocking down shield power/ 1% chance for each energy pulse to disable/5% chance for torpedoes to disable... something along those lines, would be very nice. All ships have a reserve of emergency power, being able to put that to shields or engines or weapons or aux (even though aux doesn't really make sense as that's: "reserve power to the backup power!" lol...) would be very nice... and yes, I would love it, push for it, please, make it happen. But... just being realistic, I myself, and plenty of other people have posted threads that have gone on for days arguing how the game should be more like that... and yet, here we are, same ol, same ol.
agreed except one thing.. you can still have multiple copies "emergency power to subsystem" abilities.. the only difference is you have to choose which subsystem you want to augment for each copy before a battle.. i.e. you can't choose shields and then during battle, choose engines. Likewise, I cannot be distracted with a popup that says "which subsystem do you want to increase power?" dialog messages during battle each time i activate the power.
But on premise, I like it. This would include consolidation of the powers into 1, thus, free up more abilities for other new boff abilities.
Or.. like you said, get rid of them entirely and build them into the fundamental ship design. I always believe that boff abilities and magic consoles or subnuking every 3 minutes was ridiculous in this game. The ships should be able to survive on their own and 'special" abilities like subnuke should be like once per 15 minutes or something.
I keep trying to picture one of the famous DS9 battles and O'brien saying "captain, we have been subnuked again.. all abilities are on cooldown, however we still have all basic ship functions and can proceed with attack Sorry that we didn't pick up that science team back at starbase.. guess we'll have to wait this one out.
Later, when the subnuke wears off O'brien says "Captain, subnuke has worn off. We have now xx seconds until the next subnuke attack".
Yeah.. no battles ever happened like that and this game should have been designed around actual star trek battles.
But... I digress....
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I haven't seen escorts hit and run for a while... Maybe T'Varos and B'rels, but not escorts.
Well I've seen DPS Fed cruisers hit and run, but that's mostly because they've given up so much of their tanking and healing ability that they're more fragile than an escort (hull hp not withstanding). It's hilarious watching them 1v1 you. You may not be able to kill them, but they're virtually impotent.
As someone who mains as an escort captain, the last thing they need is a buff.
Also any buff to escorts will buff the Mogai. You know, that ship with the DPS of an escort, the shields of a fleet assault cruiser refit and the battle cloak of a Bird of Prey.
agreed except one thing.. you can still have multiple copies "emergency power to subsystem" abilities.. the only difference is you have to choose which subsystem you want to augment for each copy before a battle.. i.e. you can't choose shields and then during battle, choose engines. Likewise, I cannot be distracted with a popup that says "which subsystem do you want to increase power?" dialog messages during battle each time i activate the power.
But on premise, I like it. This would include consolidation of the powers into 1, thus, free up more abilities for other new boff abilities.
Or.. like you said, get rid of them entirely and build them into the fundamental ship design. I always believe that boff abilities and magic consoles or subnuking every 3 minutes was ridiculous in this game. The ships should be able to survive on their own and 'special" abilities like subnuke should be like once per 15 minutes or something.
I keep trying to picture one of the famous DS9 battles and O'brien saying "captain, we have been subnuked again.. all abilities are on cooldown, however we still have all basic ship functions and can proceed with attack Sorry that we didn't pick up that science team back at starbase.. guess we'll have to wait this one out.
Later, when the subnuke wears off O'brien says "Captain, subnuke has worn off. We have now xx seconds until the next subnuke attack".
Yeah.. no battles ever happened like that and this game should have been designed around actual star trek battles.
But... I digress....
Rather than making it an ability and a pop up asks which version you want to use, my thought was built in and a toggle. So your ship would have emergency power to weapons, shields, engines, and aux, click on one, that's where your emergency power goes until you click another, perhaps a special captain ability/type of ship/boff can have emergency power to more than one subsystem at a time.
attack patterns omega, beta, delta, (maybe they could make up a few others) select one and your ship has the associated buffs until you select a different one.
target subsystem: weapons, shields, engines, aux, all your attacks give a knock to that subsystem's power and have a chance to disable.
Tac team, science team, eng team, all built in as part of your crew. (also, they need to fix crew damage mechanics, large crews only give the bonus of "enhanced crew downtime")
Torpedoes should natively fire as a spread or a volley, one hardly ever saw a single torpedo being fired at something, and when one torp was fired, it was typically a "we only need one" type of moment.
