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The Non-aligned people of the galaxy
slifox
Member Posts: 379 Arc User
Star Trek has made a point that there are people within the galaxy that are simply not aligned with any of the major powers of any quadrants. Wouldn’t the non-aligned be a faction and story arc worth exploring?
Post edited by baddmoonrizin on
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Even in principle Cryptic doesn't have a whole lot to go on (the IP just hasn't spent much time weaving itself together in this respect) and while that does create some great world building opportunities its probably best done through bringing new elements in as parts of missions dealing with other plot lines (so that has some grounding and ability to leverage off other parts of the Trek universe.) Ex. New Kentar and the Lukari's arc (within the Temporal Cold War and Tzenkethi skirmish.) An unaffiliated "alien of the week" style faction would probably be a hard sell over, say, Borg Cooperative or Discovery-era Klingon which are both frequently requested and there is the point to make that with so many costumes, ships, and alien parts to play with headcanoning your own unaffiliated Captain or crew is quite doable already (for Borg co-op there's some pretty severe limitations that would benefit from dev time.)
And if you want to go nuts, just build your own civilization as part of a Foundry mission! That's how I got started.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
You can pick out one particular non-aligned species, and Cryptic did just that. We got the Lukari, who were non-aligned at the time we discovered them. Now they're working with the alliance so... alliance-aligned?
> They aren't really a faction since they have are non-aligned. They by definition have no leader, no group identity, no shared goals. If they had those then they would be aligned, one of the powers.
>
> You can pick out one particular non-aligned species, and Cryptic did just that. We got the Lukari, who were non-aligned at the time we discovered them. Now they're working with the alliance so... alliance-aligned?
As far as the game is set up, it would be set up as a faction who would have access to their appropriate ships. But of course as factions these days have been lately, you would probably end up allying with one of the major factions. At the very least, there’s an opportunity to tell an original story in an arc that doesn’t have much cannon to it at all.
Assuming of course that you simply leave them in the blank space of their initial setup and don't do any further story telling from there. Ex. Sunrise if we just said hello to the Lukari and scheduled an ambassadorial visit (no Tholians, Tzenkethi, protomatter, Kentari, ect.)
Building conflict is something you do when telling any story. If Cryptic did build another faction out of a minor third party (ex. Xindi or Borg Cooperative as some of the more notable examples) then they darn well would find something to drive the narrative from that faction's ideology, relationships, struggles, or your characters personal goals (to name just a few possibilities). It's an intrinsic part of the process.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
I wouldn't see that so much of a problem because I think the most interesting element of a non-aligned faction isn't that simple descriptor but where they'd be starting out in the universe. Ie. in some of the grey spaces that episodes have touched on but never fully elaborated...well except the Borg co-op since they've been fairly well elaborated on in VOY and even STO.
It gives a lot of great opportunities to explain more about how the galaxy works and what it means to be forming a galactic alliance. Through the FED it's basically "what we've been doing but more so" and the KDF/ROM it's where moments of reconciliation in various episodes have been leading to (like what we've been doing but more so.) But there's a lot of different perspectives that could be had if you focused a starting experience on someone on the outside looking in and seeing more to the alliance than just the inevitable product of Trek's ethos playout out in world building over time. Ie. security, self-sufficiency, and achievement that might not be available as someone squeezed between powers.
But for the best of that I think a dedicated player-centric story line isn't necessarily the best way to handle it because the mission format of STO tends to gloss over major world building texture in favor of the cinematic feel of certain Trek episodes (and a restricted focus on paying that content off.) Counterpoint to that: New Kentar's deeply textured optional dialogs. A little bit can go a long way and I think some bits dedicated to explaining what folks at a particular neutral location are going through (and perhaps with a few customization unlocks to let players take it from there) would be the best way to handle this (and do a lot more to add conflict, context, and depth to the game.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
There's built in conflict for a storyline there without the species/faction being 100% friendly or hostile towards the alliance.
Also Duncan aren't the Xindi federation members in 25c?
They are but I've always counted that as nominal members since there's considerable ideological and practical independence demonstrated through such things as the Xindi lock box (they're on good terms with the KDF/ROM, arguably better than the core FED.) They don't follow the traditional archetype which suggests a lot about their position in the galaxy. If Cryptic wanted to spin them out as their own faction (with FED membership being an asset they balance with their other relations and interests, rather than defining their identity or central allegiance) I think they have a lot of latitude to do so.
Add to that the question of which species have joined the FED. Easy point of clarification: so far it's only the Xindi-Primates that have officially joined the Federation (IIRC they're the only ones depicted so far in FED uniform through Cryptic NPC's, the rest have boffs/doffs across factions) with the others having various positions on whether that's a near-term or long-term prospect, serving as a point of inter-species tension for personal conflicts and political drama (something a Xindi starting experience could make good use of.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
That's a nice idea. I'm not sure enough players want it though -- Cryptic tried minimizing combat for the first Lukari episode and I remember seeing complaints of it being boring since it lacked the pew pew pew.
The Foundry seems like the best place for niche content that isn't profitable enough to get approved by Cryptic management.
I do not disagree.
