My point was that there is a big difference between the results someone will see if they are playing to get to max level and if they are playing with no regard to whether they level. Anyone who focuses on leveling should reach max level in a few days of game time with no difficulty; however, someone could have weeks played without reaching max level only if they weren't interested in reaching max.
What would greater rewards change that these people would suddenly want to reach max level if it only take a day or two instead of three or four to do so?
I'm glad it only took you a few days to reach max level. It's safe to assume that it takes most people significantly longer (especially KDF PvEers). What double XP does for the KDF is it reduces grind. Isn't that what this thread is about?
My experience is not based on PvP, since I almost never do and haven't at all on most characters.
Again, kudos to your ability to level rapidly. How does the disclaimer go? "Inspired leveling time is not typical." Your experience is not everyone's. Most people, especially PvE players, find KDF leveling to be a mindnumbing grind. The OP's proposal could fix that.
People are doing so during a weekend event to take advantage of unique opportunity, people who don't play often or who normally play a different character would have no significant reason to change if the reward increase became the new norm.
What double XP does for the KDF is it reduces grind. Isn't that what this thread is about?
In fact, it is. The double XP itself isn't the point. The point is the population increase that would result, demonstrating to the devs that people would play the KDF if they reduce the grind through other means, such as diverting some resources to manufacturing KDF exclusive content.
It's a realistic way around the catch-22 we're currently stuck in.
Even if it isnt Q, have some "famous" hero of the Empire telling stories that "inspire" you for the same effect. Until the KDF has a complete PvE leveling path they deserve to have something special like this.
In fact, it is. The double XP itself isn't the point. The point is the population increase that would result, demonstrating to the devs that people would play the KDF if they reduce the grind through other means, such as diverting some resources to manufacturing KDF exclusive content.
It's a realistic way around the catch-22 we're currently stuck in.
first, its not a catch-22. thats an excuse the devs have used to try to justify not doing anything regarding content for the KDF. second, population would not increase. why? because there is still no content. all the xp bonuses in the universe aren't going to change that. you STILL will have to do the same missions over and over and over again. xp or no xp, nobody wants to do that. and even if they do it, what happens when they reach max level? nothing. they leave. because there is nothing to do.
to say nothing of what the fed players will scream if the KDF starts getting xp bonuses and they don't.
in short, this idea will solve nothing and if anything, will only lead to more problems
I'm glad it only took you a few days to reach max level. It's safe to assume that it takes most people significantly longer (especially KDF PvEers). What double XP does for the KDF is it reduces grind. Isn't that what this thread is about?
Again, kudos to your ability to level rapidly. How does the disclaimer go? "Inspired leveling time is not typical." Your experience is not everyone's. Most people, especially PvE players, find KDF leveling to be a mindnumbing grind. The OP's proposal could fix that.
Sure they would. Less grind.
My bad. Corrected.
Z
It has nothing to do with ability to level rapidly. People are either trying to level or not. If they're trying to level, I don't see how it can take more than a few days of playing time. Yes, I've had characters that I mostly played for fun and not get to max level, and those can easily get to several days (and potentially much more) of played time before reaching max level. All this does is explains why some players who actually play the game are not at level. Because that is not their goal.
And again, if it is not their goal to get to get to max level, then how does a reward boost benefit them?
Even if it isnt Q, have some "famous" hero of the Empire telling stories that "inspire" you for the same effect. Until the KDF has a complete PvE leveling path they deserve to have something special like this.
They could give the loresingers on Qo'noS more purpose this way.
So rather then Having more content we bribe the player base with a leveling boost? it feels kind of lazy to me. and I'm sure some people would call that outright unfair. Most people Don't play klingons for at least 3 primary reason i always seem to see.
1. no content or lack of.
2. lack of customization.
3. honestly this one makes me raise my eyebrow. But i've seen a lot of ...too many ugly aliens.
I don't think a level booster will do much. Sure you can level fast fly your ships....but because there is a lack of content...players will simply go right back to feds. It's a stopgap measure at most. like putting a bandaid on a hemmorage (spelled that wrong)
Content in this players opinion should still be the primary focus for KDF players not flashy frills and little dangling fish hooks.
f you STILL will have to do the same missions over and over and over again.
Half as much, with the story missions meaning twice as much. I'm not the only one who noticed a stark difference in the KDF experience between normal and double XP.
Outlier or not he's 100% correct. Even if most haven't reached max level, what he's suggesting is entirely possible and entirely abusable. Even just putting in a few hours a night you could max a character in less than three days.
And for the record, if this happens then yes I am going to do it. It would make KDF grinding ridiculously quicker and easier than actual Emblem grinding on either side.