I think these basic ship functions should be available to all ships out of the box and other abilities require "skill" like using tractor beams as a weapon... makes sense that could be a bridge officer skill not everyone would know how to do, ejecting warp plasma without blowing your nacelles in combat... etc. Though, really, I'd prefer pretty much all "skills" be baked in as they all seem to me to be hardware functions and have boff skills be more like captain skills in that your boff's "skill" in a department enhances those functions of your ship. Like a tactical officer with high helmsman skills could enhance attack patterns, or maybe even enhance the turn rate of a ship, etc... but that would probably require quite a bit of work.. well... I imagine they'd say it takes alot of work, I intellectually imagine it shouldn't be THAT hard... but then I don't know what systems they use/how their coding works and interacts. Could be a real mess that's not easy to tweak.
Hey, don't look at me, I'd basically only like to see beam turrets added so I can fire all beams forward on my DBB-carrying sci ships, instead of being stuck with (cannon) turrets in the back...
The simple fix is to make Turrets universal instead of cannon based so both beam or cannon Boff abilities effect them equally.
Then any build can make use of them.
The simple fix is to make Turrets universal instead of cannon based so both beam or cannon Boff abilities effect them equally.
Then any build can make use of them.
That...is actually a damn brilliant idea. Possibly even tweak the VFX depending on which boff ability is being used?
The one thing nobody has pointed out is the actual underlying origin of the idea.
tfomega, in multiple instances you have cited a show quote or have made up a show-like quote to support your belief. Not a problem with that, there is however a problem with the belief in the relevance and context to this game:-
Star Trek Online is a game, not the show.
It is an unfortunate fact every long-term player here has probably faced already, and any new players will have to deal with the hard way. I accepted this wasn't the show a very long time ago (not long after launch actually), and I adapted to know the systems of this game.
What you are suggesting is actually a very good idea for more realism and is supported by the show in multiple instances. However, the way this game system works, it does not act as a good idea. Cannons and beams were separated the way they are for a more balanced approach based on the angle of their weapon - Beams have a very wide arc and do moderate damage and DHC's Cannons have a very narrow arc and do very high damage (a fact supported by weapons such as DBB's/Torpedoes, good to high damage but fairly narrow, Single Cannons which is pretty wide but moderate damage and turrets, all-round weapon but weak damage).
Forget the builds part of the equation, look at the basic underlying system part of the equation. Beams in this game were chosen to be the weapon of choice for subsystem attack (for whatever reason, despite Cannons doing the same job in the show, it doesn't really matter anyway). Beams are extremely versatile in terms of both equipping onto ships and abilities, because it has to cover all available ship classes. Cannons (at the very least, DHC's) are restricted to Escorts and such, and thus have limited availability to make sure they aren't too 'overpowered' (shoot me for that if you want :P) and thus do not give escorts more abilities than is actually necessary.
With the intention of having Cannons primarily on Escorts, the idea of making them how they are now is a very good one, because anymore would make Escorts do the jobs Science ships and Cruisers normally perform, thus making them partially redundant. Its an equation of Escort do the damage, Cruisers are versatile and Science ships are the debuffers. Multiple builds are present in STO and there is a huge variety of combinations, but they are all based on these fundamental facts.
Now, to address the belief. If this game was realistic to the point of being good in balance, then I'd support it. Since this game is, unfortunately, not leaning in that direction a whole lot, this cannot be supported because it would not half the game any good.
Hope I made this post pretty clear xD
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I haven't seen escorts hit and run for a while... Maybe T'Varos and B'rels, but not escorts.
Well I've seen DPS Fed cruisers hit and run, but that's mostly because they've given up so much of their tanking and healing ability that they're more fragile than an escort (hull hp not withstanding). It's hilarious watching them 1v1 you. You may not be able to kill them, but they're virtually impotent.
As someone who mains as an escort captain, the last thing they need is a buff.
Also any buff to escorts will buff the Mogai. You know, that ship with the DPS of an escort, the shields of a fleet assault cruiser refit and the battle cloak of a Bird of Prey.
