Very meh on the new ships. only thing that caught my eye was the fact it was a command ship with a hanger, then I read the starts of the Class -c shuttles and was underwhelmed. Compared to hanger pets such as the Flight Deck Cruiser Bundle or the Yukawa Frigates and the Styx's dreadnoughts.
Also what is the point of building up your character to operate a t6 ship if you can use them post training mission ?
Uhm, those ships aren't really great. Layout isn't great, the console is horrible +0,66% hull and 2% shields, some weak click me, what???? Not saying every new piece of equipment added to the game needs to be OP but that is really really bad. Also the starship trait does not list bridge officer CD reduction on the tooltip. Announcement said it would have that. I thought "ah who knows maybe on a sci build that could be useful". Hope that is just missing on the tooltip and wasn't removed after the announcement.
Why did it say Frigattes as Hangar Pets in the game ? (German version, text is english)
Because they have the broken Cestus Frigate AI which makes them next to useless. Also the trait has been nerfred so no cool reduction and no heal to pets. Even though it still says so in the cstore it doesn't when you buy it.
Its a shame such a stunning looking ship has to have such messed up stats and messed up release. Hopefully the text gets corrected and bugs fixed.
It has to have meh stats. Otherwise, how could they bring the player base to a frenzy for the upcoming Constitution?
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Uhm, those ships aren't really great. Layout isn't great, the console is horrible +0,66% hull and 2% shields, some weak click me, what???? Not saying every new piece of equipment added to the game needs to be OP but that is really really bad. Also the starship trait does not list bridge officer CD reduction on the tooltip. Announcement said it would have that. I thought "ah who knows maybe on a sci build that could be useful". Hope that is just missing on the tooltip and wasn't removed after the announcement.
You're looking at the console from space dock, I imagine. The console's passive bonus is actually +5% max hull and +15% max shield, which the text will accurately reflect when you're in a real space zone.
The trait being nerfed is pretty harsh, though... assuming the text accurately reflects the ability. We'll have to wait and see whether its the announcement and store text, or the trait's tooltip, that need fixing.
the keys are "BOUND" - Yes the keys are currently bound to account - this has to be an oversight and needs a quick patch. No way can keys be bound, as other bundle that include keys are not bound.
C) Ironically the fleet ship module is not bound - a slight plus to this mess of a bundle
Overall rating of the Dreadnought Bundle, a D-
[It gets a D for effort and the ship model but fails epically on everything else - It is "NO" Dreadnought but a flying marshmallow.
I do have to say the Magee Frigates that awfully resembles shuttles are interesting. Again the image resemble a shuttle and not a frigate per se. When I think of a Frigate I am thinking about Miranda Frigates etc...
These are more like shuttles - they need to make that correction in its description
I just purchased the bundle not reading into it, and discovered that the BOFF layout is not only weird as heck, but useless to an offensive build. I mean what is the role of this ship? What is it suppose to do with that kind of BOFF layout?
I agree with Stark2K, the hanger pets are more like shuttles than frigates. As far as fleet ship module and keys, well the keys are bound to account while the fleet ship module is not.
With the layout and lack of anything else, this is not so worth 4K discounted zen price tag, let alone the 5K price tag after the sale is over.
Shoddy & lazy BOFF layout implementation
Overpriced bundle
and bound Keys
Ship design and looks is great, but useless in comparison to functionality
I just purchased the bundle not reading into it, and discovered that the BOFF layout is not only weird as heck, but useless to an offensive build. I mean what is the role of this ship? What is it suppose to do with that kind of BOFF layout?
I agree with Stark2K, the hanger pets are more like shuttles than frigates. As far as fleet ship module and keys, well the keys are bound to account while the fleet ship module is not.
With the layout and lack of anything else, this is not so worth 4K discounted zen price tag, let alone the 5K price tag after the sale is over.