Also, doubling XP doesn't really change anything. The problem with levelling in the KDF isn't speed, it's lack of content.
Keep in mind that the fastest method to levelling is grinding cluster missions, and those are available to the KDF (and are quicker to get to, and you have the kill X number of NPC quests which stack thus making it quicker to level a klingon as things stand). So yeah, speed is not the problem. If it were then the KDF would have the bulk of the game's population already since levelling is faster there now (just not enough so to be incredibly abusable).
The problem is that there is so little to do. Whether repeating the same task 1,000 times or 500 times the difference is minimal, and ultimately immaterial to the problem. Shortening the grind doesn't make the grind more appealing, it just makes it shorter. You still have only a handful of missions for content. So... there's still no real incentive there for (most) people to sign up. So there still isn't likely to be any dramatic increase in population. Nothing to do for a few weeks, or nothing to do for a few days... it' still nothing to do.
So rather then Having more content we bribe the player base with a leveling boost? it feels kind of lazy to me. and I'm sure some people would call that outright unfair. Most people Don't play klingons for at least 3 primary reason i always seem to see.
Any substantial KDF faction specific content is not an option. Devs have said it's not on the table anywhere in the near term and may be years off, if ever, before there will be equality there.
In turn, there are plans to launch about 50 missions in the 12 month window following Featured Series 4. That's about what the Klingons need for smooth leveling. That's not laziness. That's what Cryptic has said is the absolute best they can do, with everyone working as hard as they can.
The permanent Double XP is the only real solution I've seen to make KDF leveling less painful, aside from Duty Officer assignments, that can be in place in 12 months with the resources available.
Your counter-option is not PHYSICALLY OR FINANCIALLY possible.
Outlier or not he's 100% correct. Even if most haven't reached max level, what he's suggesting is entirely possible and entirely abusable. Even just putting in a few hours a night you could max a character in less than three days.
It does ignore free market forces though. Commonality of epics will drive prices down.
Besides, you already have people doing the Diplomatic grind (27-32 hours) and selling those BOs for 20 million on the exchange.
It does ignore free market forces though. Commonality of epics will drive prices down.
Besides, you already have people doing the Diplomatic grind (27-32 hours) and selling those BOs for 20 million on the exchange.
That Diplomatic Grind gives (a) white BOffs of no real worth, unlike Emblem gear they are essentially aesthetic only and (b) it would actually take longer to grind to Diplomat than grinding a KDF character to max if double skill points were made permanent. In fact, most people don't even manage to hit Diplomat on their way to Vice Admiral.
It does ignore free market forces though. Commonality of epics will drive prices down.
Oh, and on this note, consider the bigger picture...
If Emblem gear starts flowing like water (and it would) who is going to buy that Rare drop you infrequently get? No one, because much better Very Rare equipment will be much more common and easier to get.
I'd think they could simply add an extra round of restrictions on emblem vendors or vet emblems that require a minimum amount of time on a character to start using them.
Besides, leveling in a day, even with double XP is Herculean playing and with plans to increase emblem availability anyway and consolidate currencies, I'm not sure I get it.
You can get close to 200 emblems in a weekend during a Double XP weekend with the same kind of hardcore play it would take to level an alt for the freebie vet emblems. I'm sure that once they consolidate currencies, 250 emblems will be chump change.
I don't think the economy should really be a pressing factor in decisions like this because it needs and will get an overhaul anyway... and almost certainly one which devalues everything currently purchasable aside from ships anyway.
Consider that if emblems will be the currency at all tiers of exploration with higher tiers assigned more emblems, emblems and existing emblem gear are bound to get dramatically devalued.
That Diplomatic Grind gives (a) white BOffs of no real worth, unlike Emblem gear they are essentially aesthetic only and (b) it would actually take longer to grind to Diplomat than grinding a KDF character to max if double skill points were made permanent. In fact, most people don't even manage to hit Diplomat on their way to Vice Admiral.
So the two situations aren't at all comparable.
[EDIT]
Oh, and on this note, consider the bigger picture...
If Emblem gear starts flowing like water (and it would) who is going to buy that Rare drop you infrequently get? No one, because much better Very Rare equipment will be much more common and easier to get.
[/EDIT]
The best crafted gear is what, 2-3 DPS less than the best Emblem gear (ground)? And crafted ship weapons are actually better than Emblem gear (176 DPS vs 172 DPS for a Mk XI Disruptor Beam Array). And the price of crafted gear to the crafter is "time served". I'm pretty sure I can get the samples to craft that stuff faster than someone can get an alt to level 41, even with a double XP boost.