I'm not talking about a buff to anything. I am simply talking about consolidating the tac abilities. Why does targeting a subsystem have to be separate abilities? If you know how to target one, then you know how to target another, right? There is no reason why my tac officer can "learn" target engines, then the next moment learn target shield but forget the first. Right?
Also, I am talking about removing the keyword "beams" from those tac ability names and making it so that cannons can also benefit. I would like to be able to bring a cruiser's shields offline like they can do with me with beams. That's all I am saying.
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My intention was shooting for realism and my "made up quotes" are designed to show how ridiculous some of these circumstances are. "Captain, I knew target engine subsystems last month, but I have replaced it with target aux subsystems this month. If you want, I can go back to starbase and learn target engines again?".
To sum up how the game currently is in respect to all these abilties and procs, how they are distributed, etc.. I would have to apply the term "goofy".
Again, I am only trying to get us back to some realism with these suggestions, because when I play space PvP.. it is not believable and therefore opens the door to more frustration than fun.
Scenario: I am full hull, full shields. a cruiser with DEM3 (OP right now btw) opens fire and procs my shields on the first attack.. shields go down and BOOM.. I am dead.
While most likely I would survive that scenario, it can and does happen and represents the goofiness I was referring to earlier. What is so fun about that scenario?
Chance replaces tactics in this game.. and that is what makes it goofy
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My intention was shooting for realism and my "made up quotes" are designed to show how ridiculous some of these circumstances are. "Captain, I knew target engine subsystems last month, but I have replaced it with target aux subsystems this month. If you want, I can go back to starbase and learn target engines again?".
To sum up how the game currently is in respect to all these abilties and procs, how they are distributed, etc.. I would have to apply the term "goofy".
Again, I am only trying to get us back to some realism with these suggestions, because when I play space PvP.. it is not believable and therefore opens the door to more frustration than fun.
Scenario: I am full hull, full shields. a cruiser with DEM3 (OP right now btw) opens fire and procs my shields on the first attack.. shields go down and BOOM.. I am dead.
While most likely I would survive that scenario, it can and does happen and represents the goofiness I was referring to earlier. What is so fun about that scenario?
Chance replaces tactics in this game.. and that is what makes it goofy
I also agree that realism should be more of a part of the game, something which should have been from the start. Unfortunatly, it wasn't, so that's why I decided to move on and accept something like this will probably never happen, simply because it upsets the basic nature of the game the Space Combat system is based on.
That scenario is a likelyhood of several factors:- Tactical character, DPS-orientated build, DEM3 (which of course you said was OP), a 2.5% lucky shot to disable a shield facing (just 1, not all of them, a change done a long time ago btw), any resistance buffs on you, your basic resistance value with console(s) and your current movement speed.
All of these factors are in flux during a match, only when a common factor is deduced in combat through the noticable intentions of one ability or one combination can something even be considered overpowered or needing to be changed.
A valid point on your part. Unfortunate that, because of the way the game is developed, it cannot be introduced
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Of course under that same light, wouldn't you then want a BRF and a BSV to go with it? Because let's face it, BFAW is... well... yeah... XD.
I mean you see lots of instances of BRF in the shows, and you see things similar to BSV in the show as well, so if you were to take out the limitation on SST to beams, I would want to see ALL tac powers universalized.
But I would maintain that if you were going to do that, keep the damage types separate as abilities go. But I think I see where you're going with this. And I semi-approve, but at the same time... your initial arguments kind of lost me tbh...
BFAW with DBB's is basically CSV, BUT i think CSV should be changed to CFAW let's see how much the escort jockey's complain when all their firepower isn't going forward and their turret's are firing everywhere.
Aside from that Beam overload would be epic if it did it to, you know, more than just the one beam. BFAW and BO are both BS when compared to the canon abilities. and as for shared cooldowns on the canon abilities i really dont think a 15s GCD is all that bad (i fly everything)
A beam rapid fire would be great, and as useless as they are the "target subsystems" should be just that. A generalized ability inherent to all ships, not just science. But as usual all musing and suggestions will never be implemented.:cool:
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Comments
I mean you see lots of instances of BRF in the shows, and you see things similar to BSV in the show as well, so if you were to take out the limitation on SST to beams, I would want to see ALL tac powers universalized.
