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Cryptic has peeved off the Luna's Creator
majesticmsfc
Member Posts: 1,401 Arc User
Sean Tourangeau, the creator of the Luna class (aka USS Titan, Riker's ship in the novel series), is rather disappointed and frustrated by Cryptic. He had tired to get into contact with Cryptic, so they can accurately get the Titan model right. This has been an on going process. He hasn't heard back since Captain Logan left Cryptic.
Now the Mirror Universe Titan has come out. Again not accurate just a repaint even though he already has a Mirror Universe Titan/Luna designed and even available as a Resin Kit.
Us gamers know Cryptic only has released the Mirror ships to fill out the Lock Boxes, cheap and easy to do and not all that great. But I am also a 3D modeller and ship designer so I can understand and feel for Sean, who's own design which he has put a huge amount of himself into has been brutally abused.
So what say you Cryptic? If you plan to bring in Mirror designs and fan designs into this game, do them justice. Also while I'm at it, how about giving the canon KDF designs a spruce up as they are pretty poorly done especially the Negh'var.
Now the Mirror Universe Titan has come out. Again not accurate just a repaint even though he already has a Mirror Universe Titan/Luna designed and even available as a Resin Kit.
Us gamers know Cryptic only has released the Mirror ships to fill out the Lock Boxes, cheap and easy to do and not all that great. But I am also a 3D modeller and ship designer so I can understand and feel for Sean, who's own design which he has put a huge amount of himself into has been brutally abused.
So what say you Cryptic? If you plan to bring in Mirror designs and fan designs into this game, do them justice. Also while I'm at it, how about giving the canon KDF designs a spruce up as they are pretty poorly done especially the Negh'var.
Support the Game by Supporting the KDF, equality and uniqueness for all factions!
Post edited by majesticmsfc on
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And yes, the Imperial Luna actually looks the part compared to the in game repaint.
That said, in all fairness, the ship guys' plates have allegedly been rather full of late. Between the D'kora, the Vesta, the Aeon, the Rozhenko, the Wells, the Mobius, the Kren, the Korrath, and the Regent, I'd believe it.
I'd really like to hear from Jamz or Miller about this, though. I can't imagine one of them wouldn't have responded if contacted directly, but I don't know either of them personally, so.... can't say for sure.
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
Where did you hear this? I can't go to DA right now, because I'm at work, and there are things there that would make my boss's eyes bleed, lol.
EDIT: Is this the one you're talking about? It looks like it has twin 'mission pods' on top...although they look more like torpedo pods, at first glance... http://www.dynaverse.net/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=163369568.0;attach=9469
The unfortunate reality is that the schedule demands a certain output from these designers so that there are compelling reasons for players to spend money on the game. Fitting in graphical fixes that most players won't even notice is not a cost effective use of time.
I heard it from the guy himself on DeviantArt, I wouldn't call us friends, we don't know each other well enough, but we are fellow arts who share a similar passion. Both starship designers and all that and I can understand his disappointment.
To be honest doesn't matter how busy they are, the problem with this company is they always do things half done and more on. I say if you're going to do a ship (or anything else for that matter) do it correctly the first time. I'm an amateur modeller myself and if I can do a model within a certain timeframe from start to finish I think a company who pays people could do it right with a lot bigger timeframe. The Feddies get a new ships what, once every 4-6 weeks? Give the modellers a more realistic timeframe and some freedom to do the best they can, attention to detail all that. I understand the gaming industry giving unrealistic timeframes on their employees.
The whole point of this thread however is to see if Cryptic will get in contact with the artist and at least open/respond to him and keep the communication lines open. Include him in any future developments of the Luna class or kitbashes, retrofits etc.
Firstly, the minute you pick the ship, you're given the option to customise it, so it is no longer a true Luna Class (from any point of view). Secondly, Cryptics idea of a Mirror Universe ship is a simple re-skin. If people started suggesting that the Mirror Universe models (and not just their textures) were different, Cryptic would have a lot of work cut out for them having to essentially rework every Terran vessel.
Like I said, I can see where the author is coming from; least Cryptic could have done is talk to the guy, but I don't think, in this instance, the question of whether the model is true really matters.