I don't make Foundry stuff, myself. I remember some people mentioning having issues with the creator side a while back. Is that still problem?
Speaking as (at once) a massive overgeneralization and oversimplification. Note that STO spent the last two arcs telling stories centered around species which had never actually appeared before in canon (Tzenkethi and Hur'Q). They were a couple off-hand references (in miscellaneous DS9 episodes) away from being completely original creations. Yes, players play STO to engage with the Star Trek universe. But do they exclusively play STO to do so? That's demonstrably untrue.
Look, it's not hard to write a story about a new alien species that can hook an audience into the stakes of that immediate episode. It's the creative challenge every Trek episode goes through. You can say there too ONLY DIE HARD FANS WATCH TREK AND FANS ONLY WANT TO SEE WHAT THEY ALREADY LIKE AND YOU CANT DO ANYTHING NEW BECAUSE EXPECATIONS but time and again good writing overcomes the immediate problem of not already knowing a species backstory exhaustively. Every species introduction is a testament to this fact.
And if you want to demonstrate this in a live environment (Cryptic's own examples being strawmaned away) build a Foundry mission with a new alien species and see whether people are, on principle, willing to engage with the characters, plots, and set pieces. Don't just rest on assertion, test the logical veracity of your ideas. You'll find the answer is "TRIBBLE yes" and I can say that as someone who has run this exercise in every one of his 15 missions. No one has ever said across thousands of reviews that introducing a new alien species of minor or even major status was simply too much for them (quite the opposite, it's one of the easier ways to engage with people if you do it thoughtfully and appropriately to the IP.) I can even go so far as to make a mission with entirely original species and factions and so long as I write that mission well folks are more than willing to play along (because it's not the iconography of trek that matters most to giving the impression that you're playing through an experience fit for the IP. It's an easy way of linking concepts through visual short hand but effective writing isn't there the invocation of known faction, characters, ect. is moot.) STO is still STO and me suggesting that there's more to that universe than players already know has never demonstrably caused someone to switch off in disgust (and I don't see that extreme reaction arising if the variable of author is changed and it's a Cryptic mission we're talking about.)
The creative limitations you subscribe to are not prohibitive, particularly when held as less than absolute (we're not talking about a total conversion of STO to an original IP here and walling off major elements from established canon.) You can most certainly write stories in STO that feature unfamiliar or completely novel elements and do so in a way that audiences can engage with (however tightly they personally subscribe to the IP) as at the very least that presents analogous experience to watching the show for the first time and naturally learning more about Trek through introductions (See. Cardassians, Romulans, Borg, Ferengi, and Klingons; they all started as aliens of the week and were expanded on over time.) You can't replicate a Star Trek experience just by slavishly copying what fans already know because that's not how the original work was constructed in the first place. If we want STO to be as authentic a Trek experience as possible, it needs to do more than mix cameos for easy self-affirmation. Original contributions and playing with minor factions should also be mixed in as well.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
The Lukari were independent but they are now for all intents and purposes, part of the Alliance. Though it helps having a fully functional "Genesis Device" of their own to demand respect in this Alliance. We probably wouldn't have cared about them at all if it weren't for their Protomatter tech.
Anyways. You got the ultra powerful Alliance headed by the Romulan Republic, Federation, Klingon Empire. The Romulan Star Empire isn't a key player anymore as it shrivels up. Even Sela is a prisoner. The Alpha & Beta Quadrants are firmly under the Alliance's thumb. To make matters even more lopsided, it is working in conjunction with a now friendly Dominion, the Gamma Quadrant's leading political and military power and the only traditional power that went head to head with a similar alliance decades ago in the Dominion War. They could have won, too, if they were able to get Gamma Quadrant reinforcements.
In one of my Foundry missions I had a group of Boslic(a race seen in TNG, DS9 and Ent as minor or background chars) get contracted by Tholians to build a space station in what was technically Federation space. Why? Well the Feds would probably notice if Tholians did it, but Boslic ships going in and out of Fed space is normal enough to not raise an alarm. Thing is, the Boslics aren't hostile to the player. They did it solely because the Tholians paid them to. They actually have no idea WHY the Tholians felt the need to do it this way.
My character Tsin'xing
This gets into a very direct problem with how folks interpret Federation space. The FED is comprised of voluntary member species stretched over a large volume of space. It's borders are principally defined by the outermost systems controlled by said member species. This is drawn as a completely homogenous blue region, similar to a terrestrial map (for the sake of the audience.) This is also bunk because within FED space there must (logically and statistically) be species who didn't happen to meet the criteria for entry (see. united government, generally enlightened) or don't have the inclination to join. The FED should be a very loose network of star systems with a lot interpenetration by unaffiliated powers (single species or species groups) who cannot, by the principles of the Federation, be placed under FED control. More accurately, the Federation should be represented by a fibrous web, not a cohesive area in which the FED has principle rule.