But I would maintain that if you were going to do that, keep the damage types separate as abilities go. But I think I see where you're going with this. And I semi-approve, but at the same time... your initial arguments kind of lost me tbh...
Rapid Fire
Scatter Volley
Fire-at-Will
Overload
Target Auxiliary
Target Engines
Target Shields
Target Weapons
You'd have 8 abilities that lock each other out for 15s. The BTS abilities lock you out of BO/FAW just like BO/FAW lock each other out. Just like CSV/CRF lock each other out.
It would cause problems for folks that currently mix in a DBB with their Cannons - since they are distinct now, there are things you can do with them that you couldn't do if they were all linked.
Still though, I still think the BTS abilities should be a single ability - Beam Target Subsystems, where the player is able to select which subsystem the ability should target - rather than having to carry multiple copies of the ability. By rolling the four abilities into one, it would create space for the addition of other Tac abilities that could alleviate that feeling of the build being cookie cutter...
Yeah, this is good.. allow the player to select the subsystem they wish to target. By consolidating the abilities, that would also open up on the tac player to new abilities being added. The way they are setup now is cumbersome.
Example:
Worf: Captain, I just returned from the starbase where I was trained in targetting auxiliary subsystems.
Picard: Excellent, Mister Worf.
*Romulan ship suddenly attacks the Enterprise and they are caught off guard, but able to survive. They cannot survive another attack so Picard orders..."
Picard: Mister Worf, we cannot survive another attack. Target their weapon systems and fire at my command.
Worf: I am sorry, Captain, but while I may have been trained in targeting weapon subsystems previously, I have forgotten how to do so. I can target aux subsystems for you or we can pause the fight while I return to the starbase and learn how to target weapon systems again.
Picard: Mister Worf, you are relieved of duty.
....... so idiotic. and the fact that cannons cannot attack a subsystem is equally ludicrous.
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How sad.
How far we've fallen.
In naval warfare the "escort" is simply a smaller ship that's cheaper to produce and acts as a screen for the more valuable larger ships. But since we don't have a definition for "cheaper to produce" in a MMORPG environment the escort had to be made equal to the larger battleships.
How sad.
How far we've fallen.
Targeting subsystems was a special attack done by Tuvok, where he "modulated" the frequency of a phaser to penetrate shields and target a particular subsystem. That it became a general attack at all, in the sense that it has (including being built in to Sci Vessels) - is somewhat silly. Still, you couldn't do the same with a cannon (a pulse) that you could do with a beam (non-pulse).
Course, one could simply point to Phaser procs with pulse weapons. I'd say a second wrong thing shouldn't be used as a justification to do a third wrong thing...
Both targeting subsystems and the Phaser proc should be pulled. And on that topic, Viral Matrix should be pulled...bunch of script kiddies running around the universe attacking ship computers running Win95 or something, eh? Meh...
Targeting various subsystems has been done with all manner of weapons including torpedoes. It's not a matter of magic modulation technobable, it's "hey, see that port there? that's a torpedo port, please disable their ability to fire those ouchie torpedoes by blowing that to hell."
I agree with the dialogue story above that it is ridiculous that our builds are so specialized and limited in general, if you want to target more than one subsystem, you're gonna carry multiple copies, if you want to divert emergency power, a system on your ship, to shields AND also be able to put it to engines or weapons, you're gonna need multiple copies. Many abilities would work better and be more trek-like if they were baked into the ship, since many of them are hardware functions, not really boff skills, however, I don't think the devs want to do that, as the game would lose the typical mmo trinity vibe they were aiming for. I'm not saying I wouldn't love for them to drop that and rework things, but I really doubt they will... at least not in the near future.
But yes, having "attack patterns" and being able to choose which one you want to use without having to eat up a whole bunch of boff skill slots would be nice. Being able to say "target shields" and all damage your ship does for the next 15 or so seconds goes to knocking down shield power/ 1% chance for each energy pulse to disable/5% chance for torpedoes to disable... something along those lines, would be very nice. All ships have a reserve of emergency power, being able to put that to shields or engines or weapons or aux (even though aux doesn't really make sense as that's: "reserve power to the backup power!" lol...) would be very nice... and yes, I would love it, push for it, please, make it happen. But... just being realistic, I myself, and plenty of other people have posted threads that have gone on for days arguing how the game should be more like that... and yet, here we are, same ol, same ol.
agreed except one thing.. you can still have multiple copies "emergency power to subsystem" abilities.. the only difference is you have to choose which subsystem you want to augment for each copy before a battle.. i.e. you can't choose shields and then during battle, choose engines. Likewise, I cannot be distracted with a popup that says "which subsystem do you want to increase power?" dialog messages during battle each time i activate the power.
