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Random Design I Found on Google images

afree100afree100 Member Posts: 332 Arc User
edited July 2013 in Ten Forward
http://johneaves.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/starship-es.jpg

I don't recall seeing this ingame, what does everyone think?
...
Starfleet M.A.C.O. KDF Honor Guard
Post edited by afree100 on
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Comments

  • theraven2378theraven2378 Member Posts: 6,016 Arc User
    edited July 2013
    i like the look of the archer, but the McCall is ugly
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    • baudlbaudl Member Posts: 4,060 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      i wouldn't call john eaves designs "random designs" ;)

      anyway...those ships are on the web since STO beta or so. Idk the story behind them or why they never made it into the game...possibly financial. After all john eaves is the designer of many many Ships in the movies and series.
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    • hevachhevach Member Posts: 2,777 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      They were designed for Perpetual, who burned through one of the largest MMO budgets of its time "developing" STO before anyone realized they didn't actually have anything except fake screenshots and concept art and stopped investing in them.
    • catstarstocatstarsto Member Posts: 2,149 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      I dont McCall these designs, but they do look like Asshault Cruiser variants. The ones saucer looks like the boomerang weapon from FF8.
    • catstarstocatstarsto Member Posts: 2,149 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      theraven2378 wrote: »
      i like the look of the archer, but the McCall is ugly

      "..quote theraven, never more." :3
    • tacofangstacofangs Member Posts: 2,951 Cryptic Developer
      edited July 2013
      I like John Eaves' work for the most part, but I feel like all of his Starfleet ships are too blocky and armored looking. I think if both designs were smoothed out some, they would have a lot of potential. I'm also not so crazy about the speed holes in the saucer. I've seen that in a few designs, and it always strikes me as unnecessary, and makes the ship look flimsy.
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    • burstdragon323burstdragon323 Member Posts: 853 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      tacofangs wrote: »
      I like John Eaves' work for the most part, but I feel like all of his Starfleet ships are too blocky and armored looking. I think if both designs were smoothed out some, they would have a lot of potential. I'm also not so crazy about the speed holes in the saucer. I've seen that in a few designs, and it always strikes me as unnecessary, and makes the ship look flimsy.

      Hmm, the McCall could be used as a base for a much needed Typhoon redesign, considering the current one is a kitbash.
    • hyplhypl Member Posts: 3,719 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      I would love a Fed Escort that looks like the Archer, maybe smoothed out a bit. Just an escort that has a "normal" Trek ship feel to it, with a saucer, engineering hull, and nacelles with outward pylons. The Armitage and Prometheus come close.

      I'd also want the Warship Voyager... >_>
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    • vonhellstingvonhellsting Member Posts: 543 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      tacofangs wrote: »
      I'm also not so crazy about the speed holes in the saucer. I've seen that in a few designs, and it always strikes me as unnecessary, and makes the ship look flimsy.

      Oh you mean like this ship?:P
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    • hatepwehatepwe Member Posts: 252 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      tacofangs wrote: »
      I like John Eaves' work for the most part, but I feel like all of his Starfleet ships are too blocky and armored looking. I think if both designs were smoothed out some, they would have a lot of potential. I'm also not so crazy about the speed holes in the saucer. I've seen that in a few designs, and it always strikes me as unnecessary, and makes the ship look flimsy.

      I thought this too, then I looked at all the Star Trek space battles and saw how many times there was a huge feedback explosion in the ship after a phaser blast punched through the saucer.

      Less surface area makes it more flimsy but also reduces the target size.
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    • organicmanfredorganicmanfred Member Posts: 3,236 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      Once again, I am the only one who actually likes the Perpetual ships. :D
    • jonsillsjonsills Member Posts: 10,476 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      The McCall's primary hull is a terribly inefficient design. If you're in one of the aft quarters of the saucer, and need to get to the forward section for some reason, you have to go all the way around, with no possible route through the bulk of the saucer - as the bulk of it does not exist.

      And I've seen things blow up on the bridge of Federation ships when they get hit in the engineering hull - what they really need is to reinvent the circuit breaker.
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    • umaekoumaeko Member Posts: 748 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      Both ships have several design point in common with the Regent-class. Nacelle pylon angle, use of negative space over the spine.

