Need help with Web Mines :'(

vegie0 · August 2013

Kinda right there... I can't fight anybody that has them.

Even with 4 Neutros, Pol Hul 1, Aux2Sif 3, Haz 2, and BFI they do ~50k thru shields... thats just not something I can do...

I keep telling myself it's cheap, im loosing cuz they got something I don't...

But the people that have them say they are balanced... So why not... how can one survive them? They do more then Thalaron does...

I will not PvP until I find a way to make them less of a problem. It is too much of a dent to my ego to go from full hull to dead from 1 weapon.

Help please?

jaegernl · August 2013

They still do stupid amounts of damage. They haven't been 'balanced' at all.

Oh, and Vegie, let us just spam acetons. We'll be safe from Web Mines, Breen Clusters and all other forms of TRIBBLE. Wohoo.

vegie0 · August 2013

jaegernl wrote: »

They still do stupid amounts of damage. They haven't been 'balanced' at all.

Oh, and Vegie, let us just spam acetons. We'll be safe from Web Mines, Breen Clusters and all other forms of TRIBBLE. Wohoo.

I personally agree with you, I think the people using them want to just defend thier I Win button. But if anybody know how to survive them. I am all ears.

I can't, and I will not PvP until I can. Yes I know I am just one person. But hey, it is one less PvPer. Ques can pop slower until I find a way.

jaegernl · August 2013

Well, ApO for the stun immunity and hope for the best.

rmy1081 · August 2013

Try dropping a neutronium for a monotanium?

I haven't pvped in my b'rel for a while now so idk if it's just the ship. In my marauder and mirror vo'quv I take almost no damage and the hold lasts about 3 seconds (maybe less). Maybe I've been lucky.

since it's now kinetic damage have you tried auxiliary power to dampeners? That will lessen the hold, give kinetic resist, and let you fly away faster when you're out. ET is good to. It clears the mine once you're held.

Just some ideas. Hope that helps, and please post what works and doesn't work. Any info is good info

vegie0 · August 2013

rmy1081 wrote: »

Try dropping a neutronium for a monotanium?

I haven't pvped in my b'rel for a while now so idk if it's just the ship. In my marauder and mirror vo'quv I take almost no damage and the hold lasts about 3 seconds (maybe less).

since it's now kinetic damage have you tried auxiliary power to dampeners? That will lessen the hold, give kinetic resist, and let you fly away faster when you're out.

Just some ideas. Hope that helps, and please post what works and doesn't work. Any info is good info

It's not Kinetic, it is still Physical damage. No resists can work against them.

Thanks for your time. So far the only defence is to not get hit, otherwiser your dead. I am not in a carrier on my Fed but my Klinks both have no real big issue since I stayed on Intercept for the most part.

rmy1081 · August 2013

vegie0 wrote: »

It's not Kinetic, it is still Physical damage. No resists can work against them.

Thanks for your time. So far the only defence is to not get hit, otherwiser your dead. I am not in a carrier on my Fed but my Klinks both have no real big issue since I stayed on Intercept for the most part.

oh wow..I thought they changed the damage type to kinetic from physical last week..guess I was wrong.

rudiefix1 · August 2013

use a FAWboat in your team....

antoniosalieri · August 2013

Honestly ya its a mine... don't hit it... think of them as a tric... you don't run those over on purpose.

Put 6 points in sensors so you can see them a bit earlier.

Run TBR if you can...
Gravity wells... for sure if you have a team no team should be with out min one gravity well...
Shockwave...
Omega...

I have been hit by these things a few times lately... and honestly I haven't died.

I have killed many many more of the dumb things though... best defense is ya to not hit them...

Chron mines... Phasics... Trics... Cloaked tractor mnes... i mean we all avoid these things for a reason.

rickpaaa · August 2013

The way to survive a web cage is to have an engineering team at the ready.

Unknown · August 2013

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drkfrontiers · August 2013

mattjohnsonva wrote: »

Of course you could buy the consumable from the Nuke Rep hehe, only 1500 Dil for 10.