But on premise, I like it. This would include consolidation of the powers into 1, thus, free up more abilities for other new boff abilities.
Or.. like you said, get rid of them entirely and build them into the fundamental ship design. I always believe that boff abilities and magic consoles or subnuking every 3 minutes was ridiculous in this game. The ships should be able to survive on their own and 'special" abilities like subnuke should be like once per 15 minutes or something.
I keep trying to picture one of the famous DS9 battles and O'brien saying "captain, we have been subnuked again.. all abilities are on cooldown, however we still have all basic ship functions and can proceed with attack Sorry that we didn't pick up that science team back at starbase.. guess we'll have to wait this one out.
Later, when the subnuke wears off O'brien says "Captain, subnuke has worn off. We have now xx seconds until the next subnuke attack".
Yeah.. no battles ever happened like that and this game should have been designed around actual star trek battles.
But... I digress....
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Well I've seen DPS Fed cruisers hit and run, but that's mostly because they've given up so much of their tanking and healing ability that they're more fragile than an escort (hull hp not withstanding). It's hilarious watching them 1v1 you. You may not be able to kill them, but they're virtually impotent.
As someone who mains as an escort captain, the last thing they need is a buff.
Also any buff to escorts will buff the Mogai. You know, that ship with the DPS of an escort, the shields of a fleet assault cruiser refit and the battle cloak of a Bird of Prey.
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Rather than making it an ability and a pop up asks which version you want to use, my thought was built in and a toggle. So your ship would have emergency power to weapons, shields, engines, and aux, click on one, that's where your emergency power goes until you click another, perhaps a special captain ability/type of ship/boff can have emergency power to more than one subsystem at a time.
attack patterns omega, beta, delta, (maybe they could make up a few others) select one and your ship has the associated buffs until you select a different one.
target subsystem: weapons, shields, engines, aux, all your attacks give a knock to that subsystem's power and have a chance to disable.
Tac team, science team, eng team, all built in as part of your crew. (also, they need to fix crew damage mechanics, large crews only give the bonus of "enhanced crew downtime")
Torpedoes should natively fire as a spread or a volley, one hardly ever saw a single torpedo being fired at something, and when one torp was fired, it was typically a "we only need one" type of moment.
I think these basic ship functions should be available to all ships out of the box and other abilities require "skill" like using tractor beams as a weapon... makes sense that could be a bridge officer skill not everyone would know how to do, ejecting warp plasma without blowing your nacelles in combat... etc. Though, really, I'd prefer pretty much all "skills" be baked in as they all seem to me to be hardware functions and have boff skills be more like captain skills in that your boff's "skill" in a department enhances those functions of your ship. Like a tactical officer with high helmsman skills could enhance attack patterns, or maybe even enhance the turn rate of a ship, etc... but that would probably require quite a bit of work.. well... I imagine they'd say it takes alot of work, I intellectually imagine it shouldn't be THAT hard... but then I don't know what systems they use/how their coding works and interacts. Could be a real mess that's not easy to tweak.
The simple fix is to make Turrets universal instead of cannon based so both beam or cannon Boff abilities effect them equally.
Then any build can make use of them.
R.I.P
That...is actually a damn brilliant idea. Possibly even tweak the VFX depending on which boff ability is being used?
tfomega, in multiple instances you have cited a show quote or have made up a show-like quote to support your belief. Not a problem with that, there is however a problem with the belief in the relevance and context to this game:-
Star Trek Online is a game, not the show.
It is an unfortunate fact every long-term player here has probably faced already, and any new players will have to deal with the hard way. I accepted this wasn't the show a very long time ago (not long after launch actually), and I adapted to know the systems of this game.