People can grind out an alt to 41, cash in their Veteran bonus Emblems for gear and put them on the Exchange now. And as has been mentioned, it takes a paltry amount of time to do so. Delete toon, rinse and repeat, right? Since this is most likely occurring now, the system is either working as intended or Cryptic will make any item purchased with Marks/Emblems/Badges Bind on Pickup.
And most rares are worthless now anyway due to crafted gear being better. I'm constantly getting what I think are really good rare drops only to find out they're on the Exchange for 40% of their face value (or less). Most gear is nothing but vendor fodder at VA, rare or otherwise.
I don't think a level booster will do much. Sure you can level fast fly your ships....but because there is a lack of content...players will simply go right back to feds. It's a stopgap measure at most. like putting a bandaid on a hemmorage (spelled that wrong).
Any substantial KDF faction specific content is not an option. Devs have said it's not on the table anywhere in the near term and may be years off, if ever, before there will be equality there.
(snip)
Your counter-option is not PHYSICALLY OR FINANCIALLY possible.
Nevetheless, CaptainThraxx does have a point. It may not be just the grind that keeps people away from the faction - it may be the impression that they have to grind at all. For such folks, no amount of xp bonus is going to draw them in. It may be that the only players it would attract would be those who couldn't give a flip about content - but then those folks would already be playing KDF if they were so inclined.
IMO, the xp bonus is a catch-22 solution to a catch-22 problem. Who would actually bite? What's to keep Fed-side players from demanding the same treatment (at which point we're back at square one)? What's the "exit strategy" if the KDF does get a smooth levelling experience?
The only reason I'm not saying "over my dead account" to this is that I can't deny that it just might work. Not likely, IMO, but stranger things have happened.
I'd still like to see the Klingon missions restructured, so that they're accessible at lower levels (and so you don't have to grind to the end of a tier to access them). Or, as others have suggested, bring the Foundry more squarely in play somehow.
Nevetheless, CaptainThraxx does have a point. It may not be just the grind that keeps people away from the faction - it may be the impression that they have to grind at all. For such folks, no amount of xp bonus is going to draw them in. It may be that the only players it would attract would be those who couldn't give a flip about content - but then those folks would already be playing KDF if they were so inclined.
IMO, the xp bonus is a catch-22 solution to a catch-22 problem. Who would actually bite? What's to keep Fed-side players from demanding the same treatment (at which point we're back at square one)? What's the "exit strategy" if the KDF does get a smooth levelling experience?
The only reason I'm not saying "over my dead account" to this is that I can't deny that it just might work. Not likely, IMO, but stranger things have happened.
I'd still like to see the Klingon missions restructured, so that they're accessible at lower levels (and so you don't have to grind to the end of a tier to access them). Or, as others have suggested, bring the Foundry more squarely in play somehow.
XP bonus is far from what you portray. It helps the Klingons, because they lack content and have problems leveling and once there have nothing to do but PvP.
It effects the Federation, because they lack content and have nothing to do but PvP at the same level.....
Sure it takes longer if you are KDF, but this isn't 2 games.
Any Kdf who maxes, faces the same problems as any Fed who does, The KDF has the advantage of being a PvP built race, and (even in small doses) gets some love. Less "need Q", more play a klingon, or ask this game to stop trying to be 2 different things,.
KDF PVE is asking for a second game added to this one, and really, we would probably do better adding Romulans, than adding to the KDF, if that's what you want.
Last note.
Think about what players might like. Open PvP isn't going to be the Godsend you think it is.
Would prefer a "Klingon Welcome Back Weekend' or something like this to increase the Klingon Player Base ... come see the new Quonos etc ... here are some goodies and douBle XP etc etc ....
Maybe on a regular basis like every two months ... they could even attach it to an event like Borg Invasion in KDF Space etc ...
XP bonus is far from what you portray. It helps the Klingons, because they lack content and have problems leveling and once there have nothing to do but PvP.
I'm not sure I follow - are you saying that the solution to the content imbalance is to race the Klingons to max level - where there's even less to do?
Think about what players might like. Open PvP isn't going to be the Godsend you think it is.
I'm not sure double XP flat across the board would be wholly fair, but I think the answer lies merely in increasing the XP for KDF specific content. Especially the wrapper missions, those yield a laughably pitiful ammount of XP. I also genuinely think PVP xp should be increased, it's almost nonsensical that you supposedly can gain more experience from fighting NPCs than human opponents who can think and improvise just like you can.