I think thats the idea.

virusdancer · August 2013

edit: Had to edit (half-asleep and need caffeine).

They'll do 55% damage to the hull vs. non-Res shields and 52.5% damage to the hull vs. Res shields. The hull damage appears to ignore any resists while the shield damage will be reduced by shield damage reduction.

Grab a friend/etc...drop some...parse it.

Somebody doing an APA3/APO1/Ambush/etc of a DPB3...would easily take out the 50k+ hull Veg mentioned.

On a Tribble test toon with only 6 SAP.

Base - 958.2/tick

w/APA3 APO1 Ambush - 1785.6/tick
DPB3 drops 8 mines. 8 ticks a mine.
114278.4 damage...
...with 55% going to the hull for 62853.12 damage.
...with 52.5% going to the hull for 59996.16 damage.

w/APA3 APO3 Ambush - 1875.4/tick
DPB2 drops 6 mines. 8 ticks a mine.
90019.2 damage...
...with 55% going to the hull for 49510.56 damage.
...with 52.5% going to the hull for 47260.08 damage.

A base pair of 2 (no DPB used) without any buffs would do 15331.2 damage...
...with 55% being 8432.16 damage.
...with 52.5% being 8048.88 damage.

You'll notice when they're buffed or not...

edit2: Hrmm, and that wasn't taking into account any potential damage resistance debuffs and what that could mean.

edit3: Hrmm, I didn't account for crits or other gear that could increase the damage either.

edit4: Hrmm, the conversation that prompted this thread - weren't they also using Scramble DOFFs?

pulserazor · August 2013

A single person on your team tasked with the assignment to clear spam with a copy or two of torpedo spreads will usually be enough to clear this and other spam, but at the potential cost of their personal damage totals, making it less likely they will have the highest score at the end of the match to satisfy their ego.

If you really want to, you could just swat them with turret using a keybind: /bind x target web mine. Make sure you have 'Target Threatening Enemies First' in your general settings so you dont just target your own team's spam. Every once in a while press your keybind, treating it as a 'scan'.

If you would like to add anything else to a keybind like this, it will work for any other targetable object, such as 'Tractor Beam Mine', 'Aceton Assimilator', and even a player's name. YOu can have your bind search for multiple objects with one press by seoperating the bind with "$$" - ie: /bind x target tractor beam mine$$target Yellowstone Runabout$$target web mine. - Since the command will target all things in one stroke, place your priority targets in reverse order.

praxi5 · August 2013

Supposedly the damage is reduced by Engine power?

It's almost certainly just a bug for that to work, but that's the word on the street.

rudiefix1 · August 2013

how is the automated defense turret nowadays

chemist6lp · August 2013

In the last few days I've encountered them quite often and I have to admit that they are much less efficient than before. Perhaps they weren't buffed by high-level DPA/B.

aquitaine985 · August 2013

I'm about ready to take mine off. True, I can *make* them really powerful, but they're just a minor nuisance at this point. The weird damage is gone and ways to get out or negate the mines has increased.

Not sure what the problem is.

shinzon2013 · August 2013

vegie0 wrote: »

Kinda right there... I can't fight anybody that has them.

Even with 4 Neutros, Pol Hul 1, Aux2Sif 3, Haz 2, and BFI they do ~50k thru shields... thats just not something I can do...

I keep telling myself it's cheap, im loosing cuz they got something I don't...

But the people that have them say they are balanced... So why not... how can one survive them? They do more then Thalaron does...

I will not PvP until I find a way to make them less of a problem. It is too much of a dent to my ego to go from full hull to dead from 1 weapon.

Help please?

Why don't you use some tric mines with Dispersal patterns against people with the web mines? You used to really like them when they were broken. Wasn't making people go from full health do dead with one weapon fun when you could do it with trics? :rolleyes:

vegie0 · August 2013

shinzon2013 wrote: »

Why don't you use some tric mines with Dispersal patterns against people with the web mines? You used to really like them when they were broken. Wasn't making people go from full health do dead with one weapon fun when you could do it with trics? :rolleyes:

I did it to borg which is why we can not use them anymore (I had perfected it to the point where I could finish a cube in CSE in under 10 seconds... kind trolled my own team doing it thou), not people. And yes I used them on my Br'lol when I was being camped, but my primary attack was and always has been spike damage.