My character Tsin'xing
PWE would like to think they are perfect.
also with regard to the general thread topic, Cryptic can just say to the guy "Well multi-verse" sadly they can use that argument to support whatever the hell they want to do to the game and there is nothing we can do about that as Multi-verse is a concept often used in Star Trek
They were looking at the Excalibur as I recall, and when they checked the polycount, it seemed way too high. What they found out was that there were at least 5,000 polys around the edge of the saucer to make it appear smooth. When they removed all the unnecessary vertices, the mesh turned into something resembling play-doh.
If all the in-game models are as weird as that, then even small modifications would be a massive undertaking. Considering that would involve resources that they could devote to making more lockbox stuff and C-Store fluff, I would seriously doubt that the devs will be applying any further polish to any ship that doesn't cost $25 (and sometimes, not even then) anytime soon. Especially since the game has scores of bugs that have been present for quite some time.
What saddens me is that I have the Bridge Commander SNS Galaxy model converted for the SFC2/3 engine in Taldren's old model viewer right now, and that a low poly fan made galaxy model constructed for a game engine over 10 years old looks superior to the in-game graphics for the Galaxy in almost every way. So I can sympathize with everyone who looks at the Luna in-game (including her creator) and feels like she just looks wrong, wrong, wrong!
Which leads us to another problem, the ships should be rescaled! Rescale everything, bigger = better in my book.
Reality Check for Mewi: They wont do that, because that involves... effort.
| Join Date: January 2009 | Computer | Fleet: Broken Wings |
I agree with that Negh'Var its always missed that look it had from the series IMO and the bridge lay out does not even make it feel like a warship it just makes it feel like its a federation ship stuck inside the armor of a klingon one.
In most cases though when everything is incorporated they play the silence game and just ignore someone unless its costing them potential profits... they just hope someone gives up and goes away so they never have to face the issue.
THe sensor pod does not have a deflector dish on never did never wanted.
As for other details they are minor, and I was going to get capt Logan all the detailed
images of the Luna for rework before he left. Since then I have tried contacting people at cryptic to get them the images but no one has.
As most of you know I also developed a Mirror Universe version of the Titan a while back, and when I saw what they were calling a Mirror Luna for the game I had really got ticked off. I designed a way better version that they could of used all they need to do is ask and I would of been more than happy to let them have it.
I have always been open to letting more of my design go into the game if they wanted.
Oh well off my soap box. Thanks for all of your support.
Sean
http://stourangeau.deviantart.com/#/d3116pd
Mirror Universe Art - http://stourangeau.deviantart.com/gallery/445971
Commissions - http://stourangeau.deviantart.com/gallery/7624222
Titan Images - http://stourangeau.deviantart.com/gallery/445973
And the Titan Shipyards - http://hammerheadgraphics.iwarp.com/TitanShipyards/
Enjoy,
Sean
No, I WON'T give you a break.
Going by your logic, why do we have Galaxy Classes ingame? In the "30 years since TNG", the Galaxy should've been refitted to "Galaxy-X" specs. I.e the 3rd nacelle, spinal lance, cannons etc. Miranda Classes are woefully outdated, yet they seemingly remain a full 130 years post-Wrath of Khan. Cryptic covers these facts up, by justifying it as being "recreations" of existing ship classes. Why would ANY Captain wanna fly a 130 year old rust-bucket, when they could be flying Odyssey Classes, or Regent Classes?
You "Cryptic defenders" seem to justify all the mistakes on the ships, by that it's been 30 years since Nemesis. I say, Cryptic should've just run with ALL ORIGINAL designs, and skipped all the canon ships in the first place. But that would be a disservice to the fans, wouldn't it?
Honestly, as the designer of the Luna Class, I hope Sean Tourangeau takes legal action against Cryptic/PW for bastardizing his designs.
Number #01: If Cryptic wants to have "Mirror Universe" or Terran Empire ships in the game, that's fine. But leave them as an NPC faction like they used to be. That way you can design truly unique ships indicative of the "violent" nature of the Mirror Universe.