Another thing that'd perhaps be intresting to explore is additional KDF bonus objectives to the existing feature episode missions that'd be covered in a series wrapper mission like "Path of the Warrior" for the sorties. It'd allow extra XP, and also give a good way to add more "Klingon" elements to the missions. Would a Klingon really fix a Ferengi's replicators? Really?
My main point however is that the wrapper missions as they are however, are an oppurtunity for Cryptic to grant XP that has to be earned, but that they do not have to create additional content for. I have no idea why they thought they should make the XP for them so low. That and sensible PVP XP would probably mean the KDF, while still being a sparse PVE enviroment, would be much more bearable to level.
Comments
I'm glad it only took you a few days to reach max level. It's safe to assume that it takes most people significantly longer (especially KDF PvEers). What double XP does for the KDF is it reduces grind. Isn't that what this thread is about?
Again, kudos to your ability to level rapidly. How does the disclaimer go? "Inspired leveling time is not typical." Your experience is not everyone's. Most people, especially PvE players, find KDF leveling to be a mindnumbing grind. The OP's proposal could fix that.
Sure they would. Less grind.
My bad. Corrected.
Z
In fact, it is. The double XP itself isn't the point. The point is the population increase that would result, demonstrating to the devs that people would play the KDF if they reduce the grind through other means, such as diverting some resources to manufacturing KDF exclusive content.
It's a realistic way around the catch-22 we're currently stuck in.
first, its not a catch-22. thats an excuse the devs have used to try to justify not doing anything regarding content for the KDF. second, population would not increase. why? because there is still no content. all the xp bonuses in the universe aren't going to change that. you STILL will have to do the same missions over and over and over again. xp or no xp, nobody wants to do that. and even if they do it, what happens when they reach max level? nothing. they leave. because there is nothing to do.
to say nothing of what the fed players will scream if the KDF starts getting xp bonuses and they don't.
in short, this idea will solve nothing and if anything, will only lead to more problems
It has nothing to do with ability to level rapidly. People are either trying to level or not. If they're trying to level, I don't see how it can take more than a few days of playing time. Yes, I've had characters that I mostly played for fun and not get to max level, and those can easily get to several days (and potentially much more) of played time before reaching max level. All this does is explains why some players who actually play the game are not at level. Because that is not their goal.
And again, if it is not their goal to get to get to max level, then how does a reward boost benefit them?
They could give the loresingers on Qo'noS more purpose this way.
1. no content or lack of.
2. lack of customization.
3. honestly this one makes me raise my eyebrow. But i've seen a lot of ...too many ugly aliens.
I don't think a level booster will do much. Sure you can level fast fly your ships....but because there is a lack of content...players will simply go right back to feds. It's a stopgap measure at most. like putting a bandaid on a hemmorage (spelled that wrong)
Content in this players opinion should still be the primary focus for KDF players not flashy frills and little dangling fish hooks.
Half as much, with the story missions meaning twice as much. I'm not the only one who noticed a stark difference in the KDF experience between normal and double XP.
Outlier or not he's 100% correct. Even if most haven't reached max level, what he's suggesting is entirely possible and entirely abusable. Even just putting in a few hours a night you could max a character in less than three days.
And for the record, if this happens then yes I am going to do it. It would make KDF grinding ridiculously quicker and easier than actual Emblem grinding on either side.
Also, doubling XP doesn't really change anything. The problem with levelling in the KDF isn't speed, it's lack of content.
Keep in mind that the fastest method to levelling is grinding cluster missions, and those are available to the KDF (and are quicker to get to, and you have the kill X number of NPC quests which stack thus making it quicker to level a klingon as things stand). So yeah, speed is not the problem. If it were then the KDF would have the bulk of the game's population already since levelling is faster there now (just not enough so to be incredibly abusable).
The problem is that there is so little to do. Whether repeating the same task 1,000 times or 500 times the difference is minimal, and ultimately immaterial to the problem. Shortening the grind doesn't make the grind more appealing, it just makes it shorter. You still have only a handful of missions for content. So... there's still no real incentive there for (most) people to sign up. So there still isn't likely to be any dramatic increase in population. Nothing to do for a few weeks, or nothing to do for a few days... it' still nothing to do.
Any substantial KDF faction specific content is not an option. Devs have said it's not on the table anywhere in the near term and may be years off, if ever, before there will be equality there.
In turn, there are plans to launch about 50 missions in the 12 month window following Featured Series 4. That's about what the Klingons need for smooth leveling. That's not laziness. That's what Cryptic has said is the absolute best they can do, with everyone working as hard as they can.
The permanent Double XP is the only real solution I've seen to make KDF leveling less painful, aside from Duty Officer assignments, that can be in place in 12 months with the resources available.