      They might not be suited for STO, but surely they've proven good inspiration.
    • atatassaultatatassault Member Posts: 1,008 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      jonsills wrote: »
      The McCall's primary hull is a terribly inefficient design. If you're in one of the aft quarters of the saucer, and need to get to the forward section for some reason, you have to go all the way around, with no possible route through the bulk of the saucer - as the bulk of it does not exist.
      That assumes that there is always a straightline path from any point A to any point B, which is a false assumption. The corridors and turbolifts would be arranged in some grid like fashion regardless. The time from distance point A to distant point B would be about the same in the McCall vs a variant with the holes filled in.
    • ursusmorologusursusmorologus Member Posts: 5,328 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      I've read about these befores, IIRC the open saucer means its a science ship, for research
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    • theultimatefunkytheultimatefunky Member Posts: 8 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      not read all replies but that ship was a concept for the game by the company that started STO before cryptic
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    • tuskin67tuskin67 Member Posts: 1,097 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      vonhellsting wrote: »
      Oh you mean like this ship?:P
      https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BPe6h0iCMAEfOaD.png:large

      Woah, is that a Romulan Timeship?
    • dmfreddie_1426533189dmfreddie_1426533189 Member Posts: 84 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      The one on the right reminds me of the USS Vengeance from Into Darkness. Rommie time-ship looks like a striped our D'deredex
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    • vonhellstingvonhellsting Member Posts: 543 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      tuskin67 wrote: »
      Woah, is that a Romulan Timeship?

      Yes it is or so I've been told I still believe it's a Swissmoanian Swiss cheese ship mortal enemies of the Tacoians.:P
      dmfreddie wrote: »
      Rommie time-ship looks like a striped our D'deredex

      That or a block of swiss cheese...:confused: Man that ship has a lot of holes in it , it looks so fragile I'm surprised the engines don't shake it apart. Wait I've got it I can't believe I didn't see it before it's actually a star ship defense system!:eek: It has so many holes in it when the enemy ship fire on you they miss because the shots fly through all the holes pure genius those Romulans are clever.:P
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    • psycoticvulcanpsycoticvulcan Member Posts: 4,160 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      I like the look of the McCall, though I agree a smoother design would be nice.
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    • dmfreddie_1426533189dmfreddie_1426533189 Member Posts: 84 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      vonhellsting wrote: »
      Wait I've got it I can't believe I didn't see it before it's actually a star ship defense system!:eek: It has so many holes in it when the enemy ship fire on you they miss because the shots fly through all the holes pure genius those Romulans are clever.:P

      Now why didn't I think of this? It's the Hole-y grail of Romulan ship design! :D
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    • tacofangstacofangs Member Posts: 2,951 Cryptic Developer
      edited July 2013
      vonhellsting wrote: »
      Oh you mean like this ship?:P
      https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BPe6h0iCMAEfOaD.png:large

      Exactly. Not a fan of the Wells either.

      However, Romulan ships at least have a precident for having large open areas within their structures (i.e. D'Deridex). I don't necessarily mind having open areas between components (i.e. Odyssey), but don't like when the holes are cut through the main body of a single component (i.e. saucer)
      hatepwe wrote: »
      I thought this too, then I looked at all the Star Trek space battles and saw how many times there was a huge feedback explosion in the ship after a phaser blast punched through the saucer.

      Less surface area makes it more flimsy but also reduces the target size.

      Thing is, it doesn't actually shrink your target size. The ship is as big as it would be otherwise, and counting on someone to shoot through the opening is ridiculous. If you want to shrink your target size, you take the same amount of mass and put it in a shape that is less spread out.

      The only advantage I can think of for having holes int he saucers, is that you have more surface area for windowed cabins. Meaning it should be a cruise ship over a cruiser.
      jonsills wrote: »
      The McCall's primary hull is a terribly inefficient design. If you're in one of the aft quarters of the saucer, and need to get to the forward section for some reason, you have to go all the way around, with no possible route through the bulk of the saucer - as the bulk of it does not exist.

      To be fair, Turbo lifts (and hallways) already tend to follow the lines of the saucer anyway. i.e. even if the saucer were filled, you'd still likely be taking the same route to 10 forward. Example

      ursusmorologus wrote: »
      I've read about these befores, IIRC the open saucer means its a science ship, for research

      How do openings in the saucer help with science?
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    • futurepastnowfuturepastnow Member Posts: 3,660 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      I like the shape of the one on top. It'd make a neat mid-size escort.
    • lordfuzunlordfuzun Member Posts: 54 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      tacofangs wrote: »
      I like John Eaves' work for the most part, but I feel like all of his Starfleet ships are too blocky and armored looking. I think if both designs were smoothed out some, they would have a lot of potential. I'm also not so crazy about the speed holes in the saucer. I've seen that in a few designs, and it always strikes me as unnecessary, and makes the ship look flimsy.