Shoddy & lazy BOFF layout implementation
Overpriced bundle
and bound Keys
Ship design and looks is great, but useless in comparison to functionality
> @xstaythirstyx said: > BUYERS BEWARE > > I just purchased the bundle not reading into it, and discovered that the BOFF layout is not only weird as heck, but useless to an offensive build. I mean what is the role of this ship? What is it suppose to do with that kind of BOFF layout? > > I agree with Stark2K, the hanger pets are more like shuttles than frigates. As far as fleet ship module and keys, well the keys are bound to account while the fleet ship module is not. > > With the layout and lack of anything else, this is not so worth 4K discounted zen price tag, let alone the 5K price tag after the sale is over. > > Shoddy & lazy BOFF layout implementation > > Overpriced bundle > > and bound Keys > > Ship design and looks is great, but useless in comparison to functionality > > Gets a whopping "F" in my book
As a slow maneuvering ship focused on command abilities; isn't the role supposed to be a support oriented tank? Looks like it fits that role pretty well.
I have to agree, I mean it's a very beautiful ship and easily my favorite design from Discovery, but the stats of the ship I just don't think I can like.
Just feels like she is a space whale with a weak bite
I believe someone (not me) today showed a Fleet version of the ship at 173.7k DPS, in fact almost identical (+/- 1.07k) now in their revised T6 - Constitution Class, TOS, or Temporal Light Cruiser T6. Using similar traits I believe, though their are changes to some weapons/consoles, a result of being different ships.
A forum with 'Red' in it comes to mind - and I believe the person was using a TAC with TAC preference build. I eluded to some 'hints' earlier in this thread, but those options were focused on ENG/SCI.
- - - UPDATE - - -
I suspect there are many ships, despite initial perceptions, that many have overlooked.
It is just me?
There is literally not one Discovery Z-Store ship that would be really impressive performance-wise.
Ok - the lockbox/lobi maybe are, but I use mainly Z-Store ships.
The earlier ships are for me much better.
The only Discovery ship that I actually buyed is the Prototype Light Exploration Cruiser (Walker) - and only because it was - I think - first scaleable Z-Store ship.
Now I know that all older T6 ships will go fully scaleable, there is no need for me to buy the new ships - especially as they do not have any special mechanics.
I mean, when new seasons go online there was normally some new mechanics:
Solenae Dyson Sphere got Dyson Sci-Destroyers, Delta Quadrant got Intel Ships, then there were Command Ships, then Pilot Ships, then Temporal mechanics for TOS, after that was Miracle Worker Ships, and lastly - JemHadar Vanguard Ships with their escorts.
Now we got the Discovery ships - alright, but is there any special "gimmick" for even one of the ships?
Ok - there was Scaleable ships, but now we know it will be for all T6 ships, so it's not unique Discovery thing.
So… unles someone really like Discovery is there anything special about the ships, that would make me want them?
For me - no.
Edit:
Also, I'm not sure how much of percantage of players actually saw and like ST Discovery, after all - it's behind a paywall.
For example - I did not see any episode of it, simply because I do not have Netflix access, and I'm not planning to get it in the future, so while I do not actually dislike Discovery, I do not like it either - simply I do not know anything about it, that is not from the game.
I believe someone (not me) today showed a Fleet version of the ship at 173.7k DPS, in fact almost 40k better than the T6 - Constitution Class - TOS - or Temporal Light Cruiser T6.
- - - UPDATE - - -
I suspect there are many ships, despite initial perceptions, that may have been overlooked; I think it surprised them too.
What I would like to know is where the DPS is coming from? I have no problem with creative ship builds as long as I know I can do something with it.
Correct, staythirsty is correct in regards to the hanger pets description in the actual CStore which states:
"1 Hanger Bay, loaded with Magee Frigates" - borderline false advertisement IMO
I too see frigates as Jem'Hadar bug ships and Miranda class starships
Regarding dps numbers that someone threw out there - be nice to back that up with a video or a screen shot. Also anyone that unlocked traits from better T6 ships and is a good min maxer can make a Tier 1 ship roar
However; pound for pound - There are better T6 ships out there that can do the job better.
It has to have meh stats. Otherwise, how could they bring the player base to a frenzy for the upcoming Constitution?