What you are suggesting is actually a very good idea for more realism and is supported by the show in multiple instances. However, the way this game system works, it does not act as a good idea. Cannons and beams were separated the way they are for a more balanced approach based on the angle of their weapon - Beams have a very wide arc and do moderate damage and DHC's Cannons have a very narrow arc and do very high damage (a fact supported by weapons such as DBB's/Torpedoes, good to high damage but fairly narrow, Single Cannons which is pretty wide but moderate damage and turrets, all-round weapon but weak damage).
Forget the builds part of the equation, look at the basic underlying system part of the equation. Beams in this game were chosen to be the weapon of choice for subsystem attack (for whatever reason, despite Cannons doing the same job in the show, it doesn't really matter anyway). Beams are extremely versatile in terms of both equipping onto ships and abilities, because it has to cover all available ship classes. Cannons (at the very least, DHC's) are restricted to Escorts and such, and thus have limited availability to make sure they aren't too 'overpowered' (shoot me for that if you want :P) and thus do not give escorts more abilities than is actually necessary.
With the intention of having Cannons primarily on Escorts, the idea of making them how they are now is a very good one, because anymore would make Escorts do the jobs Science ships and Cruisers normally perform, thus making them partially redundant. Its an equation of Escort do the damage, Cruisers are versatile and Science ships are the debuffers. Multiple builds are present in STO and there is a huge variety of combinations, but they are all based on these fundamental facts.
Now, to address the belief. If this game was realistic to the point of being good in balance, then I'd support it. Since this game is, unfortunately, not leaning in that direction a whole lot, this cannot be supported because it would not half the game any good.
Hope I made this post pretty clear xD
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I'm not talking about a buff to anything. I am simply talking about consolidating the tac abilities. Why does targeting a subsystem have to be separate abilities? If you know how to target one, then you know how to target another, right? There is no reason why my tac officer can "learn" target engines, then the next moment learn target shield but forget the first. Right?
Also, I am talking about removing the keyword "beams" from those tac ability names and making it so that cannons can also benefit. I would like to be able to bring a cruiser's shields offline like they can do with me with beams. That's all I am saying.
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You did
My intention was shooting for realism and my "made up quotes" are designed to show how ridiculous some of these circumstances are. "Captain, I knew target engine subsystems last month, but I have replaced it with target aux subsystems this month. If you want, I can go back to starbase and learn target engines again?".
To sum up how the game currently is in respect to all these abilties and procs, how they are distributed, etc.. I would have to apply the term "goofy".
Again, I am only trying to get us back to some realism with these suggestions, because when I play space PvP.. it is not believable and therefore opens the door to more frustration than fun.
Scenario: I am full hull, full shields. a cruiser with DEM3 (OP right now btw) opens fire and procs my shields on the first attack.. shields go down and BOOM.. I am dead.
While most likely I would survive that scenario, it can and does happen and represents the goofiness I was referring to earlier. What is so fun about that scenario?
Chance replaces tactics in this game.. and that is what makes it goofy
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MEMBER SINCE JANUARY 2010
I also agree that realism should be more of a part of the game, something which should have been from the start. Unfortunatly, it wasn't, so that's why I decided to move on and accept something like this will probably never happen, simply because it upsets the basic nature of the game the Space Combat system is based on.
That scenario is a likelyhood of several factors:- Tactical character, DPS-orientated build, DEM3 (which of course you said was OP), a 2.5% lucky shot to disable a shield facing (just 1, not all of them, a change done a long time ago btw), any resistance buffs on you, your basic resistance value with console(s) and your current movement speed.
All of these factors are in flux during a match, only when a common factor is deduced in combat through the noticable intentions of one ability or one combination can something even be considered overpowered or needing to be changed.
A valid point on your part. Unfortunate that, because of the way the game is developed, it cannot be introduced
Return of Ja'Dok Series (6 Part Series)
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BFAW with DBB's is basically CSV, BUT i think CSV should be changed to CFAW let's see how much the escort jockey's complain when all their firepower isn't going forward and their turret's are firing everywhere.
Aside from that Beam overload would be epic if it did it to, you know, more than just the one beam. BFAW and BO are both BS when compared to the canon abilities. and as for shared cooldowns on the canon abilities i really dont think a 15s GCD is all that bad (i fly everything)
A beam rapid fire would be great, and as useless as they are the "target subsystems" should be just that. A generalized ability inherent to all ships, not just science. But as usual all musing and suggestions will never be implemented.:cool:
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