Are Aux cannons working as intended?

darramouss1 · March 2013

As per my understanding, aux cannons feed off auxiliary power. Why is it that my aux cannons go off-line when EITHER my weapons or auxiliary subsystems are knocked off-line?

Cryptic, I'm seriously hoping that this is a bug. No item should be dependent on two subsystems, especially not an item that is paid for like the Vesta.

Anyone else have this issue?

EDIT: Ticket submitted in the stead that this is a bug, but what do tickets do? Not much in my experience.

kimmym · March 2013

It is working as intended, in fact the game was patched to add it.

Knocking weapons offline takes out aux cannons as well, so that you don't get around skills like TSS:W.

IMO Aux cannons aren't that great anyway, so who cares.

smokeybacon90 · March 2013

Put points into subsystem repair, and run as many human boffs as possible. System downtime will only be a few seconds. Engineering team will also remedy this. It is hardly a huge drawback, as a focused science build can now concentrate solely on Aux power without worrying about a drop in damage.

darramouss1 · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

It is working as intended, in fact the game was patched to add it.

Knocking weapons offline takes out aux cannons as well, so that you don't get around skills like TSS:W.

IMO Aux cannons aren't that great anyway, so who cares.

They should not be tied to two subsystems. You say that they would get around TSS:W but they fall victim to TSS:Aux. Let's face it, Aux is the skill that a sci dreads losing, so taking the Vesta's weapons off line for losing weapons really blows.

Who cares? I'd say people like me who use the Vesta with aux cannons with max aux power and no weapons power.

darkjeff · March 2013

I thought they patched it so that Aux cannons are only disabled when Aux is disabled. Did they unpatch it recently or something?

kimmym · March 2013

Well, the devs say you are wrong, as they used to work they way you say and they purposely changed it to work how it does now.

It is how it works, and if you are using aux cannons that is a situation you have to deal with.

I don't use the aux cannons on my Vesta. There is a reason. You're half way there already.

Next you will notice that as you fire with your aux cannons, your aux goes up and down, so your sci abilities lose consistancy.

Then you realize that you still need weapon power anyway, or else your turrets and such are gimp. So you are still trying to maximize both power systems like any other non torp sci. You realize you aren't really gaining anything, just shifting the burden around.

Then you realize that there are better phaser cannons, and so for all the hassle you were dealing with to break even, you are then behind because the weapon itself is inferior.

Yeah... I could be arsed what happens to aux cannons, I replaced that starter gear ages ago.

Edit: I don't know if maybe they made a new patch to the old patch that I missed, but no, the last time I was aware they patched the cannons from being aux only. Originally you could fire them under the effects of target sub systems or one of those tholian torps or what have you. They nerfed that right quick because of course you then just load an aux and a normal cannon and your weapons never go down... which is the behavior the OP wishes they had. It was nerfed for being herp derp overpowered.

chuckingram · March 2013

darramouss1 wrote: »

Who cares? I'd say people like me who use the Vesta with aux cannons with max aux power and no weapons power.

Agreed, Darr. I didn't buy the Vesta pack to have an important feature like this get stealth nerfed.

As to the woefully ignorant question ?Who cares?? I have two suggestions:

1. Learn to stay away from topics that aren?t of concern. Not everyone is itching to read your every thought.

2. Respect the fact that MY error today may be YOUR error tomorrow. I?m SURE that if the shoe was on the other foot, kimmym wouldn?t want me trying to show how ?cool? I am by spitting on his thread.

doffingcomrade · March 2013

Wasn't really stealth. Was in patch notes ages back.

Aux cannons will go offline if the Weapons system goes offline, but NOT if the weapons system simply loses all power. Aux cannons will also go offline if Aux goes offline.

kimmym · March 2013

Spit on his thread, or show the proper lack of empathy? I was trying to be comforting believe it or not, trying to show that this concern was not a big deal in the scheme of things.

If your skin is really that thin, I can't help you, sorry. I swear some people get offended at oxygen these days...

