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No-win needs to be heavily reworked
captaintroika
Member Posts: 210 Arc User
There has got to be a better way to make it difficult than having multiple ****-you turrets that are far from the battle spamming tons of bioneural warheads (and are also virtually unkillable), or having multiple Scimitars that can fire their thalaron beam while cloaked show up simultaneously (which is an instant wipe because even if the players can somehow tank them, the freighter can't).
This is yet another piece of Gozer work that needs to be smashed with a crowbar, and then the pieces reassembled into something better.
Before Gozer got his greasy pedipalps on it, it was possible for a really really tight team to get to the last wave. Now this is impossible, which means this is literally a waste of time for getting fleet marks.
This is yet another piece of Gozer work that needs to be smashed with a crowbar, and then the pieces reassembled into something better.
Before Gozer got his greasy pedipalps on it, it was possible for a really really tight team to get to the last wave. Now this is impossible, which means this is literally a waste of time for getting fleet marks.
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And that's NOT counting where it suddenly decides it just doesn't like that you're doing so well so it wipes out the entire team without firing a shot. Had that happen more than once.
It's not worth 7 Fleet Marks to waste my time, at all. Ever. Cryptic is TRIBBLE up a lot of stuff.
Seriously, bullcrap. We know we're not suppose to win, but we are still suppose to be ABLE to win. make it challenging enough that someone can actually beat it just by the skin of their teeth, not a slaughterfest that prevents anyone from getting past wave 5.
-The Milkshake Song: Vulcan Edition
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
There are enough missions in the game where the enemies are evenly spaced out allowing to you to heal and they will just wait until you come over to kill them.
To me the No-Win battles are what happens with a stronger force throws everything they have at you. No long breaks, no coming in just outside your range and waiting for you to come to them.
For the turrets, I have been in well coordinated events where a couple of the bigger damage ships go and take them out in the brief pause between waves.
While normally I have made it to wave 4, there was a time where wave 2 of a Romulan attack had the Battleships firing those 5-shot torpedo bursts. That did not end well. I took it as if I had those to throw at an attack I would.
Peaceful exploration? I have a heavily armed ship and a phaser with a kill setting, how peaceful is that?
While I agree the ramp up is messed up, you obviously don't understand the meaning of No-Win.:rolleyes:
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
If you want to win,it's not a NO-WIN scenario... :P
That being said 4 out of the 5 players were tacs with escorts.
Opening a lockbox is like using a public restroom when u gotta poo.
You are just hoping nobody blew on the seat or that all the toilet paper is gone.
then why did the developers design it that someone eventually could finish and win it?
The fact remains that it has been beaten, and the patch notes when it was first put in mentioned that it is possible to beat it. This means that the designers DESIGNED the no-win scenario to be winnable.
It needs to be balanced out where players actually can win it through sheer luck (key word: luck), without stacking the odds against the players where it is completely impossible to make it to the next wave.
They need to make it "Next-to-impossible" to make it to the next wave instead.
-The Milkshake Song: Vulcan Edition
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
we make private team of 5, go in, only 4 of us get there due to current teaming bugs, and then we get served with 3 karfis on lvl 1. And they are not player karfis with reasonable 40 - 60k hull. no they are nowin karfis with 160+k hull and some superpowers.
since then we practially stopped bothering. Cause it's bugged and boring. But alternatively we have to grind ground nukara for marks and that is pure bloddy torture... Well but at least you can get your marks there.
It is particularly hard to avoid profanity describing it, but i think I managed somehow.
This NO WIN scenario released in Season 6 is utter horse rubbish.
Let me explain why......It does not gauge anything.....
Perhaps if the scenario offered accollades i.e. I survived round 5 ....or some other things it might start appealing to the masses.
There is no reason in having this scenario.......it does not fit in with the SEASON 6 flavor......why is saving a holographic ship even there....feels like empty filler for no content.
right now it fails on all levels IMO.
Maybe if the devs implemented an ANALYSIS of the team afterwards.......best DPS best heals blah blah......SOMETHING
Been playing STO since Open Beta, and have never regarded anything as worse than 'meh', if only due to personal standards.