Your counter-option is not PHYSICALLY OR FINANCIALLY possible.
It does ignore free market forces though. Commonality of epics will drive prices down.
Besides, you already have people doing the Diplomatic grind (27-32 hours) and selling those BOs for 20 million on the exchange.
That Diplomatic Grind gives (a) white BOffs of no real worth, unlike Emblem gear they are essentially aesthetic only and (b) it would actually take longer to grind to Diplomat than grinding a KDF character to max if double skill points were made permanent. In fact, most people don't even manage to hit Diplomat on their way to Vice Admiral.
So the two situations aren't at all comparable.
[EDIT]
Oh, and on this note, consider the bigger picture...
If Emblem gear starts flowing like water (and it would) who is going to buy that Rare drop you infrequently get? No one, because much better Very Rare equipment will be much more common and easier to get.
[/EDIT]
I'd think they could simply add an extra round of restrictions on emblem vendors or vet emblems that require a minimum amount of time on a character to start using them.
Besides, leveling in a day, even with double XP is Herculean playing and with plans to increase emblem availability anyway and consolidate currencies, I'm not sure I get it.
You can get close to 200 emblems in a weekend during a Double XP weekend with the same kind of hardcore play it would take to level an alt for the freebie vet emblems. I'm sure that once they consolidate currencies, 250 emblems will be chump change.
I don't think the economy should really be a pressing factor in decisions like this because it needs and will get an overhaul anyway... and almost certainly one which devalues everything currently purchasable aside from ships anyway.
Consider that if emblems will be the currency at all tiers of exploration with higher tiers assigned more emblems, emblems and existing emblem gear are bound to get dramatically devalued.
The best crafted gear is what, 2-3 DPS less than the best Emblem gear (ground)? And crafted ship weapons are actually better than Emblem gear (176 DPS vs 172 DPS for a Mk XI Disruptor Beam Array). And the price of crafted gear to the crafter is "time served". I'm pretty sure I can get the samples to craft that stuff faster than someone can get an alt to level 41, even with a double XP boost.
People can grind out an alt to 41, cash in their Veteran bonus Emblems for gear and put them on the Exchange now. And as has been mentioned, it takes a paltry amount of time to do so. Delete toon, rinse and repeat, right? Since this is most likely occurring now, the system is either working as intended or Cryptic will make any item purchased with Marks/Emblems/Badges Bind on Pickup.
And most rares are worthless now anyway due to crafted gear being better. I'm constantly getting what I think are really good rare drops only to find out they're on the Exchange for 40% of their face value (or less). Most gear is nothing but vendor fodder at VA, rare or otherwise.
Z
IMO, the xp bonus is a catch-22 solution to a catch-22 problem. Who would actually bite? What's to keep Fed-side players from demanding the same treatment (at which point we're back at square one)? What's the "exit strategy" if the KDF does get a smooth levelling experience?
The only reason I'm not saying "over my dead account" to this is that I can't deny that it just might work. Not likely, IMO, but stranger things have happened.
I'd still like to see the Klingon missions restructured, so that they're accessible at lower levels (and so you don't have to grind to the end of a tier to access them). Or, as others have suggested, bring the Foundry more squarely in play somehow.
At least for this one, Q's capricious nature.
XP bonus is far from what you portray. It helps the Klingons, because they lack content and have problems leveling and once there have nothing to do but PvP.
It effects the Federation, because they lack content and have nothing to do but PvP at the same level.....
Sure it takes longer if you are KDF, but this isn't 2 games.
Any Kdf who maxes, faces the same problems as any Fed who does, The KDF has the advantage of being a PvP built race, and (even in small doses) gets some love. Less "need Q", more play a klingon, or ask this game to stop trying to be 2 different things,.
KDF PVE is asking for a second game added to this one, and really, we would probably do better adding Romulans, than adding to the KDF, if that's what you want.
Last note.
Maybe on a regular basis like every two months ... they could even attach it to an event like Borg Invasion in KDF Space etc ...
Another thing that'd perhaps be intresting to explore is additional KDF bonus objectives to the existing feature episode missions that'd be covered in a series wrapper mission like "Path of the Warrior" for the sorties. It'd allow extra XP, and also give a good way to add more "Klingon" elements to the missions. Would a Klingon really fix a Ferengi's replicators? Really?
My main point however is that the wrapper missions as they are however, are an oppurtunity for Cryptic to grant XP that has to be earned, but that they do not have to create additional content for. I have no idea why they thought they should make the XP for them so low. That and sensible PVP XP would probably mean the KDF, while still being a sparse PVE enviroment, would be much more bearable to level.