Completely agree with you on that. And despite all shows, flagships, movies and franchises everything end having its pinnacle where all started, my beloved Constitution class
Does the Ship trait Unified Engineering stack with team mates? If so that would mean a premade team of 5 could have bonus 19% hull, 50% flight and turn rate, and 250% regen. Granted as most would have to use Aux2Sif to activate the trait the meta A2B wouldn't be available to them, but then if the Cool Down part of the trait that was announced is actually just missing due to a bug that might not matter at all and would make this trait very powerful for some people.
Yeah there are often 2/3 various ways to skin a potato, what works best for you depends on your Skill Choices, Consoles, Gear, Traits, etc... But there's likely room to still yet improve the ship as people explore various creative combinations as well.
ENG/SCI can focus a bit more on 'some' idea suggested on Page 4 but there are several options in missions, various rep, including the new REP, not to mention the Colony as well!
Yet as this isn't a build forum, I've kept comments minimal, but enough to rethink some 'first impressions'.
The other woman nodded. “Yes, it’s important for a captain to know every bolt, every weld in her ship. And while it might not be prudent to see a mace in every hammer, galactic circumstances have taught me that a certain amount of ...creativity can keep you alive.”
Does the Ship trait Unified Engineering stack with team mates? If so that would mean a premade team of 5 could have bonus 19% hull, 50% flight and turn rate, and 250% regen. Granted as most would have to use Aux2Sif to activate the trait the meta A2B wouldn't be available to them, but then if the Cool Down part of the trait that was announced is actually just missing due to a bug that might not matter at all and would make this trait very powerful for some people.
What I can say is, it works well with Speed Tweaks & Reinforced Engineering, if it fits within your design specifications.
Now perhaps time to only slight expand on what was said on Page 4 little bit...
Command & Miracle worker Specializations are good possibilities, or Command and Temporal, perhaps even Command and Constable perhaps depending if your ENG/SCI/TAC based.
Still the T6 Ambassador trait may help some, but will depend on your build; or consider obtaining Honored Dead especially for Federation characters.
NOTE: History will Remember & Honored Dead once a stack is earned remain, at least until you leave the map. I believe Vengence or Kelvin Dread offer's something very similar. The sale on now is/was also a good time to maybe consider some options.
Prolonged Engagement Set is another very good set as suggested by someone in our Fleet, as is perhaps the Kentari Mass-Produced Missle which pairs 'very' well with another I eluded to should you choose 2 Torp's; some 'find' 1 works best but two is very viable. Regardless Surface Tension with Admiral Tuvok also has some good options, and to complete the SET you do 8472 REP. In it the console provides Phaser & Disruptor bonus, not to mention Kinetic & Radiation, which can also benefit the first two items identified here.
Advanced Engine's Trait from REP &/or a Crafted ENG/SCI consoles can also improve turn rate.
What works best for everyone is going to vary a lot, as there's too many variables from skills, gear, consoles, trait's, etc... ...so the only way to really know what works best for you is to explore. In fact there are other very good opportunities, depending on your build choices from Colony or others as well.
----
So there are various opportunities to explore with this ship, most in fact from Missions, Events, Reputation, or Lobi from Past & Future rewards of all kinds. Focus also on Omni or 2/3 360 options in Aft ARC, and realize with changes to FAW that accuracy can help. Regardless it leaves everyone opportunities to explore!
so I had really been waiting on the cardenas and dont min/max so despite the blek lookin stats I got the bundle and rigged this real quick on 2 different alts... bit too sluggish even for dual beams but it does turn better than youd expect for its 6 rating somehow. I threw on a fleet RCS from the dil min and fleet neutronium[turn] and she makes a solid omni/array circle strafer. Tanking is obviously pretty easy. All in all not as bad as expected but still a big damned letdown
edit: just as a side note I used purple mkXII gear as a baseline on both alts
Comments
Also what is the point of building up your character to operate a t6 ship if you can use them post training mission ?
BOFF layout, confusing. Trait and console, boring. Just no on this one.
Its a shame such a stunning looking ship has to have such messed up stats and messed up release. Hopefully the text gets corrected and bugs fixed.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
You're looking at the console from space dock, I imagine. The console's passive bonus is actually +5% max hull and +15% max shield, which the text will accurately reflect when you're in a real space zone.