Sounds about right.
CO noob and STO veteran.
apart from that i like it. if u get to wave 6 ur doing dam amazing
At Wave 3, in one scene, that poor freigther was lite up like a christmas tree, with 2 or 3 Rifts place dead center on it.
There is no frakkin' ship in the Feds, or Klinks that can removed that right away. I like tough challlenges like any other person.
But when I see Over-abused Tough...then it is not a challenge.
It was beaten buy the Pandas, and then Gozer buffed it to a true NO WIN. the highest i have made was with a pug to level 6 on tribble, but that was 1 day before release onto Holodeck.
How is one suppose to get the Accolodes? What is the point of it if you can get it? That is my only argument, make it no win for Premades, but "HOLY MOTHER of that guy Peter Griffin! that was hard" (excuse the metaphor, inside joke)
It now stands a bragging rights kinda thing. But i think the OPed 5 man Jemmy can do it... Go jemmys go...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
1) Teamwork and timing is #1
2) You cannot "Kirk It" in every ship
3) You are going to die, just get back up
"OH NOS TEH PAINT IS SCRATCHED! CLOAK AND PREPARE TEH LAZR!"
I pictured No Win scenario as the team eventually being overrun by sheer numbers or by numerous powerful ships. Then the team gets killed one by one until they cant respawn fast enough to save the freighter.
wave 1
5 mph
wave 2
10mph
wave 3
20mph
wave 4
40mph
wave 5
300mph immediately followed by a crash into a brick wall...........
join date: Jan. 2012
I have no problems with how you would design it - just as long as you call it the "Next-to-Impossible to Win Scenario". Just saying.....
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
They can go on forever without any increases in top power level but that kind of stagnation rarely if ever makes for a good game. We are already seeing T6 (fleet) ships... eventually people will get bored with those and look for new challenges.
The No-Win scenario offers a longer term goal.
It is clear from many of the posts on the boards that there are a lot of players who shun the concept of longer term goals, but that does not make them a bad thing. Getting everything immediately just makes for a quicker boredom.
Gozer's No win was beaten, he took out that frustration of the one group that did it, on everyone else and made it impossible to even get very far in it. Getting overrun is one thing, get run over with a mac truck while driving a vespa is entirely different.
[Unrepentant] Lapo@overlapo: the problem with space STF
is that you can't properly teabag your defeated opponent
Unrepentant: Home of the Rainbow Warrior and the Rainbow Brigade.
It was beaten on TEST, not on live. It was meant to be NO WIN. That isn't 'taking out frustrations' that is observing it was not working as intended on testing and revising it accordingly.
It was not meant to be winnable. Period. At least not at this time.
However, it gets impossible only at Wave 5. Wave 4 is quite difficult to complete with those bio-neurals that are impossible to destroy and shoot back for a bucket ton of damage (seriously, I was at full health and those things shot me for like 2seconds and I died. Not the turret, the warheads).
But you can get past it. But Wave 5? So many groups, all at once, very spread out and only 15seconds later. And you normally don't even have those 15 secs to get ready because there are almost always a last wave of bio-neurals to take out.
Opening a lockbox is like using a public restroom when u gotta poo.
You are just hoping nobody blew on the seat or that all the toilet paper is gone.
1) So there is something more for people to try for.
2) Because as newer and better gear is released over time, it will eventually get beaten.
Alternately: 3) Gozer is a terrible game designer and a petulant man-child and anything he touched in this game should be gone over with a fine-toothed comb to remove his slime.
It needs tweaking. Last time I played (2 or 3d ago) it was from 1-4 quite cool. It got a bit harder but nothing too much and at 5 it totally went berserk and anihilated everything in a few seconds. Might be 1-5 cool and 6 = nightmare. Not completly sure anymore. But I think it was 5 with made an insane difficulty jump.
Or it could be a massive conspiracy involving the Illuminati, the Free Masons, and the Underpants Gnomes.
I am sticking with the 'it was always intended to be no win (at this time)' explanation.
Your explanation is incorrect, as the existence of the accolade for completing it proves.