The Boslics are not a FED member. Therefore, they aren't subject to FED oversight. Mark's idea just posits that within Bosalic territory (which here is said to be within that hypothetical blue border of FED extent) they got up to some nasty business involving some Tholian subterfuge. Why would they? Simple, they're a minor power operating in the midst of the FED, a larger and more capable organization with significant resource requirements. They will claim and consume resources faster and more intensively than other species that lie within their territorial extent. Prioritizing immediate material need or vague political expedience (be nice to the FED or the FED is going to get unilateral...) is compelling drama baked in by their position in the galaxy which Mark could use to shine a line at the implications of the FED even merely existing. Trek tends to overlook these secondary consequences, hence why its fertile ground for story telling.
Why would the Tholians? They're Tholians. They may be xenophobic but we've seen xenophobic species and organizations make use of aliens when convenient, even to the point of compromising their own principles (it's a fairly pat bit of dramatic irony. See. Hardline Bajorans accepting help from the Cardassians when it proved advantageous.) Beyond that, the attempt at rationalization is incompatible with a species which is most characteristically portrayed as an enigma. It's incompatible with who they are, any author just has to shrug and defer to the tautology "because they're Tholians." (we don't even know what that means per their internal politics across whatever medium of space/time they operate by. Ie. how much variation is there within the species or are they all but one homogenized caricature. That is where you get into some poor writing BTW. Species typically aren't so reductive.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
A Foundry mission you might like is "A Smuggler's Life For Me" by Johnnysnowball. It's a lighthearted mission (sounds like you're thinking more gritty) but it's written for smuggling RP (after the release of the Amarie escort) and is a lot of fun besides while covering the major activities a scoundrel might get up to.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Sorry but this just returned a "does not compute" for me. Unless the Bosalics were building this station within a FED controlled star system the fibrous nature of FED space is the explanation for why they were able to do this. Simply draw it out of you don't see it, if I have FED space within a particular region defined by two points and a line running between those stars...where's the point of intersection if I draw in a 3rd point that doesn't fall on that line.
Note too that while you might be aware of what the Federation is, realistically, Trek has never the less represented FED territory as a 2D field of blue. Why then would you naturally assume that someone on the internet mentioning territory in an off hand way was using that to refer specifically to a FED system (to which "Technically FED space" is a big jump) as opposed to the maximum extent of FED influence (which is what that field of blue represents even if practically what it contains is a network.) To be frank, I think you're just repositioning your argument here. If you understood and went in with that understanding, the answer "oh, Mark's referring to territory in the conventional way, not practical, but never the less making use of the heterogeneous nature of FED influence within FED extent" immediately explains his setup and specific use of the term technically.
This also ignores the fact that "replicators existing" doesn't meet the material needs of any species in the Trek universe beyond daily essentials. See. Voyager's entire run and how many times a certain element was required that can't be replicated efficiently or at all (for the sake of plot) forcing them to trade, mine, and collect resources. That handful of substances is critical for maintaining ship systems and "large neutral sources of dilithium" just lying around for anyone to claim does invalidate the dramatic imperative of episodes such as Journey to Babel (if it's such a throwaway resource, why that episode?) and undermine explicit dialog in episodes like [insert any involving Ferengi deals. Why bother with middle men and supply chain economics [see. all references to freighters and cargo] when you can just REPLICATE ANYTHING YOU WANT AT ANY TIME.])
oi...
Star Trek doesn't treat resource scarcity as a non-issue, far from it in galactic terms. You've arrived at an interpretation which is antithetical to how the setting works. Replicators have solved problems like food, housing, and minor tools sufficient to create a civic utopia, not the material requirements of interstellar civilization. Trek is, first and foremost, a drama and the writers haven't yet written off this well of conflict and plot points (and indeed actively maintain it by writing in specific limitations of the replicator.) There are still species who have to struggle more than others to get by and replicator tech doesn't fundamentally change that (beyond meeting daily needs.) This has been explicitly made to function both in main plots and background details, with the need for trade and specific resources made central to both faction level and personal motivation. It's pretty darn basic.
Okay, square the events of Temporal Ambassador with a protectionist view of historical causality. Note too the map it took place on. Does it seem familiar? Yes, because it's also used in Azure Nebula Rescue. What does capturing Republic vessels have to do with "self preservation against timeline changes?" What does capturing Terran empire crews on Nukara? Removing the Vault? Their protection of the Crystaline entity? Their interest in Kal Dano's pod? Destroying the Na'Kuhl's star?
Tholians not believing the Temporal Accords go far enough is a patent self-contradiction with their gross exasperation of the conflict which serves to underscore their inextricable behavior. See. "Because Tholians." What drives them cannot be explained in meaningful detail because the principle basis of their society also hasn't been explained. They are a largely undefined entity, there isn't sufficient basis to define forces, principles, extent, or medium of their society and thus to define any basis for motivation besides simply wanting to exist (a minimum with sentient life.)
What's left? The tautology, they just do what they do. That's what gives the Tholians their principle characterization. They know what they're up to, you don't and they're not inclined to explain (because that would fill in the gaps which define their characterization.) My recommendation to any author exploring Tholian behavior is simply to indulge in this aspect, don't over-rationalize and especially don't prioritize internal self-consistency (the inextricable angles force the consideration of complex social structures and viewpoints in the player futily trying to rationalize an undefined entity without exposition.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!