Edit: Oh yeah, well yeah you don't need weapon power, but like I said, if you knock weapons offline out go your aux cannons too. Working as intended because elsewise you never lose weapons in a vesta, and that is stupid over powered.

Aux cannons are not meant to be end game gear. At least not running 3 of them. They have stated time and time again that they want you to have incentive to get gear after you get a ship, which is why things like the andorian phasers in the dil store got nerfed. They want you to have to progress to endgame weaponry, and c-store weapons are meant to get you started or for gimmick effects.

Aux cannons are starter gear, and then best used when mixed with regular cannons when you are fighting a weapon drain but not disable enemy... so yeah... working as designed.

chuckingram · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

I was trying to be comforting believe it or not, trying to show that this concern was not a big deal in the scheme of things.

Whether it's a "big deal" or not is a matter of opinion. If you had a fully formed ego you'd know this. At any rate, the situation is worthy of the feedback forum, hence this correctly positioned thread. I'd very much like to hear from CRYPTIC as to why this listed feature was altered.

kimmym · March 2013

Heh, my ego isn't fully formed, but I was trying to give advice and comfort on the fact that something you purchased wasn't gimp because one part of it was less then optimal, and instead of bemoaning it I simply say who cares and advance my character past that point and now they want to start slagging at me...

No good deed goes unpunished I suppose...

snoggymack22 · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

Yeah... I could be arsed what happens to aux cannons, I replaced that starter gear ages ago.

Starter gear? I thought they were Mk XII very rare weapons?

kimmym · March 2013

Purple text that says mkxii doesn't make good endgame gear.

Stats make good endgame gear.

Aux cannons aren't terribad, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying you're a gimp if you run them, they perform adequately.

Min maxing it is damn near impossible to get them to break even with even regular DCH with the same stats, let alone one with better mods.

Edit: Hell, using one is even a benefit in certain circumstances. So much of a benefit that it was nerfed down for being overpowered, but the OP would like that old functionality restored. I could be arsed one way or the other to be honest, just dropping the memo off not to expect the change he desired, and some ways of looking at it to soften the blow.

tangolight · March 2013

It makes sense anyway. When a captain says 'take their weapons offline', that means they're targeting your aux cannons if you're using them. The loss of weapon power doesn't effect them, but the 'weapons offline' status does.

tpalelena · March 2013

That is fair, but then taking the auxiliary offline should not take the weapons offline. Getting offline if aux or weapon power goes is a bit of a double weakness.

brataccas · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

Purple text that says mkxii doesn't make good endgame gear.

Stats make good endgame gear.

Aux cannons aren't terribad, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying you're a gimp if you run them, they perform adequately.

They're as good as any other regular purple Mk XII Phaser DHCs. The nice thing about Aux cannons is that if you min/max your power levels with Efficiency you can run your DHCs at 125 Aux and your rear weapons (Turrets or whatever) at 100+ Weapons simultaneously - end result is more DPS than a 125 Weapons Phaser build and near enough 100% 125 Aux uptime.

darramouss1 · March 2013

chuckingram wrote: »

Agreed, Darr. I didn't buy the Vesta pack to have an important feature like this get stealth nerfed.

Especially considering that the pack is $50 and the Aux cannons are supposed to be one of the drawing cards for the ship.

kimmym wrote: »

I don't use the aux cannons on my Vesta. There is a reason. You're half way there already.

Next you will notice that as you fire with your aux cannons, your aux goes up and down, so your sci abilities lose consistancy.

Then you realize that you still need weapon power anyway, or else your turrets and such are gimp. So you are still trying to maximize both power systems like any other non torp sci. You realize you aren't really gaining anything, just shifting the burden around.

Then you realize that there are better phaser cannons, and so for all the hassle you were dealing with to break even, you are then behind because the weapon itself is inferior.

If you need to worry about weapons power on your Vesta then you've built it incorrectly. My weapons power on my Vesta is as low as I can put it and more often than not the damage output in PvP matches is just as high as an escort's.

kimmym · March 2013

And anything an aux vesta can do my wep vesta can do just better with a standard build with stronger cannons.

And anything said Vestas could do I can out do in an Atrox, other than turn on a dime and give you change.