      These are my thoughts on John Eaves's orignial first iteration designs myself. I think the "speed holes", as the Taco'ed one terms them, are just too much of a deviation from the established Starfleet ship design lineage. (I'm talking about the art design lineage not a technological lineage.) Anything which introduced too much negative volumes to a Startshp just turns me off (i.e. speed holes or sunked hulls like the Assault Cruiser refit). They just don't look Starfleet to me.
    • bughunter357bughunter357 Member Posts: 588 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      these look like variants to the intrepid myself, everyone else I have read thinks they would be a good cruiser or escort but to me they look like a science ship.
    • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      hypl wrote: »
      I would love a Fed Escort that looks like the Archer, maybe smoothed out a bit. Just an escort that has a "normal" Trek ship feel to it, with a saucer, engineering hull, and nacelles with outward pylons. The Armitage and Prometheus come close.

      I'd also want the Warship Voyager... >_>
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      Hehe, but yeah, that would be loads of fun to have in game. :)
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    • catstarstocatstarsto Member Posts: 2,149 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      tacofangs wrote: »
      I like John Eaves' work for the most part, but I feel like all of his Starfleet ships are too blocky and armored looking. I think if both designs were smoothed out some, they would have a lot of potential. I'm also not so crazy about the speed holes in the saucer. I've seen that in a few designs, and it always strikes me as unnecessary, and makes the ship look flimsy.

      I think those new streamlined designes, for the exploration cruiser, asshault cruiser, deepspace, etc where a nice touch given the change of the timeline...it seemed more trek like...even the tier 2 constitution refit version was an impressive design

      I think any remakes of the shows should use your guys designs
    • vonhellstingvonhellsting Member Posts: 543 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      dmfreddie wrote: »
      Now why didn't I think of this? It's the Hole-y grail of Romulan ship design! :D

      Oh Cryptic bless this thy Romulan time ship that with it thy may blow thy enemies to tiny bits in thy mercy.:D

      tacofangs wrote: »



      Thing is, it doesn't actually shrink your target size. The ship is as big as it would be otherwise, and counting on someone to shoot through the opening is ridiculous. If you want to shrink your target size, you take the same amount of mass and put it in a shape that is less spread out.

      The only advantage I can think of for having holes int he saucers, is that you have more surface area for windowed cabins. Meaning it should be a cruise ship over a cruiser.



      How do openings in the saucer help with science?

      Well I could see it working like a Satellite dish or radio antenna to aide in creating a warp bubble or for sensor readings. Where the ship needs a large surface area but not the mass , so cutting down on the needless excess material makes some sense. As far as I know it's still pretty expensive to make an entire star ships so this could be a way to cut down on production costs. Such as in cases of war when supplies are in short supply. Not entirely unheard of event in history for tons of cheap ships to be built to meet war demands by streamlining production. Sure it wouldn't be top of the line but you do what you have to in wars.
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    • sander233sander233 Member Posts: 3,992 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      tacofangs wrote: »
      Thing is, it doesn't actually shrink your target size. The ship is as big as it would be otherwise, and counting on someone to shoot through the opening is ridiculous. If you want to shrink your target size, you take the same amount of mass and put it in a shape that is less spread out.

      It does though. If you're firing at a target that's mostly empty space, you're mostly going to hit empty space. I cite the P-38 Lightning.

      A ship like the Eaves/McCall class or the USS Vengence combines the advantages of a big ship (Weapons hardpoints, crew capacity, systemic redundancy) and a smaller ship (reduced target area, reduced mass/inertia) and adds a healthy dose of intimidation factor.
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    • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,236 Arc User
      edited July 2013
      sander233 wrote: »
      It does though. If you're firing at a target that's mostly empty space, you're mostly going to hit empty space. I cite the P-38 Lightning.

      A ship like the Eaves/McCall class or the USS Vengence combines the advantages of a big ship (Weapons hardpoints, crew capacity, systemic redundancy) and a smaller ship (reduced target area, reduced mass/inertia) and adds a healthy dose of intimidation factor.
      Except that you need WAY more empty space than those tiny holes give you. :P
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