The trait being nerfed is pretty harsh, though... assuming the text accurately reflects the ability. We'll have to wait and see whether its the announcement and store text, or the trait's tooltip, that need fixing.
BUT
A) Boff layout is utter tripe
C) Ironically the fleet ship module is not bound - a slight plus to this mess of a bundle
Overall rating of the Dreadnought Bundle, a D-
[It gets a D for effort and the ship model but fails epically on everything else - It is "NO" Dreadnought but a flying marshmallow.
I do have to say the Magee Frigates that awfully resembles shuttles are interesting. Again the image resemble a shuttle and not a frigate per se. When I think of a Frigate I am thinking about Miranda Frigates etc...
These are more like shuttles - they need to make that correction in its description
I just purchased the bundle not reading into it, and discovered that the BOFF layout is not only weird as heck, but useless to an offensive build. I mean what is the role of this ship? What is it suppose to do with that kind of BOFF layout?
I agree with Stark2K, the hanger pets are more like shuttles than frigates. As far as fleet ship module and keys, well the keys are bound to account while the fleet ship module is not.
With the layout and lack of anything else, this is not so worth 4K discounted zen price tag, let alone the 5K price tag after the sale is over.
Shoddy & lazy BOFF layout implementation
Overpriced bundle
and bound Keys
Ship design and looks is great, but useless in comparison to functionality
Gets a whopping "F" in my book
Thanks for your first hand impressions
that dont look right lol
> BUYERS BEWARE
>
> I just purchased the bundle not reading into it, and discovered that the BOFF layout is not only weird as heck, but useless to an offensive build. I mean what is the role of this ship? What is it suppose to do with that kind of BOFF layout?
>
> I agree with Stark2K, the hanger pets are more like shuttles than frigates. As far as fleet ship module and keys, well the keys are bound to account while the fleet ship module is not.
>
> With the layout and lack of anything else, this is not so worth 4K discounted zen price tag, let alone the 5K price tag after the sale is over.
>
> Shoddy & lazy BOFF layout implementation
>
> Overpriced bundle
>
> and bound Keys
>
> Ship design and looks is great, but useless in comparison to functionality
>
> Gets a whopping "F" in my book
As a slow maneuvering ship focused on command abilities; isn't the role supposed to be a support oriented tank? Looks like it fits that role pretty well.
I believe someone (not me) today showed a Fleet version of the ship at 173.7k DPS, in fact almost identical (+/- 1.07k) now in their revised T6 - Constitution Class, TOS, or Temporal Light Cruiser T6. Using similar traits I believe, though their are changes to some weapons/consoles, a result of being different ships.
A forum with 'Red' in it comes to mind - and I believe the person was using a TAC with TAC preference build. I eluded to some 'hints' earlier in this thread, but those options were focused on ENG/SCI.
- - - UPDATE - - -
I suspect there are many ships, despite initial perceptions, that many have overlooked.
There is literally not one Discovery Z-Store ship that would be really impressive performance-wise.
Ok - the lockbox/lobi maybe are, but I use mainly Z-Store ships.
The earlier ships are for me much better.
The only Discovery ship that I actually buyed is the Prototype Light Exploration Cruiser (Walker) - and only because it was - I think - first scaleable Z-Store ship.
Now I know that all older T6 ships will go fully scaleable, there is no need for me to buy the new ships - especially as they do not have any special mechanics.
I mean, when new seasons go online there was normally some new mechanics:
Solenae Dyson Sphere got Dyson Sci-Destroyers, Delta Quadrant got Intel Ships, then there were Command Ships, then Pilot Ships, then Temporal mechanics for TOS, after that was Miracle Worker Ships, and lastly - JemHadar Vanguard Ships with their escorts.
Now we got the Discovery ships - alright, but is there any special "gimmick" for even one of the ships?
Ok - there was Scaleable ships, but now we know it will be for all T6 ships, so it's not unique Discovery thing.
So… unles someone really like Discovery is there anything special about the ships, that would make me want them?
For me - no.
Edit:
Also, I'm not sure how much of percantage of players actually saw and like ST Discovery, after all - it's behind a paywall.