So no you are wrong.

icepiraka · August 2013

I believe teleports might let you escape a web cage, though I'm not 100% sure. I don't know about Subspace Jump, but I seem to recall getting hit by a web mine in PvP in my warbird, panicking, hitting my singularity jump, and then I was out of the mine. I'll have to test that to be sure.

vegie0 · August 2013

icepiraka wrote: »

I believe teleports might let you escape a web cage, though I'm not 100% sure. I don't know about Subspace Jump, but I seem to recall getting hit by a web mine in PvP in my warbird, panicking, hitting my singularity jump, and then I was out of the mine. I'll have to test that to be sure.

Thats a neet one, I know the only methods so far to survive is to not be hit. Otherwise any buffed set of 6+ mines will insta kill anything. Still not in PvP, wish a way to survive a strike from those was out there. Even Trics are survivable now.

Also I tested Trics in Ker'rat, since I figured hey, since im supposed to be good at using Trics for 1 hit kills can I still do it? The answer is yes, if they run into mines unprepared and unaware they die instantly. I did it for a while while spamming in chat that if they helped get Web Mines nerfed I would stop... Dunno how effective that was. Also I used Trics to kill the Cube in Cure without killing the probes first, trolls your team really bad, since before they even kill the BOPs, the Raps are spawning. My team was mad

icepiraka · August 2013

Sorry, I spoke to soon. Just tested it, teleports don't break you free. They web cage is just teleported with you. So that doesn't work.

playhard88 · August 2013

i been using the mines today with my sci, without any dispersal pattern, and they are doing a lot of dmg..can't image with a DPB

twam · August 2013

Somehow, I seemed to be okish in my tac/vesta yesterday when I ran into some (non-dispersal patterned) web mines. I'll have to do some more testing, but once the original stun was over, Polarise Hull seemed to work. I do have some points in Inertial Dampeners, though. Like I said, I'll need to do some more testing.

mimey2 · August 2013

I'm honestly thinking that these really aren't fixed.

scurry5 · August 2013

I've been testing them on occasion in PuG arenas, and the results are pretty confusing.

Without a dispersal pattern buffing them, they do little besides the stun. Not useful for much besides interrupting healers.

However, with a dispersal pattern, things get a bit screwy. Some shrug the entire batch off as though it was water. Others blow up in a spectacular display of fireworks after a few seconds.

We really need to find out the full gamut of resistances affecting these things - the spec and the All Resist work, I know, but the interaction with Aux power (user) and Eng power (used on) is pretty unclear. Not to mention whether Particle Gens might affect these or not.

skurf · August 2013

They're still the most OP weapon in this game. When I see a nukara mine take down a cruiser's hull by 80% that's not balanced. Ok, so maybe they're not killing cruisers and carriers anymore but a nukara mine hit on them makes them super-easy to kill. I have seen them still kill escorts though. Rule of thumb: if you see someone get hit by a nukara mine, target him for the easy kill.

logicalspock · August 2013

To begin with, I really do think they are an important addition to the game since speed tanking and battle cloak on every Romulan ship has become popular.

However, the way they work just really is not well thought-through.

What they should do is trap ships inside doing modest damage over time (like a gravity well). They should be boosted by science skills. They should last up to ten seconds (depending on skills) and there should be some science skill (such as science team) that can dissipate the web.

Right now, there are few ways to counter them and they can do insane amounts of damage.

snoge00f · August 2013

For the record, Sci Team clears the web mine.

rmy1081 · August 2013

snoge00f wrote: »

For the record, Sci Team clears the web mine.

So ST and ET both work? These mines are getting weirder by the minute.

You know, they'd still be great if they did no damage.

One thing I don't understand is why they made it disable all but two skills. I think it would be better if it only allowed one to target themselves but still be able to use any skill while inside the web.

Need help with Web Mines :'(

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