Cling to them if you must, I really CBA.

brataccas · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

And anything an aux vesta can do my wep vesta can do just better with a standard build with stronger cannons.

Only if you're popping Aux and/or Weapons batteries and personally, I don't consider relying on batteries 'better' but maybe you do.

kimmym · March 2013

Oh, your one of those bads who think consumables are bad.

I'll just move along, even tho my consumable use is rather light.

brataccas · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

Oh, your one of those bads who think consumables are bad.

I'll just move along, even tho my consumable use is rather light.

I didn't say they were bad, just that it's possible to build a Vesta with Aux DHCs and 125 Aux (so max Sci/heals) that does more damage than a Vesta with 125 Weapons and [Acc]x2 [Dmg] Phaser DHCs - I think that's pretty neat.

Oh, and I use Shield Batts and Deuterium.

kimmym · March 2013

And with no batteries I build my vesta, and my atrox both, to have both 125 aux and 125 wep, so I'm not certain your pride... Or your point? And I haven't skimped on shield power either.

brataccas · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

And with no batteries I build my vesta, and my atrox both, to have both 125 aux and 125 wep, so I'm not certain your pride... Or your point? And I haven't skimped on shield power either.

Well then you're relying on powers to boost those stats - powers my build doesn't need to use = more Boff skills for other things.

kimmym · March 2013

Great, you do that, I'll out perform you, and giggle, and you won't listen or learn, like most of the people out there.

snoggymack22 · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

Purple text that says mkxii doesn't make good endgame gear.

Stats make good endgame gear.

Still, though, calling them starter gear is a pretty big exaggeration. They're not starter gear. They may not be your weapon of choice, but they work just fine in the end-game for others and keep pace just fine with a lot of other Mk XII equipment.

brataccas · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

Great, you do that, I'll out perform you, and giggle, and you won't listen or learn, like most of the people out there.

Oh please.

Just because you've failed to realize it's possible to put together a very powerful build with Aux DHCs doesn't mean that you have to get all defensive.

And if you want to test your build against mine then by all means get in touch @brataccas

kimmym · March 2013

Ok, I'll just let somebody who admits that they don't run a log parser pretend they understand the numbers better then me...

Humans... I swear...

darramouss1 · March 2013

kimmym wrote: »

Ok, I'll just let somebody who admits that they don't run a log parser pretend they understand the numbers better then me...

Humans... I swear...

Wow, holier than thou complex much?

Regardless of how you go about power management levels one thing that can't be argued with is that the player who only needs to worry about 3 subsystems will have more power to go around than a player who worries about 4.

ussberlin · March 2013

post you builts and shut up

and PVP is no part of Star Trek Online if it whold go like i want

i dont want that PVP want a buff or debuff and i get it too as PVE Player

make a big big line/wall between PVP and PVE Gameplay

tpalelena · March 2013

You two should really see who has the longer.... I mean, who has the more powerful ship.

the1tigglet · March 2013

darramouss1 wrote: »

As per my understanding, aux cannons feed off auxiliary power. Why is it that my aux cannons go off-line when EITHER my weapons or auxiliary subsystems are knocked off-line?

Cryptic, I'm seriously hoping that this is a bug. No item should be dependent on two subsystems, especially not an item that is paid for like the Vesta.

Anyone else have this issue?

EDIT: Ticket submitted in the stead that this is a bug, but what do tickets do? Not much in my experience.

Well for one thing, they shouldn't drain like the regular weapons do because that makes them completely useless, Aux isnt there for show and the only people to use aux are science ships who need it for their skills

They don't do anywhere near the same damage as the other cannons do so why bother with them imo. I was making a new science character but it's really worthless imo to use these at all!

If they made them anywhere near the damage output of the quads I could understand their purpose but really I don't It's sorta like using the defiant for pve you really won't be using 50 in engines which is required for quads honestly.

Now what they should have done is made these weapons get enhanced damage bonuses from the other types of power instead of relying on these types that would have made sense so that it would remain balanced yet a benefit.

Are Aux cannons working as intended?

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