Number #02: I refuse to believe that all ship classes are virtual copies of the "Prime Universe" ships. The Mirror "TOS Enterprise" is easily explained by the lack of budget back in the 60s. The Mirror "Defiant" in DS9, is explained by Mirror O'Brien having copied the plans for the Defiant.
Number #03: Lastly, having the Mirror Universe ships being nothing more than simple "retextures" of the Prime Universe ships, is indicative of the lazy nature of certain Cryptic developers.
However, I do agree that the Art Department should be given time - by the games Producer - to revisit the Luna itself as originally intended. Get some of its lines adjusted appropriately. Licensing aside, it's a good faith move as the designs original artist is interested in advising. If only from a distance.
You may refuse to believe it, but this is how Trek lore has worked.
Forgetting about the ship appearances for the moment, this is called the Mirror Universe; where everybody and everything is suppose to be mirrored. Sisko, Picard and Kirk should have been Sasha, Penelope and Katherine.
Thinking back to events of the Mirror TOS (or Mirror ENT if you're connecting the Enterprise timeline); events that happened there didn't happen here, and we know that the smallest of changes can have a huge impact on the future.
In the Mirror Universe (via ENT) Sato became empress, and humanity was at war with the Vulcans, Andorians, Tellarites, Orions ect. Many people would have thus died in those conflicts that didn't die in the true timeline, yet people (Kirk, Picard, Sisko) all have their mirror counterparts. It seems highly unlikely that this would be the results. If Miles had grandparents stationed on the ISS Avenger (which was destroyed) then howcome we've still got Smiley?
The Mirror Universe doesn't make sense, it's just the writers trying to entertain. Don't put too much thought into it cause the logic will come back and bite you in the TRIBBLE every time.
Again, I am in full agreement.
"I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey, and reminds us to cherish every moment... because they'll never come again. What we leave behind is not as important as how we lived" Picard to Riker
Wouldn't that make it "Opposite Universe?" You don't see "flashica252" when you look in your bathroom mirror do you? I get what you're saying, and sure, some main characters shouldn't have mirror counterparts, but on the whole I think the concept is workable, just needs some polish. Besides, if you're telling me that if Cryptic took a mirror ship, and added some sort of spikes or other garnishes on it to further differentiate from the "prime" universe, then I feel like we're just splitting hairs at this point.
really, i'm not even surprised anymore.
sell a new Luna Class per, by now, default Money Grab LockBox rip off scheme, and don't even do the research to make sure that the product you try to sell fits with what the customer would expect.
Because all Mirror Ships are just a reskin with a one texture fits all approach anyway, so who cares to double check?
*disappointed sigh*
+1 to fix the Luna
+1 to fix everything else on the list of ship errors
many people aren't playing this game for the newest C-Store / LockBox Shiny but to fly their all time favorites from STAR TREK.
Cryptic seems to have forgotten about that.
Quantity > Quality.
it should be abundantly clear that crypic has 0 interest in going back and touching up already released ships, all they care about is what new non starfleet or non klingon ship they can include next, the artists have mentioned several times preferring making those :mad:
they had an opportunity to make the akira and sov look better with their recent releases, but no, they just made unattractive 2409 over styled beasts of costumes instead.
I just got a n email from Brandon W. Felczer - Community Manager - Star Trek Online
and I will get back to him with my concerns on the Luna.
It sounds like the Luna may be heading back to the Digital Spacedock in the future, just no stardate yet.
I take that as promising and plan on working with them in every way I can to get her looking right.
I am not sure about the I.S.S. getting retouched, but atleast it sounds like the U.S.S. might get an overhaul.
sounds good
but don't let them off the hook with the ISS so easily,
after all it is inside a LockBox and that means players have to pay $ for it (or somebody else did and put it up on the exchange), every Mirror Class Luna that exists is a $ earned, i don't think adding that alternate sensor pod + nacelles would be too much trouble for them.
only the red paint might not be in line with what they want the mirror ships to look like in their game,
maybe a yellow recolor of your pic would be a compromise we all could live with?
out of the 30,000 bugs, hickups, imbalances, inconsistencies and possible additions I would like the devs to spend their precious time on...this one... is among the bottom 5.
just saying