For example - I did not see any episode of it, simply because I do not have Netflix access, and I'm not planning to get it in the future, so while I do not actually dislike Discovery, I do not like it either - simply I do not know anything about it, that is not from the game.
What I would like to know is where the DPS is coming from? I have no problem with creative ship builds as long as I know I can do something with it.
U.S.S. Maelstrom, NCC-71417 (Constitution III-class/flagship) --- Fleet Admiral Hauk' --|-- Dahar Master Hauk --- I.K.S. qu'In 'an bortaS (D7-class / flagship)
I know I took a little 'heat' in one community, for having suggested it 'may' in fact be 'very' good, or at least better than many initial thoughts...
Thought I think even Cryptic in their Official blog, eluded to Creativity, a reference to 'open mind' about the ship.
Correct, staythirsty is correct in regards to the hanger pets description in the actual CStore which states:
"1 Hanger Bay, loaded with Magee Frigates" - borderline false advertisement IMO
I too see frigates as Jem'Hadar bug ships and Miranda class starships
Regarding dps numbers that someone threw out there - be nice to back that up with a video or a screen shot. Also anyone that unlocked traits from better T6 ships and is a good min maxer can make a Tier 1 ship roar
However; pound for pound - There are better T6 ships out there that can do the job better.
Completely agree with you on that. And despite all shows, flagships, movies and franchises everything end having its pinnacle where all started, my beloved Constitution class
Looks like they did it with 3 LT tac boff slots, using the extra for that.
U.S.S. Maelstrom, NCC-71417 (Constitution III-class/flagship) --- Fleet Admiral Hauk' --|-- Dahar Master Hauk --- I.K.S. qu'In 'an bortaS (D7-class / flagship)
ENG/SCI can focus a bit more on 'some' idea suggested on Page 4 but there are several options in missions, various rep, including the new REP, not to mention the Colony as well!
Yet as this isn't a build forum, I've kept comments minimal, but enough to rethink some 'first impressions'.
The other woman nodded. “Yes, it’s important for a captain to know every bolt, every weld in her ship. And while it might not be prudent to see a mace in every hammer, galactic circumstances have taught me that a certain amount of ...creativity can keep you alive.”
Live Long & Prosper!
What I can say is, it works well with Speed Tweaks & Reinforced Engineering, if it fits within your design specifications.
Now perhaps time to only slight expand on what was said on Page 4 little bit...
Command & Miracle worker Specializations are good possibilities, or Command and Temporal, perhaps even Command and Constable perhaps depending if your ENG/SCI/TAC based.
Still the T6 Ambassador trait may help some, but will depend on your build; or consider obtaining Honored Dead especially for Federation characters.
NOTE: History will Remember & Honored Dead once a stack is earned remain, at least until you leave the map. I believe Vengence or Kelvin Dread offer's something very similar. The sale on now is/was also a good time to maybe consider some options.
Prolonged Engagement Set is another very good set as suggested by someone in our Fleet, as is perhaps the Kentari Mass-Produced Missle which pairs 'very' well with another I eluded to should you choose 2 Torp's; some 'find' 1 works best but two is very viable. Regardless Surface Tension with Admiral Tuvok also has some good options, and to complete the SET you do 8472 REP. In it the console provides Phaser & Disruptor bonus, not to mention Kinetic & Radiation, which can also benefit the first two items identified here.
Advanced Engine's Trait from REP &/or a Crafted ENG/SCI consoles can also improve turn rate.
The Sunrise Mission with a Dying Star also pairs with Kentari & likely several other creative solutions found in Beyond the Nexus I referenced to much earlier with Geordi.
What works best for everyone is going to vary a lot, as there's too many variables from skills, gear, consoles, trait's, etc... ...so the only way to really know what works best for you is to explore. In fact there are other very good opportunities, depending on your build choices from Colony or others as well.
----
So there are various opportunities to explore with this ship, most in fact from Missions, Events, Reputation, or Lobi from Past & Future rewards of all kinds. Focus also on Omni or 2/3 360 options in Aft ARC, and realize with changes to FAW that accuracy can help. Regardless it leaves everyone opportunities to explore!
Live Long & Prosper!
edit: just as a side note I used purple mkXII gear as a baseline on both alts